(Topic ID: 126759)

What happened to Tracelifter???


By Ronnie1114

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 87 posts
  • 49 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by NJGecko
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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    -3
    #51 4 years ago

    i wish i could thumbs up that mod comment.

    #52 4 years ago
    Quoted from dsuperbee:

    Is he going? Last time I talked with him he said they weren't making it this year. Not the same without playing a game on FH with his son.

    I don't think he will ever go to PAGG again under the current regime.

    12
    #53 4 years ago
    Quoted from Carl_694:

    I am not trying to criticize a specific mod decision here, but would like to raise a general question as to the "can't criticize a mods' decision in public" rule. While I understand the intent, Doesn't that seem oppressive? It seems like a better approach would be to limit the amount of such criticism so that it's not too much, or to allow public comment on the threads that users create when interacting with the mods.

    Well, generally public mod-criticism turns into a nasty bloodbath quickly. As soon as you put up a criticism....even if well meaning and polite....others take it as their cue to go absolutely berserk and bash with impressive gusto.

    So, you've got to understand....we KNOW we aren't perfect. We make mistakes all the time! I absolutely try my best to be fair, and I work hard to do what's best for the entire group....but man, I can't say I'm 100% right all the time. (And...even when I feel I AM right, chances are that not everyone will be happy with a decision to lock a thread, or eject someone, or whatever).

    Because of these factors...that's why the Moderator Feedback section exists. We welcome your comments, and we are happy to discuss issues there, in a non-public setting. Sometimes we're right, sometimes we're wrong....and sometimes individual moderators handle things differently. (I've said it before...we aren't all perfect robots). The discussions in the Mod Feedback section can help explain the various positions, and generally people leave with a better understanding of things...with no hard feelings.

    Pete

    #54 4 years ago
    Quoted from Carl_694:

    I am not trying to criticize a specific mod decision here, but would like to raise a general question as to the "can't criticize a mods' decision in public" rule. While I understand the intent, Doesn't that seem oppressive? It seems like a better approach would be to limit the amount of such criticism so that it's not too much, or to allow public comment on the threads that users create when interacting with the mods.

    You really can't draw a line in a gray area like this and define levels of acceptable criticism. But, that said, this is a moderated site. That's life here. You set up an account and agree to it.

    But...normally we are a pretty light-handed bunch. We don't like to get involved in doing anything beyond keeping a level of civility here, keeping things from getting out of hand and ugly. We all understand that it's not something everyone agrees with. If you don't agree with it, open up a topic in the moderator feedback forum and we are happy to discuss with you privately.

    Back to where this all started, it's just not cool to mock the mods. We aren't gods. We are here of our own free will (and time) for the love of the hobby and forum. Nothing more, nothing less. We have discussions on keeping our moderation consistent and fair. While people may just see the occasional post from us, rest assured there is constant discussion before and sometimes during, and often after any major moderation.

    We are here to make this a forum that's pleasant and a happy place for all.

    #55 4 years ago
    Quoted from pmWolf:

    Well, generally public mod-criticism turns into a nasty bloodbath quickly. As soon as you put up a criticism....even if well meaning and polite....others take it as their cue to go absolutely berserk and bash with impressive gusto.
    So, you've got to understand....we KNOW we aren't perfect. We make mistakes all the time! I absolutely try my best to be fair, and I work hard to do what's best for the entire group....but man, I can't say I'm 100% right all the time. (And...even when I feel I AM right, chances are that not everyone will be happy with a decision to lock a thread, or eject someone, or whatever).
    Because of these factors...that's why the Moderator Feedback section exists. We welcome your comments, and we are happy to discuss issues there, in a non-public setting. Sometimes we're right, sometimes we're wrong....and sometimes individual moderators handle things differently. (I've said it before...we aren't all perfect robots). The discussions in the Mod Feedback section can help explain the various positions, and generally people leave with a better understanding of things.
    Pete

    I understand this strategy, but would suggest making the subforum public. In this way, third parties can comment. This matters because, let's say, I am given some type of warning. I would then be reluctant to disagree with said decision because it would ultimatley only serve to cause me more problems and/or annoy the mods (I'm probably doing this now, but I'm honestly just trying to provide feedback. I am a former journalist, so I'm "into" these types of issues).

    But I understand the bloodbath-type scenario. Just wondering if there is some type of middle ground here rather than a user getting banned for making a comment a mod might consider criticism. I think it makes a poor impression on folks when they see that, but many are reluctant to say anything for fear of reprisal.

    15
    #56 4 years ago
    Quoted from Carl_694:

    "can't criticize a mods' decision in public" rule.

    Seems fair. You have an issue with a mod. PM the mod, or take it up with Robin.

    Criticize a mod here, and there is a fine line between constructive criticism and a subtle attack. And then the dog pile can start.

    The mods are volunteers. Which means you should be nicer to them than the guy screwing up your burger and fries order.

    Pinside is great. We are lucky to have it, and be here. Treat it accordingly. Add to what makes Pinside special, don't make it something less.

