(Topic ID: 254874)

Why is Co-op Mode not in every modern game?


By joelbob

6 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 101 posts
  • 42 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 months ago by northerndude
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Should Co-op mode be available in every modern game. ”

  • Heck yes. Great feature that is needed. 54 votes
    77%
  • No thank you. Don't waste the developer's time. 16 votes
    23%

(70 votes)

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There are 101 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
10
#1 6 months ago

As a TNA owner we play co-op mode more with friends/family then we do standard scoring. It is so much more fun playing WITH them instead of AGAINST them when the other players aren't particularly good. I understand ACNC has co-op mode and I would expect Scott's next game will probably have it as well, but why does JJP or Stein not include this in their games?

People complain that Wonka is hard and you can't get that far in the game on three balls. Well why not let more than one person work together to try to get deeper into the game? Same goes with Hobbit, or Pirates. Even Stern games have enough depth and challenge to warrant multiple people trying to accomplish the same goal whether it is defeating the Black Knight or getting to a Wizard mode.

I'm no software expert but it seems adding this into more modern games can't be that hard. Thoughts?

16
#2 6 months ago

Because Scott Danesi is awesome and he's the one who came up with the idea!

#3 6 months ago

I agree and think it’s such a great concept. I’ve played a lot of TNA co-op with my son. Hopefully, we will see the concept in more and more games.

-19
#4 6 months ago

Because it's a novelty that isn't worth investing time or money in.

it doesn't help sell games.

#5 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Because it's a novelty that isn't worth investing time or money in.
it doesn't help sell games.

Oh Levi, as cynical as ever

#6 6 months ago

I think being able to play just the wizard mode (GB, God Mode) would sell more games.

#7 6 months ago

I loved co op mode. I agree, it should be an option in modern games. Also a difficultly section screen/home mode could be in there too. Very easy to code in additional options for home use/route

#8 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Because it's a novelty that isn't worth investing time or money in.
it doesn't help sell games.

I disagree. I bought TNA specifically for the co-op mode. Lots of people including myself feel TNA is one of the greatest multiplayer pinball games out there and I think co-op mode is part of that.

Just like in video games today they almost all must have some sort of multiplayer or cooperative playing mode. Why does pinball always have to be against each other.

#9 6 months ago
Quoted from joelbob:

Why does pinball always have to be against each other.

That's just how it works best.

Besides, every pinball machine already has a "co-op mode." Just set the game to 6 or 10 balls and take turns.

#10 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

That's just how it works best.
Besides, every pinball machine already has a "co-op mode." Just set the game to 6 or 10 balls and take turns.

I can't change the number of balls on location.

#11 6 months ago

I'd love this option on GOT

#12 6 months ago
Quoted from joelbob:

I disagree. I bought TNA specifically for the co-op mode. Lots of people including myself feel TNA is one of the greatest multiplayer pinball games out there and I think co-op mode is part of that.
Just like in video games today they almost all must have some sort of multiplayer or cooperative playing mode. Why does pinball always have to be against each other.

100%, I've been considering a TNA as my next game specifically for the game modes. Hopefully the co-op idea spreads, seems incredibly easy to implement.

As far as setting the game to 6 ball and just taking turns, I'd still like to see individual scores even though we're working towards a common goal. That's just not gonna be the same thing as a dedicated co-op mode.

#13 6 months ago

I'd never heard or thought about this concept before but it really sounds like an interesting pinball variation. Seems like something that a new company should consider for their next game, but who?? Hmm... API?

#14 6 months ago

It's not just co-op the complete lack of any online functionality is crazy in this day and age. Stern doesn't so much as have a companion app. It would be so simple to build a super fun online mode into pinball. You wouldn't even need the online connectivity to be synchronous. I swear when I'm in a position to write my own code again I'll reach out to a pinball company and do it for free.

#15 6 months ago
Quoted from GSones:

but who?? Hmm... API?

#16 6 months ago

A couple other games besides TNA have co-op modes. One is Lexy Lightspeed: Escape from Earth on the P3 (I believe this was out even before TNA), and the other is Alice Cooper's Nightmare Castle (seems Spooky is making it a standard, which is cool by me). Here's some gameplay examples from our streams:

Lexy Lightspeed (skip to 49:41 if the link doesn't take you right to it.):

Alice Cooper:

#17 6 months ago

What’s the difference between co-op mode and just alternating players every ball?

