Plano, TX
What's your impression of Waterworld? Have a chance to pick one up locally. I've read the ratings on here but just looking for more feedback.
(Topic ID: 166146)
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Waterworld
Gottlieb, 1995
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I always liked the movie.
The pin? It's ok. it's usually a cheap DMD game that hovers under or around $1k. It doesn't compare to a $3k+ DMD game, but for someone who doesn't want to throw that kind of cash around for a DMD game, it's not too bad for the current market price.
My first DMD game. I did a full tear down and rebuild. Doesn't compare to a lot of BW titles but I thought it was a lot of fun. My kids loved it. We played the crap out of it as a family.
No, they are both about the same. Which isn't to say horrible...you'll play one if it's around or you'll watch the last 20 minutes if you chance upon it on TBS...but nobody is going out of their way for either.
Loved the movie, and the pin was worth a few coins for sure.
If it's available for a reasonable price pick it up, you will at least break even when you go to move it down the road.
Melbourne
Quoted from ForceFlow:I always liked the movie.
The pin? It's ok. it's usually a cheap DMD game that hovers under or around $1k. It doesn't compare to a $3k+ DMD game, but for someone who doesn't want to throw that kind of cash around for a DMD game, it's not too bad for the current market price.
i actually liked the movie. was really wanting to do the same with the pin.... alas, not to be.
didnt do anything for me, not much to shoot at, no ramps... but i guess if u pick it up cheap enough...
the quality of the parts, and toys on the playfield tho, are great..... and of course those system3 boards... are brilliant.
I actually like it, my buddy has one
There is a lot of strategy in hitting the correct shots on the tic tac toe middle board to maximize your scoring.
its not a deep game but you need to plan your shots to play it properly and cash in at the right time. breaking a billion is always fun
the super jack pot shot is really tough to hit
Id get one for the right price
I got bored with it after a year. The deez is fun to sink, but with the most up to date code, it GIVES you that multiball on your last ball if you havent already achieved it. I agree, if it was $1000 and in decent shape id snag it. You can add lights to brighten it up. Waterworld toys are cheap on ebay too if you want to spice it up.
So I did pick it up for a good price and am in the process of fixing it. The upper opto pair to the ship was flaky and turned out to be a damaged wire. For now I've repositioned the wire but may have to install a new one. It also appears the up kicker coil (from the hexagon scoop) was damaged and is reading too low a resistance (4 vs 24 ohm), causing the 1A fuse to blow and locking up the game. New coil along with some flipper rebuild parts should arrive today. I'm going to try the trick I read where you replace the coil stops with System 1 stops so that the flippers don't go up so high, to give it more of a B/W feel. Just have to drill out the holes a little bigger. The pf graphics above the flippers have been trashed from flipper drag. DMD looks good and boards are clean. Cab has some scratches but not bad. I'll keep the switch for "tournament mode" to ON as I read that removes all the freebie saves.
Definitely needs some more lights so I'll figure that out next. TNT has some good videos on LED mods for this. Also not a lot of youtube gameplay videos so I might have to add one. There's also only one rules sheet I could find and it's pretty sparse, so I might expand on it.
When I looked at the game, they had black duct tape covering the dive hole. When I took it off and played a game, I discovered why. You wonder how many games are out there with main features that don't work and the owners have no idea. I picked up a DESW a couple years ago and it had some issues that the owner had no idea about, and didn't know you can take the glass off.
I've enjoyed playing the game when given the chance. I like the oddness of the Gottlieb games of that time.
The movie was fun, basically THE ROAD WARRIOR on water. It had the mis-timing of being one of the last 'blockbusters' made before digital effects became easier and cheaper. So the fact that almost everything is the film was REAL live physical effects (out in the middle of the ocean near Hawaii) caused the budget to swell from $100 mil to $175, the most expensive film ever at that time. It is impressive to see, but the script did not quite live up to the spectacle. Costner recently teamed up with WATERWORLD (and Robin Hood) director Kevin Reynolds for the HATFIELDS & McCOYS miniseries.
WW also featured an early role for Jack Black as a seaplane pilot...
Quoted from miracleman:I've enjoyed playing the game when given the chance. I like the oddness of the Gottlieb games of that time.
The movie was fun, basically THE ROAD WARRIOR on water. It had the mis-timing of being one of the last 'blockbusters' made before digital effects became easier and cheaper. So the fact that almost everything is the film was REAL live physical effects (out in the middle of the ocean near Hawaii) caused the budget to swell from $100 mil to $175, the most expensive film ever at that time. I
That's the real problem with it. It cost $200 million and for the most part it looks like a cheesy B movie, which is exactly what it was (it started as $3 million Roger Corman movie) before Kevin Costner's ego got a hold of it. And it's not like it had to cost that much! Digital effects weren't the issue - instead of just filming on a studio lot Costner insisted on building a ridiculous floating island for this shoot which is what made the budget explode. You wouldn't have been able to tell the difference if they'd shot it on a lot.
