After some shipping delay, I finally am officially in the club with a beautiful CV machine. What better way to get to know it than to have a few little gremlins up front, so here we go - I'm losing pinballs in the ringmaster device. If it helps, I had two missing pinballs, and I put the playfield all the way up (couldn't see them in the subways) and back down (to the rest, but still angled back), powered on and the ball finder kicked on out the VUK by the Ringmaster, and was still missing one. When the Ringmaster came up in the test I saw it right under the head (at the top / 12 o'clock) and then when I put the playfield back to normal (all the way down) it eventually came out the VUK. I'm hoping its as simple as magnetized balls (is that a common?) and will be checking this shortly, but just curious if this is common, and if so, the most common errors/fixes.

Answered my own question, playfield angle measured at the flippers was 6.5, at the ringmaster, just over 5%. So I just averaged out the playfield angle and jamming now. Really fun game!

My backbox circus luck switch err’d, because it hadn’t been hit in some time I guess. Manually triggering it clears the credit dot. With that said, the cannon never hits it in my game, but I have no idea if there is something I have to do or if it’s just random. Watching the orange ball, it it fires, hits directly above her hand and drops straight down, never really getting near the switch. Basically following the path I’ve drawn on the attached picture. Am I doing something wrong or do I need to adjust something?

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I’ve also had 2 flipper dead, GI’s/lamps out (DMD stays on), 3-5 seconds, then reset (twice tonight). I’m going to assume this is the WPC reset issue that the daughtercard bandaids, but has a power voltage supply issue?

I’m going to look for the blue ball. But now I see what’s happening. It’s hitting the clear raised disk that is above the red ball and bouncing back. Is that disk too big or non-standard? Attached screenshots from the slow-mo video (sorry for awful glare), show the progression from hitting the clear disk an bouncing back.

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So this reset issue, I’m starting to think it’s a software issue, and not a power issue. Only because every time it resets, it goes to Sideshow mode, and the ColorDMD never shuts down. Sideshow mode randomly pops up, playfield and flippers go dark/dead, and it takes about 3-5 seconds (DMD on the whole time, playing the sideshow animation), before it gets a reboot, testing, etc. I’m running 2.0HC (which I saw isn’t official, but looks like it has a ton of improvements). I just ordered a replacement (actually ordered 2.0H Mayne different?), and also 1.4. Hoping that fixes it. Has anybody experienced anything like this? It’s a bummer just had 107M on my second ball it crapped out. Finished the full wizard mode though which is super cool!

Thank you, this is all super helpful. I’ve had that reset issue (on TAF) what makes this one unique is that before it resets, it starts playing the sideshow music and animations on the DMD, even if I didn’t hit the sideshow. It absolutely could still be an undervoltage issue (and I’m prepared to do that) just seemed weird that it’s tied to the sideshow music/animations, which made me think it could be software (I’ve had roms go bad too). I’m going to do the wiggle test, I didn’t do that (but have on a DMD driver issue on another WPC). Thank you!

There is a steel bell in a box in the cashbox, so should be easy! Previous owner thought ahead.

I plan on installing PinStadiums. Looks like they do not drown out the neon (which I was worried about)

Can you share a picture of the skinny head? Curious how it looks!

For what it’s worth, if you have LED’s in this game, the GI OCD is a must have. I thought the flickering was a feature until I tested the GI’s and the flickering was the dimming. The OCD makes a huge difference.

I ordered the blue ball from Marcos and it makes a huge difference it falls down the right about half the time and hits the switch. Started to replace the fake bell with a real bell, but didn’t get to it. Will do soon!

So my machine has not reset in sometime, but a buddy came over tonight to play and reset on him. Just for shits and grins I threw in the reset fix board (that I ordered a few weeks ago when it first started happening) and it seemed to address it for a full two player game which lasted about 30 minutes. Then it reset again, when he was playing and I was playing another pin (IJ) next to him on the same electrical circuit. I don’t know if that was the cause or a coincidence.

I measured the voltage at J101 on the power board and on pin 32 of the CPU chip, almost identical at 5.09 so not losing anything there. Measured the outlet at the wall as well as the service port, both reading the same and consistent. The only thing I can figure is that while I’m not monitoring, there is a voltage drop. Somewhere. Maybe from the pool heater (they are in a pool house), maybe the HVAC, who knows. To rule that out I ordered a line conditioner which has a battery to cover voltage drops.

I have noticed, when the reset happens, it typically starts with a shot up the left ramp and presumably when the magnet engages going into the lock. Are magnets a big power draw? And anything I should be looking for related to that?

