(Topic ID: 115926)

What's the attraction with EMs?


By Blackbeard

4 years ago



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  • Latest reply 4 years ago by RobT
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There are 372 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 8.
#251 4 years ago

Modern games are all about making shots that feed back to the flipper; with EMs, you have to worry about ball control. It's a different type of challenge.

Also, there's more randomness in layouts; look at the bagatelles down the right side of Top Score/300, Atlantis/Lawman/Sheriff, Centigrade 37, etc...

Plus, pop bumpers are positioned so they can throw the ball into the outlane (Abra ca Dabra) or straight down the middle (Surf Champ on a bad spinner shot.)

Oh, and conventional inlane/outlanes aren't to be taken for granted on EMs (again games with a bagatelle, Grand Prix, etc.)

EMs can be absolutely vicious. I love 'em for it.

#252 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Five pages now and noone has mentioned boobs?

LOL.....I almost mentioned the nice sideboob on Queen of Hearts earlier

#253 4 years ago
Quoted from Collin:

For someone who has 33 games, you really don't appreciate proper pinball.

His post has more thumbs down than games he owns now.

#254 4 years ago

Yes, sexy girls...especially backglass art by Dave Christensen!

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#255 4 years ago

Dave Christensen represented the 70s well. At least the 70s I kind of remember.

#256 4 years ago

If I didn't already know the title of this thread, it could've easily been mistaken for:

"Is Spicoli getting ridiculously high on karma, or is it just Markmon huffing prismatic powder out of the ColorDMD box again?"

#257 4 years ago

More like Spicoli waiting for his buddies to come play pinball
Fast-Times-At-Ridgemont-High-Spicoli-Van.jpg.

#258 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Dave Christensen represented the 70s well. At least the 70s I kind of remember.

Damn straight! Though Old Chicago is nothing special as a player...MAN!!! Look at those BOOBS!

Nips too. Won't get away with that nowadays.

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#259 4 years ago

If you bake it, they will come...

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#260 4 years ago

I'm not sure anybody is up for my brownies.

#261 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

Serious question, and I know "to each his own", but what is everyone's draw to EMs?

*ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching* *ching*

(Imagine that sound triggering rapidly. That's why EMs are great!)

#262 4 years ago

I'm in my mid 40's and I grew up playing vids, and *never* pinball. I found pinball 2 years ago. The nostalgia in pinball for me comes from the art and sounds -- not from a specific title.

I have different views on EMs: As a fan of art history, as a player, and as a restorer.

I. I love the art and sounds of EMs -- the art represents its time, and the sounds are very good at creating a "time-travel" ambience of antiquity. (I'm not holding out hope that modern Sterns will help me time travel back to 2010-2015 when I play them in 20 years -- we'll see.)

II. Having professed my love of EM's from an art and history point of view, I have three big issues with EMs as a player.

1. Flipper strength. I cannot get past the weak flipper strength compared to solid states.
I'm used to powerful flippers in all my games, and that responsiveness is attractive to me -- when you take that away, it's like asking a 16 year old to turn off the car ignition to his dad's V8, and go back to riding a rickety 10-speed. I can't deal with that calibration to "being ok with slower"

2. EMs have a simpler playfield design. One aspect of this design that is difficult for me is the commitment to symmetry. I really appreciate how most solid states from 1980 forward have strong asymmetry. You simply get less predictable action from an asymmetrical table.

3. Playfield pitch and speed. I'm guessing some of you have applied fast clear coats to your EMs... I have never played one with a clear coat (to my knowledge) and so I've never seen an EM that plays fast (regardless of weak flippers.) Having a playfield at 6.5' instead of 4.0' moves the ball to the flippers quicker and creates more action for the player. I call 4.0' pitched tables, "grandpa mode" -- it's so much slower, and the ball travel is much more lateral. ZZZzzz...

III. As someone who is rapidly learning how to restore pinball machines, I see learning EM's as a whole 'nother frontier, that I may not find the time to learn this lifetime.

I'm most pleased that some folks are ok with the symmetry, weaker flippers, and playing in 'grandpa mode.' It's just not something I expect to ever get excited by. If someone was willing to juice up their EM with some stronger flippers and a 6.0' pitched, and cleared playfield, please let me know because I might be interested in giving it a go -- the art and sounds are the BEST.

