(Topic ID: 193377)

Why do people ask so much?

By Dom1

4 years ago


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  • 136 posts
  • 76 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by xTheBlackKnightx
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    Topic poll

    “Are people asking too much for less then perfect machines”

    • Yes 92 votes
      47%
    • They're right on the spot 19 votes
      10%
    • They should be asking more 30 votes
      15%
    • People drive me bonkers with their asking price! 53 votes
      27%

    (194 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

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    There are 136 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
    #1 4 years ago

    Hey Me and my brother have bought a few pinball machines over the past few months and really have been enjoying it but it has become increasingly difficult to find a decent buy. Does anyone have an idea why people are asking literally double the price for a machine that pinside estimates the value of? Is pinside wrong or outdated on their pricing or do these people who have broken pinball machines just think they're stuff is gold?

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    #2 4 years ago

    They think their stuff is gold and they probably have a boat payment due!

    #3 4 years ago

    Sounds about right to me lol. I'm just not sure where they get their prices from.

    #4 4 years ago

    I hear ya. So many pins on the secondary market are 50%-100% overpriced it's almost unbelievable. Either the sellers are greedy and counting on finding someone stupid, or the sellers are stupid and equate Ebay list prices to actual value. Way too much stupidity out there.

    15
    #5 4 years ago

    Good deals are usually gone quickly, so you might not even see them if you don't check very often. It's only the poor deals that languish and tend to be visible.

    If I had the space, I probably could have easily bought a dozen project games at bargain prices in the past couple months. But, those deals only surface for a few minutes before someone pounces on them.

    24
    #6 4 years ago

    Why do people offer so little?

    So tired of getting beat up on games I offer for sale. Still having PTSD on that WWE I sold.

    #7 4 years ago

    I understand both sides of the seller and buyer. If a games estimated price value is between $1200-$1400 I don't mind to pay that amount but it's hard for me to even give the seller a call when they are asking $2500 for that machine

    #8 4 years ago

    A machine, or anything, is only worth what someone is willing to pay. If you can find that 1:1000 buyer that will pay double for a machine, why wouldn't you sell it for that price? We all want nice things cheap. We all want more than what things are worth. Some people are more realistic or have different motivators for selling. There are too many variables, and no real answers. If you don't like a price, move along. The price-police need to find something to do other than complain about what someone wants to sell their machine for.

    #9 4 years ago

    I'm trying to buy a #BSD from a friend, but thanks to eBay he thinks it's worth about €6000...

    #10 4 years ago
    Quoted from RobDutch:

    I'm trying to buy a #BSD from a friend, but thanks to eBay he thinks it's worth about €6000...

    F that man. I would think around half that number would be fair if it's in good shape. That is a neat game though . Good luck on the Hunt.

    #11 4 years ago

    I think a lot of sellers factor in haggle room. For me, I pass these by. I don't enjoy driving an hour or two to haggle. I just expect to find a properly represented machine at an agreed to price.

    I think high prices feed high prices. I see a B/C title listed a bit high. A week later another one listed higher. Neither sell, but the sellers think this is the new floor price. I also doubt the veracity of sales prices in the market. When (if) machines are marked as sold, some sellers don't admit they took less than advertised. This also doesn't help.

    I rarely sit on a machine for a week or two when I try to sell. If I don't get interest, I drop the price every few days until I get calls.

    #12 4 years ago

    It is a rising market with tons of new buyers out there. Here are the prices of some machines I bought or sold over the years:

    Whitewater - $1600 - 4/07
    STTNextGen - $1900 - 8/07
    Judge Dredd - $990 - 7/08
    Terminator 2 - $900 - 1/06
    Twilight Zone - $2500 - 7/05

    I guess my round about point is that nobody wants to sell for less than what they have into it. Damn I wish I had just put those games in a storage container.

    #13 4 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    It is a rising market with tons of new buyers out there. Here are the prices of some machines I bought or sold over the years:
    Whitewater - $1600 - 4/07
    STTNextGen - $1900 - 8/07
    Judge Dredd - $990 - 7/08
    Terminator 2 - $900 - 1/06
    Twilight Zone - $2500 - 7/05
    I guess my round about point is that nobody wants to sell for less than what they have into it. Damn I wish I had just put those games in a storage container.

    If I had a T2 for $900 or a white water for $1600 I would be a very happy person

    #14 4 years ago

    supply and demand... how does it work ?

