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(Topic ID: 57710)

WHITEWATER CLUB= Lifejackets not required


By Skypilot

7 years ago



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  • Latest reply 11 days ago by Lhyrgoif
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There are 5266 posts in this topic. You are on page 98 of 106.
#4851 6 months ago

Mine was at 234M

#4852 6 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

So, the people who just got Vacation Jackpot, how much was the jackpot value when you got it?
I've always been curious about how the Jackpot value increases. Normally, it starts at 200 million and goes up by 10,000 after each play, but at some point I think it starts to accelerate. When I bought my machine, it's value was around 750 million...which would be 55,000 plays at 10,000 each (and this assumes that no one had EVER reached VJ, and the machine had never been reset).
Considering that the machine was only 4 years old at the time, that number of plays seems unlikely.
Furthermore, I have seen a couple of other Whitewater machines with Jackpot values around 750 million also. This seems like too much of a coincidence.
As for how often I get VJ, I can make it about 20% of the time. I've gotten it twice in one game many times, and in one game (long ago) got it a third time. This is with standard 6.5 degree incline, normal tilt, and a "hard" outlane. Of course, I've been playing the machine for over 20 years, so I know all the angles and shots pretty well.

The Vacation Bonus base value is 200M. It is increased by 10K at the end of every game played. The only time you can see the Vacation Bonus value is as part of the attract mode on newer machines. On L-3 ROMs, it is not possible to apply the 5X Playfield to the Vacation Bonus - the game merely awards the 200M+change value.

Note: there seems to be some sort of unusual bug which very rarely sets the Vacation Bonus value to exactly 799M. I have actually collected this value (sweet!), and have heard that it's been seen on at least one other machine as well. It seems unlikely that exactly 59,900 consecutive non-Vacation games had been played on two different machines...
----------------------------------------------------

Cows

There are three occurrences of Cows in Whitewater. The first is the fifth item found in Bigfoot's Cave during Bigfoot Hotfoot. Once you have collected that Cow, collecting the Mystery Canyon as a Whirlpool Award the next time during that game will replace the usual Whirlpool animation with a picture of the Spirit pulling a string on the legless Cow, which "MOO"s rather loudly. The picture is labeled "The Secret of the Cow". This picture also appears briefly in the Vacation Bonus award.

The Secret of the Cow is not worth any special points, despite my earlier claim that it was worth 10M.

The third cow in Whitewater is the famous Dueling Cows display, which can be obtained during attract mode. Make sure there are no credits on the machine. It may be necessary to power-cycle first on some machines. Then, press the flipper buttons and start button in the following sequence:

3L 1S 15R 1S 23L 1S
That spells COW. Try it.

#4853 6 months ago
Quoted from djreddog:

The Vacation Bonus base value is 200M. It is increased by 10K at the end of every game played. The only time you can see the Vacation Bonus value is as part of the attract mode on newer machines. On L-3 ROMs, it is not possible to apply the 5X Playfield to the Vacation Bonus - the game merely awards the 200M+change value.
Note: there seems to be some sort of unusual bug which very rarely sets the Vacation Bonus value to exactly 799M. I have actually collected this value (sweet!), and have heard that it's been seen on at least one other machine as well. It seems unlikely that exactly 59,900 consecutive non-Vacation games had been played on two different machines...
----------------------------------------------------
Cows
There are three occurrences of Cows in Whitewater. The first is the fifth item found in Bigfoot's Cave during Bigfoot Hotfoot. Once you have collected that Cow, collecting the Mystery Canyon as a Whirlpool Award the next time during that game will replace the usual Whirlpool animation with a picture of the Spirit pulling a string on the legless Cow, which "MOO"s rather loudly. The picture is labeled "The Secret of the Cow". This picture also appears briefly in the Vacation Bonus award.
The Secret of the Cow is not worth any special points, despite my earlier claim that it was worth 10M.
The third cow in Whitewater is the famous Dueling Cows display, which can be obtained during attract mode. Make sure there are no credits on the machine. It may be necessary to power-cycle first on some machines. Then, press the flipper buttons and start button in the following sequence:
3L 1S 15R 1S 23L 1S
That spells COW. Try it.

moo

#4854 6 months ago

Unfortunately, since many (most?) people are using the free-play-only home ROMS, they can never see the dueling cows, since pressing the start button will always start a new game before the cow sequence can be completed.

