(Topic ID: 79581)

Why does pinball need outlanes??


By CraZ4Pin

5 years ago



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  • Latest reply 5 years ago by PinballManiac40
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    #51 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    nudging is very easy for larger/stronger folks ... unfortunately young kids don't have quite that strength and thus, don't get to play the game like we think it is meant to be played. That's a shame.

    These aren't toys damnit!! You think these were made for kids?? These are intricate, sophisticated devices to be used by only the most discerned professional

    It's funny, my one daughter goes to a afterschool group thing at a local center with her friends. She told me there was a Popeye in there and she tried playing it, but it's in horrible shape. She said the is a little boy in there that gets mad at it, and shakes the hell out of it, and slams his hand on the glass. While I'm sure he isn't attempting to master the fine art of "nudging", he can most definitely move the machine. My daughters, now twelve, even a couple years back were shaking them after watching me, and I keep a tight and tidy tilt, let me tell you.

    Ahh they grow up so fast, one day crapping all over you as you try to change the diaper, the next they are shaking the shit out of your HUO ACDC Premium and getting mad at ball drains.... the memories...

    #52 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    So did nobody enjoy pinball before flippers were introduced?

    I imagine not. It sounds horrible. Seriously.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    While nudging has come to be regarded as acceptable I don't think it was ever intended to be part of the game. The tilt mechanism itself had to be invented to keep people from knocking the hell out of a game. But the tilt mechanism was just a band-aid for what the real problem was ... why were people nudging to begin with?? Outlanes.

    If the only time you nudge is to avoid outlanes, you probably need to learn to play a lot better. Seriously. Nudging is used throughout the game not just in area of saving the outlane drains. This whole premise is false, therefore its conclusion cannot be accepted. Further, if nudging was not intended to be part of the game, a tilt bob would be implemented that was not adjustable. Havent you seen games like lord of the rings, batman dark knight, pirates of the Caribbean where nudging is encouraged *by game design* to hit switches or get the ball into the right lane?

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    nudging is very easy for larger/stronger folks ... unfortunately young kids don't have quite that strength and thus, don't get to play the game like we think it is meant to be played.

    If you think it requires strength to nudge a pinball game, you are already doing it wrong. And having a game designed for little kids isn't necessarily part of the design goal of the game. If a kid needs a stool to play properly, he is too young for the game. And if he doesn't need a stool, he is strong enough to nudge. Any 8 year old can nudge properly and even tilt a game.

    #53 5 years ago

    Designers have toyed around with both of these ideas to some extent and by and large the games that implement them have been unsuccessful. Spectrum has no outlanes, Goin' Nuts has no outlanes and is timed and Bally's Beat the Clock (a very fun game actually) and Safecracker are both timed. There might be others that I can't think of or don't know of. The games I mentioned production runs ranged from never getting past a prototype to 1,000 units or so, so never a concept that really caught on with operators or the public.

    #54 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    Just another related pet peeve ... nudging. Shouldn't be needed. A little boy should be able to play the game just as easily as a 6 ft. 200 lb. muscular guy can. If you eliminate the outlanes and make the rules themselves the determining factor when your ball ends then you eliminate the need to nudge. Additionally, with no nudging, you eliminate the tilt mechanism altogether and now have a more consistent game from one location to the next. I hate walking into 1 location where you can practically slide the game around the floor and another where if you sneeze you get a tilt warning. Get rid of it.
    I know all the pinball purists are out there screaming they love outlanes and nudging and pinball just the way it is. But if pinball never evolved it would not be anything like it is today (no flippers, no pop bumpers, etc. etc). Pinball is due for some new thinking out of the box.

    randomness is part of the fun, embrace it- if we wantted something purely skill based we would sit down and do math proublems all night

    #55 5 years ago

    I'm surprised that no manufacturer has attempted putting in 'difficulty levels' like they do in video games (or maybe they have but I haven't heard of any). To summarise, the issues here are:

    1. Pinball needs to be difficult (such as including outlanes) to avoid a great player from playing for hours.
    2. New and casual players are easily dismayed and turn away from the game because they find it too hard and have games that are lucky to last minutes (especially if they are paying real money for each go).

    Let's say Joe Bloggs is my friend and I want to introduce him to pinball. I like to think I'm an ok player, but he's just starting. We go up and press the start button and at the start of my ball I have a choice of difficulty: Easy, Medium, Tournament. I choose medium and the game works as any normal pinball would (default settings and play modes).

