(Topic ID: 298696)

What is on the line at Stern Pinball / Delays

By beltking

1 year ago


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    #1601 4 months ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    If CrazyLevi were in this thread

    Now now, TigerLaw, don't get mean with us or we'll have you moderated!!

    #1602 4 months ago
    Quoted from galore2112:

    Well, what is this fabled demand? 300 orders at one of the most well known distributors? LOL!
    That’s “insane” demand?
    No one here on pinside knows what the real demand is. Pinball is a total niche market and it just happens that the target demographic is *currently* swimming in easy money

    The “insane demand” is relative to demand within the hobby as recently as a year ago.

    It doesn’t matter how niche the market is, or if it’s inconsequential compared to the market for anything else— the increase in demand within the pinball market is (relatively) insane.

    #1603 4 months ago

    It's just a matter of time until some television network creates a reality series titled something stupid like "Flipping Out" that focuses on people buying coveted pins and flipping them for an insane profit. Trust me....it is coming.

    #1604 4 months ago
    Quoted from gandamack:

    It's just a matter of time until some television network creates a reality series titled something stupid like "Flipping Out" that focuses on people buying coveted pins and flipping them for an insane profit. Trust me....it is coming.

    When queens gambit was popular on Netflix they reported chess boards saw an increase in sales of over 1000% in a single day after release.

    #1605 4 months ago

    Well, I'm looking for a NIB Godzilla Premium at MSRP. I was a day 1 order from a big distributor, was informed today that I'm "not in this batch" with no reasonable timeframe now! I really had things planned out for my GZ to be here.

    If anyone knows of a distro with an extra, unspoken one in stock (or someone backed out), please PM me. I know there has to be a few here and there.

    Maybe this is a long shot, but you never hit a target you don't try for, right?

    #1606 4 months ago

    The juice is loose, as of the FlipNOut stream last night with joelbob :

    #1607 4 months ago
    Quoted from JStoltz:

    The “insane demand” is relative to demand within the hobby as recently as a year ago.
    It doesn’t matter how niche the market is, or if it’s inconsequential compared to the market for anything else— the increase in demand within the pinball market is (relatively) insane.

    I was specifically addressing the question why there isn’t more competition in pinball “due to insane demand”. I personally just don’t think that demand is that crazy as to entice more companies than there already are. I also find it funny that 300 ($1 deposit, likely several non-serious duplicates) at one very popular distributor is “insane demand”.

    But of course, it’s true that relative demand compared to 20 years ago is high (because back then this market was basically dead).

    #1608 4 months ago

    Was originally a March Godzilla order (ordered beginning in November). Just was told Distributor had their allocation cut again and now looking at July/August. Hopefully that date sticks now.

    #1609 4 months ago
    Quoted from RabanzZ28:

    Was originally a March Godzilla order (ordered beginning in November). Just was told Distributor had their allocation cut again and now looking at July/August. Hopefully that date sticks now.

    My distro won't give me a date or time frame but I think I will get one sometime this spring/ summer.

    Fingers crossed.

    I'm on the list for a DP also but I think I would prefer a GZ.

    #1610 4 months ago
    Quoted from JStoltz:

    The juice is loose, as of the FlipNOut stream last night with joelbob :[quoted image]

    This is good news for me I’m waiting on DP premium. However it just goes to show that this is a complex and evolving situation.

    #1611 4 months ago
    Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

    Agreed.
    Greed is bad, it will probably kill their business as the prices will continue to rise and more people are priced out.
    With this demand is surprising that there are not any more companies making pinball machines which led me to believe the demand is being controlled by Stern.
    I can easily get almost any other game. And I recently tried and actually did…Really. But not a Stern. I have to wait several months for one… nonetheless they kept on pumping new titles like there was no tomorrow…
    You dont go pumping new titles out when you have a supply issue, no? Seems really poorly organized.
    They are controlling the market in a sense? Perhaps making less games than they said they did…not sure…
    Weird

    You have to understand, they have deals with licensors, they have to make these, they have to put out "new" games to stay relevant. Seriously, its not about you. It's about them and their deals, it's business.

    #1612 4 months ago

    Did Stern make all of the GZ LE back in the original run? With all these delays I find it hard to believe they could have all been shipped already. Thanks.