Another thing i that I can’t figure out, it’s not an immediate reset. Every time it goes to the sideshow animation with a dark play field and no flipper control (which I believe is the case when you get the sideshow). Then the DMD shows testing….

I will ultimately figure it out by trial and error, but any comments or thoughts would be appreciated.

Love this game!

I've got a fathead, but I also have that post (although it doesn't connect to the other post with rubber, it just has it's own little ring around it).

That might be it, I need to check the 12v. My 5v is fine, but I didn't check 12v. But interesting, it resets every time going up the ramp, I'm wondering if that switch below the magnet, or the magnet, is getting a bad connection. I'm going to do some wiggling under the glass here shortly.

Is the backglass plastic trim on this game different than other WPC's? I seem to be missing the side pieces, not needed, but would like to order some. With all this game has going on in the backglass, it seemed a little thicker to me, so wondering if the trim piece was a different part number. Couldn't find a PN in the manual, so thought I'd ask! Thank you

That’s what I couldn’t find, perfect!

This bracket that is circled was not installed correctly in my machine (it was backwards from the picture). I’ve attached it the way that it looks from the CV pics I could find (harder when Pinside was down!). Does this look correct now? I have it double side taped to the back of the switch because that’s how it was, and I don’t have the screws small enough to fit.

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I’m chasing down a maddening problem, it’s intermittent which means it only happens when I’m on my GC score

Was at 168M w/ another ball left.

The machine resets, easy right all WPC’s do. Bought the bandaid, tested all the TP’s for voltages, followed the guides until I ran out of talent, took both the power and MPU board to Chris Hibler who went through them all, tested, etc. got it back, still does it. Voltage coming out of my walls measures fine and I have 3 more WPC’s plugged into the same outlets, no issues.

Here is where this is weird, my machine goes into a random Side Show mode (on DMD, music, etc) for about 5 seconds (flippers dead and playfield dark, same as when you go into it in the game) before I see the “Testing...”. Changed ROMs to 2.0H from 2.0HC (heard it was a hack), thought I solved it but then the above game happened.

It only ever happens/resets going up the ramp. Upper ramp and ramp made switches test fine. I though the issue could have been a diode that’s really close / touching the other lead on the ramp made switch, but not. It could be the magnet (next step is unplugging it to see if the resets still happen), or could be the neon, which is triggered by the ramp made (which you only see if the magnet doesn’t grab it).

Had anybody seen anything like this? For a while I was able to reproduce, but then I can go games without being able to. Driving me a little nuts!!!

Would love any suggestions.

Sometimes I can recreate, other times it plays just fine for awhile. I’ve narrowed it down to ramp w/o lock* (so no magnet engaging) and rolling down (which lights the neon). *with the glass off, rolling the ball by hand, this is how I recreates. This may be happening when lock/magnet are on, but not when trying to recreate.

I will take your advice with the playfield up, wiggling the switches, but I’d also like to disconnect the magnet and neon to see if it still happens. Assuming both are pretty big power draws. Do you know if there is molexes below to unplug or will I have to de-solder.

Thanks!

Is there a prescribed way to test the diodes on switches? I understand that a diode is sort of a one-way and prevents signal going backwards, but how would I test this?

I think this is what I needed to to do (the grins part, hitting both switches at once). I have a bunch of column 6 switches that if I push at the same time as another, activates a random additional switches. It is column 6 that is wonky.
61 (Light Standup Target) - if I hit it together with 62 (Lock Standup Target), I get 62, 21 (Slam Tilt), and 31 (trough eject) - Row 1 switch faults
61 - if I hit it with 64 (Ramp Magnet), I get 64, 21 and 31 - Row 1 again
64 - if I hit it with 65 (Ramp Made), I get 65 and 25 (Inner Loop Left) - Row 5
68 (ramp lock high) - hitting it with 61 gets a 61 and 31, hitting it with 64 gets a 64 and 28 (Inner Loop Right), hitting it with 65 works as designed (only get a 65).

There are many more combos of errors I can generate (off of column 6), but as this will be my first real dive into switch matrix issues (beyond just replacing a chip, which it has a fresh u20), I'm not really sure what to do with this data. Would the next step be start at 61 and go down the column testing to figure the last switch in the chain that effects every other switch in column 6? The last on 68 (for example) isn't problematic with switch 65, 66, or 67, but is effected by everything 64 and below (to 61). Does this mean 64 is the problem switch and maybe the diode isn't working?

Thank you for any help, I really do love learning this stuff and value the input so that one day I can help somebody else.

