(Topic ID: 123249)

Whoa Nellie mind change!


By shooterlane

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 142 posts
  • 59 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by pinwiztom
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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There are 142 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 3.
#51 4 years ago

ccotenj, what is a good EM to start with? A co-worker has a Spirit of 76 they said they said I could have, but doesn't work, they said it is in great shape, just a lil dirty. Is that a good one to start with? Looks cool. Price is obviously right.

#52 4 years ago

I think you would be happier with a Bally El Toro.

#53 4 years ago

I agree this game is not for everyone, then again no machine is for everyone. I played Wrestlemania and I would not have one. Others may like it but it's not for me. Whoa Nellie is very entertaining and that's what I like in my games. Some are into the complexity of a game, they would likely pass on this game. Talking with the guy from Marco I don't believe the price of the game will be $6500 but lower. My recommendation, play the game and see what the final price will be before you decide.

SL

#54 4 years ago
Quoted from shooterlane:

I agree this game is not for everyone, then again no machine is for everyone. I played Wrestlemania and I would not have one. Others may like it but it's not for me. Whoa Nellie is very entertaining and that's what I like in my games. Some are into the complexity of a game, they would likely pass on this game. Talking with the guy from Marco I don't believe the price of the game will be $6500 but lower. My recommendation, play the game and see what the final price will be before you decide.
SL

I would agree 100%, only this game is double what it should be priced at to even fall into that "try it before you knock it" category. I have no doubt it is an awesome game. Just horribly overpriced. The only way I'd pay that much for one of these is if it came with the girl.

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#55 4 years ago
Quoted from thedefog:

ccotenj, what is a good EM to start with? A co-worker has a Spirit of 76 they said they said I could have, but doesn't work, they said it is in great shape, just a lil dirty. Is that a good one to start with? Looks cool. Price is obviously right.

wow, too many to choose from....

i'm HIGHLY HIGHLY biased towards single player games, so i'm not the best one to ask about multiplayers...

#56 4 years ago

Spirit of 76 is a great game. Nothing like getting the quadrupal bonus for 60,000.

Gottliebs ain't the best for newbies though if they are non-working. Really no EM is.

#57 4 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Gottliebs ain't the best for newbies though if they are non-working. Really no EM is.

Nonsense. Gottliebs are great, and fixing EMs isn't that hard, just takes a little patience and a willingness to learn and ask questions. There's awesome support for all that here on Pinside.

I speak from experience. Everyone who wants an EM has to have a "first" one some time.

#58 4 years ago
Quoted from cody_chunn:

That's the point. It still has the gobbler but it doesn't gobble any more.

Sounds like my buddy's wife.

#59 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Sounds like my buddy's wife.

Sure... Your "buddy's" wife

#60 4 years ago
Quoted from FrederikFrost:

Sure... Your "buddy's" wife

I'm not married.

That's why I don't need anyone's approval for anything.

If I want it, I buy it. Guilt free.

#61 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I'm not married.
That's why I don't need anyone's approval for anything.
If I want it, I buy it. Guilt free.

even though i AM married, my wife fully knew what she was getting into... she knew i'd never be anything more than 15 year old in an adult body...

i too buy without guilt...

#62 4 years ago
Quoted from CactusJack:

I think you would be happier with a Bally El Toro.

No you don't! I thought you were holding that one for me.

#63 4 years ago

Student Prince then...

#64 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I'm not married.
That's why I don't need anyone's approval for anything.
If I want it, I buy it. Guilt free.

I'm married and I still buy machines or any other junks guilt free. I just don't want it at this price.

#65 4 years ago

My Crescendo plays just as well with more interesting stuff to shoot at, to me anyways.... The only advantage this thing is going to have over most EM's is serviceability. Putting in a real chime unit would go a long way towards relieving the ear-grating sounds which is mostly due to the fact they use ONE tone..and ONE TONE ONLY...hello? EM's usually have three chimes guys. I don't know about woodrails since they are usually bells, but the just one tone is a real kick in the nuts. If you're going to half-ass make it a modern game, then just get over it and put sound effects and stuff in.

#66 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

even though i AM married, my wife fully knew what she was getting into... she knew i'd never be anything more than 15 year old in an adult body...
i too buy without guilt...

got me beat by 3 years, I think I stopped at 12.