    These are the LEs that come up on Pinballowner.com, not one LE listed in the USA. I guess Stern can sell for more in Europe so why sell them domestically.

    A66BCF20-C0D9-4398-A876-D5B963204796 (resized).png

    #1613 4 months ago
    Quoted from pinballjah:

    Did Stern make all of the GZ LE back in the original run? With all these delays I find it hard to believe they could have all been shipped already. Thanks.
    These are the LEs that come up on Pinballowner.com, not one LE listed in the USA. I guess Stern can sell for more in Europe so why sell them domestically.
    [quoted image]

    First time I've heard of that site so maybe it's not well known in the states. I know of three GZ LE's in my immediate area alone.

    #1614 4 months ago

    Yeah that site is not big in the states. My boss is local and has a Godzilla LE.
    Here is a local distributor with one available NIB at scalper prices. https://royalflushamusements.com/pinballs-now-available/
    I bought my premium there and there was some extra markup but not THAT much. Totally worth it in today's environment.

    #1615 4 months ago

    I know they have an LE at Pinball Palace, played there this week, awesome place.

    #1616 4 months ago

    Yes, just wondering if they built them all already?

    #1617 4 months ago
    Quoted from pinballjah:

    Yes, just wondering if they built them all already?

    All are built in that month of release. since they give out the allocations everywhere for the 1k, it would be difficult to make them later. All should be sold in the first month (roughly, depending if distros store them away)

    #1618 4 months ago

    I know!! Stern can sell a "Fast-Pass"... for more money, you can bypass the line and get your game faster!! They want to be closer to Disney right?
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Status
    "Limited" to 5000 members
    $12K Premium only

    OR for a better experience..... choose the "Personal VIP build tour".... bypass the "fast-pass" line and experience 1st hand the magic of pinball making as we put YOU to work on the 2nd line assembling machines for all the dregs who aren't VIP's! We'll build your machine immediately on the 1st line, and Gomez will come out to personally bless your machine before being thrown onto the pallet at the end of the shift.
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Super VIP, Gomez Status
    Limited to 1000 members
    $18K LE

    Or for the ultimate experience.... choose "Gary's Inner Circle of Friends"...... with each new release you will be afforded a DAY 1 impersonal non specific recorded message from Gary telling you your credit card has been billed $30k and receive an obligated LE machine with each new release, customized with the limited Elvira shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the left side of the cab, a super limited Gary shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the right side of the cab, a personal message which plays at system boot in Gary's voice "Thanks [name], you're my friend", AND a SUPER.... LIMITED.... NUMBERED..... PLAQUE...... on every surface of the machine!!! Proving for all time the machine and all it's parts are genuine matched Stern OEM issue: AN INDUSTRY 1st!!
    (Topper not included).
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Platinum VIP, We Like you More than a distro, Gary's Rolodex Status
    Limited to as many as can pay.
    $30k Super Duper Signature Ultra Awesome Once in a Lifetime until next time: LE

    There's always a way to fix a problem and give people what they want....

    LOL!!!

    #1619 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    I know!! Stern can sell a "Fast-Pass"... for more money, you can bypass the line and get your game faster!! They want to be closer to Disney right?
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Status
    "Limited" to 5000 members
    $12K Premium only
    OR for a better experience..... choose the "Personal VIP build tour".... bypass the "fast-pass" line and experience 1st hand the magic of pinball making as we put YOU to work on the 2nd line assembling machines for all the dregs who aren't VIP's! We'll build your machine immediately on the 1st line, and Gomez will come out to personally bless your machine before being thrown onto the pallet at the end of the shift.
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Super VIP, Gomez Status
    Limited to 1000 members
    $18K LE
    Or for the ultimate experience.... choose "Gary's Inner Circle of Friends"...... with each new release you will be afforded a DAY 1 impersonal non specific recorded message from Gary telling you your credit card has been billed $30k and receive an obligated LE machine with each new release, customized with the limited Elvira shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the left side of the cab, a super limited Gary shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the right side of the cab, a personal message which plays at system boot in Gary's voice "Thanks [name], you're my friend", AND a SUPER.... LIMITED.... NUMBERED..... PLAQUE...... on every surface of the machine!!! Proving for all time the machine and all it's parts are genuine matched Stern OEM issue: AN INDUSTRY 1st!!
    (Topper not included).
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Platinum VIP, We Like you More than a distro, Gary's Rolodex Status
    Limited to as many as can pay.
    $30k Super Duper Signature Ultra Awesome Once in a Lifetime until next time: LE
    There's always a way to fix a problem and give people what they want....
    LOL!!!

