(Topic ID: 187991)

Warning The Pinball Company

By dung

6 years ago


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    #1 6 years ago

    TLDR: Nic put down a 300 dollar deposit via paypal and agrees to pay the rest in cash. Sends his employee out with a check. Chews me out / yells at me over the phone when I try to get him to paypal the rest. I relented and took the check. Nic wrote the check for the wrong amount and then demands I paypal the rest back. Issues chargeback. Threatens that if I posted this publicly and I quote *If you post there, it will only affect your ability to post there ever again.*

    I hate bullies. I hate when people do not hold up their end of the bargain. I am not here to argue with anyone over what they feel is right or wrong, but I do want people who may encounter Nic to know what kind of person they are dealing with.

    Nic contacted me via Mr. Pinball about my Airborne. He saw the pictures, liked the price and we looked at various options for him to get the machine. At first he was going to paypal me the whole amount and ship it, but he decides that he will pick it up instead. I explicitly asked via email for 10 percent via paypal (300), that the rest be paid in cash on pickup, and that he had six weeks to pick it up. I very clearly wrote no checks and cash on pickup. There is no ambiguity on this matter.

    Two weeks later Nic sent his employee out. Guy calls at the scheduled time to say he is an hour and half away, but ok things happens. He gets here, looks over the game and hands me an envelope, with a check. I explain that I do not take checks. I have a friend who has dealt with this company, but before Nic emailed me I had never heard of them. I say call your boss and half him paypal me what he owes. Guy calls his boss and hands me the phone, and I got ripped a new one. *How dare I, the seller, not want to take a check from a company that does 1 million in sales.* Nic also seemed to be under the impression that as a collector I am automatically tuned into retail companies, even though I have never bought retail.

    So, after getting reamed Nic says the deal is off and that I am to refund the deposit. I never agreed to that, I had pulled my ad, rearranged my day, and frankly the screw up is very clearly his fault. Still, the guy is here, drives a large company van, and my friend is saying its safe so I relented and take the check. I tell the employee I never want to hear from them again and he leaves. I head straight to the bank and deposit the check.

    Game is gone, check is cashed, done right? Wrong, Nic wrote the check for 3000 and I get this very apologetic email explaining that he chewed me out because he was having problems with his kid. That I am to send the deposit back when the check clears. No. I never agreed to any of this and I just got reamed by someone who screwed up. An honest mistake is one thing, but this guy doubled down and tried to brow beat me.

    He opened a dispute with paypal. Neither of us are going to sweat the money. He sees it that he agreed to pay 3000. I see it that he agreed to pay cash, failed, chewed me out, but worse lied. You see, Nic never had any intention of paying cash. "We are a legit company and can't use cash to purchase items. Our accountant requires check or credit card so it can be documented. " He had no business agreeing to my terms and flat out lied.

    I informed him that i responded to his paypal dispute and that I would just be posting the entire matter publicly. I invited him to refute anything I post as incorrect. His response "The people who run the Facebook pages and Pinside are my friends. If you post there, it will only affect your ability to post there ever again."

    At this point my last communication from him is simply "F*** off!" (Edited due to his swearing) And it seems he isn't feeling very confident with paypal since he issued a chargeback. As I said, I don't care about the money, but next time someone is making a deal with The Pinball Company you might want to consider how he conducts business.

    #2 6 years ago

    Sorry to hear. I have dealt with this company and Nick.

    I sold a game to them and they couldn't have been more professional. I would do it again in a heartbeat.

    40
    #3 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    He sees it that he agreed to pay 3000. I see it that he agreed to pay cash, failed, chewed me out, but worse lied.

    You both agreed on a price of $3,000. Just because he was a dick (allegedly), doesn't give you the right to charge more or to keep his deposit. Give the dude his deposit back and be done with it. I think he was in the wrong to chew you out, but now you are in the wrong to keep his deposit purely out of spite. 2 wrongs don't make a right.

    #4 6 years ago

    Sounds like you owe him $300. $3k for an Airborne you should have danced your way to the bank to cash the check.