#18 6 months ago

Because pinball is about your score and not about getting through the game...

If you simply want to see the modes, add more balls in the options.

#19 6 months ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

What’s the difference between co-op mode and just alternating players every ball?

Number of balls per game if you just mean basic co-op mode, two games = 6 balls and potential for extra balls per player, 3= 9, etc. You can also play 2 vs 2 which is a lot of fun as well.

#20 6 months ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

What’s the difference between co-op mode and just alternating players every ball?

Everyone gets three balls instead of one.

#21 6 months ago

Versus mode is also a very cool feature in TNA. Players 1 & 3 team up to battle against players 2 &. 4.

#22 6 months ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

Number of balls per game if you just mean basic co-op mode, two games = 6 balls and potential for extra balls per player, 3= 9, etc. You can also play 2 vs 2 which is a lot of fun as well.

Quoted from chuckwurt:

Everyone gets three balls instead of one.

Gotcha. Well that’s kinda cool. And I assume you still have to pay for both players. Interesting feature! If it was more well known that actually seems like a great way to introduce new players to the game. but after a couple of games, it seems like players would want to compete head to head, if the point of the game is the score. If there’s a story though - I think TH would benefit immensely from this idea.

#23 6 months ago
Quoted from joelbob:

I disagree. I bought TNA specifically for the co-op mode..

So which games that you didn't buy would you buy if it had a co-op mode?

Munsters?

#24 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

So which games that you didn't buy would you buy if it had a co-op mode?
Munsters?

It wouldn't hurt as an enhancement, in which it enhanced TNA very much. Not every game needs a co-op mode, but there are games that could be enjoyed more so because of it. Besides that, what would it hurt have as an option? I'm no programmer by any means, but could it be that difficult? The more options the better.

#25 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

So which games that you didn't buy would you buy if it had a co-op mode?
Munsters?

ANY addition to that game would probably be a positive one

#26 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Because it's a novelty that isn't worth investing time or money in.
it doesn't help sell games.

I don't get this...Why is it a novelty to offer new ways to play a game? I would love if my games had co-op, great way to play together instead of against.

#27 6 months ago
Quoted from fisherdaman:

I don't get this...Why is it a novelty to offer new ways to play a game? I would love if my games had co-op, great way to play together instead of against.

It could confuse location players, who can sometime barely grasp the most basic concepts of pinball.

It would take time away from developers' more important tasks.

It's pointless. Previous attempts at "offering new ways" to play have failed. I'm sure Dredd's "Supergame" wasn't just intended for use in one game.

I really wasn't aware that so many of your were passionate for co-op pinball. It really seems like something most would try once or twice and never try again. One of those attempts would be to force family/wives/kids to play a co-op game with you, which they may do to humor you, before going back to whatever it is they'd rather be doing. I can't argue with you though, If you like it, you like it. You have to convince the manufacturers it's worth their time, rather than convincing me it's a fun idea.

#28 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

So which games that you didn't buy would you buy if it had a co-op mode?
Munsters?

I can only afford a small collection. Because of that I wanted a deeper/challenging game that I can play on my own(Shadow) and a game more focused on playing with others(TNA). If all new Sterns had co-op mode I would definitely consider getting one for my Multiplayer game. I'd probably take some friends to our local pinball bar and see which one they get the most enjoyment out of shooting.

#29 6 months ago

+1 for co-op mode on Stern and JJP games. It would definitely get used at our house. I'd love to play with my young daughters, instead of against them. Yes, I know there are ways around it like adding more balls and taking turns, but not the same. I wouldn't think it would be too hard to incorporate this into a code update. If it's too hard, then I'm sure Scott Danesi could be consulted and paid by Stern and JJP to put it in their current games. Unless he has a non-compete, of course.

#30 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It could confuse location players, who can sometime barely grasp the most basic concepts of pinball.
It would take time away from developers' more important tasks.
It's pointless. Previous attempts at "offering new ways" to play have failed. I'm sure Dredd's "Supergame" wasn't just intended for use in one game.
I really wasn't aware that so many of your were passionate for co-op pinball. It really seems like something most would try once or twice and never try again. One of those attempts would be to force family/wives/kids to play a co-op game with you, which they may do to humor you, before going back to whatever it is they'd rather be doing. I can't argue with you though, If you like it, you like it. You have to convince the manufacturers it's worth their time, rather than convincing me it's a fun idea.

dd (resized).jpg
#31 6 months ago
Quoted from hd60609:

+1 for co-op mode on Stern and JJP games. It would definitely get used at our house. I'd love to play with my young daughters, instead of against them. Yes, I know there are ways around it like adding more balls and taking turns, but not the same. I wouldn't think it would be too hard to incorporate this into a code update. If it's too hard, then I'm sure Scott Danesi could be consulted and paid by Stern and JJP to put it in their current games. Unless he has a non-compete, of course.