-mof

#263 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I'm not sure anybody is up for my brownies.

If they are herb infused brownies I'm in.

#264 4 years ago
Quoted from mof:

I'm in my mid 40's and I grew up playing vids, and *never* pinball. I found pinball 2 years ago. The nostalgia in pinball for me comes from the art and sounds -- not from a specific title.
I have different views on EMs: As a fan of art history, as a player, and as a restorer.
I. I love the art and sounds of EMs -- the art represents its time, and the sounds are very good at creating a "time-travel" ambience of antiquity. (I'm not holding out hope that modern Sterns will help me time travel back to 2010-2015 when I play them in 20 years -- we'll see.)
II. Having professed my love of EM's from an art and history point of view, I have three big issues with EMs as a player.
1. Flipper strength. I cannot get past the weak flipper strength compared to solid states.
I'm used to powerful flippers in all my games, and that responsiveness is attractive to me -- when you take that away, it's like asking a 16 year old to turn off the car ignition to his dad's V8, and go back to riding a rickety 10-speed. I can't deal with that calibration to "being ok with slower"
2. EMs have a simpler playfield design. One aspect of this design that is difficult for me is the commitment to symmetry. I really appreciate how most solid states from 1980 forward have strong asymmetry. You simply get less predictable action from an asymmetrical table.
3. Playfield pitch and speed. I'm guessing some of you have applied fast clear coats to your EMs... I have never played one with a clear coat (to my knowledge) and so I've never seen an EM that plays fast (regardless of weak flippers.) Having a playfield at 6.5' instead of 4.0' moves the ball to the flippers quicker and creates more action for the player. I call 4.0' pitched tables, "grandpa mode" -- it's so much slower, and the ball travel is much more lateral. ZZZzzz...
III. As someone who is rapidly learning how to restore pinball machines, I see learning EM's as a whole 'nother frontier, that I may not find the time to learn this lifetime.
I'm most pleased that older folks are ok with the symmetry and speeds of playing in 'grandpa mode.' It's just not something I expect to ever get involved with. If someone was willing to juice up their EM with some stronger flippers and a 6.0' pitched, and cleared playfield, please let me know because I might be interested in giving it a go -- the art and sounds are the BEST there is.
-mof

Some games are horribly slow.

A game gone through plays pretty quick. I have a 1960 Spot A Card - regular flipper coils. Man, this game is quick! And I have Iron Man close by which is one of the fastest games of all time, for a good comparison.

I once played a Gigi with yellow dot coils, 6 degree pitch - at times the speed of the ball was unreal. I wouldn't set up a game to play that fast but the point is that you can if you want to.

#265 4 years ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

If someone was willing to juice up their EM with some stronger flippers and a 6.0' pitched, and cleared playfield, please let me know because I might be interested in giving it a go

IMO, you just described the DC voltage period, the main difference between EM's and everything thereafter. Since dimensions never changed, DC power did alot to dwarf the playfield, compromising player interest, (at least until the design teams creativity rose to the challenge).

The real interest in pinball to the average collector IMO, is the challenge of defeating the game, not the blinking lites, soundtracks, speech modes, or speed of the ball. If you enjoy this challenge, a properly dialed in EM Game can piss you off quicker than any other. It's 5-7 minute game times keeping you coming back for, "Just one more" always there despite the ball speed, or simple rules. No one wants one more DMD 20+ minute marathon game shooting ramp shots over and over again, "Just to get to the next mode," no matter how peppy it plays.

If you really think EM's are too slow or too weak, I'd have to say the game really wasn't dialed in properly to sustain your interest.

#266 4 years ago

Sorry..............I keep forgetting that pasting quotes from previous pastes gives the wrong author.

#267 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

More like Spicoli waiting for his buddies to come play pinball
.

Fast-Times-At-Ridgemont-High-Spi... 42 KB

You hear that? That was my skull!!!!!!!!!!!!

#268 4 years ago
Quoted from mof:

I've never seen an EM that plays fast (regardless of weak flippers.)

Quoted from Boatcat:

IMO, you just described the DC voltage period, the main difference between EM's and everything thereafter. Since dimensions never changed, DC power did alot to dwarf the playfield, compromising player interest, (at least until the design teams creativity rose to the challenge).