    Joe Bloggs chooses easy, and the outlanes close (maybe a mechanical thing or maybe an automatic magnasave), and multiball is awarded off a single shot (ala Judge Dredd's Super Game).

    I'm imagining Joe would have a great time and come back for more, eventually working his way up to medium.

    How would this not improve the status of pinball for everyone?

    #56 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    In my AFM example up above ... if you hit the alien targets to the right and left of the mother ship more than 4 or 5 times you "die" ... ball drains down the middle. Subsequent attacks on the mother ship might reduce that number to 1 or 2 (thus, increasing the difficulty as the game goes on.)

    That's not going to work. The first rule of the pinball designer club is that you don't make your bash toy an instant drain shot. The bash toy is there just for casual players. Shots like Sparky, Hulk and the spinning disk on Tron are relatively safe shots. Now you want to make the bash toy an instant drain shot? No. Setting that aside, how are you ever going to finish a ship if you eventually drain more by shooting at it? Ruling the universe will be impossible. Like I said, that's not going to work.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    Just another related pet peeve ... nudging. Shouldn't be needed.

    Yeah. It's been a part of pinball for about 80 years now. Old and busted.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    I know all the pinball purists are out there screaming they love outlanes and nudging and pinball just the way it is. But if pinball never evolved it would not be anything like it is today (no flippers, no pop bumpers, etc. etc). Pinball is due for some new thinking out of the box.

    Despite what you may hear, pinball isn't thriving right now. Lots of new home buyers, but not nearly enough location players. Neither large company in business right now can afford to take any big chances. Stern tried WOF a while back and look how that turned out. And you want to remove the outlanes and go back to timed pinball? If you really want Stern and JJP to grow big enough to take chances, play on location as often as you can and encourage others to do the same. That's the only way Stern and JJP will grow. The home market isn't big enough.

    #57 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    So did nobody enjoy pinball before flippers were introduced? Did nobody enjoy it before pop bumpers?

    I said nothing about enjoyment - I thought we were talking about skill & randomness.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    The game has evovled significantly over the years to appeal to a wider and wider audience. While manufacturers have found new ways to "dress games up" (LED's, LCD, etc.) the game itself hasn't changed in a long time. Who says every pinball game has to have outlanes??

    No one said this, but I have to imagine that there are plenty of good reasons, or else all pinball machines would not have evolved into this identical setup.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    While nudging has come to be regarded as acceptable I don't think it was ever intended to be part of the game. The tilt mechanism itself had to be invented to keep people from knocking the hell out of a game. But the tilt mechanism was just a band-aid for what the real problem was ... why were people nudging to begin with?? Outlanes.

    Although I can't say for sure, I think it was intended to be a part of the game. In early pins, before flippers, if you couldn't nudge, then the entire game was literally just about how far you pulled the plunger back.

    If nudging was truly "bad", then there would be no tilt adjustment and your game would immediately end if you bumped the machine. Yes, I played a game from the 60's like this recently.

    Regardless of the original intent, pinball evolved into allowing nudging. They give you warnings before tilt. Since it's in every interest of the operator to have shorter ball times and allow less skillful play - I have to imagine that the benefits of nudging outweighed the negatives, and this is why every machine works the same regarding nudging and tilt.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    nudging is very easy for larger/stronger folks ... unfortunately young kids don't have quite that strength and thus, don't get to play the game like we think it is meant to be played. That's a shame.

    You have a point there. Maybe having more pins being played in private homes is an incentive to change this?

    #58 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    Just another related pet peeve ... nudging. Shouldn't be needed. A little boy should be able to play the game just as easily as a 6 ft. 200 lb. muscular guy can.

    A little boy? How little are we talking here? The age where a kid (male or female) grows tall enough to see the whole playfield and understand some of the rules is around 10 or 11 years old. Little boys might play on a stool, but we shouldn't expect them to put up big scores. Pinball is not a child's toy and it never will be.

    Once a kid reaches 10 or 11, not only are they tall enough to play, they're also more ready to play in other ways. Their vision is fully developed and their reflexes are lightning fast. That's why kids around that age kick ass on video games. If you play competitively at all, you know that there are plenty of young kids in pinball now. Early teens up to early twenties. Most of them don't nudge much, relying more on their exceptional vision and wicked fast reflexes. So don't feel bad for the youngsters. They're doing just fine.