#67 4 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

Putting in a real chime unit would go a long way towards relieving the ear-grating sounds which is mostly due to the fact they use ONE tone..and ONE TONE ONLY...hello?

Rumor has it they will be putting chime units in the upcoming Kiss machine and leaving out all those other annoying noises.

#68 4 years ago
Quoted from gprotein:

I just don't want it at this price.

Then, it's simply not the game for you.

#69 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Then, it's simply not the game for you.

It's not for a nib, but I never said it won't be for a HUO when the price makes sense for this novelty pin.

#70 4 years ago

They are only making 500 of them, so it could be the next TronLE.

$12K by Christmas, the people began shouting........

#71 4 years ago
Quoted from thedefog:

The real question is, at $5.5K, why not just grab a real kick-ass EM for 1/10th that? I think my next game/project is definitely going to be an EM, solely for reasons of skillful play and because I know nothing about them.

I have been toying with the idea of getting my first EM What are some good ones in your opinion?

#72 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

They are only making 500 of them, so it could be the next TronLE.
$12K by Christmas, the people began shouting........

HUO TRON LE went below $5k right after it came out, and eventually went up to where it's now. And they made 400 of them, but I'm sure you knew that.

#73 4 years ago
Quoted from kporter946286:

I have been toying with the idea of getting my first EM What are some good ones in your opinion?

Galahad is a most popular title.

#74 4 years ago
Quoted from gprotein:

HUO TRON LE went below $5k right after it came out, and eventually went up to where it's now. I'm sure you knew that.

Yep, I paid $5300 NIB and it peaked at 12K for a NIB, before the rumors about the vault edition reared their head, killing it's value.

Hopefully WNBJM jumps in value the same way.

#75 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

They are only making 500 of them, so it could be the next TronLE.
$12K by Christmas, the people began shouting........

Where did you get the 500 number? I asked Greg that at TPF and he said the size of the production hadn't been determined yet and was going to depend on demand/reaction from enthusiasts at upcoming shows.

#76 4 years ago
Quoted from jfh:

Where did you get the 500 number? I asked Greg that at TPF and he said the size of the production hadn't been determined yet and was going to depend on demand/reaction from enthusiasts at upcoming shows.

My distributor said there was only 500 being produced.

Nothing stops Stern from making more if it's a runaway hit (think TRON).

#77 4 years ago

if they can sell more than 500 of them, i would imagine they will figure out a way to build more of them... imagine, not know...

that being said, let us see if they sell the first 500... as we discussed earlier, no one got into this project to lose money... we shall see if their market research was correct...

#78 4 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

Putting in a real chime unit would go a long way towards relieving the ear-grating sounds which is mostly due to the fact they use ONE tone..and ONE TONE ONLY...hello? EM's usually have three chimes guys. I don't know about woodrails since they are usually bells, but the just one tone is a real kick in the nuts. If you're going to half-ass make it a modern game, then just get over it and put sound effects and stuff in.

This couldn't be more incorrect.

#79 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Yep, I paid $5300 NIB and it peaked at 12K for a NIB, before the rumors about the vault edition reared their head, killing it's value.
Hopefully WNBJM jumps in value the same way.

Don't worry, it won't, not a LE. And VE will kill any hope of jumping value.

#80 4 years ago
Quoted from gprotein:

Don't worry, it won't, not a LE. And VE will kill any hope of jumping value.

lol

#81 4 years ago

I would think about getting this game - I would like to play it first. I wonder if it will be at California Extreme. If it is there I might have to make it up to that show.

#82 4 years ago
Quoted from DennisNordman:

This couldn't be more incorrect.

Yeah, it really needs bells!

#83 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Yeah, it really needs bells!

I dunno, i thought the sounds really fit the theme of the game pretty well.
There's some fun stuff in there.

#84 4 years ago
Quoted from joelreeves:

I dunno, i thought the sounds really fit the theme of the game pretty well.
There's some fun stuff in there.

Could be. I haven't played it yet. But when Stern announced it months ago it was supposed to have those sounds, bells and a real cowbell. That sparked my interest. It is said the bells were deleted because they couldn't be turned off by operators or something like that, but on my games with bells all I have to do is pull a plug so I won't have them going while working on it.

#85 4 years ago

I will add that by not having real bells, it has turned off some people that might have otherwise been interested in owning one. But those are business decisions that are made and the makers of these machines tend to know what they are doing.