It's not basically the Road Warrior on water because the Road Warrior is riveting, has incredibly memorable dialogue, characters, and action, and isn't boring for long stretches of time. Kind of the opposite of Waterworld.
poor atoll Waterworld the movie isn't bad at all.
The game is worse than the movie. But only because of the rules. The layout and how it's built is excellent. If the rules got an overhaul like DE games have, these Gottliebs would really have a chance to shine.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Levi rant
Physical 'real' effects do look better, that's the choice they made, and they literally paid the price for it.
It was Jack Black's fifth film, I'd call that early 
Quoted from CaptainNeo:If the rules got an overhaul like DE games have, these Gottliebs would really have a chance to shine.
That would be awesome.
The callouts killed to for me, I loved the gameplay, but those callouts drove me nuts, I would have the music and sounds of their produced voices in my head all week, I go crazy just thinking about it!
... And I had an almost perfect example of the game, I should have done something custom to the sound
Quoted from spidey:What's your impression of Waterworld? Have a chance to pick one up locally. I've read the ratings on here but just looking for more feedback.
Movie is really not as bad as the rep it got at release.
Game is very crappy. And the "dump all the balls on the field at once" multiball is annoying and not fun. I also agree the callouts are awful and irritating. If you disregard and get it, you will sell it, probably quickly.
The handle on the plunger was broken so I got a new one, but it seems I have to hacksaw the old one to remove it. I started the effort and then broke the blade when I was getting close. The top one shown is what's in there now, and the bottom one is the new one. It seems to have been machine stamped. Seems crazy because there's a C-clamp for the slot to hold the spring in (and a spring collar), so it doesn't need that ridge. Even with removing the remaining broken plastic of the handle, I still can't pull the rod out the other direction because the rod itself is slightly larger (has a texture to it) and so won't fit through the assembly. What appeared to be an easy fix turned out to be the most difficult.
Waterworld_Shooter_Rod_(resized).jpg
I just realized I have a jigsaw that would probably work for finishing off the cut.
1 week later
Had to replace a lot of parts for the flipper mechs but got it working. I must say, I don't quite get the hate but it's only been a couple days. An auto-plunger would be nice but oh well. I'll agree with one of the reviews that said the pop bumpers should be closer together to score more points and to block the large opening to the ship. The rules from what I can tell so far are pretty good. I will definitely make a rules sheet because the only one out there has almost no useful information. It's definitely got an old school ruleset where multiballs have no ball saver. It's over when it's over. Kind of refreshing because it keeps the game moving, and another multiball awaits just around the corner.
Quoted from Chosen_S:The callouts killed to for me, I loved the gameplay, but those callouts drove me nuts, I would have the music and sounds of their produced voices in my head all week, I go crazy just thinking about it!
... And I had an almost perfect example of the game, I should have done something custom to the sound
Shoot the BAWL!!!!
Quoted from miracleman:I like the oddness of the Gottlieb games of that time.
I agree. Gottlieb games are oddball games, and I like that. I'm also a cheap date who's easy to please when it comes to pinball. 80% of the time, I'm just looking to slap a few balls around (heh), score a multiball or two, and then I've had my fix. I even enjoy notoriously terrible games, like Darling or Raven, just because I'll have a good time poking fun at the bad games as I play.
Quoted from mbaumle:I'm just looking to slap a few balls around (heh)
arent we all. ; P
I got Hydro tonight but not sure how. Had played a bunch of modes so maybe that was part of it. Got a Super Hurry Up award and made the shot, then shot the Dive Hole and it gave me a really fun animated display of gears and stuff. The image was wiped away in a circular patten, then it told me Hydro! Was a nose hair away from Super Multiball. Had 30 Dirt and also just needed 1 more corner but crap it's hard to select the one you want. Then game over, of course.
Now that I think about it, maybe I got Hydro as a Super Hint award. Probably have to get a lot of them first.
1 month later
I got a Waterworld over the weekend. Having issues with the Dive hole optos so I am unfortunately unable to play the game properly (I have to avoid the hole for the most part). However, some other gameplay aspects seem solid. The orbits are really nice and the multiballs still feel somewhat modern, rewarding good shooting and controlled play. The Harpoon shot seems like an odd design choice since there's no way to feed the ball directly to it intentionally, but it's really surprising how often the ball will land there during regular play.
The Deez is a cool toy, especially when you lock the balls. I'm not a huge fan of its normal state because the ball tends to fly through the middle feed and often come back straight down the middle of the playfield. That, or the ball doesn't wrap all the way around and falls back down the playfield.
