(Topic ID: 215650)

What is John Popadiuk's Greatest game and the one CGC should do first?

By FarFromHeaven26

5 years ago


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  • 185 posts
  • 69 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 months ago by Tommy-dog
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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“Which John Popadiuk pinball machine should CGC do first? CV, TOTAN or TOM?”

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There are 185 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 4.
#51 5 years ago
Quoted from metallik:

I didn't "downgrade" your post, I simply disagreed completely with your opinion. I also never mentioned Jersey (Jack) Pinball. Please pay attention if you want to carry on a civil discussion.

Not sure how you haven't made wiz mode in TOTAN yet, but if it challenges you, that's all that matters. The modes are extremely low scoring, so wishing away two at once with a ruby+bazaar a couple times makes for a quick trip to the end.

I disagreed with your post, but I refuse to advertise it, feeling I can ably elaborate in the discussion. OK, you did not mention Jersey Jack, I accidentally erred by misreading JPOP. My apologies on that.

#52 5 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

Unfortunately with JPop's designs the thrill is gone real fast because they're just too easy for even middling players. I can't see someone being thrilled spending $9000 for a JPOP LE remake for very long. I really can't see CGC doing any of them. The economics just won't work out for a long time, especially if another pin bust is coming (as it likely has to).

both addams and mm are equally as easy. actually addams may be easier as there is never an unsafe shot so long as you always make everything. chair ramp, chair ramp, chair ramp

#53 5 years ago
Quoted from FarFromHeaven26:

Touche Kiwipinhead, now THAT is admittedly sage advice!!!!!
We do own four though now: TAF, Elvis, MM and Gilligan's Island.

Nice collection
I guess my point was we don't know if CV or TOTAN will be remade, CGC or PPS have hinted TOM is on the list,

Anyway..... my pick is TOM

#54 5 years ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

Nice collection
I guess my point was we don't know if CV or TOTAN will be remade, CGC or PPS have hinted TOM is on the list,
Anyway..... my pick is TOM

Thank you so much! Yes you are quite right methinks. TOM is a very popular choice, and when CGC makes it I'll be there with the green.

#55 5 years ago

I think JPOP is HIGHLY overrated. The more that comes out from the past the less he actually designed himself. Left on his own he gets less than nothing accomplished. ALL of his success was due to many others helping him get from A to Z.

I won't buy another "JPOP" game but I did enjoy WCS while I had it.

#56 5 years ago

Love me some TOM. It's a great shooting breather when I'm getting my ass kicked by my "players" games. Once you slip in Ingo's trunk fix and the auto Edy boards it is a super fun reliable game. Also, guests love it. Almost made the mistake of selling it once when I was desperate for room and really glad I decided not to! Definitely would not have it in a small collection though.

#57 5 years ago
Quoted from DBLM:

I can not wait to buy a remake ToM. This has always been one of my favorite games since it came out and a lot on location are beat, don't work exactly right, or have the trunk disabled (the one at Free Gold Watch last week fit into the last). ToM is a great game but if the example is not good, it plays poorly.
Regardless of the ratings and thoughts of pinsiders, Jpop games have much more visual interest than most games out there. CGC will easily remake these games because they will sell. If you know nothing about pinball, you will buy based upon the looks and the feeling it evolves. If they do any modest updates similar to AFMr, pinsiders will buy to get the upgrade.

DBLM, I have to say I agree with everything you say here. So far aside from the JPOP bashing/indifference that has surfaced in fair measure, TOM is leading the vote in my query. I will continue to monitor it and will release results when the thread has run its course.

#58 5 years ago

Until Jpoop pays everybody back he can......

bag o dicks (resized).jpgbag o dicks (resized).jpg

#59 5 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

I think JPOP is HIGHLY overrated. The more that comes out from the past the less he actually designed himself. Left on his own he gets less than nothing accomplished. ALL of his success was due to many others helping him get from A to Z.
I won't buy another "JPOP" game but I did enjoy WCS while I had it.

That's fine, I am less concerned with who the dominant inspiration was behind these games than I am with the prospects of these pinball masterpieces being re-made.