    I'll need the Cliffs Notes on that one!

    #1620 4 months ago
    Quoted from Saltimbanco:

    I'll need the Cliffs Notes on that one!

    Nah, read the full message. That was awesome and a great laugh!

    #1621 4 months ago
    Quoted from RabanzZ28:

    Was originally a March Godzilla order (ordered beginning in November). Just was told Distributor had their allocation cut again and now looking at July/August. Hopefully that date sticks now.

    Don't count on it. I ordered just days after it was announced. Was told 1 month, then November, then February, then April, now no information who knows when is my date.

    #1622 4 months ago

    Stern indeed is leaving a lot of money on the table to flippers. I know Stern doesnt want to get involve with the sales and leave that to distro but flipping a pin you bought at $10000 for $15000 to $20000 within a few days or weeks is a lot of money stern could get instead of these leeches.

    Maybe they could see the potential with a sale department. More money for them and we might pay more but I prefer encouraging Stern and their product development than flippers leeches.

    At least that's the way I see it. These distros lists who doesnt mean anything without knowing exactly how many they'll get is also a big turnoff.

    #1623 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    I know!! Stern can sell a "Fast-Pass"... for more money, you can bypass the line and get your game faster!! They want to be closer to Disney right?
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Status
    "Limited" to 5000 members
    $12K Premium only
    OR for a better experience..... choose the "Personal VIP build tour".... bypass the "fast-pass" line and experience 1st hand the magic of pinball making as we put YOU to work on the 2nd line assembling machines for all the dregs who aren't VIP's! We'll build your machine immediately on the 1st line, and Gomez will come out to personally bless your machine before being thrown onto the pallet at the end of the shift.
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Super VIP, Gomez Status
    Limited to 1000 members
    $18K LE
    Or for the ultimate experience.... choose "Gary's Inner Circle of Friends"...... with each new release you will be afforded a DAY 1 impersonal non specific recorded message from Gary telling you your credit card has been billed $30k and receive an obligated LE machine with each new release, customized with the limited Elvira shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the left side of the cab, a super limited Gary shocked face mirrored decal sticker on the right side of the cab, a personal message which plays at system boot in Gary's voice "Thanks [name], you're my friend", AND a SUPER.... LIMITED.... NUMBERED..... PLAQUE...... on every surface of the machine!!! Proving for all time the machine and all it's parts are genuine matched Stern OEM issue: AN INDUSTRY 1st!!
    (Topper not included).
    Insider Connected Ultra+ Platinum VIP, We Like you More than a distro, Gary's Rolodex Status
    Limited to as many as can pay.
    $30k Super Duper Signature Ultra Awesome Once in a Lifetime until next time: LE
    There's always a way to fix a problem and give people what they want....
    LOL!!!

    This is a meeting transcript from early brainstorming sessions for EHOH. Whoever forwarded it out of the internal system is gonna get read the riot act on Monday.

    #1624 4 months ago

    If my order for Rush Premium does not happen in April, then do I wait until all the other machines get built (according to the schedule)?

    #1625 4 months ago
    Quoted from gandamack:

    If my order for Rush Premium does not happen in April, then do I wait until all the other machines get built (according to the schedule)?

    Until its next run, yes.

    #1626 4 months ago

    Got a call from FedEx freight today that my Godzilla Premium will be delivered next week. Shipping directly from Stern.

    #1627 4 months ago
    Quoted from Obed_Marsh:

    Got a call from FedEx freight today that my Godzilla Premium will be delivered next week. Shipping directly from Stern.

    Distributor?

    #1628 4 months ago
    Quoted from Darth_Chris:

    Stern indeed is leaving a lot of money on the table to flippers. I know Stern doesnt want to get involve with the sales and leave that to distro but flipping a pin you bought at $10000 for $15000 to $20000 within a few days or weeks is a lot of money stern could get instead of these leeches.
    Maybe they could see the potential with a sale department. More money for them and we might pay more but I prefer encouraging Stern and their product development than flippers leeches.
    At least that's the way I see it. These distros lists who doesnt mean anything without knowing exactly how many they'll get is also a big turnoff.