That is interesting info about the VJ jackpot...where is that quoted from?

#4855 6 months ago

My VJ was at 294 mil. I assume by the high scores that it was collected a few times before I got my machine. On the L6 rom does the 5X playfield work on all jackpots? I have the L4 and I noticed on whitewater multiball with the 5X running I didnt get 5 times those jackpots. I was so excited to line those up!

#4856 6 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Unfortunately, since many (most?) people are using the free-play-only home ROMS, they can never see the dueling cows, since pressing the start button will always start a new game before the cow sequence can be completed.
That is interesting info about the VJ jackpot...where is that quoted from?

Pinball.org

#4857 6 months ago

anybody got any used ramps and mountains for sale?

#4858 6 months ago
Quoted from CWiehler:

My VJ was at 294 mil. I assume by the high scores that it was collected a few times before I got my machine. On the L6 rom does the 5X playfield work on all jackpots? I have the L4 and I noticed on whitewater multiball with the 5X running I didnt get 5 times those jackpots. I was so excited to line those up!

Actually, you should have gotten the 5X on the whitewater multiball. However, there are a few caveats to that.

If you start the multiball with 5X mode running, you will get 5X jackpots, but only a MAXIMUM of 5X. Meaning that instead of getting 1X, 2X and 3X jackpots, you get 5X jackpots. So, if you would normally get a triple jackpot, you get a 5X jackpot - not a 15X jackpot.

Also, on the non-home ROMs (I think all versions), the 5X timer is running during the whole "WHITEWATER!" starting animation (which lasts about 8 seconds or so). This means that unless you have at least 10 seconds left in 5X mode, it will probably be over before you can get a ball up the ramp.

On the home ROMs, the timer is disabled during most of the animations, giving you a lot more time to score those 5X jackpots.

Additionally, the 5X multiplier does NOT affect the Vacation Jackpot in any way.

#4859 6 months ago

I'd like to see a home rom with the ability to turn off freeplay. I'm a big fan of tokens, but I really like LH6

#4860 6 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Actually, you should have gotten the 5X on the whitewater multiball. However, there are a few caveats to that.
If you start the multiball with 5X mode running, you will get 5X jackpots, but only a MAXIMUM of 5X. Meaning that instead of getting 1X, 2X and 3X jackpots, you get 5X jackpots. So, if you would normally get a triple jackpot, you get a 5X jackpot - not a 15X jackpot.
Also, on the non-home ROMs (I think all versions), the 5X timer is running during the whole "WHITEWATER!" starting animation (which lasts about 8 seconds or so). This means that unless you have at least 10 seconds left in 5X mode, it will probably be over before you can get a ball up the ramp.
On the home ROMs, the timer is disabled during most of the animations, giving you a lot more time to score those 5X jackpots.
Additionally, the 5X multiplier does NOT affect the Vacation Jackpot in any way.

So if I understand correctly, if you have 5X running as you start multiball there is no reason to try for a double or triple jackpot--just hit the singles?

#4861 6 months ago
Quoted from Billy16:

So if I understand correctly, if you have 5X running as you start multiball there is no reason to try for a double or triple jackpot--just hit the singles?

No, that's not quite correct. You still want to get the triple if you can, because once the 5X timer runs out (which it quickly will) you can continue getting triple jackpots from then on, rather than just singles.

#4862 6 months ago
Quoted from Billy16:

So if I understand correctly, if you have 5X running as you start multiball there is no reason to try for a double or triple jackpot--just hit the singles?