I've looked at all of them (64 looked close and I bent it away, this was a few days ago, had a similar issue with IJ where the diode bent into the lead and cause some switch havoc) and have a heck of of a marked up switch matrix (trying the rectangle approach). All diodes look normal and I have a multi-meter, but can't seem to make any sense of the testing. half the diodes in the machine test fine using the multi-meter (showing .6-.8V one way, 0L the other way), the rest just show .001v or something both ways (including all the problematic ones). Either half the diodes in the machine are bad, or I need to figure out what I'm doing wrong with the test. Ugh....

Does a diode need to be unsoldered on one end (positive or negative) to test? That could be part of my testing issue.

Attached is a pick with the matrix, all starting by combining switches in column 6

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UPDATE - I believe I'm making progress. The diode in question visibly was 65 (ramp made), and I wasn't able to test the diode inline. So I desoldered, and it tested fine. Resoldered the switch, and I think it solved some of the issue. As we sit, the only offending switch is 64 (ramp magnet). I can hit any combo of other switches (as long as this one, 64, isn't included) and everything tests.

So I started de-soldering and testing diodes, all suspect diodes tested correctly. Found some crappy soldering on some of the switches, cleaned up. I'm out of ideas. Essentially what I could reproduce pretty regularly is that every switch works fine alone (and combined with other switches), except any column 6 at the same time as 64 (Ramp Magnet) would like both, as well as the same row in column 2 (for whatever I'm combining with 64). I just put everything back together, and it's back to random combinations of most of column 6. So it's really not even reproducing consistently, but it is consistently not working and i'm chasing changing conditions. The real risk I have outside of test mode (that resets the game) is the combination of the locks (lower, middle, and upper) with 64. I've got my tech buddy coming Tuesday, but will likely not sleep until I figure this out!

That was my next step to manually test the board with test leads. They are on the wat via prime, I could have made them but I needed a day’s break after 5 hours chasing in circles! Thank you!

What’s the p/n on the diodes (Marcos has many)? The diode on one of the the suspicious switches tests fine but looks different (smaller). May as well change it out!

Found it. The same damn switch (64) that we knew was the issue ended up being wired backwards (white and diode on wrong outside lead), somebody here called it. It sure didn't look like it because they had the diode wired backwards with it.

I'm learning from people smarter than me on this, but its quite interesting that one switch can wreak havoc on a switch matrix!

Go back a few posts I just dealt with this for weeks. My solution was 3 of the switches were wired backwards (including diodes). But start with switch 64, ramp magnet. In the switch edges test, hit the switch and see if it activates more than one switch. If not, hold it down along with the lock switches and see if more than two switches go off (this was my issue, when two switches were triggered, it activated 3-4 switches).

Deja Vu for certain. That is exactly what happened to me. If you follow in my footsteps you’ll learn a lot but I’d like to try to help you past that. Hit switch 64 (ramp magnet) and 61 (Lite standup target) on the front left of the ramp. Take a slow mo video of your DMD so you can see what switches activate (for me it was the colum 2 switches that were getting wrongly activated). I’m going to take pictures of 61, 62, and 64 and you can compare to yours. All three of those were wired backwards on mine. Give me a few.

I’m wondering if there is a CV restorer out there not doing these correctly. The odds....

My first picture is from mid playfield of switch 64. Pay close attention to the orientation of the wires. Green in middle and then the direction of the diode (which side has the white band on it).

The second picture is of 62 (light lock standup at the bottom right of the ramp). I’m embarrassed by my soldering, but white on the bottom, green in the middle (offset to left) and banded side of diode on top. 62 (standup to the left of ramp) should look identical.

Those were what cause my problems, would be really odd if you have the exact same issue but worth a look.

If those look fine, and you hit 64 (ramp magnet) with a switch not in column 6 (anything other than the ramp and lock switches), does it trigger a 3rd unwanted switch? Mine did not which allowed me to isolate column 6 as the offender.

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If you've owned the game and it used to work and all of a sudden stopped, try re-seating all of the connectors at the bottom of the MPU board (board on the left in the backbox), and then check the u20 chip, make sure it looks ok.

Just out of curiosity, what would the benefit of this be? It’s certainly cool I get it, but the rollover switches work just fine on the locks. Is it that it’s lower profile and may look better (more hidden)?

Hi, was just checking a switch (wire ramp entry), so had to take off the rear right plastic piece. Fixed the issue, went to put the plastic piece back in, and realized the only way it fits is if I push down part of it under the big bolt under the magnet (so the plastic is bent when in position). I have to assume that big magnet bold I have is too long (somebody replaced with the wrong part?). Take a look at the attached picture, green circle (plastic is under pressure when installed).

Also when I took it apart, the bottom nut on the big bolt was unscrewed near the bottom of that bolt. I tightened it up (assuming im supposed to)

Any thoughts?

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Got this installed. Much better!