Sharpsville, PA
Mirco.
(Topic ID: 57710)
Linked Games
White Water
Williams, 1993
Topic Gallery
Quoted from nman:There's also one in Atlanta just down from the Gold Room. Merely driving by it was plenty for me.
And Charleston SC as well. "Call a Cab", if I remember correctly, was the most potent as it was made with grain alcohol!
I have a flipper button led set from coin taker thats about 6 months old...Cant see where to get 12v. It mentions the board below the left flipper but all the connections are used. Any other easy place grab 12v?
Quoted from billsfanmd:I have a flipper button led set from coin taker thats about 6 months old...Cant see where to get 12v. It mentions the board below the left flipper but all the connections are used. Any other easy place grab 12v?
They draw so little you should be able to tap off the 12v from one of the leads on the coin door board.
Quoted from fiberdude120:They draw so little you should be able to tap off the 12v from one of the leads on the coin door board.
That's what it says. But where ?
On a few of my games, the bottom left of that board has 12 volt spots where no connector had been affixed. You can solder right to the pads, or attach a connector.
Quoted from billsfanmd:That's what it says. But where ?
I soldered the wires to the coin door light connections where the coin slots are. Those might only be 6.3V.
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:In about 5 years, it will be "I cannot afford to be in the Whitewater Club".
In 2005, you could still buy above average examples for $600-800.
Excellent condition less than $1600.
Superb condition $2000.
Collector $2800.
Price has more than cincdupled in 10 years.
Out of the original 7000 produced less than 3/4 are expected to be in existence now based on probability in any condition. In 20 more years, less than a quarter will remain.
Sadly, I expect this to be the case for most machines.
Manly
Hi there fellow Wh20 Freaks, and I mean that in the nicest possible way.
Ive owned a WH20 for 9 years now. It's a 3 Owner HUO only Game, well not completely. I did take it to my Kids school fate as a fund raiser some years Back and it's lived in 3 different Country's. Anyway I stripped the Playfield and mechanically rebuilt everything, replace all the Plastic Ramps and installed a new mountain set. I also Electrically overhauled it, Gold plated IC sockets in problem areas, 35 Amp Bridge's, Changed EVERY Electro Capacitor in the entire game. Even changed the Bridges on the Chase light board to 8 amp. Labelled EVERY connector and Hand tied the ENTIRE wiring Harness, well ya get the point. That was 7 Years ago now and It has around 350 Games since then. Most of those in the first 2 Years after rebuild. It still has the original Artwork ATM.
Anyway I have ordered over $4,000 AUD in parts for it's final restoration, they are on there way as we speak
New Mirco Playfield
New Color LCD
New 3D Translite
New Speaker Panel
New Insanity Ramp ( this wasn't available 7 years ago)
New Cabinet artwork
New Driver Board
New Side Rails
New Leg Levellers and lot's off other stuff.
I have a couple of questions for you blokes. When the Head unit gets Painted I will need to do something about the Big Yellow Screen Printed Warning on the Back of the Head board. I can get a large reproduction sticker, but I would prefer a Stencil but can't seem to find one. An Ideas?
Has anyone here installed the New Pinsound Board? Is the sound heaps better ETC. If I am going to spend that sort of money, I expect the kind of improvement similar to going to the color LCD. The Machine already has top quality 3 way speakers and Sub Woofer.
Love all the custom mods you guys have done on your machines, some are not to my taste, but still love it just the same.
There are stencils out there for the back of the cabinet floating around. They pop up occasionally by parts suppliers rebought from the original production games although I have not looked lately. They get "passed around" by collectors and restorers as well. Be vigilent.
I have a PinSound board in my Whitewater. The resamples were done professionally. The board is worth the money. You may not know this but the cost of a rebuilt pre-89 sound board is basically the same cost now.
Thanks Black Knightz.
I'll keep an eye out for a stencil.
So do you think the sound board is worth the effort? Personally unless the sound files are remanufactured I can't see the sound being much better, but I don't really know
Cheers
Quoted from WH20_Buzz:Thanks Black Knightz.
I'll keep an eye out for a stencil.
So do you think the sound board is worth the effort? Personally unless the sound files are remanufactured I can't see the sound being much better, but I don't really know
Cheers
You can download the complete sample set used for all game sounds and music directly from the PinSound forum for FREE. You then can evaluate them personally using you computer, phone, pad, or even your sound system. CD 320 kps stereo quality.