    -2
    #5 6 years ago
    Quoted from dgoett:

    Sounds like you owe him $300. $3k for an Airborne you should have danced your way to the bank to cash the check.

    A price he was happy to pay and I have since watched two others sell for more.

    Quoted from pinlink:

    You both agreed on a price of $3,000. Just because he was a dick (allegedly), doesn't give you the right to charge more or to keep his deposit. Give the dude his deposit back and be done with it. I think he was in the wrong to chew you out, but now you are in the wrong to keep his deposit purely out of spite. 2 wrongs don't make a right.

    Lied to, yelled at, cussed at. If he had been nice and said hey made a mistake this would have all never happened. Things happen, but he didn't own up to his mistakes. Instead he opted to tear me a new one and then demand something that was never agreed to. From the messages I have been getting on facebook this isn't a new thing.

    #6 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    A price he was happy to pay and I have since watched two others sell for more.

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-airborne-1

    #7 6 years ago

    You need to send him his $300 back.

    I am sure the guy was a complete ass, but that doesn't matter.

    #8 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    Lied to, yelled at, cussed at. If he had been nice and said hey made a mistake this would have all never happened. Things happen, but he didn't own up to his mistakes. Instead he opted to tear me a new one and then demand something that was never agreed to. From the messages I have been getting on facebook this isn't a new thing.

    So you feel that you are owed the extra $300? You are in the wrong here, dude.

    I get that he was not nice to you. That sucks. Now pay him the money you OWE him. You agreed on a price, he paid you more, now you won't make it right. This is not helping your reputation IMO.

    #9 6 years ago

    I say keep the $300 and sleep well at night. Nobody has the right to abuse you when you clearly didn't do anything other than stick to your word. Whilst strictly speaking you should hand back the deposit money, by keeping it he might think twice next time. If he runs a business and wants to be known for his good name, perhaps he will think twice before abusing people. Bullies and brash salesmen need to be taught a lesson, nothing better than a $300 lesson, other than a $400 one!

    14
    #10 6 years ago

    I was on your side until you decided to keep the extra $300. You should have just refused the sale, and then I would have had no problem with you keeping the deposit. But after you decided to take the check, you agreed to the deal, and you owe him the overage no matter how big of a douche he was.

    Also 3k for an airborne is a good price. Everyone keeps thinking they're going to be picking up Capcom games cheap still, those days are over.

    -10
    #11 6 years ago
    Quoted from pinlink:

    So you feel that you are owed the extra $300? You are in the wrong here, dude.
    I get that he was not nice to you. That sucks. Now pay him the money you OWE him. You agreed on a price, he paid you more, now you won't make it right. This is not helping your reputation IMO.

    You have your opinion, and not everyone shares it. I owe him nothing. He was to pay the difference in cash on pickup. I can post the contents of the email that I sent as well as his response. The purpose being that once the machine left my possession the deal was DONE. If you disagree then by all means, but as you said it is your opinion.

    Anyone on here that has dealt with me knows that I have a mouth, but I am also a straight shooter. I do what I say I will do, both as a buyer and a seller.

    #12 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    I am also a straight shooter. I do what I say I will do, both as a buyer and a seller.

    Ummm what? No you are not a straight shooter. You agreed to a 3k deal, were paid 3.3k and now are keeping the difference to teach this guy a lesson because he was mean to you?

    Well Dung is now on my shit list. Yes, this is a real list I keep of people that I will never buy/sell from/to.

    -7
    #13 6 years ago
    Quoted from pinlink:

    Ummm what? No you are not a straight shooter. You agreed to a 3k deal, were paid 3.3k and now are keeping the difference to teach this guy a lesson because he was mean to you?
    Well Dung is now on my shit list. Yes, this is a real list I keep of people that I will never buy/sell from/to.

    I agreed to sell a machine that he picked up. If he can't do math. If he can't stop from lying. It is not my problem.