    #15 4 years ago

    We all have reality TV like Pawn Stars and the two dingle berries from American Pickers to thank. Ebay and the misconception of "well it's selling for $X on Ebay" so mine has to be worth that much. We also have the increase in retail stores to thank.

    Problem is that the guy who has had a Dr. Who in his basement for 10 years has no clue the difference between his machine and that fully shopped out and restored machine on Ebay or in a store for $5500.

    Price guides like Mr.Pinball mean absolutely nothing to these people because Ebay is their price guide. Problem is neither Mr.Pinball nor Ebay writing a check for any of these games.

    Subjective condition of a game is king too. What one might call excellent condition is fair to good in a collector's eye.

    #16 4 years ago
    Quoted from darcangeloel:

    F that man. I would think around half that number would be fair if it's in good shape. That is a neat game though . Good luck on the Hunt.

    Hahah yeah me too and indeed it's awesome! The shape of this machine is pretty good (cabinet red, magnet working and no playfield wear), but it needs a clean up and the batteries have leaked a little on the boards.. Thank you!

    I think the prices rise because pinball is getting more and more popular (at least here in the Netherlands), and that sellers know they can sell the machines even with high prices.

    -3
    #17 4 years ago
    Quoted from Dom1:

    Hey Me and my brother have bought a few pinball machines over the past few months and really have been enjoying it but it has become increasingly difficult to find a decent buy.

    asking prices have not changed significantly in the last few months. most likely you guys are simply becoming more discerning.

    #18 4 years ago

    I have seen prices for machines go up considerably over the last 5-6 years. It's supply and demand and many new people want machines and people are paying. NIB prices have jumped because of this as well. And people are over paying for restored/shopped out pins. Until people quit buying overpriced pins this will continue.

    You can still find decent prices but you have to be patient and have cash in hand and be quick. They don't last long.

    #19 4 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    It is a rising market with tons of new buyers out there. Here are the prices of some machines I bought or sold over the years:
    Whitewater - $1600 - 4/07
    STTNextGen - $1900 - 8/07
    Judge Dredd - $990 - 7/08
    Terminator 2 - $900 - 1/06
    Twilight Zone - $2500 - 7/05
    I guess my round about point is that nobody wants to sell for less than what they have into it. Damn I wish I had just put those games in a storage container.

    you're talking about ten to twelve years ago. ancient history. the OP said the last few months.

    #20 4 years ago

    Make an offer, thats only good for the next 10 minutes. Be ready to move the game and have cash in hand.

    Remember, it's an offer, not an insult.

    #21 4 years ago

    I've mentioned this before, but it's mostly hobbiests here so you can't get as much here for games as you can elsewhere. Case in point, I recently sold my Bride of Pinbot and Theatre of Magic pins. I had long sicne stopped listing games here for sale because it's all hobbiest pricing here so I knew I wouldn't get anywhere near what I could get elsewhere, but I went ahead and listed the above two recently just to see if things had changed. For my BOP I was getting offers here in the $1xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $2xxx range. For me TOM I was getting offers here in the $4xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $6xxx range.

    Pinside is great if you need money quickly like for an emergency. In those case you sell a game at a big loss and get far less than you would elsewhere but you can sell it very fast and get the money you need. But if you aren't in a hurry then you are just better off selling it just about everywhere else. The price you can get in the real world at all the other selling venues will always be considered "too much" here, it's just how it is. But I'm a bit of a weirdo in that I like to get as much money as I can for things I sell, that way I can fund new purchases easier.

    #22 4 years ago

    where else do you sell, ebay? they take 10%.

    Quoted from Reality_Studio:

    I've mentioned this before, but it's mostly hobbiests here so you can't get as much here for games as you can elsewhere. Case in point, I recently sold my Bride of Pinbot and Theatre of Magic pins. I had long sicne stopped listing games here for sale because it's all hobbiest pricing here so I knew I wouldn't get anywhere near what I could get elsewhere, but I went ahead and listed the above two recently just to see if things had changed. For my BOP I was getting offers here in the $1xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $2xxx range. For me TOM I was getting offers here in the $4xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $6xxx range.
    Pinside is great if you need money quickly like for an emergency. In those case you sell a game at a big loss and get far less than you would elsewhere but you can sell it very fast and get the money you need. But if you aren't in a hurry then you are just better off selling it just about everywhere else. The price you can get in the real world at all the other selling venues will always be considered "too much" here, it's just how it is. But I'm a bit of a weirdo in that I like to get as much money as I can for things I sell, that way I can fund new purchases easier.