I have one in my sttng,
If i could I'd have them in all my games.
saying that tho it all depends on what the community has put together.
sttng has all the music from the original soundtrack.
a guy is working on white water but PPS are giving him shit
Thanks for that info Urbanledge,
I really had high hopes when I read Warren Davis the original voice for WH20 agreed to do the Sound. I just hope he can still do the best sound in the whole Game....."Hundred Million" Man that's just the best ever!... It even beats the Vacation Jackpot I reckon.
This awesome Machine has long been neglected and mostly "parted out "simply because Williams did such a cheap shit job on the ramps and mountain set, making it too costly to get into a remotely presentable condition. Anyone who owns one, and has done for any period of time knows this and has been through it, in both cost and hard work and it reluctant to sell. As a result the world has finally woken up and now you can only buy a Trashed or High end Machine and nothing in between. You just have to have a look at the latest 3D Translites. It was right behind "Madness".... pardon the pun.
This tells me it's now the second most popular and collectible Pinball there is! Even if in part driven by the German Passion for the Machine and Pinball in general. Good thing too. German engineering and quality is second to non.
When you look at the big picture it's hard to put all the pieces together.
So here is my take on it.
1. The machine is very fast and difficult to master piece of work. Very narrow workable Deck with very powerful Flippers make it so, among other things.
2. Vacation Jackpot is and can't be questioned the best in Pinball history and can't be repeated. (well it can but why bother its done)
3. The Topper (Love em or hate em) is simply stunning!
4. Longest single ramp in Pinball ever!
5. Stand alone design......Look at all the classics MM...WH20...CV...TOTAN.....TM...SS....MB....FH...FT...RS........sure there are Great Pins like TX...IJ...AF etc.......But to be a true classic it need more than a Movie....It needs more than Car...It needs more than a Rock Band, It need to come form the Soul.
That's why I put Fish Tales and Road Show in there...Classic unloved pins for similar reasons now getting attention.
I thought Patents were only good for 20 years.....In my Book the real owners of this Machine are Dennis Nordman, John Youssi, Scott Slomiany, Win Schilling, Chris Granner, Mike Boon, and anyone else who had input into the Final design........Williams was just the Employer. If the World was a fair and just place, these guys would have the ultimate say in who does what, and it should reflect in there wishes in any changes or improvements in design.
Dream on Buddy Dream on!
Some people already knew the game was a winner in 1993.
I unboxed one as a technician as well.
Solid earner, good home machine, but was not let go very often from operators that owned one.
They got played out and discarded.
WH20 no longer has the longest ramp in pinball history, straight lengthwise.
NASCAR took its place.
Total complete length is still TOTAN, start to finish in terms of length.
Second place is CFTBL.
Anyone know if the mirco play fields are back in stock? I can't find on the high class pinballs website. Also I had heard that he was correcting the color error on the hat band in the next production round. Anyone else heard this?
Help me out guys,
I have a chance to look at one of these and purchase it if it checks out.
What things should I look at and double check , problem areas, ramp cracks ?
Quoted from golfingdad1:What things should I look at and double check , problem areas, ramp cracks ?
Playfield planking seems to be sorta common on this game for some reason, look out for that. Also, the clear plastic part of the ramps located *just* behind the light lock standups tends to get beaten up and crack. It's not the biggest of deals though, since you can buy metal protectors to hide the damage.
Checking the ramps and boulders is a biggie. Replacements are costly. Often the "boulder garden" boulders are broken or damaged. Again, replacements are tough to find, and again, costly.
Someone mentioned to me when I was buying mine, to look out for matching standup targets. Since they're the "3D" type, they tend to break, but not often replaced with the proper style.
Look for lost mine kickout damage. Usually, there's playfield burn somewhere around the river class lights where the ball slams into the playfield.
Finally, check the upper playfield where the VUK drops the ball behind the upper right flipper. Cliffy makes a protector for this area, but it's usually beaten to hell and back on a lot of games.
Montreal, QC
Quoted from Whitewater:Missing mountain
The first mould was an epic fail, but I start from scratch and this is the first decent prototype. What do you think?
I think it looks good. As long as it hides the back corner of the game from the player position. Looking forward to see it painted. Did you have trouble mounting it?
Quoted from mbaumle:Playfield planking seems to be sorta common on this game for some reason, look out for that. Also, the clear plastic part of the ramps located *just* behind the light lock standups tends to get beaten up and crack. It's not the biggest of deals though, since you can buy metal protectors to hide the damage.
Checking the ramps and boulders is a biggie. Replacements are costly. Often the "boulder garden" boulders are broken or damaged. Again, replacements are tough to find, and again, costly.
Someone mentioned to me when I was buying mine, to look out for matching standup targets. Since they're the "3D" type, they tend to break, but not often replaced with the proper style.