    I was told take the check or the deal is off. I took the check, the deal was done.

    As for being on your list? Ok, we all have our lists and its not hurting anyone, but no hard feelings.

    #14 6 years ago

    Some small businesses clearly charge more to accept a check rather than cash, or I should say, have a cash only discount. (Home sprinkler service techs etc. $75 cash, $85 check for the same service) Heck, gas stations have this. They charge more for credit cards as there are processing fees, although I don't know of people paying for gas with a check. Anyway, going to the bank is your time invested so you could take a processing fee out of the $300, but I'd say return the rest.

    53
    #15 6 years ago

    This is Brooke with the Pinball Company writing in on behalf of my husband, Nic Parks. Nic and the seller had agreed to a price of $3000 for the Airborne machine. I was unaware he had sent a $300 paypal deposit and went ahead and wrote the check for the full $3000. Now, while Nic is one of the nicest, most honest and generous people I know (seriously), his memory isn't the best and he forgot to mention to me about the seller wanting cash. He also forgets to tell me many other things on a daily basis. So when our driver got to the pick up, we had a predicament. Nic was not happy that we sent a guy all the way to pick up the machine and he wasn't going to give it to us and they had a bit of a heated discussion, but he certainly did not yell and cuss (we were at a Subway restaurant with our 4 year old son at the time in the middle of lunch). Finally Nic just told the guy that the deal was off and we would leave. At that point, the seller changed his mind (probably when he realized the check was written out for more than we agreed on) and said he would do it. A week or two later we realized that we had overpaid for the machine with the $300 deposit and Nic tried contacting the guy for a refund. He never responded, so we had no choice but to file a chargeback. While the deal didn't go down exactly the way the seller wanted, that did not give him the right to just keep the overpayment.

    #16 6 years ago
    Quoted from KozMckPinball:

    Some businesses clearly charge more to accept a check rather than cash, or I should say, have a cash only discount. Heck, gas stations have this. They charge more for credit cards as there are processing fees, although I don't know oof people pay for gas with a check. Anyway, going to the bank is your time invested so you could take a processing fee out of the $300, but I'd say return the rest.

    My post is long winded and everyone keeps missing he did a dispute and then did a chargeback. There is no money to send back, nor do I care. This isn't an attempt to get any resolution guys. The situation is over per say, this is merely a warning post for anyone who searches for the company going forward.

    #17 6 years ago

    I don't think I've seen one of these "warning" threads where both parties didn't do something wrong.

    Just refund the $300, take a deep breath, and go play some pinball.

    38
    #18 6 years ago

    This is one of the stupidest disputes in history.

    Dung was all bluster and fire when they didn't show up with his cash. But in the end he caved anyway and took the check. I've done the same thing, at the end of the day you just want the game gone and your money.

    Now he thinks he should get an extra 300 bucks for some reason.

    Come on man. Why waste our time with this shit?

    #19 6 years ago

    I recommend settling this dispute outside of social media. TPC is good folk and I am sure Dung is a good guy too. You guys know what needs to be done to make this right. Take a few deep breaths, pinball shouldn't be this stressful.

    #20 6 years ago
    Quoted from PinballCompany:

    This is Brooke with the Pinball Company writing in on behalf of my husband, Nic Parks. Nic and the seller had agreed to a price of $3000 for the Airborne machine. I was unaware he had sent a $300 paypal deposit and went ahead and wrote the check for the full $3000. Now, while Nic is one of the nicest, most honest and generous people I know (seriously), his memory isn't the best and he forgot to mention to me about the seller wanting cash. He also forgets to tell me many other things on a daily basis. So when our driver got to the pick up, we had a predicament. Nic was not happy that we sent a guy all the way to pick up the machine and he wasn't going to give it to us and they had a bit of a heated discussion, but he certainly did not yell and cuss (we were at a Subway restaurant with our 4 year old son at the time in the middle of lunch). Finally Nic just told the guy that the deal was off and we would leave. At that point, the seller changed his mind (probably when he realized the check was written out for more than we agreed on) and said he would do it. A week or two later we realized that we had overpaid for the machine with the $300 deposit and Nic tried contacting the guy for a refund. He never responded, so we had no choice but to file a chargeback. While the deal didn't go down exactly the way the seller wanted, that did not give him the right to just keep the overpayment.