#60 5 years ago
Quoted from Syco54645:

both addams and mm are equally as easy. actually addams may be easier as there is never an unsafe shot so long as you always make everything. chair ramp, chair ramp, chair ramp

Eh. MM Battle for the Kingdom is nowhere near as easy as any of JPOP's machines. TOTAN is the only one of his Wizard modes that comes close, but it's not THAT close. ToM and CV you can practically finish in your sleep. That is not true with MM.

#61 5 years ago
Quoted from metallik:

I've owned every popadiuk game except ToM and none of 'em are worth reproducing.
WCS is fun, if basic, but they made plenty of 'em
ToM is OK, if exploitable, and they made plenty of 'em.
ToTAN is a beginner level game and gets real boring real fast - no legs at all.
CV is a 3 shot game (left orbit, RM, ramp), and a PITA to keep running on location.
SWep1 was an appropriately bad game for a pretty bad movie.
CGC is gonna do what CGC is gonna do, but IMHO any of these is a waste of time and resources.

I do agree with ONE of your contentions here for sure, the one that asserts that CV is a pain in the ass to keep running on location. I have seen this in numerous places including Asbury Park Pinball Museum, Sunshine Laudromat etc., but I am thinking/hoping a prospective CGC re-make will successfully address this previous propensity. It seems clear now based on press releases from Rick that TOM will definitely be re-made now, with the others being considered.

#62 5 years ago

I like WCS and it doesn't go for stupid money like CV, TOM, and TOTAN. TOM is probably my favorite of the others but they are all fun games. Just not my favorite so I wouldn't call them masterpieces. Curious to see how well they will sell if any get remade. I would expect a hefty price tag and not sure how many really want those games that bad.

#63 5 years ago
Quoted from jawjaw:

I like WCS and it doesn't go for stupid money like CV, TOM, and TOTAN. TOM is probably my favorite of the others but they are all fun games. Just not my favorite so I wouldn't call them masterpieces. Curious to see how well they will sell if any get remade. I would expect a hefty price tag and not sure how many really want those games that bad.

Jawjaw, thank you for the reasonable response here. The "hefty" price tag you are anticipating will be like the previous CGC re-makes.

We are talking 7K with perhaps an additional $500 or so for the expected LE version, so a bit less methinks than MM, AFM and the expected MB in LE incarnation. It has already been announced that your favored THEATRE OF MAGIC will be re-made at this point. Unless the powers-that-be have a change of heart, expect to see it:

http://thisweekinpinball.com/twip-likely-remakes-revealed-clues-ask-steve-ritchie-twipy-host-announced/

#64 5 years ago

They shouldn't make a JPOP game, at least for a while. From a business point of view they need to focus on the top 10 and also the rarest and most sought after machines.

If CGC actually ends up making 5-10 or more of these remakes I think TOTAN or TOM would be first. They made a ton of WCS and it can be found for 2k pretty easily. TOTAN and TOM could be dolled up with improvements that might even lure in current owners.

#65 5 years ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

They shouldn't make a JPOP game, at least for a while. From a business point of view they need to focus on the top 10 and also the rarest and most sought after machines.
If CGC actually ends up making 5-10 or more of these remakes I think TOTAN or TOM would be first. They made a ton of WCS and it can be found for 2k pretty easily. TOTAN and TOM could be dolled up with improvements that might even lure in current owners.

From a business standpoint, they feel it is a smart move actually.

http://thisweekinpinball.com/twip-likely-remakes-revealed-clues-ask-steve-ritchie-twipy-host-announced/

#66 5 years ago
Quoted from FarFromHeaven26:

Jawjaw, thank you for the reasonable response here. The "hefty" price tag you are anticipating will be like the previous CGC re-makes.
We are talking 7K with perhaps an additional $500 or so for the expected LE version, so a bit less methinks than MM, AFM and the expected MB in LE incarnation. It has already been announced that your favored THEATRE OF MAGIC will be re-made at this point. Unless the powers-that-be have a change of heart, expect to see it:
http://thisweekinpinball.com/twip-likely-remakes-revealed-clues-ask-steve-ritchie-twipy-host-announced/

MMr was/is not 7k. I don't know the exact numbers but it was much higher than that plus you had to throw in hundreds extra for color display. AFMr is cheaper because playfield is fairly empty. I wouldn't expect any other remakes to be that cheap.