Look for lost mine kickout damage. Usually, there's playfield burn somewhere around the river class lights where the ball slams into the playfield.
Finally, check the upper playfield where the VUK drops the ball behind the upper right flipper. Cliffy makes a protector for this area, but it's usually beaten to hell and back on a lot of games.
Man great info, thanks so much.
I may screen shot this and do the inspection as listed.
Also seller described machine as , no fade original artwork. Was it originally painted or a decal ? And is the blue darker than funhouse or the same ?
Couldn't believe how much the Big Foot lighting Mod cost is.
Anyway I'm in the process of producing the same thing only different.
It will be a simple 555 timer circuit on a separate small board. This board will not piggy back on the Motor driver board.
While the piggy back idea might be neat. I believe it will result in fatigue cracks on the header connector over time.
I bought a 555 Timer board from CDS here in Australia. His website says you can custom change the board layout.
So first up I will get it working then I will get the board design changed to suit the application. The 555 Timer board comes with an activation LED and relay to control the Light on off. The current board doesn't allow for a 555 timer reset, but that's an easy change.
One of my only concerns is the mounting of the board in a suitable location without the need to modify the machine (IE drilling holes ETC)
The Board only costs $12.50 AUD or less than $10 USD. Not including the spot light.
Anywho when I get it working I will provide details of how and what ETC.
Here is the standard board I have bought for trialing
Can anyone tell me if the current mod works correctly during Hotfoot?
I'm very excited for this. Thank you for do it! Unfortunately my pin is in pieces right now as I make repairs to the upper PF otherwise you would already have your answer!
Quoted from golfingdad1:Are all Whitewater playfields diamond plate ?
Yep. They're all Diamond plate.
Quoted from golfingdad1:Was it originally painted or a decal ? And is the blue darker than funhouse or the same ?
I think the cabinet art was originally silk screened, but I'm not 100% sure though. I couldn't tell you about the blue, but I've noticed that faded White Water cabinets have a slightly yellowed looking bigfoot, where he should be brown.
Quoted from mbaumle:Yep. They're all Diamond plate.
I think the cabinet art was originally silk screened, but I'm not 100% sure though. I couldn't tell you about the blue, but I've noticed that faded White Water cabinets have a slightly yellowed looking bigfoot, where he should be brown.
Thanks again.
Quoted from mbaumle:Yep. They're all Diamond plate.
I think the cabinet art was originally silk screened, but I'm not 100% sure though. I couldn't tell you about the blue, but I've noticed that faded White Water cabinets have a slightly yellowed looking bigfoot, where he should be brown.
Look at the tree Bigfoot is holding, it should be green and brown. On mine, it is faded to yellow. Same with Bigfoot not being brown, but more of a yellow.
Quoted from golfingdad1:Man great info, thanks so much.
I may screen shot this and do the inspection as listed.
Also seller described machine as , no fade original artwork. Was it originally painted or a decal ? And is the blue darker than funhouse or the same ?
Original was direct screen printing on the sides, not decals. It's actually pretty rare to have an unfaded cab. See mine on page 2 of this thread. The sides are unfaded (or have only the slightest of fade) while the front has some minor fading (see the color of the eagle as more of a yellow/gold rather than orange-brown.)
Unbubbled toppers are also very hard to find.
For the playfield, aside from the Lost Mine kickout and the wear under the VUK, check the spot on the right inlane where the ball drops from the upper ramp. That's a very good indicator of how much play it's had and that area is normally beaten up. The VUK spot will pretty much always have wear.
Frankly, I'd be less concerned about the mountains and the ramps as they are replaceable (although not necessarily cheaply or easily).
If you get a good clean machine, I highly suggest the Cliffy under the VUK, a mylar protector where the lost mine kicks out, mylar or cling vinyl under the right inlane spot and mlyar or cling vinyl in the channel that runs from the upper flipper to the VUK cliffy on the upper playfield (you WILL get ball trails here and it's good to prevent them from embedding). Even in home use these 4 areas will get worn down without added protection. I also think its a good idea to put Cliffy switch hole protectors in the right inlane and in the back left where Disaster Drop dumps back onto the main playfiled.
Thanks for info guys but the guy said he sold it before I could even look at it , I call BS I think he didn't like my question about possible planking on the playfiled.
What do you guys think? Look around the drain hole in the white area, sign below #16 raft , and around the round green lock inserts not mention the.multi millions insert is lifted as others. 20160907_135448 (resized).jpg20160907_135456 (resized).jpg
Looks like some minor planking in the trees (look above the two hotfoot targets and under the disaster drop arrow.) Not very bad though. Also the lock lights are not right and there's some boulder breakage. Overall looks pretty good though.