    The easiest, and really only, way to deal with flippers is to meet production demand. Make enough machines and dudes won't be able to flip them because people will just go to a distro and buy it for MSRP.

    But, when it comes to limited releases, you are always going to have them.

    -17
    #1629 4 months ago
    Quoted from TheClownpuncher:

    The easiest, and really only, way to deal with flippers is to meet production demand. Make enough machines and dudes won't be able to flip them because people will just go to a distro and buy it for MSRP.
    But, when it comes to limited releases, you are always going to have them.

    Another way is for Stern to actually price their product to keep supply and demand in balance.

    Extreme example: If they’d simply raise their GZ Premium to $20000, there would likely be no shortage nor flippers.

    Why don’t they raise their MSRP if they can’t satisfy the current demand? I really do not understand this.

    12
    #1630 4 months ago
    Quoted from galore2112:

    Another way is for Stern to actually price their product to keep supply and demand in balance.
    Extreme example: If they’d simply raise their GZ Premium to $20000, there would likely be no shortage nor flippers.
    Why don’t they raise their MSRP if they can’t satisfy the current demand? I really do not understand this.

    By pricing out a large portion of their dedicated customer base they risk permanently alienating them. I'd rather patiently wait in line for mine than pay more than double. It would solve a short term problem but create a long term problem. Demand won't outstrip supply forever.

    17
    #1631 4 months ago
    Quoted from galore2112:

    Another way is for Stern to actually price their product to keep supply and demand in balance.
    Extreme example: If they’d simply raise their GZ Premium to $20000, there would likely be no shortage nor flippers.
    Why don’t they raise their MSRP if they can’t satisfy the current demand? I really do not understand this.

    As Mileesa said, permanent alienation is why they don't just jack up the prices to sky high levels. I know several firearms collectors and during the 2012 panic lots of gun stores jacked up the prices to astronomical rates, essentially price gouging. Every gun store I know of that did that are no longer in business, no one ever came back. The ones still around learned their lesson and these past couple of years instead of jacking up prices, they just limited purchases.

    New car manufacturers understand this as well, that's why Ford and others have threatened to stop shipping to dealers who add on insane "market charges" to MSRP. It's bad for the brand. I know I went to buy a Jeep recently, there were 30 on the lot. I offered MSRP (because that's a sign of the times) and I got laughed at. I ordered a Bronco for MSRP instead, I'll wait 6 weeks and I'll never set foot in another Dodge/Chrysler/Jeep dealer again.

    This drought of machines won't last. Either supply will catch up with demand (either by Stern or others entering a "hot" market) or demand will drop because people have lost interest or can no longer afford them. Picking up production to meet demand is how Stern and others can stop the madness, not by pricing everyone out of the market and, by proxy, pissing them all off to the point of no return.

    12
    #1632 4 months ago

    To paraphrase Yogi Berra, "no one orders Stern pins - the wait is too long due to their backlog."

    #1633 4 months ago

    Maine Home Rec. Ordered on 9-14-21

    #1634 4 months ago
    Quoted from Obed_Marsh:

    Godzilla Premium will be delivered next week.

    Stoked for you brother, great game!

    #1635 4 months ago

    I’m on the fence. My distributor supposedly has valid info on production and shipping one day, and then, opposite on the next. Myself and others are paying top dollar for these games and being left in the dark in most cases! Either you have it or you don’t. It’s gonna be here in a week or it’s not! Your selling a big money product that doesn’t cost shit to make…and you can’t even communicate to your customers correctly??!
    Stern should definitely communicate what’s on the line so we don’t have to through Pinside like some unpaid subscription sidenote to your company. It actually amazes me how much information, questions, answers and forethought is answered by pinsiders and not the actual company!

    #1636 4 months ago

    Edit!
    What’s on the line at stern

    #1637 4 months ago

    I'm shouting the rain saying this but it annoys the heck out of me that scalpers are called flippers. All the jabber in here about it has struck a chord.

    It must be generational. Flipping a machine used to be "playing" it. Then it became a term for buying old junk cheap, putting time love and money into it and selling for a small profit.

    Scalping, on the other hand, is the practice of buying up all the retail product, holding it hostage from the consumers and price gouging.

