I'd say this guy will be expecting 8K plus. Check out the Whitewater club thread, I believe this question was just asked recently.

The listing indicates, perhaps in other words, "all original". That means that the mountains may have cracks/holes. The ramps will have cracks. WhiteWater is a great game (I have one). It is also the most costly and time consuming to restore. Good luck with the hunt!
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.ChrisHiblerPinball.com/Contact ... for board repairs
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

Notice how there aren't any good shots of the pf.....I bet there is some wear from the kick out at minimum.

Price says $5,750. More than I would pay, but given the current market, and the fact its your all time favorite pin, grab it! Assuming there is no major playfield wear or trashed ramps. The ramps are very expensive to replace on this game. I miss my WhiteWater ...

I hate sellers like this, no pictures of the typical wear areas like the mine kickout or raft inserts, etc. This could be a gem or a total worn out POS playfield, IMO the seller is looking for suckers desperate for the game but if you want to pursue it ask for detailed pictures of the normal wear areas and go from there.

First thing to deal with is the cabinet, which is coming apart in the corner. Definitely in need to be reglued soon as it is moved. pasted_image (resized).png

When you list a pin with a 7k production run as rare and then follow up with retail prices when you are not a retail store. it’s up to you but with it not being 100% even if it’s minor stuff and the cabinet starting to separate, I’d be hard pressed to spend over 4500 for this. It doesn’t sound like they’d be willing to go with that “lowball” offer though.

Pass. Advised a friend before he put eyes on it today.
Cracked ramps, mountains etc.-it all adds up.
Maybe negotiations will go better with you, but not at current asking price.

And if mountains and ramps are cracked like Vino says they are I’d be closer to 4100. They are expensive on this game and they aren’t easy to get to. It hasn’t happened often but there are a few times a year where pretty good players examples of this pin come up on here for right at 4000-4300. This pin is on my wishlist too but for all the fun it offers I don’t think I’d be willing to pay in the 5k range for it. Brand new stern pros can be had for that. You can score other definite “A” list WPC titles for that. TAF, TOTAN, maybe even AFM. Now I like White Water a lot but if you had two games in front of me one being WH20 and the other AFM and said you wanted 5700 for either of them. Unless it was beat I’d probably pick the AFM. I’d say WH20 is a pretty strong contender in the low to mid 4K range.

Not so easy to find these for 4000-4300, and if you do, they need work, missing topper, etc. Pinside average FWIW is now $5k+ so these seem to have increased in selling price lately.

My experience is to be wary of sellers that seem very knowledable of pinball with long detailed descriptions, pics of manuals carefully laid out etc, market analyses yet with precisely no pics of problem areas, barely any pics of playfield or with low lighting, then good lighting on other shots, heavily cropped images especially cab front & backbox. Precisely selective.

From ad: “I've seen completely refurbished ones go even higher in the 10-14k. Definitely NOT expecting this but with some time and work, this game could be in this range.”

Newb bait initiation cycle commonly consists of:

1. Seller posts carefully crafted, selective info and pics highlighting only the good
2. Builds excitement (rarity, almost never used, lucky to even have chance to buy this, profit potential even).
3. Ends ad with “put you in your place” because seller knows and you don’t so trust him and don’t lowball.
4. Sells and ships to newb
5. Newb receives game and has The Matrix, red pill, real world, zoom out moment
6. (Optional depending on pride level): futile attempt to explain something to seller that he has known all along.
7. (Rare but possibe at lowest pride and intelligence level): futile attempt to ask seller for partial refund
8. Newb graduates and years later replies to threads like this

Spidey senses should be going off and if not, then avoid this one. Not saying it will be a total ripoff, just saying every area that seller avoided taking a picture of will not match the images fabricated in the newb buyers head. My guess would be game worth at least $1000 less than what you could get it for from him. Seller will wait it out for shipment to newb - he’s an experienced ebay seller and knows how this works.

I know it’s not common, there were 3 of them on here within the last couple of months though, one of them was missing a topper but the other 2 had them intact and they looked pretty good. Of course those both sold within the hour they were posted.

$5750 is not an unreasonable price for a decent WH20 (with topper).

However, with the few lousy pictures he provides, there is no way to tell if what he has is worth it. I would simply ask for a lot of detailed pictures of the playfield (including mountains, ramps, kick outs etc.).

If it is close by, go and see (and play) it - it's the only way to be sure.

And yes, WH20 is an awesome (and still underrated) machine.