I juiced my woodrail up with a DC bridge under each pop because they bored me and I could not resist the temptation to see what would happen as an experiment. It's fairly easy to remove the bridges if I want to reverse the mod. The pops are WILD fast. I can see where the traditional EM player might not like it at all. I am thinking about modding the flippers to DC as well, just to see what happens. Like I said, easy enough to change back later so might as well play around with it. It's my game.

#269 4 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

I juiced my woodrail up with a DC bridge under each pop because they bored me and I could not resist the temptation to see what would happen as an experiment. It's fairly easy to remove the bridges if I want to reverse the mod. The pops are WILD fast. I can see where the traditional EM player might not like it at all. I am thinking about modding the flippers to DC as well, just to see what happens. Like I said, easy enough to change back later so might as well play around with it. It's my game.

Williams did this to many games in the early to mid 70s. They separated out the pops and slings and put those on DC with a bridge and filter cap under the playfield.

My Super-Star is like this and it's abnormally fast. Even though that game has up posts at the outlanes and center drain it's set up fast and hard. Had a rollover (100,000) contest during three different parties and it was only rolled over once...and that's even on AAB setting! Second highest was 99,970.

#270 4 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

I juiced my woodrail up with a DC bridge under each pop because they bored me and I could not resist the temptation to see what would happen as an experiment. It's fairly easy to remove the bridges if I want to reverse the mod. The pops are WILD fast.

I did the same to my Wms. Paddock, (5 pops), years ago. The difference was flat out entertaining! With 5 pops, the ball was kicked around so hard and so much it could barely make it down to the flipper-sling area. I had to make it a 3-ball game to keep it from getting rolled over so often. Try doing it on a game with 5 pops that is NOT a keeper.

#271 4 years ago

Answer:

Fun, great looking, nostalgic.

You can go from knowing ZERO about fixing EM's to PROFICIENT in a short time.

You can buy 5-10 EM's for the price of 1 or 2 new SS games easy.

You can buy an EM for $100 and get it running all by yourself in no time....$100!!! Try that with SS.

You can strip rubbers, posts, plastics, clean wax, put back together and be playing on a shopped machine in an HOUR(note: that's 11 hours less than a modern SS)

They aren't as HUGE and heavy as modern SS so they are great home games.

Short ball times mean you can sneak in a quick game in 10 minutes instead of committing to a long session on your stern.

If you haven't played a LOT of different EM games you aren't giving them a fair shake. Pick up a Surf Champ for $500, clean it up and it will play as fast as many early 80's SS games...has drops, spinner, kick-out hole, bonus--great fun game.

Modern SS are fun and have (obviously) way deeper rule sets thanks to a cpu, but EM's are a great, cheap, fun way to get in to pinball.

#272 4 years ago

Full disclosure: I'm a wire/gear head. I love mechanisms, and what can be done with them in the hands of someone with a true bit of 'clue'.

When you look at the levels of complexity that were achieved in the E.M. games, pins, bingos, arcades with nothing more than switches, relays, and steppers, it is hard not to be impressed.

If you can related to such things, then no additional explanation is really required.

Combine that with the art, the layouts, (from the simple to the totally bonkers) and the overall feel of the game, and you have something that is really hard to beat, even with the computer managed 'vegas' light shows being put in the games of today.

Each have their place, and either variety may not appeal to everyone... But there is room for all!

Are there 'bummer' E.M.s? Sure, just like there are bummer S.S/DMD/what have you games.

But find a decent one, that has been well looked after, and just enjoy the experience.

10
#273 4 years ago
Quoted from mof:

1. Flipper strength. I cannot get past the weak flipper strength compared to solid states.
I'm used to powerful flippers in all my games, and that responsiveness is attractive to me -- when you take that away, it's like asking a 16 year old to turn off the car ignition to his dad's V8, and go back to riding a rickety 10-speed. I can't deal with that calibration to "being ok with slower"

I'm most pleased that older folks are ok with the symmetry and speeds of playing in 'grandpa mode.' It's just not something I expect to ever get involved with. If someone was willing to juice up their EM with some stronger flippers and a 6.0' pitched, and cleared playfield, please let me know because I might be interested in giving it a go
-mof