    *Ahem*

    Lies

    You didn't realize a week or two later. Your husband sent this email on March 11th, the day of the pickup and I got as I drove to the bank. "Sorry to get upset. I was in the middle of dealing with my 4 year old's behavior at the moment and felt a bit disrespected. We are a legit company and can't use cash to purchase items. Our accountant requires check or credit card so it can be documented. Thanks for understanding. Please refund the deposit once the check clears. "

    I also have numerous emails after the fact of your husband reitterating that he is unable to pay cash for machines. Something he explicitly agreed to do.

    Finally, I had a nice easy resolution. I asked that he paypal the difference, which is what launched his tirade. As for him not swearing I can screen shot his last email to me.

    I understand you are a business, but the way your husband handled this from the time his employee arrived to now has been terrible and it is being posted publicly for that reason. Furthermore you might want to remind our husband not to email veiled threats in order to intimidate people from posting.

    #21 6 years ago

    I have learned that doing these post really doesnt help anyone. People will have good and bad experiences, at the time you feel like you are doing the community a favor, but quickly it becomes a pissing match. I know I will never post another negative thread about a member because it ultimately doesn't help. Sucks you went through this but he made a $300 mistake and seems that you should refund his money and just know that you wont do business with him again and be done with it.

    #22 6 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    This is one of the stupidest disputes in history.
    Dung was all bluster and fire when they didn't show up with his cash. But in the end he caved anyway and took the check. I've done the same thing, at the end of the day you just want the game gone and your money.
    Now he thinks he should get an extra 300 bucks for some reason.
    Come on man. Why waste our time with this shit?

    Agree, it doesn't look good for either of us, but here is the thing. I am not a business. This is my hobby and anything that makes my hobby crap I am gonna raise a stink about. The guy was an ass to me. I'd rather take a hit to my reputation and shine a light on this jerk so others don't deal with him in future.

    #23 6 years ago

    Needs a poll.

    I count 7 return the money, 1 keep it, and one keep a few bucks and return the rest.

    Pinside court is weighing against you dung (so far).

    11
    #24 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    Agree, it doesn't look good for either of us, but here is the thing. I am not a business. This is my hobby and anything that makes my hobby crap I am gonna raise a stink about. The guy was an ass to me. I'd rather take a hit to my reputation and shine a light on this jerk so others don't deal with him in future.

    If I had $300 for every asshole I've dealt with in pinball I'd own a bank. And I'm sure some of the people who have dealt with me would think they were entitled to a few checks.

    Come on man this is silly. You say this is a "hobby" for you but it doesn't sound like you are having much fun.

    -2
    #25 6 years ago
    Quoted from oohlou:

    Needs a poll.
    I count 7 return the money, 1 keep it, and one keep a few bucks and return the rest.
    Pinside court is weighing against you dung (so far).

    Pinside court is irrelevant. He disputed, and then did a chargeback. There are no funds to give guys and that is the last time I am responding to that lol

    #26 6 years ago

    My 2 cents. Let cooler heads prevail. Contacting him back let him know that after the check clears you have no issue's with refunding the 300. I would also ask for an apology I think he owes you that.

    #27 6 years ago

    If I am late paying my income taxes, I get charged penalties and fees, significant penalties and fees, until I pay up. I filed for a refund of my income taxes 8 weeks ago and no transfer of money to my account have I seen. Yet, I have no recourse of charging the government for taking so long as they said upfront we will take 10 weeks to get you your money. I don't feel disrespected by this, but the system is definitely in someone else's favor. My point is, if you requested cash and he agreed to it, he should have paypal'd the money or gave you cash, because it was agreed upon upfront.