#86 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Yeah, it really needs bells!

More bells!

#87 4 years ago

I too didn't think I would like the game but I had so much fun playing it at TPF. I have never played an EM that felt that good to flip. Almost everyone I talked to that wasn't hung up on the price enjoyed the hell out of it, and it is absolutely beautiful.

I for one am VERY HAPPY that Dennis and Greg didn't play the suckers game of cutting corners trying to chase a lower price point. The truth is that this game will always be compared to how many used EM's you can buy for the price, and that is a battle you just can't win building new games in 2015. Look at Retro Pinball's King of Diamonds. That too was a beautiful game built and sold for what some WNBJM critics claim is a magic price point for a game like this: mid $3k. They sold only 55 of them, and at the time all you heard was that you could go grab an original for $400, plus several other great EM's for the same money.

Greg and Dennis pushed as hard as they could in the direction of a collectable, playable piece of art. They didn't cut corners anywhere. They insisted on non-standard cabinets with wood rails and a wood lockdown bar, and every game coming with both legs and the fruit crate, and additional trim to hide the leg holes when on the crate. They pushed for preserving the details, and it was the smart move. They will get the game THEY envisioned out there, not some bastardized version with all the charm cut out just so they could get a low margin price point that probably wouldn't sell much better anyway.

So go ahead, continue bitching about the price, and ignore that it is a fun, beautiful, thoughtfully designed game. It isn't going to bother Gary, Dennis, or Greg one bit, because there is a market for fun, beautiful, thoughtfully designed games, even if they are expensive. Most of us just aren't in it, but don't worry, they'll still crank out plenty of product for the rest of us. In the mean time, we all get to live in a world where this game is available to play it it's current state, and not a state where it was designed by people chasing a low price point. I'm sure in that reality, pinside would be thrilled with all the compromises they made to get to that perfect mid $3k price point, and these things would have sold like hot cakes.

#88 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Galahad is a most popular title.

Bally game #866. My first pin!

#89 4 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

I too didn't think I would like the game but I had so much fun playing it at TPF. I have never played an EM that felt that good to flip. Almost everyone I talked to that wasn't hung up on the price enjoyed the hell out of it, and it is absolutely beautiful.

I hope I get to play it sometime soon.

#90 4 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Bally game #866. My first pin!

Let's see that receipt again. The dudes on the glass are far out.

#91 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Sounds like my buddy's wife.

you talkin' about me again ?!?

#92 4 years ago

DennisNordman (and Greg too!):

I really *want* to buy WNBJM. Visually, and tactilely, the game is a real work of art. I have visions of buying the game, bringing it home, swapping out the cold whites for warm whites, and enjoying the hell of it. This is an absolutely beautiful machine; and I'd love it to be in my home.

The music, the callouts, and the sound effects ruin it for me.

I'm not sure what the original WNBJM sounded like; or the following 3 solid state versions. So it is unfair for me to compare it to anything else. But I can say that while the eyes see EM, the ears hearing cartoon sound effects just don't work. The effects, music, and callouts remind me of a bad episode of Scooby Doo. Starting from the "zoink" sound of the first rollover in the top lanes, then the squish sounds afterwords hitting the bumpers.

I could cope with digital versions of EM-like sounds, if I could turn off the music and callouts. If that's an option, I'll call my favorite dealer immediately. Otherwise, I've gotta wait this one out. And hope someone figures out how to wire things up mechanically; and hope at that time I can get my hands on the melons.

#93 4 years ago

Well are you guys sure you are enjoying it for game-play or for the stiffy in your pocket?

#94 4 years ago

ok,
Here's my thoughts on this game after playing for 3 days.

It's purdy.
Game play is interesting.
I'm not sure the incline was right as the game was a bit slow. But maybe it's meant to be that way.
The playfield roll-over lights above the poppers start off lit, and you have to get the ball to roll over them to turn the light off and activate the coordinating popper scoring below. That was neat. You can't use the flippers to cycle the un/lit lights to be where the ball is heading, so it takes more time & work. That's interesting.

Definitely some skill shot practice needed to hit certain roll-overs to maximize points. Liked that. The primary colors are vivid and the playfield is really well lit. good job on that for sure. Think we've all had/have games where lighting could use some help.

