(Topic ID: 214657)

Who is second guessing their jjp potc preorder

By bigd1979

6 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 677 posts
  • 186 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by bemmett
  • Topic is favorited by 14 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Are you gonna cancel your order if the new spinning disk configuration stays?”

  • Yes 230 votes
    62%
  • No 71 votes
    19%
  • Gonna wait it out till my order is ready and then decide 68 votes
    18%

(369 votes)

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Post #15 Video from the designer explaining the changes Posted by bigd1979 (6 years ago)


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#185 6 years ago

This announcement is just strange, especially the way it was presented. It’s something that I could see Stern pulling but am flat out floored with it coming from JJP.

Nothing is 100% reliable and that is a fact. They just need to get it to the point where it is 90% reliable and can be tweaked/adjusted or minor repair and back in business. Like the POA in Indy, can be a pain in the ass at times but when it works it’s great.

They need to get this right and not make such a knee jerk decision. I for one won’t be buying a DI if I cancel my order. Game does nothing for me.

Money will likely go to Stern for multiple new games.

#198 6 years ago
Quoted from Pinwiz23:

People, I wouldn’t do something rash and cancel your preorder because of the spinning disc change. There’s still a spinning map that throws the ball around and the animations that go with it are top-notch.
This is going to be an EPIC game and might even be BETTER without the triple discs (which never worked right, were screaming loud, and weren’t even coded yet btw).
People have been saying that this is the most jam packed, innovative, and deeply coded machine we’ve ever seen. And it still is.

Couldn’t the decision by JJP be considered rash? Heck, we are the customer spending the money so I would say our opinion matters.

Don’t reveal and publicize features if you can’t follow through.

Poor way to run a business, this will hurt them.

#202 6 years ago
Quoted from ejg10532626:

I played the 3 disk center at the Las Vegas Amusement Expo and thought that part was, by far, the best part of the game.
Was really great...
Shame.

It doesn’t hurt that it was visually appealing and nice to look at either!

They replaced it with spinning barf splatter!

#221 6 years ago
Quoted from pinaholic:

The disc was cool but in gameplay I'm not sure the multi disk would afect the ball so much as a single one. It looked cool. I want to play it. I'd rather have magnets.

It really doesn’t help that the new art on the single wheel is looking like absolute shit. No animated trunk either.

They are taking the easy way out.

#227 6 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

I dunno, the video from the designer is pretty final and self-explanatory:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jjpotc-updates-for-production
The depressing part is where he is introducing the new wheel, had nothing good to say about it and ends up at "You can see the art there and how it looks...um <sharp head nod>...and there it is" then moves on. He's clearly not happy about the situation.

I thought it was sort of a half ass way to make such a big announcement and may have been better received coming from Jack himself and a little more substance as to why this decision was made. As you point out in your post, body language says a lot and I get the impression this is coming from higher up and may have nothing to do with reliability even though Eric said that.

Just my hunch

#229 6 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

It's a lot in unearned dollars, but in percentage terms likely 5% or less of total lifetime sales. The real dollars opportunity cost to fix it may be more expensive than just taking the lumps now.

Partially true but they do have a fixed cost of licensing, development and materials that they are on the hook for. This machine hasn’t earned them anything back yet.
At 10k I think many will pull the plug if something isn’t fixed.
They don’t sell thousands of any of their titles, we are talking several hundreds over lifetime and if 100+ cancel in near term this is a BIG problem.

#235 6 years ago
Quoted from JJHLH:

Wow, I’m surprised to hear that. I always figured they sold at least a thousand of each of their titles. If they only sell hundreds then losing sales would be even more painful.

I’m just taking a guess but Di has 420 owners on pinside and that includes operator locations. Can’t see how they have sold thousands. Woz is at 1100 and hobbit around 580 pinsiders and locations.
They just aren’t super high volume is the point I was trying to make.

#242 6 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

JJP sells in the thousands - multiple thousands sometimes. Anyone telling you otherwise is a moron. You don't re-up the WoZ license again if it's not selling well.

I think multiple thousands is an awfully strong statement. I would truly be amazed if they have sold more than 2000-2500 Woz.

#243 6 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

Pinside is not the world. JJP is definitely selling more than in the hundreds per game.

True but it is a pretty large segment of a relatively small hobby/gaming world community.

