(Topic ID: 283653)

WARNING to Rottendog WDB089 owners - Check it now!

By mbt

3 years ago


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PXL_20230723_152948977 (resized).jpg
you had only one job.jpg
WDB089 short (resized).JPG
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#1 3 years ago

Following the theme of this post https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/warning-to-rottendog-327-owners-check-it-now by goingincirclez

I just spent the better part of last night troubleshooting an issue with a coil locking on right after power up. After several hours of investigation,1 burned drop target coil, and replacing Q26 multiple times, I found out that the short was caused by this trace on the back of the board.

WDB089 short (resized).JPGWDB089 short (resized).JPG

The problem is that the solder mask does not cover the trace right by the ground pad around the screw mount by Connector J122 on the bottom of the board. When the board is screwed into the game, the metal standoff will short this trace to ground, which will lock the coil on. On top of that, there was a solder build up on that trace which contributed to the likelihood of it shorting out when screwed down.

This only affects Pin 1 on J122, J123, and J124 of the board, and in the case of Dracula, this happens to be the Drop Target coil.

I fixed this by removing the solder blob on the trace, and then applying super glue gel over the exposed trace, but other options could include cutting the trace and using a jumper wire, or using an insulating washer between this pad and the screw mount.

Hopefully, this post will save some of you a lot of time + spare a few coils from a melt down!

#2 3 years ago

That's good to know another thing to toss in the mental archives.

#3 3 years ago
Quoted from mbt:

This only affects Pin 1 on J122, J123, and J124 of the board, and in the case of Dracula, this happens to be the Drop Target coil.

I’m away from my games at the moment - is that coil in solenoid group 1-8?

I have an issue with a project Gilligans I bought with no boards, I installed a new Rottendog driver board ... it blows the 1-8 fuse on power up. Been chasing my tail on it for ages.

rd

#4 3 years ago
#5 3 years ago
Quoted from rotordave:

I’m away from my games at the moment - is that coil in solenoid group 1-8?
I have an issue with a project Gilligans I bought with no boards, I installed a new Rottendog driver board ... it blows the 1-8 fuse on power up. Been chasing my tail on it for ages.
rd

Looks like on GI, Q26 drives the Right Bank Flasher (Sol 25) according to the manual

#6 3 years ago

Oh wow. I had no idea! I guess its worth checking when swapping out any Driver boards (original or repro). I know I will keep it in mind from now on.

#7 3 years ago

Is there a revision number on your rottendog driver board?

#8 3 years ago

Mental note taken. I don't usually tighten those lower screws much anyway, but I'll go even lighter on RD boards.

I've had a similar thing happen on a factory WPC video board. Also documented on pin wiki.

https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Fuse_F601_or_F602_blows

#9 3 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Is there a revision number on your rottendog driver board?

It is Rev 2

#10 3 years ago

Hm... the RD dog board I put in my TZ when I thought the original board was broken almost immediately started blowing the fuse in line with the left playfield magnet. I wonder if this is why...

#11 3 years ago

Wow! Extremely sloppy routing all over that 2"x2" photo. And that was sold to people?

#12 3 years ago

some minor adjustments could have made it much better

you had only one job.jpgyou had only one job.jpg

#13 3 years ago

The issue has been added to pinwiki:

https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Q26_Transistor_.26_Coil_Locking_On_with_Rottendog_Driver_Board

If anyone has any additional information about this issue or if it is spotted on other board revisions, please feel free to add the information here and/or to pinwiki.

#14 3 years ago

I have one of these boards but it must be a newer version and those traces are rerouted and well clear of that mounting bracket. It is with a friend that does service calls in case he needed a board. I'll see if he can get the revision number off that board and I can post a picture of what it looks like.

Also, How does someone get setup to contribute to PinWiki? I've gotten some people to add things that I've found in the Bally section but could add things when I find them as well.

