When you say "no Stern machine is safe from the vault effect" I strongly disagree.
I'm nearly certain they will never vault WWE.
I think my Iron Maiden is built pretty good actually. I changed things up with my last purchase and went with CGC and yes you can tell the difference in the build quality but I still think Stern puts out great games.
Can we just acknowledge that our opinions only really matter to ourselves? Again, fuck it dude. Lets go bowling
Quoted from Coindork:When you say "no Stern machine is safe from the vault effect" I strongly disagree.
I'm nearly certain they will never vault WWE.
That's what they sad about iron man...
Great article! I only purchased an Elvira
To complete the trio . I’m guessing we have 100 games now and 3 Sterns . I really saw the decline in quality starting after AC/DC-Metallica , metal
Back box, lock down bar and it seems something is shaved off somewhere on every game . But that’s ok , there’s AP, CGC , and more . Honestly it’s more of the newer pin guys who love Stern ? I think if and when these guys do a complete restoration they will see the difference
I appreciate most of the points in the article, but not once does he mention how they play. For all their faults there’s nothing that plays like a modern Stern, and I mean that in a good way. I like 90’s games as much as anyone, but given the choice I’d likely pick a modern Stern.
I used to buy a lot of collectables thinking they would be worth money in the future . From collectible toys , animation cells , bmx's , pinballs ect . I've learnt if you want an investment buy land , shares or gold . JJP , CGC make new versions of their old games , so it's not just Stern . Buy a pinball machine for the fun of playing it , not to make money , and if you do make money on it , consider it a bonus .
What other hobby can you buy a fun toy brand new, play it for 5 years, and then get upset that it's only worth 80-90% of its original value? Sorry, but this is a really dumb article. If you want to invest put your money in the stock market. Stern still makes the most fun pinball machines of all time!
The article (if you can call it that) completely lost me near the beginning. It's called "Why I Bailed on Stern" and almost immediately goes into dollar value per machine. Why should that be the leading reason? Stern is a business that relies on supply and demand. They see the demand and make vault editions. It sucks if all you do as an owner is sit on a pin because of it's perceived value, but that shouldn't be any reason to bail on Stern. Otherwise, you would need to bail on nearly every other pin maker too.
The dimpling is a bigger reason and at least that was mentioned. Production quality has also declined, but there wasn't much on that. How about when Stern charges $280 for an add-on that should have been included in the high-end models? Or any number of reasons to show that Stern doesn't care about the customer as much as they do the profits.
I'm happy that Stern kept pinball alive. I'm happy for the several dozen games they've made that have been successful and I enjoy. I probably won't ever buy a NIB from them though. Too risky for me.
I for one am completely glad that you have 'bailed on Stern', and hope that anyone else that is buying machines as an investment is going to follow your advice, and stop doing it.
It is people like you who drive up the cost of machines in the second-hand market for their own profit, refusing to accept that a game you bought new a few years ago and played to death would depreciate in value - who'd have thought? When enough people believe this BS you start seeing games for sale at more than NIB prices because the owner has had a clown puke some garish LEDs over them of zip-tie on some plastic toy to 'add value' to the machine
Who'd have thought that a business (for that is what Stern is) would see a huge demand for a product that they have made, still have the capability to make, and decide to manufacture and sell them? How dare they impact on your ability to profit from their machine.
This is so stupid. How can you compare the inflation in price of a 80’s or 90’s machine to a modern stern? It’s called inflation. Wait 20 years then compare the price of a used walking dead. So dumb.
It’s like saying I won’t buy a 2020 Chevy corvette because when I drive it off the lot I lose 20%, but give me a 1970’s mustang! Look at how much those have gone up in value. Shut up
Quoted from WJxxxx:I for one am completely glad that you have 'bailed on Stern', and hope that anyone else that is buying machines as an investment is going to follow your advice, and stop doing it.