    Scalping is a pointless thing to complain about, though (or is it?) Some of us will never do business with people/dealers who are price gouging but as long as there are those who will it isn't going to stop. It only takes a few to make the practice profitable.

    It does make me curious about a few things, though. Elvira 40th, for example. Stern made 200. Clearly there weren't 200 suckers world wide who were willing to pay 25k. I see them NOT selling. And that's good. It was foul for stern to ask the distributors to pay what they did and extra foul for the massive mark up to the consumers after that. Let them sit. I'd bet the few (very few) who DID purchase one didn't pay that much (and they probably won't ever tell what they really paid)

    More curiousity.

    How many of the for-sale listings that we see around here are just pipe dreams? People hoping thier machine is a winning lottery ticket and then not getting any interest for a year at the asking price? I bet more than some will admit.

    I know someone who sat on a Hobbit last summer asking 12k with zero takers until he finally let it go for 7700. I know someone who picked up a Beatles for 5800 NIB last month because the seller got tired of looking at the box. I wonder if those situations are more common than it appears at first blush. Especially with regard to sales that are strictly local.

    I dont know. But I wonder.

    I've digressed. Anyway, it all makes me want to change my Wicked Flip handle which has nothing to do with selling pinball machines in any way.

    So, what's on the line at Stern Pinball? HA!

    #1638 4 months ago
    Quoted from Wicked-Flip:

    I'm shouting the rain saying this but it annoys the heck out of me that scalpers are called flippers. All the jabber in here about it has struck a chord.
    It must be generational. Flipping a machine used to be "playing" it. Then it became a term for buying old junk cheap, putting time love and money into it and selling for a small profit.
    Scalping, on the other hand, is the practice of buying up all the retail product, holding it hostage from the consumers and price gouging.
    Scalping is a pointless thing to complain about, though (or is it?) Some of us will never do business with people/dealers who are price gouging but as long as there are those who will it isn't going to stop. It only takes a few to make the practice profitable.
    It does make me curious about a few things, though. Elvira 40th, for example. Stern made 200. Clearly there weren't 200 suckers world wide who were willing to pay 25k. I see them NOT selling. And that's good. It was foul for stern to ask the distributors to pay what they did and extra foul for the massive mark up to the consumers after that. Let them sit. I'd bet the few (very few) who DID purchase one didn't pay that much (and they probably won't ever tell what they really paid)
    More curiousity.
    How many of the for-sale listings that we see around here are just pipe dreams? People hoping thier machine is a winning lottery ticket and then not getting any interest for a year at the asking price? I bet more than some will admit.
    I know someone who sat on a Hobbit last summer asking 12k with zero takers until he finally let it go for 7700. I know someone who picked up a Beatles for 5800 NIB last month because the seller got tired of looking at the box. I wonder if those situations are more common than it appears at first blush. Especially with regard to sales that are strictly local.
    I dont know. But I wonder.
    I've digressed. Anyway, it all makes me want to change my Wicked Flip handle which has nothing to do with selling pinball machines in any way.
    So, what's on the line at Stern Pinball? HA!

    I can see both sides, if someone wants to be a better person and won’t flip it, let the next guy take the slot. That doesn’t mean the next guy will not scalp it.

    #1639 4 months ago

    Any word on avengers shipping? Hopi g they ship early next week.

    #1640 4 months ago

    Easy solution for Stern: reduce the LE number to 200 and have a list price of $12,000

    That way, Stern removes the dudes who flip, who can flip away...at least Stern (who's making these) gets the extra $$$. I have no problem with that, they have a large company to run and employees to pay.

    IMO, this would be kind of the end of the problem. We win, because this problem goes away...and Stern wins. The machine flippers/greed heads...lose.

    I'm a player, not a collector, so I couldn't give a crap about having an LE. You need the extra features, purchase a Premium. Pro is a great machine most of the time, anyway. Sometimes, better.

    #1641 4 months ago
    Quoted from beltking:

    Any word on avengers shipping? Hopi g they ship early next week.

    I've seen one distro Thursday had new pro and Premiums posted as instock "in route from factory" and Friday the pros were off the website. I would have jumped on a premium, but i have a deposit with my distro and they told me they except them soon. Word was AIQ was on the line this week and next

    #1642 4 months ago

    Make the LE only available from Stern and sold only on launch/release to the quickest buyer.
    Scalpers have at it too easy, with their reserves seats at their preferred dealer.
    These are people with money, who are pre-buying everything to just make a quick coin.