#15 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Also, How does someone get setup to contribute to PinWiki? I've gotten some people to add things that I've found in the Bally section but could add things when I find them as well.

Just register for an account on the site--there is a "request account" link in the upper right. The direct link to that is here: https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Special:RequestAccount

The site owner then approves new registrations (be patient, it may take a few days).

#16 3 years ago

That could have been my problem when I tried one of those in my whitewater. Right after boot up, it would just fry a fuse. Can’t remember right now which one, but it was for solenoids. after sending it back to them a couple times and no difference, I just got a refund. I kind of wish I still had it to look at that.

1 week later
#17 3 years ago

Thanks for the tip. The knock down (solenoid #12) on my Terminator 2 locked on a few months ago, burning out the fuse, then coil. My tech came over and tested all the transistors (Q52) but it was good. We were stumped but I just wound up cutting the wire. Other than that my machine is working fine. Nobody else notices, but I know.

I am wondering if this is the issue. The other thing I wonder about is the diode. I went to the Rottendog site, but they no longer host the schematics for the driver board (WDB089). I wonder a.) if anyone else had this problem, b.) which diode (what kind? 1N4004?) these transistors are paired with, c.) the resistors don't usually fail do they? and d.) if anyone has the schematics for this board?

#18 3 years ago
Quoted from mickja1:

Thanks for the tip. The knock down (solenoid #12) on my Terminator 2 locked on a few months ago, burning out the fuse, then coil. My tech came over and tested all the transistors (Q52) but it was good. We were stumped but I just wound up cutting the wire. Other than that my machine is working fine. Nobody else notices, but I know.
I am wondering if this is the issue. The other thing I wonder about is the diode. I went to the Rottendog site, but they no longer host the schematics for the driver board (WDB089). I wonder a.) if anyone else had this problem, b.) which diode (what kind? 1N4004?) these transistors are paired with, c.) the resistors don't usually fail do they? and d.) if anyone has the schematics for this board?

I just looked at the manual for T2. On T2, Q26 (the one that has the trace issue on the board), drives Sol. 26 which are the Left Popper Flash lamps.

I know someone did post a link to the all the RD manuals. I will see if I can find it and add a link to this thread for it

1 month later
#19 3 years ago

is there a way to identify this without taking the board out? I am not being lazy but there is always the chance of something else breaking, lol.

J122 is the only one connected in my board right now, 123 and 124 do not have anything on them.
I have a T2 game and it all works well

2 years later
#20 9 months ago

I am having isuues with my WDB089 Rottendog in my Demolition Man pinball, just started out of the blue.
Rebooting at power on. But last night I played 2 player 5 ball game with no issues, then started to reboot in attract mode.
I bought the board in July 2021 but looks like the board sticker states it was made Dec 2020.
Is this a newer Revision board that took care of that trace grounding issue?

Here is link to a video of the resetting issue:

PXL_20230723_152948977 (resized).jpgPXL_20230723_152948977 (resized).jpg
#21 9 months ago
Quoted from CUJO:

I am having isuues with my WDB089 Rottendog in my Demolition Man pinball, just started out of the blue.
Rebooting at power on. But last night I played 2 player 5 ball game with no issues, then started to reboot in attract mode.
I bought the board in July 2021 but looks like the board sticker states it was made Dec 2020.
Is this a newer Revision board that took care of that trace grounding issue?
Here is link to a video of the resetting issue:
[quoted image]

Have you measured the voltages at the test points on the driver board? Have you measured the voltage at your MPU? It may not be a board issue.

I had an issue on a Judge Dredd that was rebooting. Had a solid 5V on the driver so that was fine. Had just under 4.6V at the MPU. Ended up repinning the power connector at the MPU and driver which cleared up the issue. If you are losing power definitely check the connectors. I would suspect those before the board.

I have one of these drivers and it works well. It often gets loaned out if I am rebuilding an original WPC driver for someone so they can still enjoy their game.

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