    #23 4 years ago
    Quoted from pezpunk:

    asking prices have not changed significantly in the last few months. most likely you guys are simply becoming more discerning.

    When you take that quote out of context of the OP's ENTIRE statement, then your summation would be correct.

    The OP clearly stated that they feel it is hard to get a decent deal by virtue of what sellers are asking compared to what pinside feels the true values are.

    #24 4 years ago

    More people entering the hobby with mostly the same number of machines (setting aside very expensive NIB machines). Combination of more demand and maybe more importantly less discerning demand. Early in the hobby it's pretty easy to under value your time fixing things and the cost of fixing things leading to over paying (or at least over paying relative to what someone who has more knowledge would be willing to pay). There's also some averaging down of the Pinside price estimates based on older transactions and what values used to be vs what someone is willing to pay today. I'm certainly a newcomer and have hopefully not grossly overpaid for my machines, but I definitely paid more for my $1,400 Judge Dredd than $1,400

    #25 4 years ago
    Quoted from jake35:

    where else do you sell, ebay? they take 10%.

    Even with 10% you still will pocket far more from Ebay than you ever would here. My BOP was sold on ebay and I pocketed over $1k more than the offer prices here, after ebay's cut. You should also try letgo, offerup, craigslist, even contact local stores in your area that sell machines. I sold my mint condition The Getaway pin that way, basically called a local store and had them sell it for me. They sold it, took their cut, and I still pocketed far more than I'd ever make here. When I sold my AC/DC pro I had listed it here and was getting offers in the low $4xxx range. So instead I called a local store that both sells and puts games on location, and asked if they needed an AC/DC pin. They did and bought it from me in the $5xxx range. Another option is go to your local barcade and ask to talk to the owner or purchase manager, and see if they are looking for any machines. There's lots of ways to sell these machines now because they are in big demand.

    #26 4 years ago

    This is why it's nice to find a trade: don't have to worry about the inflation so much, just the relative values.

    If you can't find a trade, it's difficult not to ask for high price, because everyone else is doing it, and if you want to buy something else, you want the funds to do so.

    I've had 3 WCS pass through my hands in the last year, and sold them for 2700, 2900, and 3100. They were all nice examples, progressively nicer with the last one looking home use only / restored. My friend says I'm responsible for the inflation on that title! It's about time it got some respect anyway! Besides, I had to shell out $2700 to get Judge Dredd...

    #27 4 years ago
    Quoted from Reality_Studio:

    I've mentioned this before, but it's mostly hobbiests here so you can't get as much here for games as you can elsewhere. Case in point, I recently sold my Bride of Pinbot and Theatre of Magic pins. I had long sicne stopped listing games here for sale because it's all hobbiest pricing here so I knew I wouldn't get anywhere near what I could get elsewhere, but I went ahead and listed the above two recently just to see if things had changed. For my BOP I was getting offers here in the $1xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $2xxx range. For me TOM I was getting offers here in the $4xxx range, so I sold it elsewhere in the $6xxx range.
    Pinside is great if you need money quickly like for an emergency. In those case you sell a game at a big loss and get far less than you would elsewhere but you can sell it very fast and get the money you need. But if you aren't in a hurry then you are just better off selling it just about everywhere else. The price you can get in the real world at all the other selling venues will always be considered "too much" here, it's just how it is. But I'm a bit of a weirdo in that I like to get as much money as I can for things I sell, that way I can fund new purchases easier.

    Based on this, maybe pinside's price range is outdated. Your BoP was listed a little above the top of the range, and it had significant playfield damage. I would expect to pay well below the listed range for a pin in that condition. From what I remember from the ad, the playfield would have needed to be replaced to make it into a nice machine (although the rest of the game did look nice). If your game didn't have the playfield damage, I would have bought it for asking price.

    BoP is the only used game I will even consider buying. Between prices all over the place, and varying conditions of games, I am only interested in new games from here on out (which makes the remakes of great games really exciting). My wife wants the BoP, and I don't think I will be able to talk her out of it at this point.

    #28 4 years ago
    Quoted from Nexyss:

    Based on this, maybe pinside's price range is outdated.

    I agree....when you factor in older listings that are priced lower, or a beat up restoration.project, the price drops.
    I don't think there's any great way to value a pin other than feel the market. A machines value is simply what someone is willing to pay.