    If you buy off a scalper you are funding their hobby and further extending their scalping activities.

    #1643 4 months ago

    crazy times

    #1644 4 months ago
    Quoted from Pinballer67:

    Easy solution for Stern: reduce the LE number to 200 and have a list price of $12,000
    That way, Stern removes the dudes who flip, who can flip away...at least Stern (who's making these) gets the extra $$$. I have no problem with that, they have a large company to run and employees to pay.
    IMO, this would be kind of the end of the problem. We win, because this problem goes away...and Stern wins. The machine flippers/greed heads...lose.
    I'm a player, not a collector, so I couldn't give a crap about having an LE. You need the extra features, purchase a Premium. Pro is a great machine most of the time, anyway. Sometimes, better.

    That will have the opposite effect: It's supply and demand.

    Increase the # of LE's, not reduce them. Most LE's don't leave collections anyway, so let more have the warm fuzzy. Won't have any effect on secondary market, with the exception of a slightly lower top ceiling on price. Scalpers go out of business since supply meets demand = no markup.
    1000 should be the starting # of a LE, maybe extend it to 2000 or 2500.
    JJP was absolutely right (IMO) in having enough available serials to continually make more, and then retire a game before the allocated number was used up.
    Everyone wins except scalpers. Of course the limiting factor is production speed, but if people know they can get the model they want - the FOMO ends and Stern winds up selling even MORE high priced models.

    If you want an "extra" tier higher than LE, that's great! They should do it for every model. That can be 200-500 units.

    Standard (Pro), Standard+ (Premium), Numbered (LE), Elite Showoff (Whatever you want to call it).
    You could easily sell triple the amount of a numbered editions if they were available... and if a specific game doesn't sell well, then you stop production and the numbering ends, making it more rare than expected. So simple.

    #1645 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    That will have the opposite effect: It's supply and demand.
    Increase the # of LE's, not reduce them. Most LE's don't leave collections anyway, so let more have the warm fuzzy. Won't have any effect on secondary market, with the exception of a slightly lower top ceiling on price. Scalpers go out of business since supply meets demand = no markup.

    The LE really should be the CE to just take the word limited out of there. Make as many as the market will bear. Multiple runs. Some people want that mirrored backglass, which ONLY comes on the top machine. Why limit it? Make the top one the Collector's model and make all the market wants, on multiple runs. Sure, you'll have a WWE LE dud with leftover stock stinking up the warehouse for years every now and again, but with a small initial run of the "normal" 500 or so, Stern can gauge the market and re-run more if the market demands. It really is leaving a not-insignificant amount of money on the table, and Stern hates that, so why are they ok with it now?

    #1646 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinMonk:

    The LE really should be the CE to just take the word limited out of there. Make as many as the market will bear. Multiple runs. Some people want that mirrored backglass, which ONLY comes on the top machine. Why limit it? Make the top one the Collector's model and make all the market wants, on multiple runs. Sure, you'll have a WWE LE dud with leftover stock stinking up the warehouse for years every now and again, but with a small initial run of the "normal" 500 or so, Stern can gauge the market and re-run more if the market demands. It really is leaving a not-insignificant amount of money on the table, and Stern hates that, so why are they ok with it now?

    Yup, I agree.

    My wife used to work in the art world..... and it was all the same game: Limited this, exclusive that.... in the end, none of it meant a thing. You'd run one print at a certain size and that was a "limited edition". Then the artist would go back and sign another run of the same print, now it was a different "limited edition". Then they'd go back, print out the same print and have the artist put a couple hand drawn dots on the print (such as white areas in wave highlights, or blue in the sea, or put a star or two in the sky) and that was another "limited edition".
    When all that was done, they'd go back and make a different size of the print and run the same scam all over again.... all new runs of "limited editions".
    The buyers all thinking they had a "one of a kind, special thing", which they did but so did several thousand other people. HA!!
    Only once a painting was "retired" would it end, but even then wait a couple decades and a new printing technology comes out promising "better" and the cycle starts all over again.