There are no doubles or triples, just 5x.
Edit: but after 5x is over, there WILL be doubles or triples, whatever you hit out of the first 3

#4863 6 months ago
Quoted from yaksplat:

I'd like to see a home rom with the ability to turn off freeplay. I'm a big fan of tokens, but I really like LH6

Yes, I agree. The only other thing I don't like about LH-6 is the end of game "light and music show". On older ROMS, you only got the fancy music ending when you'd reached a high score. On LH-6, you get it whenever you have a "good" score.

Unfortunately, their idea of a "good" score is anything over about 30 million. This means it happens almost every time now. It went from being something cool and rare to something boring and common.

#4864 6 months ago
Quoted from yaksplat:

I'd like to see a home rom with the ability to turn off freeplay. I'm a big fan of tokens, but I really like LH6

Google for the LH6C Rom.

#4865 6 months ago
Quoted from yaksplat:

I'd like to see a home rom with the ability to turn off freeplay. I'm a big fan of tokens, but I really like LH6

Me too. I'd like to be able to turn off the game over music too.

#4866 6 months ago

One of my topper chase lights is out, and it isn't a bulb issue. I reflowed the solder on the socket as it was really dull looking, that didn't help. I replaced the socket, no luck. Can I swap the connector over from the other board to see if that will light up all the chase lights without harming anything. Seems like I should be able to do that, but wanted to check first.

#4867 5 months ago

When restoring my WH20, I wasn't happy with the existing custom instruction cards out there, so I made my own. These are sized to print on a full page. Hope you guys like them. If you're interested, feel free to check out the restoration here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLn29CzX_AETXsR-MOJN1mY38knt497QbX

InstructionCards (resized).png
#4868 5 months ago

Kind of funny that you included the side cabinet rivet in your bigfoot picture...

#4869 5 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Kind of funny that you included the side cabinet rivet in your bigfoot picture...

Dude, I just noticed that...LOL

#4870 5 months ago
Quoted from longwetsocks:

Dude, I just noticed that...LOL

easy fix with some editing software

#4871 5 months ago
Quoted from woody76:

easy fix with some editing software

You can say that again.

InstructionCards (resized).png
#4872 5 months ago

Finally got the vacation jackpot for the first time today. I see what everyone means about it looking like the game broke! Got my GC score of 1.4 billion and I have my new (correct size) coil stops I put in today to thank. I didn't realize how much a difference millimeters in coil stop length attributes to the throw of the flippers. Love this game!!

IMG_20200429_202945 (resized).jpgIMG_20200429_203631 (resized).jpgIMG_20200429_203642 (resized).jpg
#4873 5 months ago

Nice, congrats...

#4874 5 months ago

New in the club, got my game today. I've got some work fixing it up properly (its rather filthy inside but the PF looks ok).

I will rebuild the pop bumpers and was wondering if anyone tried blue skirts on them? I've tried to find some pictures of a Wh2o with blue skirts but my google-fu seem to be weak. Anyone have tried blue skirts and/or have some pictures to share?

Also, is this fastening of the red flasher dome how it's supposed to be done (that long single screw)? Its inside the mountain at the lost mine kickout. If not, then how should it be fastened? As half the red flasher dome is inside the mountain it doesn't stick up that much on the topside and it looks weird to me.
20200502_230601 (resized).jpg

#4875 5 months ago

So my dad was over and he wanted to know how to play White Water so we started up a two-player game. As I was talking him through it on how to play, I noticed my score kept climbing and climbing and I ended up with vacation jackpot and my second high score over a billion. Keep in mind that this was our first game on the table today! I don't know what it is, but whenever I am giving a tutorial on a game I always get an amazing score, anyone else the same? I need to start giving more tutorials...

IMG_20200502_202946 (resized).jpg
#4876 5 months ago

Got this skull thing, looking to trade for sideboard decals but would sell to reach the same end. Shoot me a PM.

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#4877 5 months ago

I know this might be hard to answer right off the bat but any advice on what screws to get if I want to replace most screws fastening the mountains and ramps to PF, edge rails, posts and so on? The current games screws are both worn and also seem wrong; some have normal washers, some have lockwashers, some have an extra flat base on the screw and some screws are without any washer at all. Any suggestion on screw types is appreciated.