    #59 5 years ago

    The entire idea is flawed. If you are going to say that a new player is going to look at a machine without outlanes, but with shots that will automatically drain your ball and think that they will have any control over hitting those or not, you're wrong. My 4 year old can play pretty darn well, but most of the time he's just flailing. Make it so that targets that he is hitting automatically end the ball, and I can't imagine him caring.

    #60 5 years ago

    The way I see it, people who are new to pinball are just happy to keep the ball in play for a while. They understand that losing the ball is bad but many I've talked to are surprised to learn there are actually rules.

    I don't think closing off the outlanes and requiring that a new player understand the rules in order to keep the ball alive is a good thing. They will probably think the game is malfunctioning when the flippers just die.

    The beauty of pinball is that there are many levels of skill that can be acquired to help keep the ball in play and score points. Learning not to hit both flippers at the same time is the first step for a new player. Flipper control, accuracy and rules often come much later.

    I think pinball will be diminished if some of the more nuanced skills, such as nudging or avoiding a tilt are removed.

    It's fun trying to improve various skills. For many, it's important to have something to aim for to separate themselves from the competition.

    #61 5 years ago

    Got it. Okay. In general it seems folks believe YES, pinball must have outlanes. Fair enough I guess. I've just had the feeling (since ST was revealed really) that we've pretty much beaten to death every original pinball design/layout given the current pinball elements people believe are required (pop bumpers, outlanes, at least 2 flippers, etc). All the crazy LED's, LCD, and bling don't change the fundamental game objectives and skill required.

    I was only trying to think of something new ... some sort of new game design that still included a pinball and at least 2 flippers (because that's what I care about most) but was a somewhat radical departure from how pinball is played today. I think there could be an even better style game (and it's likely up to a new botique-style shop to create it.)

    I guess it's time for me to buy a P-ROC and make my own game, lol!

    #62 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    nudging is very easy for larger/stronger folks ... unfortunately young kids don't have quite that strength and thus, don't get to play the game like we think it is meant to be played. That's a shame.

    My 8 year old 60 pound son has the GC score of almost 400M on my SM (actually has most of the high scores). You don't need to nudge to have a good game.

    #63 5 years ago

    Oh, almost forgot to add this - I have a friend who set up a game so that if you hit a certain target, you would automatically get a slam tilt and the game would be over. It was actually awesome to have to try to work around that target. But, this required WAY more skill then a regular pinball game.

    By the way, for whomever talked about games having levels (or should I say not), they actually do. Take Iron Man as an example - when you start, the center of the playfield is empty and not dangerous at all. Raise the Monger, and suddenly you have to contend with a big target in the middle of the playfield, and the possibility that the magnets will throw it somewhere. If you can manage that, the Monger drops back down and you have to contend with hitting certain shots with multiple balls in play.

    Manage to do *that*, and you re-raise the Monger, who now contends with your balls AGAIN.

    Accomplish that, and you lower the Monger but now have a single shot to make to hit the Jackpot.

    It's a "five level" progression in just that part of the game, one which gets tougher and tougher to accomplish as you go through it. This is normal in a lot of current games, so there is definitely a progression to it.

    #64 5 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    A little boy? How little are we talking here? The age where a kid (male or female) grows tall enough to see the whole playfield and understand some of the rules is around 10 or 11 years old. Little boys might play on a stool, but we shouldn't expect them to put up big scores. Pinball is not a child's toy and it never will be.

    You wildly underestimate kids in both height and ability to understand the rules

    Also, when my son was 7 I watched him backhand the Doc Oct shot a full dozen times in a row. Not bad for a kid.

    #65 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    Got it. Okay. In general it seems folks believe YES, pinball must have outlanes. Fair enough I guess. I've just had the feeling (since ST was revealed really) that we've pretty much beaten to death every original pinball design/layout given the current pinball elements people believe are required (pop bumpers, outlanes, at least 2 flippers, etc). All the crazy LED's, LCD, and bling don't change the fundamental game objectives and skill required.
    I was only trying to think of something new ... some sort of new game design that still included a pinball and at least 2 flippers (because that's what I care about most) but was a somewhat radical departure from how pinball is played today. I think there could be an even better style game (and it's likely up to a new botique-style shop to create it.)
    I guess it's time for me to buy a P-ROC and make my own game, lol!