I didn't spend enough time staring at this part, but there's a little LCD-looking display on the bottom-left of the apron that gives different kinds of read-outs for different reasons. I should have studied that better, but it's easy to turn into an A.D.D person at TPF.

There's a saucer on the top-right of the playfield that takes some time & skill to get good at shooting. I like how it's designed to allow the ball to roll-over the saucer, go into the little dog-house design and roll back slowly into the saucer. The rubbers surrounding the dog-house enclosure were worn to hell. Not sure how long they've been there. But this game has seen some serious play time in it's short life, or those rubbers are cheap quality. i dunno...

During several of my games, the darned ball would end up getting caught between the flipper and a post. I think a big part of that is related to the slow speed (low momentum) of the ball overall during game-play. And just placement of playfield parts. (see pic). didn't try to do it. just after several occurrences, i though a pic was something to do.

I didn't have any of those problems with the ball getting sent back into the shooter lane, like seen on that initial demo video of the game right off the line.

Someone reminded me (Gov?) that the ink on the playfield is really not level. Might be wrong, but think the black lines were very raised, to the point of influencing the ball in game play.

Overall, it's definitely eye candy color & light popping. Game play is slow, but has some entertaining design elements. I'd definitely play it more to just try and master the game. I'd say that's a surprising positive. I've got a ton of pins, some NIB, other's pricey as hell, but this game doesn't compel me to pay it's price. Especially after paying less for TRON LE NIB. Just a thought...

Hope that helps

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#95 4 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

I'd definitely play it more

Well that's encouraging

#96 4 years ago

I can't wait for this. I'm a big Nordman fan. There will be one of these on location at Lanes and Games in Cambridge, MA as soon as I can get one.

-3
#97 4 years ago
Quoted from DennisNordman:

This couldn't be more incorrect.

While I respect you as a designer, I don't have to respect the changes that Stern made. As an EM, I was in. As a boutique product that's been modified to meet Stern's needs to sell a game, I'm out. Sorry if you have an issue with that, Dennis.

Game looks fantastic and plays great, but the sounds are F---KING ANNOYING MAN. They are BY FAR a bigger detriment to the overall package than removing the gobble hole and adding LEDs.

#98 4 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

While I respect you as a designer, I don't have to respect the changes that Stern made.

Did you not make it to Dennis and Greg's presentation?
All this and mOrE were covered...

For those that might of missed it.
Top of page 19 if you will, for a mini review.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/whoa-nellie-big-juicy-melons-confirmed-pricing/page/19

I guess I should have clarified butter, there WILL be an EM setting for those that crave a more "traditional" WNBJM.

The true beauty of this pin will be in it's flexibility.
Being able to set it up based on mood and or, pinheads/persons visiting, is why I'm attracted to it.
Did I mention it's fun to play?

#99 4 years ago
Quoted from NimblePin:

Did you not make it to Dennis and Greg's presentation?
All this and mOrE were covered...
For those that might of missed it.
Top of page 19 if you will.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/whoa-nellie-big-juicy-melons-confirmed-pricing/page/19#post-2346174
I guess I should have clarified butter, there WILL be an EM setting for those that crave a more "traditional" WNBJM.

No...I was stuck in the tournament area all weekend..

I'll check this out when I get a moment.

#100 4 years ago

Okay, so some good info there..

Good: Being able to add chimes/bells (Hopefully documentation is really good on this.. type of coils needed etc..), adjustable coil strengths (woohoo, finally! That's a much needed improvement that all future Spike games will hopefully benefit from as well.), score reel improvements (I didn't think the steppers were an issue on the one I saw.. it wasn't buttery smooth like Retro KOD, thankfully.).

Really cool that someone is out there building chime units for 120 bucks..

I still think the price is too high for what it is. I would have much rather been offered the option to buy the crate, or the decals for the crate and fabricate my own, than to pay hundreds (or more) to Stern for one. Given it was a Stern built game, I don't really feel like all of the wood trim was "necessary" either, but in the end, it's awesome that Dennis/Greg were able to negotiate that into being on the game with Stern and bust them out of their mold. Game feels great when playing it.

Just still not seeing the cost-to-value ratio on it for me, especially having to add stuff aftermarket. Time will tell if other people feel the same.

*Edit* Bring on the thumbs down, beetches.

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