Edit - as I stated the point I was trying to make is they aren’t Stern. They maybe do one title per year or so and aren’t a super high volume producer. If there is a serious blunder it could be devastating to JJP.

#250 6 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

Pirates really screwed up Jack's plan to have 2018 be the year they finally get to 2 titles released a year. His goal is to get to three a year. With his deep-pocket's investor he has the capital to do it. JJP just has to get through the growing pains. They're condensing the decades of growth and learning of Stern and Bally/Williams into a very short time and it's not always going to be smooth sailing. But kudos to them for plugging away at it and raising the bar for EVERYONE in the process. You wouldn't have seen a PRO Iron Maiden that looks as good it does without JJP and AP heating up the expectations of the market.

They make great machines. I hope they come up with a reasonable solution for POTC.
I was really excited for this one, especially as my first JJP machine in the collection.
I’m not cancelling yet but if that replacement disk stays, I’m out.
The chest, I’m not too concerned about.

#254 6 years ago
Quoted from dnapac:

I hope JJP is reading pinside...that would solve the problem of playfields already being printed...outer wheel art work fitting with the fix...as well as the problems supposedly associated with the original wheel. Coding should be easier as well. Plus, would be innovative. Maybe not a triple spinner, but look like it belongs.

Exactly, whatever they do it needs to look like it belongs. What they showed has no place being on that machine.

#271 6 years ago
Quoted from foureyedcharlie:

Time to retheme it Goonies and call it a day.

That would really be awesome!

#274 6 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

I'm sorry, but you can't charge the prices they're asking for these games and then rip out one of the two biggest selling points at the last minute. You just can't do that and expect people to be okay with that and no price change?
I played it at TPF, I had a MASSIVE game that went on for 30-45 minutes, so I got a very good feel for how the triple disc mech played when it was working correctly. It. Was. Amazing. I've seen magnets do some fun stuff, but you know what I've never seen in pinball before?
The ball take a path down the middle of the playfield that looked like \/\ <--that but vertical, within an inch and a half constraint. The ball came STDM, and literally changed direction THREE TIMES and STILL ended up in the middle because it faked me out and I mis-flipped. It was hilarious, and over in a second and a half. Really disappointing...it was looking like the best JJP title so far, now it's just the next Dialed In to me.
Pachislo and other slot machines have had stepper controlled reels that can spin in both directions, stop where the game wants it to stop without it being obvious to the player, and backlit RGB for *years*. The only difference here is size and weight aside from a ball rolling around on top of it, but when you'd need it to critically stop to reward a mystery, wouldn't the ball be in a scoop or something!? ...it sounds to me like they just haven't done proper engineering for that mech.

This is the rub against the grain for me.. not that I was ever a buyer, but as a follower of the market and a player. Stern did a similar thing with Star Trek...anyone remember that? The VUK on the premium/pro on that left side was supposed to somehow shoot the ball up onto the warp ramp? They found out in testing that it wasn't reliable when you couldn't guarantee a solid electrical system on location, and pulled it out of the game. But you know the difference? They didn't bring it to the biggest shows around the country, or even show it on promotional material BEFORE they pulled it. =| Star Trek was disappointing, but this completely guts the soul of this game, I feel like. The upper right mini playfield is more annoying than fun to me. It's neat, but it's a chore. The triple-disc introduced a lot of random ball pathing that the game DESPARATELY needs and a single disc ain't going to cut it.

Well said and excellent points.

#342 6 years ago
Quoted from SilverballNut:

Calculator is my friend: $1,738,500

Ouch....... and remember pinside is a small part of the overall community as I was explained. Lol

Criticism is good, if nobody complained on here chances are that JJP would just ram the shitty art spinner down our throat.

#376 6 years ago

Still looks like dog shit to me although with a hidden mickey.

#559 6 years ago

The whole situation is pretty wonky if you ask me. I’m almost to the point where I can move on from the triple disc even though I’m disappointed. It appears the new art will be a good bit better then the barf look we saw! Lol

The trunk really has me scratching my head though. Just seems perhaps they spent so much time trying to get the disc to work and ran out of time on the trunk and said F’it.

Even though this is a minor toy, it’s just so half assed for them to do that.

Make the son of a bitch work please!

#580 6 years ago

What's next? Ship isn't as reliable as they thought so they make it stationary! But hey, you still get to shoot a cannon, lol!

For 10k, the chest ought to work as intended.

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