What you should be doing is pitting your daughters against each other in a battle royale for their father's approval.

#32 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It could confuse location players, who can sometime barely grasp the most basic concepts of pinball.
It would take time away from developers' more important tasks.
It's pointless. Previous attempts at "offering new ways" to play have failed. I'm sure Dredd's "Supergame" wasn't just intended for use in one game.
I really wasn't aware that so many of your were passionate for co-op pinball. It really seems like something most would try once or twice and never try again. One of those attempts would be to force family/wives/kids to play a co-op game with you, which they may do to humor you, before going back to whatever it is they'd rather be doing. I can't argue with you though, If you like it, you like it. You have to convince the manufacturers it's worth their time, rather than convincing me it's a fun idea.

Isn't that why I had my daughters? Make them play pinball with me? Read small text I can no longer see? Fetch me a drink or a snack? Lord knows I pay for enough things for them!

#33 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

What you should be doing is pitting your daughters against each other in a battle royale for their father's approval.

I guess I'm lucky. My 11 and 13 still like pinball and spending time with me. My 14 year old, who is pretty good, despises pinball because she despises me and everything I like!

#34 6 months ago

Invite competition, It's more fun to compete....

#35 6 months ago

I wish more games had multiple options to fit the wide variety of player skills and settings between location, home, and tournament. What is there is mostly minor variations of the same core code.

Like let an operator set a location game to default to novice mode if they know it's mostly novices at the location (something like unlimited balls and a hard three minute time limit). But let the pinball players know that doing something like holding down the left flipper button while pressing start opens up additional options for how they might want to play the game (traditional play, tournament play, co-op play, and other differently coded modes of game)

Of course it might not help increase sales that much, but I still think it would be beneficial to multiple people in the hobby overall.

#36 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It would take time away from developers' more im

actually its really easy, all you need to do is not reset the objectives. In my Forbidden Planet I have coop, team play and team coop and it was really easy to do.

#37 6 months ago

Now with added poll...

#38 6 months ago
Quoted from Rager170:

Because pinball is about your score and not about getting through the game...
If you simply want to see the modes, add more balls in the options.

I remember when video games were limited in this way too. Then people started playing video games at home, and game designs expanded.

#39 6 months ago
Quoted from Reznnate:

I remember when video games were limited in this way too. Then people started playing video games at home, and game designs expanded.

Funny enough, this does remind me of video games also. But the difference is that games that expanded its designs are not score based most of the time.

#40 6 months ago
Quoted from Rager170:

Funny enough, this does remind me of video games also. But the difference is that games that expanded its designs are not score based most of the time.

It'd be interesting if pinball adopted a percentage complete statistic. Games that don't easy lend themselves to scores will often include a percentage of how much of the content has been finished.

It would also work well whenever games can connect online and provide some modicum of persistent player progression over multiple sessions. Persistent player progression tracking pioneered by Call of Duty 4 has become the standard in video games. Even if you have a bad game, you're still progressing towards *something* (and combine this concept with the right theme, such as Pokemon, and you have a bona-fide hit)

#41 6 months ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

It'd be interesting if pinball adopted a percentage complete statistic. Games that don't easy lend themselves to scores will often include a percentage of how much of the content has been finished.
It would also work well whenever games can connect online and provide some modicum of persistent player progression over multiple sessions. Persistent player progression tracking pioneered by Call of Duty 4 has become the standard in video games, particularly those with heavy online integration. Even if you have a bad game, you're still progressing towards *something* (and combine this concept with the right theme, such as Pokemon, and you have a bona-fide hit)

If online connectivity does become available then you could end up with achievement tracking. It could track if you competed every mode individually, or all in one game. Hit a certain number of combos, etc. Basically giving you tasks to complete besides just high score.

#42 6 months ago
Quoted from fisherdaman:

I would love if my games had co-op, great way to play together instead of against.