Grandpa says you need to play Strato/Super-Flite! This is the deck I take people to when they complain about EM games being too slow. DC flippers and pops. The game has deadly speed and all the standups mean that this game does not slow down, ever! Most 5 ball games last less than 45 seconds on my setup. Also, in this particular case... a steeper setup may make for a less speedy\dangerous setup. Once the ball gits launched off of the flipper/slings it moves with the quickness. I can't tell you how many times I shoot for the A bank for the ball to then hit the B bank, thread the pops and head straight out the right outlane. FEEL THE PAIN!!! And yes this game is fast. So fast that you will loose the ball from your field of vision only to realize that it has passed through one of the outlanes as the ball bounces off the apron into the outhole.

stratoflite1.jpg
#274 4 years ago
Quoted from Caucasian2Step:

Grandpa says you need to play Strato/Super-Flite! This is the deck I take people to when they complain about EM games being too slow. DC flippers and pops. The game has deadly speed and all the standups mean that this game does not slow down, ever! Most 5 ball games last less than 45 seconds on my setup. Also, in this particular case... a steeper setup may make for a less speedy\dangerous setup. Once the ball gits launched off of the flipper/slings it moves with the quickness. I can't tell you how many times I shoot for the A bank for the ball to then hit the B bank, thread the pops and head straight out the right outlane. FEEL THE PAIN!!! And yes this game is fast. So fast that you will loose the ball from your field of vision only to realize that it has passed through one of the outlanes as the ball bounces off the apron into the outhole.

stratoflite1.jpg 219 KB

This is what I'm noticing. Anything posted about not liking EMs for a valid reason gets a reply with "Well, there is this one outlier game that does what you said EMs don't!"

However, taking their argument and applying it to the majority of EMs it holds true.

#275 4 years ago
Quoted from jrivelli:

However, taking their argument and applying it to the majority of EMs it holds true.

EM's are slower most of the time. Yes. They have less features. Yes. They are way way way way less expensive and way way way easier to maintain. Yes. Doesn't mean they aren't challenging or fun.

Each has it's own positives. You can't beat the features and depth of a modern game if that's your measure....

Comparing them is apples and oranges.

#276 4 years ago
Quoted from jrivelli:

This is what I'm noticing. Anything posted about not liking EMs for a valid reason gets a reply with "Well, there is this one outlier game that does what you said EMs don't!"
However, taking their argument and applying it to the majority of EMs it holds true.

I don't think most EM guys feel anyone should be obligated to enjoy them. With that said, as hard as it is for you to understand why people like them, it's as hard for us to understand how they couldn't.

#277 4 years ago
Quoted from jrivelli:

This is what I'm noticing. Anything posted about not liking EMs for a valid reason gets a reply with "Well, there is this one outlier game that does what you said EMs don't!"
However, taking their argument and applying it to the majority of EMs it holds true.

Well it seems obvious the people that say they don't like EMs don't really play a lot of them. They casually play one or two at a show and walk away unimpressed and then say stuff like that. EM is a classification of games, not a particular title.

If all I had were EMs in my collection, and I decided I was going to finally play a DMD game, and happened to see a Space Jam at a show to play that was dirty, broken and not set up right, I could then say that all DMD games are crappy, slow and boring. Then someone else would say, "Yeah but have you played a cleaned and properly set-up Ironman?". Well that's an outliner game...

#278 4 years ago

I don't ask people to like them, but most that come over play them at least as much as the the newer games, sometimes more depending on the mood. So if I didn't have any, then there would be a lot less variety in my collection and one less reason for people to come by and play.

#279 4 years ago

You can always tape 3 or 4 extra 0's on the backglass of an EM if that makes you feel better too...

#280 4 years ago

Wickerman (and denver locals, or heck... anyone passing through town!), you are welcome to stop by any time and play some fast, slow, fast and slow and everything in between... anytime. Just hit me up with a PM and we can coordinate!

Once again my pin-philosophy is: If the game plays great, I want to play it! There are many EM's that I have little or no interest in playing. The same can be said for a minty-ooober-lightning-fast DMD like Champion Pub, Indiana Jones (esp. the Stern version), Rolling Stones (once again, esp the Stern version), Popeye or Gilligan's boat anchor. I don't like the way those games play regardless of era, manufacturer or designer.

And as a side note, yes... manufacturers put in numerous dummy reels to shoot the scores into the millions. Makes ya feel really proud of yer hyooj score!

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#281 4 years ago

No dummy reels on my Rocket. And I still score in the millions.