The machine does feel pretty clunky. The pivoting wireform on the right isn't flush with the right plunger ramp feed, so when you plunge the ball hits the edge of the wireform instead of feeding smoothly into it. There are a lot of aspects like that to this game, like there was really smooth flow intended, but ended up being clunky instead. I bet with some tweaking you can get the game flowing better. I spent most of the first couple of days of ownership swapping out to LEDs and cleaning the game, but later I am going to make small adjustments to try to get things flowing smoother.
Can't say I'm a big fan of the music. It just sounds cheap and repetitive. If they put more time into refining the soundtrack, I think the game could have felt epic.
The rules so far seem solid though based on what I have seen. There are good hurry-ups, filling in the map is cool, and there are higher level multiballs and modes that seem tough to get to (I hit Dry Land the other day, for instance--felt satisfying).
It's no Bally/Williams game, but for $1000? You can't beat a DMD game with decent rules for that price. Even if you don't love it, you will probably still enjoy it.
spidey - Definitely try to compile some rules. I'm going to probably do the same once I get the Dive hole working. Based on what I'm seeing, there's more here than people typically give it credit for.
Yeah I still plan on a rules sheet. It's not a Super deep game but a good rules sheet has the details of what shots are worth and strategy, so I'll just give it a whirl and refine it as I discover things I missed.
I'm still having fun with it. But the motor for the ship seems to have weakened so I have another on the way from Marco.
If you want to get Super Multiball, best to work on 30 dirt. I've only achieved 4 corners once so what are the odds I'll get that plus Hydro and a complete map in one game? I set reduced scoring on so the Super water cannon isn't too unbalanced (although it still is). 100M, what were they thinking?
I found that you'll eventually get Hydro as a choice from the Dive Hole if you start enough modes. Dryland is great because it will keep Super Jackpot lit the rest of the ball (which won't be long). I agree the Atoll is annoying because it's hard to make the return shot and the reward for all your effort may be a hurry up for a jackpot. So avoid unless you get a Super Hint for a super hurry up (those rock).
Had a friend over last weekend that helped to get the scoop working. Seemed the optos were iffy, had a few replacements on hand thanks to another friend. Scoop is working again and it definitely changes the game.
Only problem is.. now the Deez doesn't want to register ball locks. D'oh.
There's two pairs of optos under the ship (named upper and lower). Go to switch test mode and see which one isn't working. You can also simply observe the red led's on the opto board in the cab. Red all the time means there's a problem. The light should go out when the path is unobstructed. In my case, the wires to the upper optos were damaged and just bending them the right way fixed it.
I looked for a couple years for a Waterworld, put a wanted to buy add on Ohio regional page. Got a couple responses but price was 1400 1500 for games that had flipper drag PF wear, lots of dive hole wear, DMD issues and cabinets that were not going to win any beauty contests. People probably paid too much for them and tried to get it all back. Nothing close to 1k. Some were too far away and with shipping would kill deal. Not a Costner fan, but movie was O.k. Did not like the ending at all. Dennis Hopper is why I like the movie and the game. I read that DH's personal game sold at auction for $1,500 a few years back during his estate sale. Austin, Doctorchet is looking forward to seeing you twitch some WW action when you get your game tweaked.
Quoted from akm:It's no Bally/Williams game, but for $1000? You can't beat a DMD game with decent rules for that price. Even if you don't love it, you will probably still enjoy it.
Well, you can certainly "beat it" by using that money to buy a Firepower, Stars, any number of excellent EMs or early digitals, or a High Speed.
I don't understand why people would rather play a bad DMD than any number of other much better options available for the same money.
Is it to impress guests or kids who couldn't care less either way?
It is worth its weight in dirt.
I hope he paid less than $1K in that condition. After clean up and fixing to get it running it will get boring soon enough and with that playfield wear be hard to sell again.
The movie? It is one of those stupid "I'm not leaving the chair and there is nothing else on" shows. In other words you only saw the beginning once but have seen the middle many times.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Well, you can certainly "beat it" by using that money to buy a Firepower, Stars, any number of excellent EMs or early digitals, or a High Speed.
I don't understand why people would rather play a bad DMD than any number of other much better options available for the same money.
Is it to impress guests or kids who couldn't care less either way?
Try understanding harder.. not everyone gets off to the EMs or early Solid States.