    LTG : )

    #57 4 years ago
    Quoted from Carl_694:

    I understand this strategy, but would suggest making the subforum public. In this way, third parties can comment. This matters because, let's say, I am given some type of warning. I would then be reluctant to disagree with said decision because it would ultimatley only serve to cause me more problems and/or annoy the mods (I'm probably doing this now, but I'm honestly just trying to provide feedback. I am a former journalist, so I'm "into" these types of issues).
    But I understand the bloodbath-type scenario. Just wondering if there is some type of middle ground here rather than a user getting banned for making a comment a mod might consider criticism. I think it makes a poor impression on folks when they see that, but many are reluctant to say anything for fear of reprisal.

    Realistically that would just never work. You can't have a discussion with someone with the entire world weighing in.

    There is in fact a middle ground. Minor stuff gets warnings pretty regularly. Being banned from a topic isn't something that's done lightly. It's done when it's not a minor infraction.

    #58 4 years ago

    For clarity's sake, I think the mods do a fine job overall and enjoy the site. I always just err on the side of free speech. I have yet to see folks go too far off the deep end, but my tenure on the site is limited.

    * This will be my last comment on this topic. Thanks for your consideration and patience. *

    #59 4 years ago
    Quoted from NJGecko:

    it's just not cool to mock the mods

    So.....some parity here would be nice?

    #60 4 years ago
    Quoted from Carl_694:

    This will be my last comment on this topic. Thanks for your consideration and patience.

    Again, feel free to open up a Mod Feedback thread...we would love to continue the discussion there if you'd like. I don't want you to think that we're trying to sweep your concerns under the rug...

    Pete

    #61 4 years ago

    The only thing I would say is the warning message you get from a mod editing your post is kind of jarring.

    I've gotten a couple lately, both over minor edits a mod made to my post (one I forgot to censor f**k, and the other was to tone down a hyperbolic comment about people being ready to murder jpop).

    I wasn't "in trouble" for either one, just a mod making a friendly edit, no big deal. But the email that shows up kind of makes you go "oh shit" like you really screwed up.

    I dunno, just a thought, might have been what helped prompt Tracelifter to bail.

    #62 4 years ago

    Tracelifter was good people. I've always hated the "changed it for you" quote crap, but I'm sure the overall tone of pinside just got to him and he got out when he could.

    Quoted from Aurich:

    But the email that shows up kind of makes you go "oh shit" like you really screwed up.

    I'm sure it wasn't that bad.

    #63 4 years ago
    Quoted from swampfire:

    I think there's a whole subforum where you can debate Pinside rules. To me, criticizing a mod is kinda like criticizing a volunteer fireman after he puts out a kitchen fire in your house.

    Other times it's kinda like criticizing that same volunteer fireman for dousing the firepit in your backyard and telling everyone the party's over

    #64 4 years ago

    This is unfortunate as TL was a good Pin Brothah. I hope he comes back. Hey, it's only pinball.

    #65 4 years ago
    Quoted from swampfire:

    I think there's a whole subforum where you can debate Pinside rules. To me, criticizing a mod is kinda like criticizing a volunteer fireman after he puts out a kitchen fire in your house.

    Also, that forum is setup so the debates only occur between the one particular user and the mod team. There really isn't a forum for the users to discuss the rules amongst themselves.

    #66 4 years ago
    Quoted from NJGecko:

    Consider this fair warning folks...question asked and answered here in the first two posts.
    If this thread continues to get into bickering, we won't permit that stuff.

    Guess it is time to quit pinside.

    #67 4 years ago

    Let's lighten the mood and dance a little. This guy is great!

    #68 4 years ago
    Quoted from Pinfidel:

    Let's lighten the mood and dance a little. This guy is great! ยป YouTube video

    You know what...this one always makes me smile, too:

    http://i.imgur.com/NiVnVDK.gifv

    89 year old Brian Sperry scores a touchdown at the Kansas University scrimmage.

    The pure joy is just awesome...

    Pete

    #69 4 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    But the email that shows up kind of makes you go "oh shit" like you really screwed up.

    I like getting that email.

    11
    #70 4 years ago
    Quoted from calvin12:

    Tee hee!! Hilarious! Welcome to eject-ville, by the way.

    Eject me too then.

    I'm getting tired of seeing this crap from mods. Why do some of you feel the need to put your personal comments like this in? This is far from the first time, it's happening a lot.

    The above quote comes across as "I'm a mod, I can eject you and laugh about doing it"!

    I saw someone ejected from a thread and the moderators comment said "you have no skin in the game" and the poster was ejected for being "negative".

    Pinside has some great moderators. But I think they have too many moderators now, and the moderation has really become heavy handed.

    Nobody gave a shit about Tracelifter "changing the quote" except for the moderator who wanted to exercise his/her power.

    Ugh.

    #71 4 years ago

    #72 4 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    And then the dog pile can start.

    I just checked and dogpile.com still exists, as does Ask (formerly ask Jeeves, aka Aks search engine in most of New Jersey). I thought for sure dogpile would be gone.

