you might be onto something here, unfortunately.

I think most sales are made outside of pinside and between friends compared to many of the infamous threads we've seen lately. There are great friendship deals made all the time (I've made a few), so it's still a gentleman's hobby despite some vocal weirdos.

True of ever hobby.

You are just sorting out real friends and acquaintances.

Don't let it spoil a great hobby for you.

LTG : )

i'm pretty new to the hobby but my only goals are to make some friends with common interests and play some gosh darn pinball!

so there's hope.

The "hobby" you describe is alive and kicking just not what most people talk about.

I'm getting out of the hobby myself. For me its a hobby. Hobby=fun.

Good to see you back on here, Lloyd! Hope everything is OK and well.

I think the money thing spoils the hobby. As soon a money becomes the dominate concern and discussion (like I'm doing now... rolling eyes for my own comment..hehe), it all starts to get a bit uglier.

LTG, congrats on the 100K club! Wish I was closer!

Yeah, I understand man. But as was stated earlier, there are good people out there that will help out. These forums have exploded a lot lately with a bunch of new owners that havent been doing this since the 80s. Don't let these forums destroy your pinball philosophies. Better to use the forums to help repair things, find events and maybe the occasional game meet up. Your local community is still going to be better. The internet allows people to be anonymous, and once that happens you generally get a bunch of dick wads.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/

I used to be the guy selling games at great prices. After seeing the games I sold on Craigslist and Ebay for $500 more the next day, I wasn't too bothered by it.

What really got to me though, was when I tried to buy something, every time I was being jacked for every last cent.

I got sick and tired of doing favors and being the nice guy, then getting screwed when I went to buy.

I still like to sell games for decent prices, mainly because I don't want to sit on them forever, but I agree with you. I kept it friendly as long as I could, but no handouts anymore and no doing monetary favors for "buddies." The favors just don't come back around.

You are correct. Things have changed.

I was at the Texas Pinball Festival. Marcus and Mike and Frax and Jennifer made that all possible.

I dragged my laptop with to at least keep up with help here and Bay Area's tech desk.

But the $13.95 a day for internet at the hotel put the kabosh on that.

Thank you, everything is okay except my knee is really a hurting unit.

LTG : )

Congrats on the 100k karma. A rare club indeed. Hope you enjoyed the TPF. My group had a blast.

it has been going down the shitter in general. Prices are becoming unobtainable for many. It was nice before. Yes we had a couple high priced games, but the ones that were high priced, wern't that good anyway, so it wasn't that big of a deal. Now almost everything has gone up to the point where it becomes more about the money, and less about the games anymore. I'm glad I got my collection where I wanted it before all the craziness happened. I got to enjoy the games I wanted to enjoy. if I have to sit back and wait a couple of years for the market to settle back down to a normal level, that's fine. I've met some really great friends over the years. They are the ones that get special parts they need, and buddy pricing on games. Over the years, you know which ones those are.

LTG

Congrats on the 100K Wow!

It's always been like that. You just have to shrug it off because for every asshat, you do meet some really good ones along the way. If you clamp up, then yeah you don't meet asshats but then again you don't meet the real good ones either.

I've met folks doing pin stuff that I've been friends with now for literally decades. I've met a few asshats along the way, but meh, if I am going to fret over great deals I gave to not so great people I'd not have much time for other things.

I can share my experience. I did own TZ and STTNG about 12 years ago. Santa got them for the kids, supposedly. Sold them about 7-8 years ago. As politics seemed to take over my brain, and being on the less popular side, I started thinking about pinball again. Since November I concentrated on what to buy again. The guy I bought the TZ etc from was no longer in business (Johnny's Pinball in North Jersey, what a great guy!) so I reached out online. I cant say enough about how positive the experience has been. Pinside members have been very welcoming as well as others I have "met". I have been invited to several people's homes to check out their pins or have been offered help in getting restarted etc. All positive stuff. Now if only the trucks will arrive with my latest shipment......

