(Topic ID: 293642)

Who Dunnit Switch issue

By Watkinsd13

2 years ago



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#1 2 years ago

I recently got a Who dunnit with the reels not working (go figure) but I have got all the motors working and wheels good but the far right reel sensor is not working.

I have:
• made sure it is not the sensor. I moved it to the other reels and works great.

•when the board is unplugged it registers as closed even though the other two reels register as open when unplugged

•followed the lines to the cpu and checked power, everything checks out there

•followed the lines to the board by the front left of the playfield and everything seems to check out there.

•switched the j206/j207 and j208/j209 and the problem is still there

I’m not sure what I am missing or what I have tried that is right trouble shooting. I have been working on pinball machines and fixed some assembly’s, flippers, switches, and soldering but still new to a lot of the troubleshooting so please bear with me with me. Any help is greatly appreciated!

#2 2 years ago

If you can provide close up pictures of all the area where j206/207 and j208/209 are, so we can check for corrosion on the board.

You say with the board unplugged it registers as closed. Where was it unplugged? Go back to the test screen and disconnect J206 / J208. Is the error still present? If so, it would mean that the issue is on the board itself.

Do you have a multi meter or a logic probe? What's the switch number that has issues ? I'll will be easier to follow the schematic and manual with the switch number.

#3 2 years ago
Quoted from Roamin:

If you can provide close up pictures of all the area where j206/207 and j208/209 are, so we can check for corrosion on the board.
You say with the board unplugged it registers as closed. Where was it unplugged? Go back to the test screen and disconnect J206 / J208. Is the error still present? If so, it would mean that the issue is on the board itself.
Do you have a multi meter or a logic probe? What's the switch number that has issues ? I'll will be easier to follow the schematic and manual with the switch number.

I took photos. Something new happened when I turned the machine on, popped up saying to check fusses and switch, I’m going to post a photo.I havnt checked that yet. I unplugged j206/208 and the error goes away. When i plugged it back in switch 46 that should be open started blinking closed. The switch for the slot is switch 48 but it seems like there’s several things going on. I do have a multimeter!

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#4 2 years ago

Check the fuse and your voltages first and make sure everything is in order. Always check fuses by testing continuity and not only visually. If the error is not present with J206/J208 removed , then it's a wiring/playfield issue and not the CPU board. Did you try disconnecting J5 from the 16 opto board ? If you disconnect J5 and the error goes away , then the issue is on the opto board itself , most likely U4 (common LM339). Pin 13 of U4 should go high / low when the opto opens and closes. You can measure voltage at pin 13 and compare it with pin 14 when you open/close switch 47 "enter right hole". You also said switch 46 showed open/closed flickering, and it is on the same IC. This all really leads to U4 on the opto board.

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#5 2 years ago
Quoted from Roamin:

Check the fuse and your voltages first and make sure everything is in order. Always check fuses by testing continuity and not only visually. If the error is not present with J206/J208 removed , then it's a wiring/playfield issue and not the CPU board. Did you try disconnecting J5 from the 16 opto board ? If you disconnect J5 and the error goes away , then the issue is on the opto board itself , most likely U4 (common LM339). Pin 13 of U4 should go high / low when the opto opens and closes. You can measure voltage at pin 13 and compare it with pin 14 when you open/close switch 47 "enter right hole". You also said switch 46 showed open/closed flickering, and it is on the same IC. This all really leads to U4 on the opto board.[quoted image]

Okay. No more fuse issue at the moment. I checked them and everything seems good to go now. I do still have all the other issues though.

I disconnected j5 and all of the switches in test menu read open so that means the issue is on the opto board?

When you say to test “pin 13 of U4” how do I know which pin that is or is it the 13th pin on the 16 wire j5?

I have really never done anything to do with boards so it’s a bit confusing but I will also see if I can read or watch a video on testing something similar to the LM339. Thank you so much again!

#6 2 years ago

Okay I looked it up and you mean these pins? I’m also looking up how to test it with the multimeter.

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#7 2 years ago

Roamin so I was trying to test pin 13 and 14 but I guess I am doing something not correct. I try to test them but I very sporadically get a reading on 13 and nothing from 14.

But while I blocked the enter right hole I noticed the closed square on 48 went away which is great because I do not have the slot opto plugged in.

I then plugged in the opto for 48 and it registers open/closed but only when 47 is open.

Does this still keep it on the 16opto board or move the problem?

#8 2 years ago

Yes, those are the correct pins to measure. You need to measure DC volts (straight lines on a multi meter), the black probe on the ground, which is pin 12 and then red probe on pin 13. The ground can be found all over the board / machine. It is also found at pin 13 of J5 of the opto board. An open switch you would read 12 volts and a closed switch it would drop to 0 volts. Getting nothing on 14 means it's closed. But you just said that 48 actually works when 47 is "open" ?

I'm confused. You blocked (closed) switch 47 and at that moment 48 "opened" correct ? After that you installed the opto in 48 and you can now trigger it open and closed but only when 47 is opened ? If you block (close) 47 again 48 stays closed and won't change at all ? Then if you unblock (open) 47 , switch 48 works as expected ?

I can't seem to find the wiring color for the optos, are the wires of the connector of opto 47 and 48 the same colors ? Can you provide a picture of those connectors ? I'm trying to figure out if the connector for 47 is wired incorrectly ? Does anything look modified or like it was worked on before ? If it's not wired wrong or different from the others, again it could be related to the LM339 acting up. Is the chip on a socket ? If the chips are on sockets , you can exchange u2 and u4 and see if the problems moves elsewhere. U4 is responsible for switches 45,46,47 and 48. It's very possible if it's broken that it acts up the way you described , working when another switch in the chip is in a different state.

I'm still blaming U4 It's a very common part. If it's not on a socket it would be a good idea to install a socket once the chip is removed.

Edit : if you move U2 and U4 , note the polarity of the chip (the notch on one side of the chip). Don't install a chip in reverse or you'll most likely break it.

#9 2 years ago

So the game says 47 and 48 are both closed (square on the dmd) when I block 47 the square for both of them turns to a dot and says they are open. If I continue to block 47 then plug in the opto on 48 then the 48 responds if I block it or not. The moment I unblock the opto on 47 they both turn to squares and say closed.

To add to this I have realized that I took all of the balls out and switch’s 31-35 are closed. I tried blocking them and they are not responsive but I have not had problems with this before.

I do not have any of that chip but will order some now with sockets and see if that can get something fixed!

The first image is 47. (Solid orange, grey and yellow, black, solid grey)

Second image is 48 (green yellow, grey and yellow, grey and white, black)

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#10 2 years ago

Roamin got some chips and sockets ordered so in a couple days, hopefully we get some positive results!

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