#4878 5 months ago

Does anyone have the CPR mirrored back glass installed in their game? My translight is scratched up and weirdly stained and I’d like to replace it at some point. I kinda dig the idea of a mirrored one, but I’ve been hearing reports of poor color reproduction on some of their recent backglasses. Curious to see some pictures or hear some opinions.

#4879 5 months ago

I've also been thinking about getting a mirrored backglass, but I was wondering if it came with the trim. The trim on my game is kind of rough so I'll have to get new ones if the back glass doesn't come with them.

-1
#4880 5 months ago

Sorry, this may have been discussed long ago. I'm a new owner. Is anyone else a bit annoyed that the default action for the Whirlpool / Bigfoot's Cave shot is to divert the ball into the Whirlpool? Seems like that one change would have greatly improve the flow on the game. For a game about rafting down a river, I want to keep the flow.

#4881 5 months ago
Quoted from lpeters82:

Sorry, this may have been discussed long ago. I'm a new owner. Is anyone else a bit annoyed that the default action for the Whirlpool / Bigfoot's Cave shot is to divert the ball into the Whirlpool? Seems like that one change would have greatly improve the flow on the game. For a game about rafting down a river, I want to keep the flow.

Well, if the diverter were the opposite way, then the only time the ball would ever go into the whirlpool would be during Bigfoot Hotfoot. This would be weird as the Whirlpool is one of the main features. Furthermore, then there would also have to be a ramp stopper or something for when a boulder award is given so that the animation would be able to be seen.

Actually, this is the kind of thing that Williams was quite good at (and JJP sucks at). Williams would play the (main) animations only when the ball was "managed", so the player didn't have to worry about missing the ball while watching. Then they would give a nice flasher warning where the ball was going to pop out.

JJP machines like to do the opposite...they start a movie on that big backglass screen to get your attention, and then kick the ball out while you're not looking. When I play a JJP machine, I don't even try to watch the animations anymore, which makes having that huge screen kind of a waste.

#4882 5 months ago
Quoted from lpeters82:

I'm a new owner. Is anyone else a bit annoyed that the default action for the Whirlpool / Bigfoot's Cave shot is to divert the ball into the Whirlpool? Seems like that one change would have greatly improve the flow on the game. For a game about rafting down a river, I want to keep the flow.

Uh oh "new guy" is here to fix everything!

Just to be clear, you want the modes to start on the fly with no time for the game to explain what is going on?

#4883 5 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Well, if the diverter were the opposite way, then the only time the ball would ever go into the whirlpool would be during Bigfoot Hotfoot. This would be weird as the Whirlpool is one of the main features.

Sorry, perhaps I should have provided more detail. What I'm talking about is programming. I would prefer the diverter to only push the ball into the Whirlpool when starting modes and collect the Whirlpool Jackpot. There would be no change to either of those or Bigfoot Jackpot. The change would be when none of those are lit. Currently, those shots are diverted into the Whirlpool. I would prefer those shots go down the ramp, through Bigfoot's Cave, directly to the right flipper.

Quoted from TheLaw:

Just to be clear, you want the modes to start on the fly with no time for the game to explain what is going on?

No, that is not what I want.

#4884 5 months ago

Well the idea is that Bigfoot is trying to keep rafters out of his cave, so whenever you try going there he diverts you into the whirlpool. So the only way to get into his cave is to distract him and then sneak by while he's trying to extinguish his feet!

It may not be the absolute best thing in regards to flow, but I love this game's attention to detail and theme integration.

#4885 5 months ago
Quoted from lpeters82:

Sorry, perhaps I should have provided more detail. What I'm talking about is programming. I would prefer the diverter to only push the ball into the Whirlpool when starting modes and collect the Whirlpool Jackpot. There would be no change to either of those or Bigfoot Jackpot. The change would be when none of those are lit. Currently, those shots are diverted into the Whirlpool. I would prefer those shots go down the ramp, through Bigfoot's Cave, directly to the right flipper.

No, that is not what I want.

