I like them both. Dialed in definitely has some killer innovations.

I will reserve judgement until I can spend some extended time on Wonka.

Understood, but I feel even a verdict on its innovations is too soon at this point. Its probably second to dialed-in in that department, but I still don't want to make the call until I get to see them first hand with more mature code. Who knows, that clear vuk may impress more, or the camera and its implementation may change with code. Its early.

Yeah, I'll have to play Wonka first. I will say that WOZ is the crazy pin of the bunch. That's like a pinball machine from another planet. A freaking spinning house? A flying Monkey? The toto ball save feature.

I think Wonka is technically Dialed In 2. Hard to say until you see the final version and can get into the game deeper than you can playing one game then jumping to the back of the line. I was told it doesn't even have its sell thru code on it.

While I think Wonka is the better game, DI absolutely has more innovation.

I can’t comment on how wonka plays, I have yet to have hands on time. Dialed in was pretty innovative with the lcds, camera and Bluetooth. Did JJP capitalize on these to their fullest potential? No. I think so much more could have been done with cameras and Bluetooth and even possibly WiFi in pinball. Time for these companies to step up the technology and implement internet connectivity.

Dialed In appears to have more innovation but I think that’s on purpose to an extent.

I can’t count how many times I visit an arcade and WOZ or POTC aren’t working and in need of service.

Maybe dialing back SE prices and simplifying the toys/mechs will make it more accessible on route and lead to collectors having more confidence.

I don’t even think it’s close. You said it all in your first post.

DI has more innovation but Wonka has a much more satisfying layout and gets rid of all the things that annoy me about Dialed In. No scoop bounce outs due to Cliffys the game wasn't designed around, no theater that drops the ball down onto the annoying Electric guy, etc. I was playing DI on location today after playing Wonka on Sunday and just wasn't having nearly as much fun. I'm of the mentality that a good layout is more important than innovative toys. One of my favorite games is Iron Maiden, which is also a 4 flipper game that is pretty barren of toys and innovation. Give me a great layout with excellent rules and that's all I really need

From what I see I like Wonka more but Dialed In has more innovation.

Innovation is overrated. If I cared about innovation I'd buy a P3. It's the most innovative game of all

Don’t you mean one insider? There was only one that talked about the innovation.

Everything in Dialed In feel's like it part of that world and is something that the player can interact with. There's 3 miniature drones that each rotate, there's the quantum theater toy that interacts with the ball in multiple modes, the large molded physical ball lock representing station 3 from the theme, the quantum mechanic which mom jeans or not is incorporated extremely well and is used in several modes. There's the QUED moving electric toy that is used to charge the phone and then can be hit extra times to "super charge" the phone to increase scoring. The magnets in the game are tied directly to specific modes such as the EMP mode. I would say that the phone toy itself is very innovative as it's not just a mini LCD display that shows mode information. The phone features multiple custom animations from characters within the theme that interact with the player during modes and there's multiple character animations for each Disaster Mode. Finally the art, sounds, and music are all custom, all original and tie perfectly together with the theme. No compromises had to be made, no movie clips playing that are stuck on loop throughout a mode and and where audio from the scenes is missing.

Besides the mini LCD all of the features in Dialed In are miniature items from that world. When I look at Wonka and see the giant spinning Gobstopper I can't help to think "what does this do for me as a player"? Honestly, nothing. I have the Hobbit which features a toy that doesn't interact with the ball, Smaug but at the same time Smaug interacts with the player throughout the game, hell it even talks to you after some games. A giant spinning Gobstopper toy does not.

From a code perspective everything in Dialed In's ruleset is tied together extremely well and there's multiple mini wizard modes to go after. Two of the most innovative code elements to Dialed In are the "Big Bang" shot and the "SIM" card feature. If you light big bang hitting it in during any mode collects all shots on the playfield, that's cool. The SIM card feature extends the life to modes as it gives the player something else to go after and collect after modes are completed. Finally each are tied together as you can light Big Bang, hit it during a mode, and then immediately have the SIM card shot lit. Want to play a game and just attempt a handful of Disaster modes to go after a wizard mode? There's a mini wizard mode for that. Want to go after starting all 11 disaster modes to light another mini wizard mode? There's another mini wizard for that. Want to complete enough modes and collect SIM cards from each to spell "Dialed In" (one for each letter) to light the games super wizard mode? Yup, there's a super wizard mode for that as well. I don't see that same level of depth currently being offered by Wonka and for some players that will be fine.

As an entire package I think Dialed In is the far more innovative game on every level and I say that thinking Wonka looks cool. Dialed In to me is truly 90's pinball with modern technology, and modern code that is used in innovative ways.

Excellent summary

Amazing yes. But only one said it was so innovative. I do think it’s a great pin.

You should work for JJP and help with marketing. You always have the most informative, detailed posts about their pins. I know you own them all and are very passionate about JJP. Ever think about writing articles for twip?

Thanks, I appreciate it! I don't mean to sometimes sound like all I do is say good things about JJP pins lol. There's things on each one that have driven me nuts over the years but each have also been a lot of fun to own.

I look at it like this....If both games were revealed at the same time side by side I would absolutely be more wowed and impressed with DI from simply and innovation perspective.

DI blows Wonka away on innovation for all the reasons Panzer nicely stated. My fear is now we are going to see innovation regression as these pin prices have peaked. No way JPP can keep packing more on and make a decent profit w/o raising the prices - and no way they can keep raising the prices. I think TZ was a nice plateau for for innovation and DI is another. A 3rd one coming? Not thinking so which is why I will be keeping my DI.

Incidentally I feel the same way about toys and is a reason I am keeping my FH and Stern POTC - those contain two of the best toys ever and I do not see those being surpassed by many newer pins - rather I see toys being made more simplistically or removed because of cost as well.

On the bright side like MikeS stated the PF design can change to offset less innovation and toys with IMDN being a great example - not much of innovation or toys - but a kick azz layout with cool LCD images and sound that make it a great pin.

Will Jack finally cash in on Dialed In when he has pat modify a few things from its playfield design and re-themes it to Toy Story this fall?

I believe Pat was rumored to be the designer for both Wonka & Toy Story at one point. It turned out true for Wonka and I just don’t believe Pat would have been working on two layouts at the same time.

Most people. Agree Dialed in is a great game just hindered by a shitty theme. Change a couple things on the playfield and slap Woody & Buzz on that sucker and you probably have an instant hit on your hands.

Yep , people typically view a certain mechanism on a game as innovative if it’s something that seems as though it’s never been done before . But the way an “old” mechanism is implemented or interacts with the ball or player can also be considered innovative. Wonka is still too early code to decide if it has many innovations or not .