    #73 4 years ago
    Quoted from RobT:

    Nobody gave a shit about Tracelifter "changing the quote" except for the moderator who wanted to exercise his/her power.
    Ugh.

    Actually, Robin cares. Robin gave a directive to us, The Mod Team, to actively moderate that particular rule. Robin does not want people changing quotes, even for a laugh. Robin has drawn the line in the sand. And when Robin tells us to focus on something, we focus on it.

    And in Tracelifter's case, we simply used the tool given to us, "the warning" to notify him that modifying quotes is not allowed on Pinside. And to please not do it again.

    If that is too much moderation for him, or anyone else, then he will be unhappy on Pinside because that is the least obtrusive manner in which we can moderate outside of a PM.

    And Robin has asked that we use the Moderator Tools so that our efforts can be properly recorded.

    So if anyone has an issue with the "do not change another pinsider's quote" rule, then please open a Moderator Feedback thread and Robin, as well as the rest of the mod team, will be happy to discuss it with you. Chances are you will not change Robin's mind regarding the rule or the emphasis on enforcing it, but you will be able to speak to us directly about it.

    Marcus

    #74 4 years ago
    Quoted from thedefog:

    I just checked and dogpile.com still exists,

    Dogpile was the jam back tin the day for sure...back when Google was just mirroring yahoo

    17
    #75 4 years ago
    Quoted from Zampinator:

    Can we partially quote a text? Meaning, using their words, but only the sentences that pertains to our comments.

    Quoted from pmWolf:

    Absolutely...no worries there.
    Just try not to grab things that are insanely out-of-context as a way to "get" someone.
    Pete

    Dan has too much time on his hands.png
    #76 4 years ago
    Quoted from thedefog:

    I just checked and dogpile.com still exists, as does Ask (formerly ask Jeeves, aka Aks search engine in most of New Jersey). I thought for sure dogpile would be gone.

    Nice, I'm moving to Lycos for email - just to be an old hipster.

    http://www.lycos.com/

    #77 4 years ago
    Quoted from Daniml:

    Dan has too much time on his hands.png (Click image to enlarge)

    This was freaking hilarious!

    #78 4 years ago

    Re: "Tee hee!! Hilarious! Welcome to eject-ville, by the way."

    Why are moderator comments anonymous?

    I'm not questioning the moderator's decision. I'm just wondering why the comment below the moderated post is anonymous.

    #79 4 years ago
    Quoted from Razorbak86:

    I'm not questioning the moderator's decision. I'm just wondering why the comment below the moderated post is anonymous.

    There was a time when it wasn't anonymous....

    And that's when things went bat-crap insane with people making some really nasty, attacking youtube videos, sending awful PM's, and generally being jerks.

    So, anonymous corrections were the better choice. Subjecting your volunteer mods to some insane abuse....that's rough.

    Pete

    #80 4 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    I wasn't "in trouble" for either one, just a mod making a friendly edit, no big deal. But the email that shows up kind of makes you go "oh shit" like you really screwed up.
    I dunno, just a thought, might have been what helped prompt Tracelifter to bail.

    I got something a few weeks ago, and had no idea what it was about, and for a second was like F this place... But stepped away for a day and came to my senses. You're probably right about the shooting from the hip thing, it is easy to do and sometimes hard to restrain yourself depending on the day.

    #81 4 years ago
    Quoted from Daniml:

    Dan has too much time on his hands.png (Click image to enlarge)

    This....was....brilliant.

    Seriously.

    #82 4 years ago

    Oh also

    in_before_the_lock_gif.gif
    #83 4 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    The only thing I would say is the warning message you get from a mod editing your post is kind of jarring.

    Trust me, this has been a big topic of discussion among us.

    We're still working on things...and you know that Robin loves to improve the site. We are always looking for a "better way" to do things.

    Pete

    -1
    #84 4 years ago

    Very simple, don't like the rules of the website you're a guest on, stop coming around.
    I hate to see people go that have been on here for years, but it happens. Tracelifter now, that otehr guy last month...some guys maybe before don't really remember their name....

    -1
    #85 4 years ago

    Well, at least this discussion explains all the "welcome back from the dark side" comments to him over on RGP...

    #86 4 years ago
    Quoted from pmWolf:

    There was a time when it wasn't anonymous....
    And that's when things went bat-crap insane with people making some really nasty, attacking youtube videos, sending awful PM's, and generally being jerks.
    So, anonymous corrections were the better choice. Subjecting your volunteer mods to some insane abuse....that's rough.
    Pete

    I agree. No one deserves that. It's the tone of how things were delivered that i think rubs people the wrong way, talking to grown men like their children. I keep hoping that some grow into the position and take the lead from some of the older mods but not so much yet. The fact two mods were in here with no issues and one "up voting" my post that was deemed bickering by a third mod illustrates my first point.

    -3
    #87 4 years ago

    Goodnight topic. This thread has got to be pretty firmly entrenched in the "derailed" category, so lock-o-matic away...

    If anyone has particular issues with mods, moderation techniques, or anything else, please fire up a post in the moderator feedback forum.

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