I know what you mean. There is a custom ROM floating around somewhere on pinside that does this amongst other things. You should try it on VPX if you are savvy enough, or if you really want to you can get an rom programmer and put it on your actual pinball machine. The whole software package was not ever completed from what I remember, and the animations are lacking. But at least it could show you what it would be like.

#4886 5 months ago

anyone have a lost mine kick out wear spot decal laying around?

#4887 5 months ago
Quoted from daveyvandy:

I know what you mean. There is a custom ROM floating around somewhere on pinside that does this amongst other things. You should try it on VPX if you are savvy enough, or if you really want to you can get an rom programmer and put it on your actual pinball machine. The whole software package was not ever completed from what I remember, and the animations are lacking. But at least it could show you what it would be like.

I made that new rom in freewpc.

Topic is here: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bigfoot-new-rules-for-whitewater-with-freewpc
It works in visual pinball and also in a real machine. I've tested it in my machine, coils work well, but it's always at your own risk

The diverter doesn't push the ball into the whirlpool (except when a mode is lit) but lets it pass, like you ask for.
This gives you more flow.

It's a work in progress and incomplete. Sometimes it'll crash and reboot. There are still bugs in it.
But it playable, everything works (all coils, targets, ..). There are new modes (although most are not nice polished - most need tuning of sounds and lights and nicer graphics).

I recently started working on it again, hadn't worked in 4 years on it..
The rules are similar to WW, maybe I should've changed rules much more but you're stuck with the layout/lamps/labels so it doesn't give that much freedom.
While similar, strategy changed a lot.

The story I had in mind was you have to find bigfoot by rafting the correct path. I think in the current version I disabled that, but I had code that if you only made the lit shots it'd award a 'perfect raft' and you saw bigfoot. So for raft 2 - not just make 2 lit shots but only make those 2 lit shots and no unlit shot.
Making an unlit shot in between would advance the raft (like in current WW rules) but not show you bigfoot.
This changes a lot how you play - either you go for 'perfect rafts' or you go for other parts like whirlpool modes and multiballs.

I never got much feedback on this rom, don't know what other thing how much fun it is to play..
Always interested in continuing work on it if people like it and want to help with ideas and testing.

#4888 5 months ago
Quoted from mystman12:

I've also been thinking about getting a mirrored backglass, but I was wondering if it came with the trim. The trim on my game is kind of rough so I'll have to get new ones if the back glass doesn't come with them.

I have it. It doesn’t come with trim and they are slightly thicker than standard back glasses so it takes a little effort to slide them on. It is darker so you’ll need bright leds to make sure it’s lit well

#4889 5 months ago

Could anyone post a picture of their ball through and specifically the position of the ball feeder mechanism and coil? My game works (balls are fed to shooter lane) but the coil assembly mounting screws are actually going through the playfield and I can see two screw ends down in the recess where the ball wire-form starts, is this normal?

I really want to see how this is mounted on other Whitewaters.

The strange thing is I can't see any old vacant holes on the underside either, so I'm not sure it has been moved, but if feels wrong where it is now too.

And yes, its dirty, I just bought it and are going through the game so haven't really cleaned it properly yet

20200505_225031 (resized).jpg

#4890 5 months ago
Quoted from aeneas:

Always interested in continuing work on it if people like it and want to help with ideas and testing.

I'd be glad to help in any way I'm able. I'm going to try to review all of your notes at flipper.be to try to get a handle on where exactly you are at with this project. My initial thoughts are that completing lit hazards to advance down the river needs to remain the main goal of the game. I think the perfect route sounds interesting, though I might make that a smaller bonus versus a multiplier. I'd also be in favor of adding as many combos as possible. I'd keep it simple, shoot any hazard shot and have a few seconds to hit any other hazard shot to continue the combo. I guess my brain is really going wild thinking about things, so let me know if you want some more feedback.

