It's all so clear now!! It's anti coin mech not door.

I think the lack of a coin door would reduce the appeal of a pinball machine....the coin door makes the game look like 'real' machine you'd see in an arcade and not a home-market machine. That said, I have upgraded most of my machines so they still have the 'real' look but instead of the admittedly useless coin-for-play feature, you put your money in and get something useful in return.

horny goat weed (resized).JPG

How much longer is physical currency even going to be used? Time to advance to the next level and do away with them. I do agree that something needs to be put in it's place, decorative at least.

This is such a scary thought. You want the govt to be able to shut off your spending source on a whim with no alternative? What's the benefit of just getting rid of currency? You can live that way today if you want. Every financial transaction would require and internet connection. This is so dumb lol.

Digital currency - in fact, the computer chip itself - will spell the death of mankind. Yet people welcome it with open arms....

When I buy an old machine that has the coin door dismantled to prevent operating, I replace all the parts including the mechs to make it right. Sorry, but this is a terrible idea.

We're already there, or soon will be. Doesn't matter what we want, it's all being planned for us.

But back to coin mechs. Actually, now is the perfect time for them to stop them. With the backload of games, sure there will be some anger, but like anything else, the demand will outweigh the negativity and people will still buy pinball games. I'd do it now if I was Stern. Ride out the negative goodwill hit and then it will blow over in a year or so. Maybe offer a separate coin door as an add on like a shaker motor.

That's what I was referring to. Dismantled not removed (meaning coin mechs and the hardware that holds them).

If they stopped using coin mechs in doors do you think it would end in a cost savings for the consumer? We have grocery stores doing away with bags or even charging customers for the bags. Yet there has been no decrease in prices to reconcile with the $$ the stores are now saving.

Games are already built more cheaply than they were 20 years ago. Yet prices have increased substantially. Just be happy you get the coin door. I’m sure within 5-10 years or so it will be a thing of the past anyway

You're only powerless when you start to believe you are.

"You do realize there have been "computer chips" in pinballs since 1977, and all around your home today? Last time I counted, there are well over 200 microprocessors in my various home appliances and car."

Yes, I do...and it's appalling. It's like a lot of things....a little is good, but people go overboard and it becomes a bigger evil than you started with. It starts with a computer that makes your car run better...then turns into a car that doesn't let you drive without your seatbelt fastened, the door open, and without first pressing a button that captures your binding agreement that you will only drive the car if you've had 8 hours of sleep and accept the risks involved and hold the manufacturer harmless.

Can you imagine a world where a toaster doesn't have a computer chip? A world where your toaster only toasts bread and doesn't gather your personal data and send it to someone you've never met? A world where your toaster's memory chip can't be subpoenaed and used to incriminate you in court? I can....

I recently tossed a 3 year old, $3500 refrigerator because the computer chip failed and cost more to replace than it was worth. That's progress...?

Any product affixed with the terms 'smart' is sure to be stupid....

I agree with you but the deck has been stacked against us.

Someone smarter than me correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe in the mid to late 80’s, AAMA created a set of standards for all coin-op manufacturers to follow. One of them was two money acceptance devices installed. The practice has been around for so long that most probably have forgotten it was an adopted standard.

Ive got the collection tickets (where we document coins, bills, mobile/CC) to show coins most certainly are not out. I remember buying DBA pool tables when we went to $1 pool 12 years ago or so, and the revenues went down! Put the coin tables back in (Valley ZD-8 coin and the DBA tables were the “Great 8”) and added change machines and the revenues shot up. People would rather drop 4 quarters for pool rather than insert $1. That was then, so maybe times have changed, plus the 12VDC DBAs suck like a $20 hooker-you hold the bill in the slot (oh the out of context jokes that could be made) and wait for it to come out of sleep mode (another!) and don’t get me started on having to go change batteries because nowhere has floor outlets and fire code won’t let you run a cord on the ground with some kind of covering.

Dart players will still drop 4 quarters for cricket before they’ll put in a dollar, and of all my pins on the route (all at $1 play) most have equal if not more coin to currency play.

The exception to this obviously being the jukebox app. I thought it was the dumbest thing I’d ever seen when it launched. I was wrong. I have at least 10 jukeboxes that are 90-95% mobile play.

Unless the change machine is tokens only, it’s actually a federal crime to have a card reader on a change machine that dispenses coins. I’m an ATM operator. Takes more paperwork to become an ATM owner than it does to buy a machine gun. I’ve done both.

And listed in "Additional Options" are (drumroll): CREDIT CARD SYSTEM UPGRADE.
https://americanchanger.com/product/front-load-floor-model-ac6000/

...also: pasted_image (resized).png
https://americanchanger.com/product/rear-load-token-dispenser-ac2207/

Now as far as you claim about this being a federal crime to dispense change from a cc operated changer, can you site this?