#67 5 years ago
Quoted from jawjaw:

MMr was/is not 7k. I don't know the exact numbers but it was much higher than that plus you had to throw in hundreds extra for color display. AFMr is cheaper because playfield is fairly empty. I wouldn't expect any other remakes to be that cheap.

My friend I just bought MMR not more than six weeks ago for 8K from a CT dealer. I agree with you that AFMR is a bit cheaper for the reason you say, but let's face it none of us can expect to see ANY future CGC remake for less than 7K. I am hoping it stays at that price point.

#68 5 years ago

With TOTAN's with cab fade and normal wear/tear listing at $7,500, I don't think pricing should be an issue for a remake. I think the CGC treatment would be awesome and TOTAN is already one of the most beautiful machines in my opinion. That would get my vote.

I know it's not super hard, but I hope to accumulate a nice mix of deep/complex/fast/brutal games for Pinheads and some more casual games for casual players. Trying to explain Ripleys to casual friends was a very quick turnoff and AFM is just brutally hard with SDTM drains galore because they can't stop themselves from shooting the ship in single ball mode.

#69 5 years ago

Jar Jar multiball!! I will admit i owned one, it was my first pin and I didn’t know any better. I didn’t like it, kids loved it

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#70 5 years ago
Quoted from metallik:

I've owned every popadiuk game except ToM and none of 'em are worth reproducing.
WCS is fun, if basic, but they made plenty of 'em
ToM is OK, if exploitable, and they made plenty of 'em.
ToTAN is a beginner level game and gets real boring real fast - no legs at all.
CV is a 3 shot game (left orbit, RM, ramp), and a PITA to keep running on location.
SWep1 was an appropriately bad game for a pretty bad movie.
CGC is gonna do what CGC is gonna do, but IMHO any of these is a waste of time and resources.

I could not agree more with the above. I never understood the attraction to his games. Find some games with good artwork AND fun to play and remake them. I have never missed a Jpop game after it left my house. To me that subconscious longing, or lack there of, is the best indicator of unbiased opinion that there is.

#71 5 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The only good one in the bunch is WCS and no point in reproing a lower value game. And even that gets old.
JPop is the most overrated pinball designer in history. Most of his games are gimmick-laden and look cool, but play poorly, or at the very least get old quickly due to repetition of dull tasks and poorly balanced scoring.

Agree. WCS is his best game in my opinion, but doesn't warrant a remake for the obvious stated reasons. The rest of his games are pretty to look at--but at some point you have to press the start button, and then it all falls apart.

However, with NIB games sitting in private collections for years with less than 200 plays on them and the recent morbid interest in JPop's Magic Girl light box, maybe "looking games" ARE more popular than games that actually play well.

-4
#72 5 years ago
Quoted from spiroagnew:

Agree. WCS is his best game in my opinion, but doesn't warrant a remake for the obvious stated reasons. The rest of his games are pretty to look at--but at some point you have to press the start button, and then it all falls apart.
However, with NIB games sitting in private collections for years with less than 200 plays on them and the recent morbid interest in JPop's Magic Girl light box, maybe "looking games" ARE more popular than games that actually play well.

Not an opinion I remotely agree with and not one pinside voters concur with by a longshot, but I asked for opinions here and you gave yours which is fair enough. When one presses the start button on CV, TOTAN or TOM one is transported with heavenly bliss to a rapturous pinball dimension, a place where ownership beckons in a big way

Translation: For.my time and money CV, TOTAN and TOM play as magnificently as they look and sound.

#73 5 years ago

World Cup Soccer '94 is the only J-Pop game I actually enjoy. I won't pass up a ToM for a play or two, but it's really the only other game I will entertain arguments for. His games are usually pretty boring, though they are pretty.

WCS94, easily.

#74 5 years ago

My vote is for Tales of the Arabian Nights to be remade. That is for selfish reasons as it's the only one I do not own
I enjoy all of these games, due to their themes, artwork and yes their play. WCS is a lot of fun as well. Another reason I like these games is because you can have a pretty good experience in 10 ~ 20 minutes. It is possible to have a quick game or two on WCS. With games such as the Hobbit you really have to invest like 40 minutes, at least if you want to plumb the depths of the experience. This fact is amazing if you want to have some epic play. But if you want a game or two while waiting for your significant other for example, then this collection fits the bill well.