It is people like you who drive up the cost of machines in the second-hand market for their own profit, refusing to accept that a game you bought new a few years ago and played to death would depreciate in value - who'd have thought? When enough people believe this BS you start seeing games for sale at more than NIB prices because the owner has had a clown puke some garish LEDs over them of zip-tie on some plastic toy to 'add value' to the machine
Who'd have thought that a business (for that is what Stern is) would see a huge demand for a product that they have made, still have the capability to make, and decide to manufacture and sell them? How dare they impact on your ability to profit from their machine.
Did you read the part about how I sold the games? That means I asked for market value, I am not an idiot. How else do you sell something?
And trust me I hate clown puke LEDs even more than you.
The point was Stern (and Jersey Jack too) are fucking collectors for their own greed. The only company treating us with actual respect and doing things the right way currently is Spooky. Spooky says they will make X machines and they stick to it. When they are gone, they are gone. This is how collectables are supposed to work. Would you expect Chevy to re-release a '53 Corvette?
Quoted from EricHadley:When did a pinball machine become a “collectible”?
Says the guy with 14 at home in a collection. Oh and I am sure the dozens you sold never turned a profit. Right?
Quoted from freakandgeek:Did you read the part about how I sold the games? That means I asked for market value, I am not an idiot. How else do you sell something?
And trust me I hate clown puke LEDs even more than you.
The point was Stern (and Jersey Jack too) are fucking collectors for their own greed. The only company treating us with actual respect and doing things the right way currently is Spooky. Spooky says they will make X machines and they stick to it. When they are gone, they are gone. This is how collectables are supposed to work. Would you expect Chevy to re-release a '53 Corvette?
Pinball machines are't collectibles. Your joy in the hobby is being killed by greed....your own greed. Not Stern's.
Quoted from JodyG:Pinball machines are't collectibles
You may want to open a dictionary.
Quoted from freakandgeek:The point was Stern (and Jersey Jack too) are fucking collectors for their own greed. The only company treating us with actual respect and doing things the right way currently is Spooky. Spooky says they will make X machines and they stick to it.
If you could point me to where Stern said they would make x amount of Iron Man, Spiderman, Star Wars, etc. which they reneged on by doing a vault or comic art I'd be interested to see that.
JJP have been more of at 'fault' with this by releasing numerous LE editions of Woz, but you didn't title your thread 'Why I Bailed on JJP Pinball', you instead lumped on Stern - citing the fact that the machines YOU bought (having seen other machines rise in value) had not in fact gone up in value.
I repeat, it is just sour grapes that you have lost perceived profit, and the less people try passing off second hand machines at NIB or higher prices the better.
Quoted from freakandgeek:The point was Stern (and Jersey Jack too) are fucking collectors for their own greed.
No man, you're fucking yourself.
Quoted from WJxxxx:JJP have been more of at 'fault' with this by releasing numerous LE editions of Woz, but you didn't title your thread 'Why I Bailed on JJP Pinball', you instead lumped on Stern - citing the fact that the machines YOU bought (having seen other machines rise in value) had not in fact gone up in value.
Bingo
Here we go again with the greed thing. So Stern is greedy for looking for profit but you are not for wanting a bigger return on your "investment"? I'm sure you wouldn't complain if a pin you bought went way up in value but oh boy are we going to hear it if it goes down one cent.
Got to love how Stern gets blasted for making a profit.
I guess they should focus on losing money instead..........and people wonder why I always say economics should be mandatory in school.
When I buy any pin for my Enjoyment, I never view it as a profitable venture. I know I am OK to lose some money when I would sell.
When I buy for Enjoyment and Profit, specifically a Stern, I buy carefully, to realize the possibility
of profit. Always used, and so far, I have never lost more than 5% on average....A daily loss in the stock market sometimes.
How one buys and sells, and what one "expects" is the issue.
Dont buy Pinball for Profit, Buy it for Fun! What is that worth?
Quoted from EricHadley:This is so stupid. How can you compare the inflation in price of a 80’s or 90’s machine to a modern stern? It’s called inflation. Wait 20 years then compare the price of a used walking dead. So dumb.