    Unfortunately, you didn't present your case well. You have a thread about outlanes and then go off on wild tangents about nudging and crazy rules where hitting the wrong target drains the ball. I am ok with a design that doesn't have an outlane. I am against the argument that the lack of the outlane has anything to do with the amount of nudging required. I hate the idea that accidentally hitting some target can end my ball. And I disagree with the premise that adding outlanes increases luck vs skill.

    #66 5 years ago

    If you want absolute control over a game, pinball is not for you. Play video games, and memorize the patterns.

    Games do have difficulty built in. Explore your adjustment menus!

    Nudging has always been a part of the game, and I do believe it is built that way. Look at games like Spanish eyes or wof for good examples where the designers knew nudging is a part of the game.

    #67 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    we've pretty much beaten to death every original pinball design/layout given the current pinball elements people believe are required (pop bumpers, outlanes, at least 2 flippers, etc). All the crazy LED's, LCD, and bling don't change the fundamental game objectives and skill required.

    I equate pinball to golf in a lot of ways. Every golf course, has 18 holes, greens, fairways, tee-boxes, rough, water hazards, sand traps, etc. Yet every golf course is different, fun and unique in its own way.

    To paraphrase Jack Sparrow, Its not just flippers, outlanes, and a ball. That's what a pinball needs. What a pinball really is, is freedom.

    #68 5 years ago
    Quoted from markmon:

    I hate the idea that accidentally hitting some target can end my ball.

    Yet you have no issue with your ball accidentally flying down an outlane. Odd.

    I don't know why anyone feels the need to get combative here. I asked a simple question for friendly discussion. Does pinball have to have outlanes? I just stated my own opinion that it would be nice to see an original game with 2 flippers and a pinball (and no outlanes). I'm not looking for a fight.

    #69 5 years ago

    What you are wanting is the same as what happened to video games but to a much lesser degree. Video games started out with giving you a set amount of lives and maybe even a timer but have evolved to be interactive stories for the most part. This happened after the games were moved into homes and because once a dev sold a home game, there was no more money to be made on how many times a player failed.

    While personal collections now make up a larger percentage of pinball machines owned then at pinball's height in the nineties, they are still not that prevalent in people's homes. They are still designed first and foremost as a money making machine, and given the initial cost, anyone who puts them on route needs that money making certainty that features like outlanes give them.

    If you look at virtual pinball like Zen Pinball/Pinball FX you will see that those games are not as strict on rules. For one, their ball save time is much, much long than a real machine.

    There would need to be some strong numbers showing the manufacturers that they would sell more for them to do something like eliminate outlanes

    #70 5 years ago

    Outlanes are part of the percentaging process.

    #71 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    Yet you have no issue with your ball accidentally flying down an outlane. Odd.
    I don't know why anyone feels the need to get combative here. I asked a simple question for friendly discussion. Does pinball have to have outlanes? I just stated my own opinion that it would be nice to see an original game with 2 flippers and a pinball (and no outlanes). I'm not looking for a fight.

    I don't think that he, or anyone really, has been overly combative.

    Honestly, a ball "flying" down an outlane is pretty darn user controllable. Make your shots and don't end up in the slings, and you'll be okay. Miss your shots, and you won't be.

    You can argue that your idea is the same thing - make your shots and everyone is happy, miss them and not so much, except that without it being the "way that it has been done", even casual players will be confused.

    Ever play Whirlwind and watch when at the end of the game, the game unloads the multiball hold and people jump back to the machine and frustratingly flail at the (now, not working) flippers to try to hit the balls? Having the flippers die randomly in the middle of a mode that they didn't even know they were in would add to this confusion ten times over. It just would.

    And really, nudging is what it is. The tilt though wasn't put in to stop people from nudging, it was put in to make it so they couldn't do it too much. Nudging is part of the game.

    #72 5 years ago
    Quoted from goatdan:

    Ever play Whirlwind and watch when at the end of the game, the game unloads the multiball hold and people jump back to the machine and frustratingly flail at the (now, not working) flippers to try to hit the balls? Having the flippers die randomly in the middle of a mode that they didn't even know they were in would add to this confusion ten times over. It just would

    Super true, watch it on met le with people they freak out during the ball locks empty at the end of the game.