This says it all for me in terms of exactly why I don't want this option. The joy of playing against people is why I play with people at all. I don't want a pinball friend. Its like that whole "you play the right flipper and I'll play the left" no thanks I play both with a nice steady feeling of anxiety as I try to beat ur score. That's the point of multi play for me, If we aren't going to compete and maybe even bet a little cabbage per game then no one would be there in the first place, I'd play 100% alone, by myself and with myself. Wait I do that now, everyday, sometimes twice a day.

#43 6 months ago
Quoted from joelbob:

If online connectivity does become available then you could end up with achievement tracking. It could track if you competed every mode individually, or all in one game. Hit a certain number of combos, etc. Basically giving you tasks to complete besides just high score.

An achievement system would be incredible for games like JJ POTC. Achievements for exploring the wide breadth of content, trying different character combos, getting rare rewards, etc... It would always give the player something else to shoot for.

Yes people can take off the glass and cheat. Yet people cheat online all the time and it still hasn't stopped video games from greatly benefiting from connected play.

#44 6 months ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

An achievement system would be incredible for games like JJ POTC. Achievements for exploring the wide breadth of content, trying different character combos, getting rare rewards, etc... It would always give the player something else to shoot for.
Yes people can take off the glass and cheat. Yet people cheat online all the time and it still hasn't stopped video games from greatly benefiting from connected play.

Sounds like an awful lot of work for the coders, and a horrendous waste of resources for a feature that won't be used much and will be of value for very few. Unless I've missed all the threads where people complain that code updates happen way too often in pinball, I don't think there's much demand for that process to become even slower and more laborious.

if Pinside ran a pinball company it would be out of business in a month.

#45 6 months ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

This says it all for me in terms of exactly why I don't want this option. The joy of playing against people is why I play with people at all. I don't want a pinball friend. Its like that whole "you play the right flipper and I'll play the left" no thanks I play both with a nice steady feeling of anxiety as I try to beat ur score. That's the point of multi play for me, If we aren't going to compete and maybe even bet a little cabbage per game then no one would be there in the first place, I'd play 100% alone, by myself and with myself. Wait I do that now, everyday, sometimes twice a day.

Different strokes for different folks. I'm in that limbo spot skillswise where I can crush any beginner, can have fun competing with a small group of similarly skilled players, but get crushed by the very skilled players. So I'm not that interested in playing with the people who crush me, I fully understand why the people I crush aren't interested in playing with me, and I only have a small group of people to play with in a hobby that is already niche. It's about having the option. No one is trying to take away the traditional high score attack style of competitive play.

#46 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Sounds like an awful lot of work for the coders, and a horrendous waste of resources for a feature that won't be used much and will be of value for very few. Unless I've missed all the threads where people complain that code updates happen way too often in pinball, I don't think there's much demand for that process to become even slower and more laborious.
if Pinside ran a pinball company it would be out of business in a month.

It's not a lot of work at all. There are so many low hanging fruit in pinball right now its crazy. This is literally stuff you throw at a co-op.

#47 6 months ago
Quoted from epotech:

I think being able to play just the wizard mode (GB, God Mode) would sell more games.

I could see this as something that would be unlocked after first beating the wizard mode during normal play.

#48 6 months ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Sounds like an awful lot of work for the coders, and a horrendous waste of resources for a feature that won't be used much and will be of value for very few. Unless I've missed all the threads where people complain that code updates happen way too often in pinball, I don't think there's much demand for that process to become even slower and more laborious.
if Pinside ran a pinball company it would be out of business in a month.

I get it, you don't like it. You've made your opinion clear and add nothing to the conversation other than pointing out it would take a modicum of effort. (Also I don't take your opinion seriously if you're not a programmer)

Stern keeps rising the prices and for what? If we aren't going to get impressive hardware, we can at least get impressive software.

#49 6 months ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

o I'm not that interested in playing with the people who crush me

You should, thats the best way to become a crusher urself. If they put this into game code fine but I'm not interested personally. Listen I hope those who want it get it, actually thats a lie.

#50 6 months ago
Quoted from Darscot:

It's not a lot of work at all. There are so many low hanging fruit in pinball right now its crazy. This is literally stuff you throw at a co-op.

Great! You are a pro. You should volunteer to do it for free, I'm sure you can bang it all out in an afternoon.

You've been going on for years about how simple and easy pinball coding is. Why not prove it?

There's plenty of folks, like treyboy, who desperately want to believe it.

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