    #29 4 years ago
    Quoted from Reality_Studio:

    I've mentioned this before, but it's mostly hobbiests here so you can't get as much here for games as you can elsewhere.

    I think that's over-generalizing a bit. For me, condition and value dictate where I sell a game.

    If you have a high value game and/or high quality game, you can certainly get a good price from Pinsiders - you just have to be patient and turn down the early offers. Shipping is almost always part of the Pinside equation, so games under $2000 are harder to sell when you have a $400 shipping cost on top.

    I know I could get more off of eBay in most cases, but not enough to justify the *HUGE* risk of accepting PayPal. Ebay/Paypal fees are closer to 13% if I remember correctly. I also enjoy networking with other Pinsiders and have made many friendships from buying /selling games here.

    #30 4 years ago

    I think sometimes buyers ask too much.

    Can you send me more pics? Will you work with me on the price? Is that a scratch on the side of the head? Will you triple blanket and pallet it for me? Will you drop it off 100 miles away so I can save $50 on shipping?

    #31 4 years ago

    And here I thought this was just an ironically titled thread about questions.

    15
    #32 4 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    I think sometimes buyers ask too much.
    Can you send me more pics? Will you work with me on the price? Is that a scratch on the side of the head? Will you triple blanket and pallet it for me? Will you drop it off 100 miles away so I can save $50 on shipping?

    My favorite is the "free shipping" gambit. "Yeah, I'll take the game, if you include shipping."

    Sure, no problem, I'll eat $500. My treat.

    #33 4 years ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    I know I could get more off of eBay in most cases, but not enough to justify the *HUGE* risk of accepting PayPal. Ebay/Paypal fees are closer to 13% if I remember correctly. I also enjoy networking with other Pinsiders and have made many friendships from buying /selling games here.

    You don't have to accept paypal, you can list in the auction that paypal is not accepted and cash on pickup is required. My BOP that I sold on ebay was paid for in cash when he picked it up. Ebay is great for networking as well though. For example the guy that bought my BOP actually lived near me and is hugely into the arcade/pinball scene. He sold a bunch of his rare games to the Pinball Museum in Banning for example, like Varkon.

    #34 4 years ago

    Look im fairly new to buying and selling but heres my take on newer games since i dont really buy older games. No game is worth more used then NIB to me ever no matter what. If i by a Pro at $5k i sell it at $4500 with a loss but i think thats the only fair way to do it personally since the game is used. I cant stand seeing guys listing games for NIB prices because they did a mod or two, mods are meaningless to me unless there a $500 topper then it might make the game worth alittle more but not $500 that topper originally cost. I eat the loss get another game and play on.

    #35 4 years ago
    Quoted from ToucanF16:

    They think their stuff is gold and they probably have a boat payment due!

    If you're talking about a retail shop, and they're a good, reputable retail shop, then their prices are always going to be higher ... however, you'll usually get support in the form of a warranty from that retail shop (they back up the work they do refurbishing their game) ... that's invaluable if you're new to pins and don't know anything about them. I doubt their money is going to a boat payment . Unless boating is in your blood, a good businessman knows that the day you buy a boat and the day you sell a boat are the happiest days of your life (there are a couple of pins that fall into this category ... Orbitor 1 comes to mind ).

    If you are talking about a Joe Schmoe that tries to sell a horrible condition Gold Wings for $2K, chances are that money is going to a meth addiction and not a boat payment . Seriously though, some people see "pinball", look on ebay, and put their crummy game up on Craigslist for insanity money. Just ignore them. I bring up Gold Wings since it looks like a high end pin . I get a kick out of it, but it's a $500 pin no matter what the market says .

    In this hobby, you have to network. You'll eventually find acceptable prices.

    #36 4 years ago

    I tend to have to ask more for a machine because I will more then likely be going down in that price when negotiations start.

    #37 4 years ago
    Quoted from vdojaq:

    When you take that quote out of context of the OP's ENTIRE statement, then your summation would be correct.
    The OP clearly stated that they feel it is hard to get a decent deal by virtue of what sellers are asking compared to what pinside feels the true values are.

    i truly don't understand what they're asking, then. why does the OP assume some Pinside algorithm is an authoritative source on market prices? they seem to be complaining that it's harder to find deals than it was a few months ago. i see no evidence that that is the case.

