Likely you have a shorted bridge rectifier on your Fliptronix board (top left board). Try unplugging the IDC connectors and see if the fuse on the driver board still blows when you have J107 connected.
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Likely you have a shorted bridge rectifier on your Fliptronix board (top left board). Try unplugging the IDC connectors and see if the fuse on the driver board still blows when you have J107 connected.
Quoted from cbdarden:Tried it, messed up the screen, still burned out 104. Now with everything plugged back in, it burns out 112 and 114, the goalie comes on.. and now everything is twice as messed up as before.
Yes, I have the correct fuses in everywhere.
So, now it’s quickly getting beyond my skills.
Did you unplug the ribbon cables? If so, you may have plugged it in a row off up/down.
Quoted from cbdarden:That was it, thank you! Should I unplug everything from the Fliptronix board (including the ribbon cables) when I test again? I’m not sure I did that the first time.
I was meaning for you to only unplug the larger IDC connectors (J901 and J907 on the right and J904 at the bottom), not the ribbon cables.
Sorry, I should have stated connector numbers but I didn't have a board in front of me at the time. Just want to isolate power going to this fliptronix board.
Sounds like it is ok. It is what I just ran into with one a couple of weeks ago. I'll have to check, I hope tomorrow, what other board to try and disconnect if someone else hasn't already chimed in.
I'm sorry. I was thinking about the wrong connector.
So it seems the J107 is going to the coil power. With F104 removed, you should be able to see in the solenoid test which coils are not working. Inspect the coil wrappers for burnt marks under the playfield. Also check to see if the non working coil plunger moves freely.
Quoted from robertmee:Do the fuse conventions follow on Rottendog the same as WPC-S?
Pretty positive that it does but I can't get a great picture off the internet of the board to confirm. You can see in his picture that J107 is disconnected and it does go to coil power.
Are you looking at the WPC-95 driver board by chance?
Definitely blowing up his picture looks like it matches rhe original board, though it is hard to make out the numbers.
Could you PM the schematic to me? I cannot find it on the website since it has been updated.
Quoted from cbdarden:Guess I’ll go back through the solenoids again. Maybe one is firing when I power on and I’m missing it.
I’m running out of 3A Slow blows...
Just run through the solenoid test with the fuse removed and report the ones not working. Any coils not working, you should inspect the paper coil wrapping for brown or darker discoloration.
2019-01-24 06_35_55-F14 burnt coil and other questions _ Tech_ Alpha-numeric _ Pinside.com - Interne (resized).png
Quoted from robertmee:Confused? How does the coil work with the fuse removed?
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't the blanking circuit keep any coils from firing on power up? That's why I initially suspected a flasher.
Just trying to help identify which coils/flashers use power from the F104. Although, the diagrams from Tlamb should show the same results.
If you have no coils/flashers firing during the tests, make sure you close the coin door for these tests.
The blanking circuit on power up will not keep a locked on transistor from frying a coil.
Quoted from robertmee:True on the blanking, but if it were a locked on transistor, he would hear the coil turn on during power up. He hasn't mentioned this. He said he checked the coils for shorts and there were none, so it doesn't sound like it's a combination of locked up transistor AND shorted coil that wouldn't turn on.
If the glass is on, some coils are hard to hear lock on during power on. I hope it only turns out all coils are ok and only a transistor is shorted.
Well, I know in the past, I had overlooked shorted coils. A shorted coil, does not always mean it is 0 ohms. A shorted coil may be 5 ohms when it should be 11 ohms. This is why it is important to look at the coil wrappers. Best to compare the resistance of the same type coil to know if the coils are all good.
On top of looking at the coil wrappers, I would pull the MPU board out and test out all the coil/flasher transistors for shorts. Should be quick to test them all.
Testing the transistors in all 3 combinations for shorts
outer to outer pins
middle to one outer pin
middle to other outer pin.
Usually if a coil burns, the coil plunger will not move. You'll need to test the transistor for that kickback coil, as it should definitely be shorted. Best to measure with the coil with an ohmmeter too so we know if the resistance is too low on it or not. Is the paper wrapper burnt at all like in my example picture?
Quoted from robertmee:Agree, likely blown transistor. But why did it blow? I would test the coil, transistor and diode on the board for that coil.
Borderline transistors can breakdown, especially after 20 years, and short causing the coil to lock on when power is applied.
Blown suggests that it is blown open, which will no longer fire a coil and no longer would be blowing out a fuse.
If the coil has the right amount of resistance and you cannot see an burn on the coil wrapper, there would not be a need to replace it.
Quoted from robertmee:Didn't say replace it...said check it.
That particular statement was toward the OP in response to his question.
Quoted from cbdarden:So, I’ve gotten around to testing and the kickback is firing right at the start and then the fuse blows. I’m assuming I should replace that coil?
Quoted from robertmee:Ah, sorry....it followed my post, so I missed that. Carry on
Sorry, I did not tag the quote originally
Quoted from cbdarden:I misspoke before, it was the goal popper that fired when I turned it on, and yes, Q82 is associated with the goal popper according to the schematics.
Great. Time also to look at the coil wrapper and measure the resistance of the coil. Set the meter to 20 ohms. The goalie popper coil is AE-23-800, which is the same as the kickback coil. You can compare the resistance of both and if they measure close, then coil should be ok.
Edit: Rottendog may not use the TIP102 as the original driver board for Q82.
Quoted from robertmee:Be sure you check the coil with the connector off the board, otherwise you'll read across the diode on board...if that diode is shorted, you'll read no impedence.
Nay. Don't worry so much. Only time I had ever seen a diode shorted on the driver board for a coil being shorted, the driver board had a hole in it.
Quoted from robertmee:For the time it takes to remove the connector, it's silly not to eliminate that possibility. Troubleshooting 101...minimize possibilities of erroneous readings.
Better to test the diode in the circuit with the coil. You'll end up doing it at the end anyway.
A shorted transistor to ground, still will not affect the coil resistance measurement either. I even jumpered a coil to ground braid last night and the coil resistance measured the same, grounded or not. Worked just as I expected.
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