    Pinheads (or any niche) are the same marks that exist in any hobby or interest. Many want something that others can't have, the same snobby elitism that pervades everything (sadly). For many it isn't about having something good, it's only about having something that others can't so they feel better about themselves.
    In art there is only one way to actually achieve this: The Holy Grail: The original painting.
    Can't do this in pinball since there is no singular original, but you could come close to it: A Reference Grade Pinball machine made in very limited quantities (similar to the fanatic audiophile and vintage audiophile communities). While the pin community thinks that's what an LE is (since that's all they've ever known) the truth is "standard" Limited Editions are nothing special in most other niches and are used liberally and loosely.
    Stern and the other pins makers need to figure this out.... fast. Their growth and ability to sustain a healthy audience depends on it. Rule #1 of business is to give the paying consumer what they want, and most people in any niche want a special number on the item giving them a false sense of security that their purchase was a smart one.

    #1647 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    Yup, I agree.
    My wife used to work in the art world..... and it was all the same game: Limited this, exclusive that.... in the end, none of it meant a thing. You'd run one print at a certain size and that was a "limited edition". Then the artist would go back and sign another run of the same print, now it was a different "limited edition". Then they'd go back, print out the same print and have the artist put a couple hand drawn dots on the print (such as white areas in wave highlights, or blue in the sea, or put a star or two in the sky) and that was another "limited edition".
    When all that was done, they'd go back and make a different size of the print and run the same scam all over again.... all new runs of "limited editions".
    The buyers all thinking they had a "one of a kind, special thing", which they did but so did several thousand other people. HA!!
    Only once a painting was "retired" would it end, but even then wait a couple decades and a new printing technology comes out promising "better" and the cycle starts all over again.
    Pinheads (or any niche) are the same marks that exist in any hobby or interest. Many want something that others can't have, the same snobby elitism that pervades everything (sadly). For many it isn't about having something good, it's only about having something that others can't so they feel better about themselves.
    In art there is only one way to actually achieve this: The Holy Grail: The original painting.
    Can't do this in pinball since there is no singular original, but you could come close to it: A Reference Grade Pinball machine made in very limited quantities (similar to the fanatic audiophile and vintage audiophile communities). While the pin community thinks that's what an LE is (since that's all they've ever known) the truth is "standard" Limited Editions are nothing special in most other niches and are used liberally and loosely.
    Stern and the other pins makers need to figure this out.... fast. Their growth and ability to sustain a healthy audience depends on it. Rule #1 of business is to give the paying consumer what they want, and most people in any niche want a special number on the item giving them a false sense of security that their purchase was a smart one.

    That's the truth.. I got like 20k in Michael Goddard AP giclee paintings that have been sitting in a closet for a decade.. had to have those artist proofs at that time though.‍♂️

    #1648 4 months ago

    Wonder what would happen if Stern said their warranty is not transferable? It currently is correct? Flipping would be at risk technically for 90 days. They could up the warranty to six months.

    #1649 4 months ago
    Quoted from PinMonk:

    The LE really should be the CE to just take the word limited out of there. Make as many as the market will bear. Multiple runs. Some people want that mirrored backglass, which ONLY comes on the top machine. Why limit it? Make the top one the Collector's model and make all the market wants, on multiple runs. Sure, you'll have a WWE LE dud with leftover stock stinking up the warehouse for years every now and again, but with a small initial run of the "normal" 500 or so, Stern can gauge the market and re-run more if the market demands. It really is leaving a not-insignificant amount of money on the table, and Stern hates that, so why are they ok with it now?

    This!...And put me down for one of those mirrored back glasses.

    #1650 4 months ago

    At the end of the day scalpers will be there looking for a way to get their hands on sought after machines that they can make money on. We should be reliant on distributors to "distribute" them equally and fairly. Verify buyers, limit number of orders, things like that. The bigger issue in my opinion is watching distributors being the ones charging $17k for a machine and using the excuse "I have a family I need to take care of".

    Although it may not be the best, it certainly would be the most fair. Everyone who wants an LE after announced opts into a raffle. 100 are selected and sent invoices, those who don't pay, that machine goes back into the pool. Next week/month do it again. So on and so on.
    While it won't eliminate scalpers it will get the machines in the hands of those who want one but won't pay scalper prices. Issue is it would have to be regulated or done by Stern, as stated before some distributors are downright scalpers themselves, but please continue to tell us how you're "for the pinball community"

    There are 3,544 posts in this topic. You are on page 33 of 71.

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