I would be remiss if I didn't mention that JPop still needs to apologize and make whole the people he lied to and defrauded.
I know that these items are independent but this fact should not be forgotten. So having that be the case, Alice in Wonderland, Adventure~Land Zombies, A fully realized Magic Girl (not just a lightbox), Kiss (Jpop version) and whatever foam core project he collected monies for should be made before any of his old work is remade.

#75 5 years ago

You keep calling TOM, TOTAN and CV "Masterpieces". I don't think that word means what you think it means

I'm being snarky with you but honestly there are MUCH better games out there. Not one of those games falls in the top 10...however they do fall into the top 25...which I personally think is still too high. They'd make my top 100 for sure but probably the lower half. TOM might make the top 50 but dang it's easy.

#76 5 years ago

CV,TOM and totan are great pins and their rating is justified. Because of the magic girl debacle it's hard to discuss jpop old work but i would guess those pins remake would sell ok regardless of this chat here. Also the fact that they are easy doesn't change the fact that the art is great and the fun is here but it's only my opinion. I also don't enjoy that much recent games with complex rules, older games were much more fun but it's again my opinion.

#77 5 years ago

I'd say re-pop J-Pops games at your own risk. You've been warned, they are style over substance--most pinheads won't buy them. How any of his games are in the top 25 is baffling.

#78 5 years ago

many more games out there that dont have 'issues' attached

#79 5 years ago

Cv and totan regulaly sell over 7500 and if they are very nice with color dmd and other upgrades they sell over 8k pretty easily . Tom is getting up there also but can still b found under 7k . Those 3 are fun pins and are all original themes so i think they will remade at some point. They aren't the most difficult pins but are fun with lots of neat toys and tricks that alot of folks love.

10
#80 5 years ago

Other than WCS, he made extremely nice looking, playing, & sounding games. People saying that they wouldn't sell are completely deaf to what is going on in this hobby. Whether they are "good" or "too simple" has nothing to do with anything related to new sales.

13
#81 5 years ago

I am probably one of the worst pinball players on Pinside, but I absolutely love the hobby. Playing, working on machines, watching people play, admiring the artwork, you name it....it's just a really satisfying hobby on so many levels.

I understand there are a lot of "purists" and "players" out there who have been playing consistently for years and want a challenge, I've only been in the hobby for about 3 years, but I have been fortunate enough to live/work/travel to a few places that have a lot of machines. So, I have been lucky enough to play many and own 3.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion of course, but opinion is not fact. The reality is that although maybe the JPOP machines *might* not appeal to some of the true aficionados, out there, discounting the games for what they are makes you come across as sort of arrogant and dismissive...like these machines are beneath you and unworthy of remakes. I play ToM with my 17 year old daughter who is on the autism spectrum and she loves it. We love it. We have a great time playing it. It's a beautiful machine and so much fun to play. Isn't that what pinball is all about? Having fun. Socializing. Realize that if it's "easy" for you that doesn't mean it's easy for everyone else.

Also, would love to know what the expert players think of as the Top 10?

#82 5 years ago
Quoted from Damagio:

Also, would love to know what the expert players think of as the Top 10?

Top 10, or 20, or 100 is all completely irrelevant.
Half of those games aren't as "good" as Flash Gordon or Centaur.
It's just internet votes that are as worthless as any other.

#83 5 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Top 10, or 20, or 100 is all completely irrelevant.
Half of those games aren't as "good" as Flash Gordon or Centaur.
It's just internet votes that are as worthless as any other.

I am looking more for what personal favorites and not some "official" Top 10, which is totally hype and obviously "what's hot now". Especially favorites from some of the more skilled players, which may be more challenging machines.

#84 5 years ago

Ha. This thread is great. With all the j poop hate, I either missed or didn't realize the deuche nozzle actually made some well liked games.

Who'da thunk?

