Beaumont, TX
We've had a great discussion on the merits of paint types on my stencil thread but I would like to know what type of paint is actually used from the factory on these EMs. Does anyone know?
(Topic ID: 96865)
Quoted from o-din:Leaded premium
So they used a lead based paint?
Guess that is why I have seen threads with people saying to be careful while sanding these things.
Quoted from Arcade:So they used a lead based paint?
Back in the day everything had lead in it. That was until they found out it caused brain damage in laboratory rats. They then looked around at the general public and decided it was probably best to stop using it.
Leduc, AB
Quoted from o-din:Back in the day everything had lead in it. That was until they found out it cause brain damage in laboratory rats. They then looked around at the general public and decided it was probably best to stop using it.
Most likely it ain't good to lick an old EM pin anyway.
Most anything pre mid 1970's (not sure on exactly when lead was banned in paints off the top of my head) has a good chance of having lead in the paint.
Quoted from o-din:Back in the day everything had lead in it. That was until they found out it caused brain damage in laboratory rats. They then looked around at the general public and decided it was probably best to stop using it.
Great. Good to know.
Now, where can we buy some lead paint so it will be original? 
Quoted from Arcade:Now, where can we buy some lead paint so it will be original?
China. Lead in paints crops up occasionally in toys made overseas. The last I recall were some of the"Cars" toys and Thomas the Tank wooden trains.
Quoted from sixpakmopar:China. Lead in paints crops up occasionally in toys made overseas.
The horror!
Sana'a
Quoted from vid1900:Lead was banned in household paint in 1978
Lead was still used in commercial paints well into the 2000s - and can be found in use today.
It's not that we are trying to be pure original but are more trying to learn. So basically they used leaded latex even in the 80's till decals came about?
Quoted from KingNine:So basically they used leaded latex even in the 80's till decals came about?
Even when decals came out, pins still were painted with lead paint.
They were commercial equipment, not intended for home use.
You always see people putting a commercial range in their kitchen, and that's great until some visiting child puts their hand on the uninsulated door of the oven ......
It wasn't meant as an insult. I just thought if anyone knew what went into these machines, you would. What did they use to coat old playfields after shellac went away?
Thanks! I read your playfield thread and got me worried about using alcohol. What would be a good substitute cleaner for shellac? I like to use magic eraser.
Quoted from KingNine:Vid I have a question for you. What is your opinion of the following product for cabinet painting?
Sorry, I have not tried it.
Auto or Latex, either will work, either can be matched by computer. 2-part auto dries faster, but cost more - Latex much less toxic and easier clean up.
Pull the coin door off and have the shop computer match to the unfaded paint underneath. Just roll in it on a dolly.
Quoted from o-din:What would be a good substitute cleaner for shellac? I like to use magic eraser.
Magic Eraser is great at removing the topcoat of an old playfield. Near the bottom of the page:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration/page/19
Quoted from vid1900:Sorry, I have not tried it.
Auto or Latex, either will work, either can be matched by computer. 2-part auto dries faster, but cost more - Latex much less toxic and easier clean up.
Pull the coin door off and have the shop computer match to the unfaded paint underneath. Just roll in it on a dolly.
Thanks. I have an old PMS color match chart I used to get the closest match for the blue and the red with. It doesn't work well on whites though. Picked up a bunch of while samples while I was in Lowes the other day to see if any are near the original.
One more question. My brother and my nephew both hate the webbing from the factory. Williams Hot Tip doesn't use it and looks fantastic without it. What is you oppinion on not using it on the repaint? We are about to do Captain Fantastic.
I've got a gun that shoots "flyspec" or "webbing", so I'm partial to it.
But your game is already boogered the moment you repaint it, so do what you like - you can always repaint it again latter if your tastes become more conservative.
Quoted from vid1900:Not meant to be harsh, but it's true.
Once anyone (including me) repaints a cab, clearcoats a playfield or does any other irreversible "restoration", the game is boogered to any serious collector.
A collector would rather have faded and beat up cabinet, than a like-new cabinet?