    #38 4 years ago

    Buyers are always gonna think sellers are being greedy, and sellers are always gonna think buyers are being cheap. It's the nature of the beast and another price complaint thread won't change it.

    The only way to avoid the games is to buy NIB, brand new, in production machines.

    #39 4 years ago
    Quoted from Phbooms:

    Look im fairly new to buying and selling but heres my take on newer games since i dont really buy older games. No game is worth more used then NIB to me ever no matter what. If i by a Pro at $5k i sell it at $4500 with a loss but i think thats the only fair way to do it personally since the game is used. I cant stand seeing guys listing games for NIB prices because they did a mod or two, mods are meaningless to me unless there a $500 topper then it might make the game worth alittle more but not $500 that topper originally cost. I eat the loss get another game and play on.

    Although I agree with you for the most part, the only difference is if the game is not made anymore. At that point the only way to own the game is through the secondary market. Some games still go down after production stops, but some can go up.

    #40 4 years ago

    It takes cash to move my games and plenty of it. Which people seem to have in abundance these days. Been listing some pins (which are in excellent condition). I get 2 types of emails. I'm either $2000 too high or I'll be by to pick it up, no haggle. This economy has people in the mood of if they want it, they aren't going to let $1000 or more keep them from getting it.

    16
    #41 4 years ago

    Why does everyone looking to buy a game think they are entitled to some great deal. Prices would likely start slightly lower if sellers didn't have to deal with so many lowball tire kickers.

    #42 4 years ago

    If you want a cheap machine your 8 years to late, sorry but that was the time to be collecting.

    #43 4 years ago
    Quoted from pinbum:

    If you want a cheap machine your 8 years to late, sorry but that was the time to be collecting.

    There is much truth in this

    While I complain about prices, I usually make money whenever I sell a pin especially if I've had it a few years. Right now I am clearing a few out, so high prices aren't killing me. That said, at today's prices I'm less likely to take a chance on a marginal title. I'll let the new guys hoard the $1800 Gold Wings and $3000 Demolition Man pins. (I'm not saying they are bad titles, just hard to move at those prices)

    I'm just saving my money for the dip in prices when the boomers start dropping.

    #44 4 years ago

    I've been both a cheap ass buyer, and a greedy seller - sometimes in the same day! You can sell high or you can sell fast; rarely both st the same time. Sellers need to be able to walk away from a semi-serious buyer . Buyers need to be able to walk away from a sale if it's over their budget. Prices are going up. They aren't making too many more of these games! ( I suppose MM and AFM excepted .

    #45 4 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Buyers are always gonna think sellers are being greedy, ...
    The only way to avoid the games is to buy NIB, brand new, in production machines.

    Yup no one thinks NIB are too much these days

    #46 4 years ago

    So many people end up with a pin from someones basement or a relative then they find games online for 8k and they think a 1.5k game must be worth at least half the 8k of the game they found so they ask for 5k and think they will get a buyer easy.

    #47 4 years ago

    i'm glad I was in the hobby in the late 90's and early 2000's.
    I bought a congo for $800, a whitewater for $1100, a getaway for $1k, saw a TZ with no display [complete otherwise] sell for $400 etc. etc. etc.
    I've owned almost all the 90's Williams. couldn't imagine trying to own them all now. ugh.

    A super nice game is going to sell for super nice money. a lot/most people on pinside don't have deep enough pockets to own those games that are super nice HUO or restored to better than new condition and therefore think the seller is trying to gouge on price. These buyers that complain couldn't do the restores themselves in 100 years [and do it right] and have NO IDEA the time and work and money it takes to make a machine look and play new again.

    Granted, there's people selling average games at a premium price, but just because a machine is expensive you shouldn't automatically assume the seller is gouging.

    #48 4 years ago

    The funniest part to me is all of the people expecting great deals that then turn around a try to resell the game for more then the price they were just certain as a buyer is way to much.

    #49 4 years ago

    If you're already in the hobby and have a decent number of pins, when you buy and sell, it's all relative. Yes it hurts to lay out say $3000 for a T2, but if you're selling at the same time, you're riding the same wave upwards. Where this hurts is for people new to the hobby. They get excited, start buying, you know the drill, don't have the same perspective as someone who remembers back to prices before the mayhem. Demand > Supply (and the $ spiral upwards of JJP and Stern new pins) keeps the prices climbing.

    #50 4 years ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Yup no one thinks NIB are too much these days

    My point being there's no haggling or mystery. Price is the price.

    There are 136 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.

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