#4891 5 months ago
Quoted from Lhyrgoif:

Could anyone post a picture of their ball through and specifically the position of the ball feeder mechanism and coil? My game works (balls are fed to shooter lane) but the coil assembly mounting screws are actually going through the playfield and I can see two screw ends down in the recess where the ball wire-form starts, is this normal?
I really want to see how this is mounted on other Whitewaters.
The strange thing is I can't see any old vacant holes on the underside either, so I'm not sure it has been moved, but if feels wrong where it is now too.
And yes, its dirty, I just bought it and are going through the game so haven't really cleaned it properly yet
[quoted image]

That's normal - you can use shorter screws.
http://christopherhutchins.com/gallery/album362/22_G

#4892 5 months ago

Are there any protectors for the Bigfoot ramp entrance? It's been cracked for a while and a piece of it broke off yesterday. I've repaired it with some Scigrip, but I'm not sure how long it will hold (It should hold for quite a while, but I'd like to reduce force to that spot if possible). Also looks like my upper flipper is using an FL-11629 solenoid, but it should be FL-11630, right? I get crazy air balls pretty frequently on the upper playfield whenever I flip too early and send the ball into the rubber.

IMG_20200507_190701~2 (resized).jpg

#4893 5 months ago

Try Cliffy protectors!

#4894 5 months ago

One of my slingshot coils had a broken lug (it's hanging completely loose) so I ordered a replacement coil. Both old and new coil are AE 27-1200 but they differ in wrapper paper color, guess that's not really an issue but I was a bit surprised. What really confused me though is that the new coil got a diode between the lugs while the old one doesn't have one at all.

So, what should I do now, remove the diode completely from the new coil and rely on the diode on the power driver board?

If I let the diode stay then what is the correct way to solder the cables. The old coil have a thicker purple-orange cable and a thinner brown-red one; how should I solder them on the new coil if the diode stays?

Edit: According to the manual, the left slingshot coil drive wire is "brown-red" so that's the thinner cable. I had the impression that the thick purple wire was the power wire and should go to the banded side though. The diode ring is really hard to see in this picture but it is on the left side, so what cable goes where?!?
20200511_203738 (resized).jpg

#4895 5 months ago
Quoted from mystman12:

Are there any protectors for the Bigfoot ramp entrance? It's been cracked for a while and a piece of it broke off yesterday. I've repaired it with some Scigrip, but I'm not sure how long it will hold (It should hold for quite a while, but I'd like to reduce force to that spot if possible). Also looks like my upper flipper is using an FL-11629 solenoid, but it should be FL-11630, right? I get crazy air balls pretty frequently on the upper playfield whenever I flip too early and send the ball into the rubber.
[quoted image]

I have just bought this game and have no idea if this is a protector from another game or a specific cliffy but I have a protector mounted on my ramp exactly where your damage is, seems like it is needed.

1 (resized).jpg
#4896 5 months ago
Quoted from Lhyrgoif:

I have just bought this game and have no idea if this is a protector from another game or a specific cliffy but I have a protector mounted on my ramp exactly where your damage is, seems like it is needed.
[quoted image]

Interesting, I've never seen anything like that before on WH2O! I didn't find anything like that on Cliffy's site though.

#4897 5 months ago
Quoted from Lhyrgoif:

So, what should I do now, remove the diode completely from the new coil and rely on the diode on the power driver board?

You can just cut the diode off. It serves no purpose on a WPC game and this way it doesn't matter which wire goes to which lug.

#4898 5 months ago
Quoted from mystman12:

Interesting, I've never seen anything like that before on WH2O! I didn't find anything like that on Cliffy's site though.

Mine has it too. I've also got some ramp protectors elsewhere, and what I believe is a cliffy for the now way out drop and mantis protectors for the lite lock targets. I did not install them, but this is what they look like.

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#4899 5 months ago
Quoted from daveyvandy:

Mine has it too. I've also got some ramp protectors elsewhere, and what I believe is a cliffy for the now way out drop and mantis protectors for the lite lock targets. I did not install them, but this is what they look like.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Man... I have to clean and flame polish my ramps. Those look great.

#4900 5 months ago
Quoted from yaksplat:

Man... I have to clean and flame polish my ramps. Those look great.

*They are all new ramps. Only about two months old

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