    #73 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    but why do we need them at all??

    Because pinballs are commercial equipment designed to bring in quarters.

    #74 5 years ago
    Quoted from goatdan:

    Oh, almost forgot to add this - I have a friend who set up a game so that if you hit a certain target, you would automatically get a slam tilt and the game would be over. It was actually awesome to have to try to work around that target. But, this required WAY more skill then a regular pinball game.

    Gotta put a tilt on the center ramp of any shoot the center ramp all day games like Police Force! Lots of fun. I think they did that as a side tournament in Portland a few years ago.

    #75 5 years ago

    Alright... I figured somebody would have done this by now...

    helen-lovejoy.jpg

    #76 5 years ago

    Maybe the easiest solution for the OP is to add rubber bands to close off his outlanes. I'm not teasing, I did that on all our machines for a long time as my kids and I were brand new to pinball and wanted to play longer without just using tons of balls per game. If the intent is to have fun and enjoy the machines, learn the modes by experiencing it at home there is nothing wrong with it to me.

    Some will get upset and say 'you might as well play with the glass off' or whatever but the point is, you can easily 'mod' most tables to remove the oulanes. Solved

    I don't agree that the way things are is because it's the best way they can be. That suggests we have no room to improve. But I think just like flippers and slings the outlanes are a fixture of pinball that don't seem to be leaving any time soon.

    #77 5 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    Despite what you may hear, pinball isn't thriving right now. Lots of new home buyers, but not nearly enough location players. <snip> If you really want Stern and JJP to grow big enough to take chances, play on location as often as you can and encourage others to do the same. That's the only way Stern and JJP will grow. The home market isn't big enough.

    My thoughts exactly...get out of your basements and play!

    -Mark

    #78 5 years ago

    space station ONLY had outlanes (in inlane)

    #79 5 years ago

    Pinball as a commercial device was about making coin. Remember that the first pins did not even have flippers, they were pretty much all drain lanes/outlanes. The flippers were introduced to allow players to ATTEMPT to keep the ball in play longer, peaking interest, getting them to put in more coin. Too long and the amount of coin going in is slower, so the outlanes were mostly kept.

    #80 5 years ago

    A.g USA Football
    And
    A.G soccer

    No out lanes at all
    Great game if you have friends

    #81 5 years ago
    Quoted from Mar:

    I'm surprised that no manufacturer has attempted putting in 'difficulty levels' like they do in video games (or maybe they have but I haven't heard of any). To summarise, the issues here are:
    1. Pinball needs to be difficult (such as including outlanes) to avoid a great player from playing for hours.
    2. New and casual players are easily dismayed and turn away from the game because they find it too hard and have games that are lucky to last minutes (especially if they are paying real money for each go).
    Let's say Joe Bloggs is my friend and I want to introduce him to pinball. I like to think I'm an ok player, but he's just starting. We go up and press the start button and at the start of my ball I have a choice of difficulty: Easy, Medium, Tournament. I choose medium and the game works as any normal pinball would (default settings and play modes).
    Joe Bloggs chooses easy, and the outlanes close (maybe a mechanical thing or maybe an automatic magnasave), and multiball is awarded off a single shot (ala Judge Dredd's Super Game).
    I'm imagining Joe would have a great time and come back for more, eventually working his way up to medium.
    How would this not improve the status of pinball for everyone?

    Was thinking the exact same thing, only I would add a time limit (say 15-20min) in easy mode. That would keep someone from hogging the machine.

    #82 5 years ago

    Nudging is huge in pinball. I'm constantly nudging or banging on the machine to kill the balls momentum or controlling the direction. Lots of side slapping to get the ball off the side of the orbits on some games.

    Watch Bowen play on certain games... he is smacking the side of the machine to get it to come to the flipper and avoid hitting the sling shot.

    #83 5 years ago

    "nudging" has been part of pinball since day 1... you can't properly play an em without nudging the machine, and generally well in advance of when the ball gets to where you don't want it to go... many older em's need to be truly manhandled to be played properly...

    as far as "kids"... ever since i've been tall enough to see the playfield, i've been able to nudge a machine...

    a big part of pinball is "avoiding losing the ball"... pinball isn't all about "hit this target and complete this goal"... that's merely target practice...