#85 5 years ago
Quoted from tommyp:

Ha. This thread is great. With all the j poop hate, I either missed or didn't realize the deuche nozzle actually made some well liked games.
Who'da thunk?

I think the jury is still out on what he's done as far as his actual level of contributions to the games he gets credit for designing . As far as I can tell his only real skill is picking out other people's eye catching artwork and slapping it on a game.

#86 5 years ago
Quoted from Honch:

I think the jury is still out on what he's done as far as his actual level of contributions to the games he gets credit for designing . As far as I can tell his only real skill is picking out other people's eye catching artwork and slapping it on a game.

Aye Honch. I knew when I published this post there would be vitriol hurled at JPOP, whose stellar creativity speaks for itself and whose games at Pinside are enjoying a sustained and lofty run in the Solid State Top 25. While a good number here have been passionate there are some dismissive, confusing fact with opinion. As THEATRE OF MAGIC has already been named by Rick for the re-make schedule and CV and TOTAN real possibilities pinball will triumph over cynicism in the end.

#87 5 years ago
Quoted from tommyp:

Ha. This thread is great. With all the j poop hate, I either missed or didn't realize the deuche nozzle actually made some well liked games.
Who'da thunk?

Aye Tommy P. I knew when I published this post there would be vitriol hurled at JPOP, whose stellar creativity speaks for itself and whose games at Pinside are enjoying a sustained and lofty run in the Solid State Top 25. While a good number here have been passionate there are some dismissive, confusing fact with opinion. As THEATRE OF MAGIC has already been named by Rick for the re-make schedule and CV and TOTAN real possibilities pinball will triumph over cynicism in the end.

#88 5 years ago

WCS94 is a really fun game. It will never get remade but that’s what I would vote for.

#89 5 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

You keep calling TOM, TOTAN and CV "Masterpieces". I don't think that word means what you think it means
I'm being snarky with you but honestly there are MUCH better games out there. Not one of those games falls in the top 10...however they do fall into the top 25...which I personally think is still too high. They'd make my top 100 for sure but probably the lower half. TOM might make the top 50 but dang it's easy.

Well my friend, snarkiness can go both ways. You inquire about the generally accepted definition of "masterpiece." Ah, let's see....Dreyer's "La Passion de Jeanne d'Arc", Murnau's "Sunrise" and Ozu's "Tokyo Story" are cinematic masterpieces. Shakespeare's "Hamlet," Miller's "Death of a Salesman" and Sophocles' "Oedipus Rex" are masterpieces of the stage; Mozart's "Clarinet Concerto in A major", Tchaikovsky's Symphony No. 6 (Pathetique) and Ravel's "Bolero" are classical music masterworks; Melville's "Moby Dick", Dickens' "Great Expectations" and Tolstoy's "War and Peace" are masterpiece novels and Da Vinci's "Mona Lisa", van Gogh's "The Starry Night" and Munch's "The Scream" are painting masterpieces. In the far more innocuous world of pinball, I judge masterpieces of the form on the art, sounds, game play, durability, general theme and design and passionate engagement of the machines I feel qualify for the ultimate annointment. Pinsiders have spoken with their ratings, and apparently CGC is listening.

#90 5 years ago
Quoted from FarFromHeaven26:

Thank you so much! Yes you are quite right methinks. TOM is a very popular choice, and when CGC makes it I'll be there with the green.

You’re bringing the green for a game you yourself rated a 4??? You keep touting pinside ratings as holy, when you give Gilligan’s Island a perfect 10... Pinside is no place for a Jpop fanboy. If I had to place a bet I’d say you’re the man himself, trying to stroke his own ego. Or possibly a Russian troll farm.

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#91 5 years ago

JPOP games are pretty, but not that fun for me personally. I wouldn’t be buying any of them. If you are drawn to his art style, then I can see the attraction.

My casual observations are that JPOP fans tend to be more aesthetic collectors than players and tinkerers. The “JPOP makes artful masterpieces” group usually doesn’t care for WCS94. Conversely, WCS seems to be the only JPOP game most regular players and tinkerers are drawn to.

Considering that this is an enthusiast forum and JPOP recently took a lot of money from collectors and gave them nothing, he’s not the most popular name in Pinball right now.