I have no special knowledge, but if the change machine had a credit card reader, then it would effectively be an ATM. And one would imagine that ATMs are heavily regulated.

I think you meant "cite" versus "site". Anyway, since we are dealing with Credit and Debit cards, in the United States, thebFDIC Comsumer Protection regulations under Title VI, Electronic Fund Transfers, § 901-923 has almost as much fun stuff like the Federal Tax Code.

Because some of us still need them

The real question is why is stern not including stern branded tokens for the authentic arcade feel

HaHa. Good one.

LTG : )

I know what you’re saying. Card readers actually cost less than DBAs.

As far as a proof or citing of the law, I’m no attorney. Just a poor, humble and uneducated vending and amusements operator. I’d have to suspect that the first infraction would be simply operating an unregulated or unregistered banking device.

Notice all those links and pics are “Tokens Only” machines.

No? That's surprising. I'd at least think they are more regulated than a typical change machine.

Coin mechs add extra cost. The doors should be shipped with plastic or metal plugs to bring cost down. If you have a route you should have to buy the mechs as an add on from your distributor.

Yup they'll pass those savings right on to you

Since different people/companies regularly approach me to see if I want one for my business. Makes me believe there isn't much to it.

ATM with 3K to 5K in it. Telephone line. And internet and bank access and bank account for card deposits.

Not much to regulate. And I don't believe there is any limit to what you charge for each transaction.

LTG : )

Remember when games routinely had actual left lane kickbacks and physical ball locks. The kickback is a relic and physical ball locks are reserved for premium titles. Someone had a great idea that those things were not needed and could be replaced with what we have now. Again, resulted in zero cost saving for consumer. It only provided them a better margin.

Bulbs have been replaced by cheap led pixels. Costs less to build but we pay more.

I never get these threads demanding that we get less on our pinball machines because they are "for the home."

I've heard people request they cut everything from backboxes to coin doors to "save us money."

Good luck with that.

They can cut anything you want from a Stern Pro or any other manufacturer, the price will never go down. The only time in history a pinball company has lowered it's prices was in 1990, with the Gottlieb Street line. The line was a huge flop with each game selling less than the next until the concept was dumped in a year.

"Buy our shitty game, it costs slightly less and has a bunch of stuff stripped out of it compared to the competition" will never be a winning marketing ploy in pinball.

There's a JP home edition if you want a game with no coin door slots or mechs.

Games just look weird without a coin door with coin slots. I could see Stern probably dumping the mechs and charging more for the game. That wouldn't surprise me.

Yea. Not a fan of the Home Edition's. Same as the 1ups.

Change is hard. We need to make the coin door a relic of days gone by as it is ridiculously outdated technology, form of payment and product thinking. Most of these machines are going into homes. I would rather let the operator pay for a payment mech if she or he needs one.

I'm also an old fart but I also think change is important. Whether we like it or not, coins and bills are being eliminated as a form of payment in more and more places. Plus there are advantages for the operator like being able to adjust the cost of games throughout the day and by machine and from a remote location. Not having to empty coin boxes has to be a plus. It's just an unnecessary element and I'd rather the money go towards something else.

A great coin door substitution....

coin door fridge (resized).jpg

Oops we see here that you said something in 2009 that is now considered too taboo here in 2035, we're shutting off all your payment sources until you complete government mandated education classes

I’d love for a company to make a new flipperless game! I still want coin mechs for it though.

Coin doors are great still for all pinball nice too have

I read that a guy in China stepped outside the cross walk lines as there was a lot of people. A week later he saw a deduction in his checking account- a fine!

Back on topic: Stern removed the knocker and used that dreadfull audible noise. And I thought slam switch was taken out to?

Naivety has a cost too.

I hate that digital screech! One of the first things I did was add a real knocker to my JP when I bought it.

At least it saved me $20 that Stern discounted off the price of the pin when I bought it.

Sainted Williams who lived not to make a
Profit but to impress pinball nerds 25 years later eliminated the real knocker in 1997, replacing it with “the screech.”

or go full golden tee and take at least $0.25 of each game played (even local coin in)

or go full golden tee and take at least $0.25 of each game played (even local coin in)

they have boasted spins no free spins. you get the funds to play your boasted spins up front and then your play your bonus round. But you can win $1199.99 per spin and as you pay for each spin no W2-G needed.

Just because a new machine may start out it’s life in a collectors possession that does not use the coin mechs does not mean it will not end up on route at a location where it needs coin mechs at some point.
I have sold or traded many machines to local friends/ops that own locations.
Every location I can think of here uses either quarters or tokens.

Thank you for your Non-Coin related opinion
I kid.

"Why do we still need coin mechs in doors?? "

...just...because!