In all seriousness, I enjoy the EMs and have owned a decent round of Solid States (Eight Ball, Future Spa, Meteor, Genie), but the truth is I tire of them pretty quickly in my own personal collection and the DMDs get the majority of playtime. If I had the space for 15 games, then yeah, it would be different and I'd certainly have a block of old games in there, but tossing one of those kinds of games into my (currently three games max) collection, it would be a waste of space. So, at York when I had the option to buy a cheap solid state that didn't really do much for me, or buy the Waterworld DMD for not much more.. I took a chance with that figuring there would be more there rules-wise. Also, since Pinburgh I have been wanting to get a '90s era Gottlieb, so that was a factor as well. The multiballs are solid and there is more than hitting a few standup targets and a spinner, so for what I paid I made the right choice. It's also good hands-on experience since I've never owned a System3.
1 week later
Quoted from spidey:There's two pairs of optos under the ship (named upper and lower). Go to switch test mode and see which one isn't working. You can also simply observe the red led's on the opto board in the cab. Red all the time means there's a problem. The light should go out when the path is unobstructed. In my case, the wires to the upper optos were damaged and just bending them the right way fixed it.
I finally got around to troubleshooting this over the weekend and it turned out the lower opto was always activated. I cleaned it and that fixed the problem (makes sense I suppose, this game was dirty as hell when I got it).
Quoted from spidey:I got Hydro tonight but not sure how. Had played a bunch of modes so maybe that was part of it. Got a Super Hurry Up award and made the shot, then shot the Dive Hole and it gave me a really fun animated display of gears and stuff. The image was wiped away in a circular patten, then it told me Hydro!
Quoted from spidey:Yeah I still plan on a rules sheet. It's not a Super deep game but a good rules sheet has the details of what shots are worth and strategy, so I'll just give it a whirl and refine it as I discover things I missed.
I'm still having fun with it. But the motor for the ship seems to have weakened so I have another on the way from Marco.
If you want to get Super Multiball, best to work on 30 dirt. I've only achieved 4 corners once so what are the odds I'll get that plus Hydro and a complete map in one game? I set reduced scoring on so the Super water cannon isn't too unbalanced (although it still is). 100M, what were they thinking?
I found that you'll eventually get Hydro as a choice from the Dive Hole if you start enough modes. Dryland is great because it will keep Super Jackpot lit the rest of the ball (which won't be long). I agree the Atoll is annoying because it's hard to make the return shot and the reward for all your effort may be a hurry up for a jackpot. So avoid unless you get a Super Hint for a super hurry up (those rock)
If you are still interested in making a rules sheet, I could help out. I could make and manage a new thread if you want, to get a head start on it. Then maybe when it's all said and done, we can submit it to IPDB and PAPA, the sheet there is insanely out of date and is more of a review than an actual rules sheet. On a side note, I picked up a manual for the game, and as expected, there are tons of rules details that we could use as a base, then build up to the more complex rules from there.
Hydro - I think you are correct that when you play enough features, it will eventually pop up as an award. I had this happen over the weekend. I also noticed that some features can't be played again and "Completed" will show up in their place.
Four Corners - I got this yesterday but completely by accident. Now I know what to do to get it consistently--fill in four corners on the grid, and you are awarded this insert. It also seems to award a Super Jackpot at the same time.
Dryland - As you said, the Super Jackpot is lit at all times once you get here. I found that out a few days ago as well and it definitely makes going for it worthwhile. I found that the Big Score window award will light a map segment on the left orbit temporarily, so you could knock out Dryland pretty quickly if you can focus on getting the Big Score award repeatedly.
In regards to the window awards, I noticed you are awarded a Super Jackpot if you get three across and three down on the grid at the same time. I'm not sure if this works in the middle of the grid (with both columns intersecting in the middle), but I do know it does this if they both connect to a corner. Good stuff, it gives you incentive to try to strategically fill out the grid instead of taking any award you see.
I did adjust my settings to where the Deez multiball is not given on a Feature award. At first I was disappointed that you can't adjust the difficulty of qualifying the next window award (by default any single switch qualifies the dive hole on the first go around), but now that I understand what the awards do, I don't mind how it's set. In the beginning of the game I am spending time changing the window awards to what I want, then cashing in on things that will be useful later (5 dirt repeatedly? Big Score to light the map segments? etc). It's a lot harder to get the window awards after you get across (you have to hit the right orbit, super risky on my game, sometimes goes SDTM).
Just an idea for anyone that has the game, I took out the three posts blocking the harpoon shot. The ball goes into it so much more often now and it's making the game flow better/more enjoyable.
Turns out Dryland is actually timed. Although, I did find it stacks into multiball modes at least.
I did something magical and was awarded a billion points out of nowhere on a window award. I believe I had three across both horizontally and vertically, meeting at the top right corner, then also had a couple of others filled in. "BILLION" briefly flashed across the DMD. I have no idea what I did.
Damn this game is cryptic with its delivery--it's often not obvious when something's timed or why you were awarded something. Definitely going to need to trigger everything repeatedly with the glass off.
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