    #84 5 years ago

    In 1981, Bally clearly encouraged nudging with the outlane star posts found in a very strange place -- in the outlanes! After you drain the ball, you are given one or two chances to nudge the ball back into play.

    Genius.

    http://ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=476&picno=9680&zoom=1

    -mof

    #85 5 years ago

    I am the happy owner of a Bally Spectrum, which has no outlane... I like that game so... yes, Pinball does not always require outlanes. And don't imagine ball times are much longer on that game (and several very good players experienced it). What I miss in that game are active slingshots (which normally add a lot of lateral motion to the ball, "helping" with the drain!)

    Disclaimers:
    - I enjoy games with outlanes as well.
    - As stated before, that game was not a commercial success... (around 500 sold).
    - Most of my friends hate that game!

    #86 5 years ago

    The reverse inlane/outlane arrangement found in Speakeasy, Comet, and others allows plenty of nudging opportunities

    image-24.jpg

    #87 5 years ago

    "jacks open" also gives the player opportunities to "save"... of course, it can also "punish" as well if you aren't careful when you cradle the ball...

    image.jpg

    #88 5 years ago
    Quoted from jlm33:

    I am the happy owner of a Bally Spectrum, which has no outlane... I like that game so... yes, Pinball does not always require outlanes. And don't imagine ball times are much longer on that game (and several very good players experienced it). What I miss in that game are active slingshots (which normally add a lot of lateral motion to the ball, "helping" with the drain!)
    Disclaimers:
    - I enjoy games with outlanes as well.
    - As stated before, that game was not a commercial success... (around 500 sold).
    - Most of my friends hate that game!

    love the disclaimers!!! funny stuff

    #89 5 years ago

    I sold a non-pinhead a fishtales last year. The first thing they did was open it up and put rubber bands across the outlanes. Sold him a Partyzone in the fall he had the rubber bands waiting. LMAO

    #90 5 years ago
    Quoted from Skypilot:

    I sold a non-pinhead a fishtales last year. The first thing they did was open it up and put rubber bands across the outlanes. Sold him a Partyzone in the fall he had the rubber bands waiting. LMAO

    LMAO right with you. Everyone that plays Pinbot with the center post says I should add a center post to all of my games!

    #91 5 years ago
    Quoted from wayout440:

    LMAO right with you. Everyone that plays Pinbot with the center post says I should add a center post to all of my games!

    some people like to win at all cost i guess, theses are the funniest 2 post of the day i think

    #92 5 years ago
    Quoted from Skypilot:

    I sold a non-pinhead a fishtales last year. The first thing they did was open it up and put rubber bands across the outlanes. Sold him a Partyzone in the fall he had the rubber bands waiting. LMAO

    Why didn't he put a center post right between the flippers while he's at it. Only need the game set on 1 ball then.

    #93 5 years ago
    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    I'm not saying there is no skill in pinball ... I'm simply saying outlanes in general introduce randomness and detract from it being even more of a skill game. Yes, there are strategies to make shots that keep the ball away from the outlanes, and yes, certainly you can "nudge" a game ... but why do we need them at all?? I think it would be cool to see a game where more focus was put on the player to consistently make ever increasing difficult shots.
    For example .. AFM ... what if you had to destory the ship WITHOUT hitting either of the alien targets on both sides of the entrance to the ship? It would be interesting if there were more rules like "hit those aliens 2 or 3 times and you die ... ball drains". Rules like this put more emphasis on the player making accurate shots versus randomly getting rewarded for every target the ball flies around and hits. Additionally, it allows us to eliminate outlanes and remove a very random element to the game.
    I also think this would provide a way to start the game easy and quickly make it harder and harder (kind of like how a Pac Man speeds up as you get to each next level). I think this style of play would go over much better in an arcade or on location.

    Wow, this idea didn't even make it from the mixing bowl to the oven to get half-baked.

    #94 5 years ago
    Quoted from TheShameGovernor:

    Love the idea of certain targets you need to consciously avoid. Offhand, I can't think of an example where that has ever been implemented.

    Maverick. Certain groups of targets are lit, and if you hit a target thats not lit enough times it will end the mode.

    #95 5 years ago

    I would put it this way. Pinball was designed to be put on location to entertain and to make money. The more possibilities of the ball draining faster, the more money that the operator can potentially make.

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