Says the guy who sold his games for a f*ckton.

Look - I love my pinfriends - but as much as I'd LIKE them to sell me a BBB and MM for well below market value...it's not going to happen, and I don't hold it against them.

That being said, I'll be your best friend if you sell me a BBB for $8k lol

This. Everyone want's $500 more for a game with $175 worth of LEDs because they want to be paid for installing light bulbs. People seem to want $750 more for $300 worth of powder coating that generally doesn't match the game. People want $1K more for zip tying a bunch of cheesy trinkets into places that just ruin and clutter the game up.

For a lot of these guys, it is just about the money. Some of these guys are praised quite a bit. Bring in an unshopped game, clean it up, LED it, now it's worth top dollar? I've seem more than one newb wise up a bit after being in the hobby a while and regretting purchases like these.

I know a guy who does EXCELLENT work, he does it right, and he eats the cost from time to time because he takes pride in the games he works on. He's quietly stepped back, has all his games but is barely in the hobby anymore. Granted, there were other factors, but people like him used to be around, now they are very few and far between.

I think we went from taking pride in our work, to seeing how much flashy shit we can cram in the game to jack someone out of top dollar.

I found my happy medium. I don't sell shit, I do a good job, and I don't make as much money as some as these other guys. If I'm selling a piece of crap, I only sell it to certain people who know what they're getting. People have spent good money for games they bought from me and while I didn't make a killing, they've all been very happy.

Agreed, look what kind of money they are getting for some of those old Lionel trains. Maybe we should re-classify our endeavor. I'm going to start calling it an affliction.

Very true. I've just accepted the fact that it's changed. I've met some really great people recently, some that I will talk to again and some not. You make great points.

I give good prices to my friends on games I actually want to sell. Not ones that I want to keep but have the "well, if you give me that, I can't say no" pricing. Same goes with parts. Friends raid my stash all the time for stuff, most of the time give away, or trade for. Makes me laugh when people PM me to get them the prices I see games for sale for. And are the same ones that say shit when I quote prices i've seen games for. If I take the time to actually go and buy the game, i'm going to give it up to my friends for the reasonable price, not people at random that I don't know from adam.

Well said... Pinside = the land of mods to jack up the prices

Like CV.....what a crock of crap at a high price

Love how greedy selfish people choose friends not by their character but by:

good deal = good friend

bad deal = a hole

There are still great people, especially here on pinside.

Pinwillie came over and taught me how to replace connectors out of the goodness of his heart before he knew me. Sent me a bunch of LEDS for free when I asked him about what type he liked. Repaired a lamp board for me for free.

Pismoarcade sold me a F-14 for a very reasonable (for California) price without knowing me first. And now we are friends.

A guy sent me a Hurricane topper for free and sold me a hard to find ramp for a very nice price without knowing me.

I put up a WTB thread for Mata Hari plastics a long time ago and a guy sent me one for free just cause I needed it.

Not to mention all the free advice people like Lloyd, Pinvid900 and many others have given me.

There are more good guys for every jerk on here, just ignore the jerks.

If you cut someone a deal on a game they really want based on your relationship with that person, and then they jack you for top dollar wanting above book prices and are being unreasonable when you want something from them, they probably aren't your friend.

I have marveled regularly at how helpful and generous people on this site are when it comes to offering advice, especially about fixing pins. On the other hand, I agree that talk of money consistently moves the discussion into the dumpster.

LOL, keep trying to justify it, but you're the same as the high-priced flippers you rag on.

I was thinking the same thing today. I am new to the hobby and have one machine. I'm not in a big hurry to have this moster collection to make everyone think I'm cool. I could buy more machines if I wanted to, but I'm going to wait till I know which one is for me and when I have a lot of disposable income. I think their's a mentality that these machines are going to be gone tomorrow if I don't act now. Pinball should be fun!! sure amassing a nice collection is something I aspire too, but making friends, sharing experences and knowledge, seeing my kids experence the joy makes it all worth it.