It’s like saying I won’t buy a 2020 Chevy corvette because when I drive it off the lot I lose 20%, but give me a 1970’s mustang! Look at how much those have gone up in value. Shut up
I was talking about their run up the last 10 years not since beginning of their release. Otherwise the numbers would’ve been even more lopsided.
Quoted from GorillaBiscuits:If only there was a way to buy these evil new Sterns second-hand...
Lol. The article sucks, but these responses are gold.
Quoted from GorillaBiscuits:If only there was a way to buy these evil new Sterns second-hand...
Exactly, you hear all this whining about quality, but I’ve yet to see a reduced priced pin with dimpling, pooling etc.
Quoted from freakandgeek:Would you expect Chevy to re-release a '53 Corvette?
If Chevrolet could reasonably make a profit from a new '53 Corvette, then I have no doubt they would. There's no binding contract that something is a collectable, they certainly weren't when they were new.
Hell, you can build a brand new '69 Camaro from parts these days.
Quoted from GorillaBiscuits:If only there was a way to buy these evil new Sterns second-hand...
Obviously this is the way to buy them but you can still get burned if you buy just before a vault comes out.
I assume you're buying these and not taking them out the box. Freaking "collectable". Buy for your enjoyment or save your money and go play one on site.
Quoted from Trekkie1978:Got to love how Stern gets blasted for making a profit.
I guess they should focus on losing money instead..........and people wonder why I always say economics should be mandatory in school.
It is common place, in specific media, to degrade some companies that make a profit.
It is politically designed, and falls under social judgement of the masses promoted by some media,
to vilify some entities as "Greedy" or "Hypocritical" and garnish a mass negative attitude towards
political positions. (We are good/right, they are bad/evil)
<
Quoted from JodyG:Pinball machines are't collectibles. Your joy in the hobby is being killed by greed....your own greed. Not Stern's.
OK so to be happy I need to needlessly throw money away. Thanks got, it I’ll try that from now on I’m sure I’ll be happier.
I just opened a pack of baseball cards and didn’t get a Mike Trout autograph, I’m going to write an angry letter to Topps about how I just lost $3
Quoted from jawjaw:Here we go again with the greed thing. So Stern is greedy for looking for profit but you are not for wanting a bigger return on your "investment"? I'm sure you wouldn't complain if a pin you bought went way up in value but oh boy are we going to hear it if it goes down one cent.
I don’t think I used the term greedy in the article. I mentioned a lack of empathy for the collector mindset. Which I stand by. Also I believe they were plenty profitable before they started releasing vaults.
Quoted from Jaybird815:I just opened a pack of baseball cards and didn’t get a Mike Trout autograph, I’m going to write an angry letter to Topps about how I just lost $3
Wrong analogy. Not even close. You might want to caffeinate up and come back.
Quoted from freakandgeek:Wrong analogy. Not even close. You might want to caffeinate up and come back.
Nope they’re both “hobbies” that I enjoy and fully expect not to profit off of
Quoted from epotech:I assume you're buying these and not taking them out the box. Freaking "collectable". Buy for your enjoyment or save your money and go play one on site.
You assumed incorrectly I played the hell out of all of them.
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:When I buy any pin for my Enjoyment, I never view it as a profitable venture. I know I am OK to lose some money when I would sell.
When I buy for Enjoyment and Profit, specifically a Stern, I buy carefully, to realize the possibility
of profit. Always used, and so far, I have never lost more than 5% on average....A daily loss in the stock market sometimes.
How one buys and sells, and what one "expects" is the issue.
Dont buy Pinball for Profit, Buy it for Fun! What is that worth?
But all Pinball’s are fun. So when you can easily buy things that are appreciating that would be the smart move = unless you just like to throw away money.
Quoted from freakandgeek:You assumed incorrectly I played the hell out of all of them.
I see irony is lost on you.
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