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#282 4 years ago

i LIKE ac flippers... you are rewarded with plenty of "speed" to make the needed shot if your flip is timed correctly... if your flip is timed incorrectly, you are not rewarded...

for those of us who are also stubborn enough to chase the little white ball... it is analogous to old skool equipment (persimmon driver, forged blade irons, wound balata ball)... square up the ball and have good timing, it would go plenty far (and MAN it felt good)... mis-hit it, and it went nowhere (and didn't feel so good, especially on those cold mornings)...

#283 4 years ago

image.jpgem's beat the hell out of studying back in 1976

#284 4 years ago
Quoted from Caucasian2Step:

Grandpa says you need to play Strato/Super-Flite! This is the deck I take people to when they complain about EM games being too slow. DC flippers and pops. The game has deadly speed and all the standups mean that this game does not slow down, ever! Most 5 ball games last less than 45 seconds on my setup. Also, in this particular case... a steeper setup may make for a less speedy\dangerous setup. Once the ball gits launched off of the flipper/slings it moves with the quickness. I can't tell you how many times I shoot for the A bank for the ball to then hit the B bank, thread the pops and head straight out the right outlane. FEEL THE PAIN!!! And yes this game is fast. So fast that you will loose the ball from your field of vision only to realize that it has passed through one of the outlanes as the ball bounces off the apron into the outhole.

stratoflite1.jpg 219 KB

Absolutely. When set up right many 70's Williams games with their DC pops and slings are insanely fast.

#285 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

And you can't do this with a modern game.

128165-i.jpg 35 KB

What the hell is going on in this pic? Is that made like that or a custom add on?

#286 4 years ago
Quoted from CaptainNeo:

What the hell is going on in this pic? Is that made like that or a custom add on?

It is happy hour!
1515f1.jpg

#287 4 years ago

I like how the flyer mentions nothing about the tray, like it's common place to have it.

Btw, is this a time based game like my Travel time is?

#288 4 years ago

I love how Williams advertised with the cigarette holder on the wooden shelf. Where do the ashes drop to?

#289 4 years ago

One day when I have space, time and money to build a decent games room I will own some EM games for sure.

#290 4 years ago
Quoted from AlexF:

I don't think most EM guys feel anyone should be obligated to enjoy them. With that said, as hard as it is for you to understand why people like them, it's as hard for us to understand how they couldn't.

I don't find it hard that people enjoy them. I just don't

#291 4 years ago

It really is a beautiful game. It is a little wider and heavier than most and nudging is king!
It is next on my list to shop out.

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#292 4 years ago
Quoted from dtown:

I love how Williams advertised with the cigarette holder on the wooden shelf. Where do the ashes drop to?

that's what the shelf was for... then they'd get brushed off onto the floor (where the butt was likely crushed as well)...

i can't remember playing one of those "shelf cabinet" designs... by the time i started smoking, those things were long gone, we used to just lay our smoke on the machine up against the lockdown bar, with the lit end hanging over the side of the machine...

#293 4 years ago
Quoted from schudel5:

Well it seems obvious the people that say they don't like EMs don't really play a lot of them. They casually play one or two at a show and walk away unimpressed and then say stuff like that. EM is a classification of games, not a particular title.
If all I had were EMs in my collection, and I decided I was going to finally play a DMD game, and happened to see a Space Jam at a show to play that was dirty, broken and not set up right, I could then say that all DMD games are crappy, slow and boring. Then someone else would say, "Yeah but have you played a cleaned and properly set-up Ironman?". Well that's an outliner game...

This also assumes the only EMs played by "us" (myself in this case) has been crappy or some shitty title. I wouldn't even start a game on something beat up looking. I always try to play some at the shows on the nicest games I can find, otherwise why bother. I don't personally hate EMs, I just were never own one, even for free. They are kinda fun to play a few games on every couple hours at the show when I leave the booth. In fact, that or the oddball mechanical arcades are what I normally play

#294 4 years ago

Just loaded this one up in the Sanctum here in Connecticut. Tothesanctum.com

Everyone absolutely loved it last night for league. And the crowd is mostly 30 average age I would say. No one had ever seen it and I would guess most here haven't either. Think around 900 made in 1956.

If anyone here does know the game well as far as I can tell bonus does not reset ball to ball or player to player. It's like a growing jackpot until you cash it out in big gobble hole for 1x value or small upper gobble hole for 10x value. If it is an option to reset I can't find the jones plug selector.