My pic below is a quick search of IPDB using the JPOP name.

C9CA6F40-A308-4304-A3BB-CDD7879974B9 (resized).jpegC9CA6F40-A308-4304-A3BB-CDD7879974B9 (resized).jpeg

#92 5 years ago

Why is the OP responding multiple times in his thread, and there IS NO POLL?

#93 5 years ago

LMAO I had no idea people were so OCD for polls around here.

It’s like it doesn’t count if there’s no poll!

On topic - ok I give up. J pop sucks but I’ll play - TOTAN would make the most sense as a remake. It’s the highest price and only mildly stupid.

#94 5 years ago
Quoted from megalo17:

You’re bringing the green for a game you yourself rated a 4??? You keep touting pinside ratings as holy, when you give Gilligan’s Island a perfect 10... Pinside is no place for a Jpop fanboy. If I had to place a bet I’d say you’re the man himself, trying to stroke his own ego. Or possibly a Russian troll farm.

So I'm a "JPOP Fanboy" by your reckoning, yet I rated THEATRE OF MAGIC with a 4ish rating?! And then you up the ante even further by suggesting I may be JPOP himself in apparent masochist mode. Yes I am JPOP coming on here to downgrade one of my machines. Did you ever think that my ratings, while trying to be close to the way I feel were also tempered with strategic aims? I have long felt GILLIGAN'S ISLAND was grossly underrated and thought I'd try and boost it so it would place in the Top 300. I stated at the outset of this thread that THEATRE OF MAGIC was my least favorite of JPOP's games in an effort to get some affection for CV and TOTAN now that TOM is headed for a re-make. But yes, I would indeed still purchase TOM, because I feel CGC's superb work will make virtually all their new releases irresistible if financially feasible for the buyer...........but anyway, here ya go. My name is Sam Juliano. I am 63 years old, I reside at 7 Spruce Street, Fairview, NJ, 07022. Literature and creative writing teacher for 35 years in my hometown in a school where my wife serves as Principal. We have five kids, all pinball fans (22, 21, 19, 17, 16.) I don't know JPOP from Adam, but have long thought him one creative talent, regardless of some indiscretions connected to his aborted projects.

#95 5 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

LMAO I had no idea people were so OCD for polls around here.
It’s like it doesn’t count if there’s no poll!
On topic - ok I give up. J pop sucks but I’ll play - TOTAN would make the most sense as a remake. It’s the highest price and only mildly stupid.

Hahahaha Levil! true what you say!! But be rest assured I am counting and when this thread peters out i will release the results. It should be clear though at this point that TOM is leading, which supports CGC's recent press release, committing to the title.

#96 5 years ago
Quoted from FarFromHeaven26:

It should be clear though at this point that TOM is leading, which supports CGC's recent press release, committing to the title.

Do you have a link to the CGC press release? I follow them on Facebook and don't see it. Are you referring to Rick's post (from PPS) regarding possible future titles?

#97 5 years ago
Quoted from FarFromHeaven26:

I have long felt GILLIGAN'S ISLAND was grossly underrated and thought I'd try and boost it so it would place in the Top 300

See... that's not how that's supposed to work. That's "gaming" the system. You'd think as a career teacher you would have a better grasp of ethics.

#98 5 years ago

I think Cirqus Voiltaire deserves it the most, that’s a neat game that never really got the love it deserved back in the day, especially with the backbox animations and trim, PF mounted DMD, and pop up bumper and Ringmaster toys. TOTAN seems a little more likely tho, as it’s more in line with what CGC has been making so far.

-1
#99 5 years ago

The only thing I can't believe in this thread is I'm the first to say "hey John".

Sorry, had to do it.

#100 5 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

Unfortunately with JPop's designs the thrill is gone real fast because they're just too easy for even middling players. I can't see someone being thrilled spending $9000 for a JPOP LE remake for very long. I really can't see CGC doing any of them. The economics just won't work out for a long time, especially if another pin bust is coming (as it likely has to).

Normally, I would agree with you, but then I think about how many times people on here have been screwed by the prepaid purchase system. It makes you realize that emotional purchases will always prevail over common sense for a huge number of people.

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Pinball Machine
Mircoplayfields
 
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