Under what conditions would you consider it appropriate to restore/repaint a cabinet?
Quoted from ForceFlow:A collector would rather have faded and beat up cabinet, than a like-new cabinet?
Absolutely.
Quoted from ForceFlow:Under what conditions would you consider it appropriate to restore/repaint a cabinet?
If the cab is beat, it's cheaper to make a new one, than to sand, and fill, and sand and prime......a pre-primed flat pack cab is $225.
But just like an old Mustang, no collector wants one with fiberglass fenders or bondo. The money cars are all original, including the paint.
Quoted from vid1900:Absolutely.
If the cab is beat, it's cheaper to make a new one, than to sand, and fill, and sand and prime......a pre-primed flat pack cab is $225.
But just like an old Mustang, no collector wants one with fiberglass fenders or bondo. The money cars are all original, including the paint.
Can you post a link to the site where cabinets are $225 ??
Quoted from dasvis:Can you post a link to the site where cabinets are $225 ??
I'd like that info also.
Quoted from dasvis:Can you post a link to the site where cabinets are $225 ??
Quoted from KoolFingers:I'd like that info also.
It's just a local CNC cabinet shop.
They don't do any type of mail order sales, and said they don't have any proper packaging to ship.
When Xtreme gets through his family problems, he sells them for $250 in the same flat pack:
http://www.xtremepinball.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65_67&products_id=191
I don't know that I completely agree with Vid's statement. I do agree that there are afficionados that want the original cabinet in the original condition. But I think the people that want a beautiful restored version equal that number if not outweigh them. Restored cars sell for top dollar over rusty origninal ones. When you get into major historical items such as civil war guns and swords people want all the original patina, scratches and scuffs as they tell a story of the history of the piece.
Where I would want an original conditioned cabinet is one that has all the providence documentation of where it came from such as a machine that was at the original Coney Island. It would be awesome with a picture of the exact machine at a place like that and a real conversation piece. I had a Bally Nip It for years and one of those was on the set of Happy Days TV show. If it was the original one from the show that would have been super cool and been a hell of a conversation piece to own. Instead it was just a Bally Nip It lol.
Vid is the one of the utmost authorities on restoration and I don't want this to mean I'm saying he is wrong but that is just my two cents on the act of restoring them. If I'm way off base let me know. It is a subject I'm greatly interested in now.
Agh, I'm still torn about deciding whether or not to repaint. On one hand, I want a pin to look fully refreshed and don't want to look at badly faded paint. On the other hand, I don't want to kill its value for when I want to sell it at some point down the road.
I deal with a high end clientele, so they place a high value on original.
There is a market for everything.
You see old Mustangs with giant fins bolted on the back and obscene hood scoops. High school kids go crazy for that stuff, but a serious collector is going to have to shield his eyes from it.
There was a restored Fireball for sale that had a repainted cab that while technically well done, just looked too new for a 45 year old game. It was for sale for $5500, then a few months latter it was $4000, and finally it went for $1500.
I could sell a well routed Fireball for $2300 any day of the week.
Quoted from vid1900:I could sell a well routed Fireball for $2300 any day of the week.
Now much could an original collector quality possibly HUO Fireball go for (American version)?
Quoted from o-din:Now much could an original collector quality possibly HUO Fireball go for (American version)?
If it truly was HUO, probably $7k
That is one of the few fun EMs that is not clowns, cards or cowboys - highly collectable.
Quoted from vid1900:If it truly was HUO, probably $7k
That would be hard to document, but I would consider it collector quality. It took three different ones to get to this point, and I don't see how I could go much further up the ladder. Or should I say I'm through looking.
Quoted from ForceFlow:Agh, I'm still torn about deciding whether or not to repaint. On one hand, I want a pin to look fully refreshed and don't want to look at badly faded paint. On the other hand, I don't want to kill its value for when I want to sell it at some point down the road.
I pretend I will never sell any game. I might later..... but I can't worry about the distant future on what is now basically, a game, a toy. I want it to look and perform the way it makes me happy now. I might not be around for selling day.
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