I am the only pinball addict in my family, but I see how all my freinds and family that comes over has a blast with my FT. I read some of these FS/FT threads and it really turn me off. I understand why flippers are out there, but I would just like to deal with real people who love pinball.

But its a great machine to start out a collection with (FT is a super fun game)

It's obvious to me that selfish greedy people think:

If you give me something for free = we are friends, you are a good guy

or

If you invite me over, give me a good deal, and give me stuff = we are friends, or a good guy

Selfish people are always thinking = Me, me, me. What can I get?

I think everyone wants fair value for their games and mods because we all work and care about our money. I just don't like the cut throat nature of buying and selling. Everyone has the right to charge what they want for their games and the buyer has the right to say no or yes. I don't like all the hate on the FS threads, calling people "trolls" just because they ask a question about the deal?? makes no sense to me... can't we all be adults and just enjoy this cool hobby.

Here in PDX, we generally trade / sell games between the collectors with a guarantee to sell it back at the same price + cost of any mods. We usually also give first right of refusal. This is why you should value your local community more than an online one where no one has to be accountable for their actions.

Yikes to the whiners, I've been remarkably suprised at the generous nature of almost every pinsider I've met. I've got some weird and poor offers via pm but again every person I've physical met has been great.
And I've never heard of anyone forced to buy a pinball so if the price is ridiculous don't buy it.

Yeah I was stoked to loan sopranos for your junkyard for a month.
Next time I hope we can swap GC's as that didnt happen on either game!
If you ever wanna do another temp swap I'm down.

Haha how true. You see it all the time here.

I always find it funny how some members get away with the above LED and flip "wow, great deal" ... yet in other posts its "I hate the guys who flip machines for profit"

Almost like a double standard ... It's ok for some guys to flip pins, but not ok for other people.

rd.

I wish I had a local friend who'd take me up on my BBB offer.

I will buy a BBB for $8k - and if I ever sell it, the original buyer gets first dibs to buy it back for $7k.

That's not what this thread is about, you are the only person who seems to think that it is. This thread is about people who know exactly what to do to get top dollar for mediocore or even junk machines without spending one more penny than they have to because they don't care about pinball or the people in the hobby.

Nobody said anything about only being friends with people who cut them deals. But yes, again, if I cut someone a deal, and they try to screw me when they sell something, they probably aren't my friend.

I'm not into this affliction to make money, but if I decide to sell a machine I would at least like to get out of it what I put into it, and I'm sure a lot of you think the same way. Therein the problem lies. Each person who owns the machine has invested not only the purchase price, but shipping, upgrades, mods, sales tax, etc.

I know that for some money is no object, but for me, I can't just throw that money away for the sake of being able to possess a machine a while.

Forget about making money and concentrate on making fun and you wont go far wrong. Stressful overthinking on any subject is for politicians. Now, white russian anyone?

It's all about money and you know it.

That's because I do my own thinking, not just consume the "press release" as if it contained the truth that a "friend" would give.

I am in the hobby to play the games and to own the games and to enjoy the games. My games aren't going anyplace.

You're right. You're just this enlightened free thinker. You can "think" what you want, nobody is this thread is saying they are only friends with people that cut them deals.

Of course this thread is about money. But it's not about only being friends with people that cut you deals.

Being wrong and then just spewing all this crap about what a free thinker you are is a bit insane, no? You can think whatever you want, it doesn't make it true.

Newbies screwing newbies too. Selling games with outgassing dmds with lines out graffiti pf glass and inserts lifted and chipped.
Top it all off claiming ingnorance.
TRUE STORY

I dont hook anyone up anymore with my Operator deals NO BODY nor will I ever again.

Let's be "friends"

money.jpg

I had fun with this hobby in the past when games were treated like games and not some lucrative investment. I can't even find a game that needs work as all of tham seem to be labeled as "shopped" or "cleaned" regardless if it's true or not.

Hell yea, anytime. It was sad that neither of us could knock the other guy off. You want to swap AC/DC for something? ;p