Quoted from golfingdad1:I call BS I think he didn't like my question about possible planking on the playfiled.
Hard to say. It is a pretty hot title. Easy to sell, and people seem to be willing to pay a certain level of price premium for the game these days.
But there is a fair amount of planking in those pictures. Not too bad, as Jam_Burglar has said, but definite planking.
Thanks for the confirmation guys.
And he did want a premium price for, granted it is a really nice example , the cabinet and topper were very very nice .
Quoted from WH20_Buzz:Couldn't believe how much the Big Foot lighting Mod cost is.
Anyway I'm in the process of producing the same thing only different.
It will be a simple 555 timer circuit on a separate small board. This board will not piggy back on the Motor driver board.
While the piggy back idea might be neat. I believe it will result in fatigue cracks on the header connector over time.
I bought a 555 Timer board from CDS here in Australia. His website says you can custom change the board layout.
So first up I will get it working then I will get the board design changed to suit the application. The 555 Timer board comes with an activation LED and relay to control the Light on off. The current board doesn't allow for a 555 timer reset, but that's an easy change.
One of my only concerns is the mounting of the board in a suitable location without the need to modify the machine (IE drilling holes ETC)
The Board only costs $12.50 AUD or less than $10 USD. Not including the spot light.
Anywho when I get it working I will provide details of how and what ETC.
Here is the standard board I have bought for trialing
Can anyone tell me if the current mod works correctly during Hotfoot?
Ill take one! LMK when finished.
I posted this on a tech thread but the rough wh20 I'm bringing back to a life has a strange Backbox flasher issue...Ill post it here too. Gonna try and work on it this weekend.
Game has all new boards. I like solving probs but this one stumps me. hoping its something obvious. In switch test mode I noticed every time I triggered a coil switch all of the LED flashers in the backbox fired. Very weird. slings, pops up kickers all cause flashers to go off. In coil test any coil that fires also makes bb flashers flash
Looked over manual in solenoid section 3-9 and connectors all seem correct. Any ideas?
I would pay particular attention to the Ribbon Cable between the Driver Board and CPU board. Re seat this cable and make sure it's on correctly.
If it's only the Backglass Raft & Backglass Riders then I would suspect U4 on driver board.
If it's ALL the flashers going off, I would suspect your machine could do with Driver board Capacitor replacement (15,000Uf Caps)
Also make sure the Boards are screwed down properly...The PCB's get the Main Earthing through these screws.
Check again the following connectors on the Driver board again headers J107. J106, J126, J125, J127,J128
I'm willing to have a stab in the dark here and say you have J125 & J127 swapped around.
When you say all new boards, are they reproduction boards? IE Rottendog Driver board? In which case what Revision is it.
If it's and old original driver board, I would strongly suggest a blanket Electrolytic capacitor change as well as C31 (100uf Cap) on the CPU board. Bad Capacitors will give you all sorts of grief.
Quoted from WH20_Buzz:I would pay particular attention to the Ribbon Cable between the Driver Board and CPU board. Re seat this cable and make sure it's on correctly.
If it's only the Backglass Raft & Backglass Riders then I would suspect U4 on driver board.
If it's ALL the flashers going off, I would suspect your machine could do with Driver board Capacitor replacement (15,000Uf Caps)
Also make sure the Boards are screwed down properly...The PCB's get the Main Earthing through these screws.
Check again the following connectors on the Driver board again headers J107. J106, J126, J125, J127,J128
I'm willing to have a stab in the dark here and say you have J125 & J127 swapped around.
When you say all new boards, are they reproduction boards? IE Rottendog Driver board? In which case what Revision is it.
If it's and old original driver board, I would strongly suggest a blanket Electrolytic capacitor change as well as C31 (100uf Cap) on the CPU board. Bad Capacitors will give you all sorts of grief.
Thanks for your help. Problem was very stupid. LEDs caused it. Reg flashers don't. Something about diodes on the board for those flashers in bb
Quoted from golfingdad1:Thanks for the confirmation guys.
And he did want a premium price for, granted it is a really nice example , the cabinet and topper were very very nice .
The left slingshot plastic is broken in the lower corner.
Missing moutain
I bought my at
http://www.pinball.center/en/shop/pinball-parts-by-game/white-water/7464/white-water-waterfall-mountain?c=2082
Quoted from billsfanmd:How much in US? What is vat ?
Value Added Tax which only needs to be paid by Ger/EUR citizens. Based on current FX probably about $60 shipped to the US
Quoted from pincrazzzy:I ended up making my own.
You own what? Lost mountain?
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