-Jimimage.jpg

#295 4 years ago
Quoted from plowpusher:

em's beat the hell out of studying back in 1976

Bump that forward to 1982 and there I am!!!

#296 4 years ago

Em's are more pure pinball than DMD's. DMD games are great and some of them are certainly more fun than EM's, but an EM is fun like Checkers is fun. An EM pin is the essence of what pinball is all about, the randomness of the ball, trying to get a higher score than somebody else, or the last time you played the game.... the artwork on just about any EM, the total package of the cabinet design, backglass, lighting, and artwork is usually more attractive than all but a few DMD machines.

With all due respect to the modern designers, too, I'd say that the design of most EM's is much more creative than most DMD games. Not necessarily from a gameplay standpoint but from an engineering stand point, some of the things in the games are genius.

For instance.

Williams' Hotline... had a grid in the middle of the playfield with lit rollover targets. Using just relays and motors, the game lit up the letter "H" on the grid... when you rolled over all those targets, it reset and lit up the targets to spell "O"... then "T, L, I, N, E" as it went on. How in the world did they ever think the engineers would be able to pull that off with switches and relays??? ... but yet it works. Brilliant design.

There's a simple mechanism in some Williams games that has a little wheel at the top left of the playfield. Depending on what color is lit on the wheel, it changes the scores of every target on the playfield! So if it's yellow, all the targets are 1 value, if you make the wheel move to red, now each target is worth twice what it was before... or ten times what it was before, and they're all different values. How in the world did they make that work with just relays?

Look at some of the designs Bally did in the mid 60's, all asymmetric with gates and pop bumpers, mushroom bumpers all over the place. On Bally's Dixieland, the left drain starts at the top of the playfield! There's two gates that open and close on the left, and if the gates are closed your ball is saved back to the playfield.. but if both gates are open, and you lose the ball to the left at the top, it falls 3 feet and drains!

Look at Gottlieb's "Gobble Holes" on some of their games... heck, look at their whole Add-A-Ball concept. Brilliant!

There's a Bally game called Capersville that can start multiball modes, on an EM, by having captive balls in saucers at the top of the playfield. Several other multiball games, too, it's just amazing what they were able to pull off with only relays.

#297 4 years ago
Quoted from ArcadeTechNerd:

Each have their place, and either variety may not appeal to everyone... But there is room for all!

+1

#298 4 years ago
Quoted from jrivelli:

This also assumes the only EMs played by "us" (myself in this case) has been crappy or some shitty title. I wouldn't even start a game on something beat up looking. I always try to play some at the shows on the nicest games I can find, otherwise why bother. I don't personally hate EMs, I just were never own one, even for free. They are kinda fun to play a few games on every couple hours at the show when I leave the booth. In fact, that or the oddball mechanical arcades are what I normally play

The beat up ones are probably the best ones, they clearly has a ton of play. There was probably a reason for that.

#299 4 years ago

Well I'm convinced. I'm thinking my next game is going to be an EM. I really need to get over and get the Happy Clown out of my brothers barn. When we were younger, one of his shop teachers gave it to him. My dad spent a lot of time getting it going with what parts he had. It didn't play 100% but was fun. I know my brother broke the backglass when moving it once. I'm not really sure what condition its in now after all these years. I'm also a little scared to think what it might look like tho. Its been in his barn unheated for the last 20 years.

#300 4 years ago
Quoted from rottenrobert1313:

Well I'm convinced. I'm thinking my next game is going to be an EM. I really need to get over and get the Happy Clown out of my brothers barn. When we were younger, one of his shop teachers gave it to him. My dad spent a lot of time getting it going with what parts he had. It didn't play 100% but was fun. I know my brother broke the backglass when moving it once. I'm not really sure what condition its in now after all these years. I'm also a little scared to think what it might look like tho. Its been in his barn unheated for the last 20 years.

two words... tetanus shot...

three more words... appropriate breathing protection...

four more words... go get it now!!!

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Sebring, FL
€ 8.40
$ 21.00
$ 29.95
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos
$ 14.00
Electronics
Yorktown Parts and Equip
$ 239.99
Lighting - Led
PinballBulbs
$ 2.00
Playfield - Decals
Doc's Pinball Shop
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