    #28 6 years ago
    Quoted from KozMckPinball:

    . My point is, if you requested cash and he agreed to it, he should have paypal'd the money or gave you cash, because it was agreed upon upfront.

    That all became moot when he decided he'd take the check instead of just calling off the sale.

    #29 6 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    That all became moot when he decided he'd take the check instead of just calling off the sale.

    Send the guy to an ATM in Dung's neighborhood, to get $2700 and keep the receipt, cancel the overpayment check, that's enough of a paper trail for any accountant. Anyway, the business is losing here, they need to be more careful about their reputation in the future.

    #30 6 years ago

    If I mess up and give someone too much cash at a pinball deal, I'm not calling your mom or the bank about it. I messed up, my mistake, your gain. I'm just a small hobbyist. If a business can't handle a $300 mistake, without it turning into a mess, they're not in that great of shape as a business.

    #31 6 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    That all became moot when he decided he'd take the check instead of just calling off the sale.

    The agreement was broken when his guy arrived without cash. I was told take the check or the deal is off. I relented, foolishly, and took the check. I was never asked, told, or otherwise informed to refund money until the employee had my machine and was gone.

    11
    #32 6 years ago

    Did you mention to the guy that the check was made out for $300 too much?

    #33 6 years ago
    Quoted from KozMckPinball:

    Send the guy to an ATM in Dung's neighborhood, to get $2700 and keep the receipt, cancel the overpayment check, that's enough of a paper trail for any accountant. Anyway, the business is losing here, they need to be more careful about their reputation in the future. Mistakes of communication are legit mistakes to a customer. The customer is always right. Or so THEY say.

    OK I was gonna sit the rest of this thread out due to it's stupidity but then I saw this...

    I'm not sure which bank you belong to but you can't go to an ATM and take out anywhere close to $2700. I'm pretty sure it's $500 a day. I guess the guy should have just been Dung's houseguest for a week?

    And pinball isn't Wal-mart or Stew Leonards. The customer is frequently wrong in pinball...and in this case weren't the PBC the "customers" anyway? It's all so confusing.

    Anyway I have a big Coke deal to finish up I'm gonna go take $4,000 out of an ATM...

    #34 6 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    OK I was gonna sit the rest of this thread out due to it's stupidity but then I saw this...
    I'm not sure which bank you belong to but you can't go to an ATM and take out $2700.

    Or bank counter teller sorry. Maybe the bank was closed at the time of the transaction if not that'd work.

    #35 6 years ago

    Karma is always at work, return the $300, a deal is a deal.

    #36 6 years ago

    I have clients that are huge pains in the ass, but if they overpaid me, I'd send them back the difference.

    Everyone gets all butt-hurt these days for some reason. The guy was a dick, so what? You should have told him to hit the pavement, but instead you took his payment knowing that the deal was $3000.

    The original agreement was for $3000 in cash. You and you alone decided to accept the check so that's a moot point. The agreement of $3,000 was never changed so why not give it back?

    #37 6 years ago

    We have bought countless games from Pinsiders over the years and have had wonderful experiences as they can all vouch for and we very much appreciate the opportunity to buy such nice machines from collectors and hobbyists. We make all transactions about as easy as possible. I guess every now and again when doing this many deals, a deal is bound to go sour. In the end, we got the machine and the seller ended up with the $3000 agreed upon. I can think of a lot worse ways for this to have turned out. We are sorry for any ill-will associated with the transaction, but when he didn't respond to us, we were not just going to let him keep the money. - Brooke

    #38 6 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    I have clients that are huge pains in the ass, but if they overpaid me, I'd send them back the difference.
    Everyone gets all butt-hurt these days for some reason. The guy was a dick, so what? You should have told him to hit the pavement, but instead you took his payment knowing that the deal was $3000.
    The original agreement was for $3000 in cash. You and you alone decided to accept the check so that's a moot point. The agreement of $3,000 was never changed by either party.

    Actually, what I was told was take the check or the deal is off. I took the check. I wasn't told the deal was take the check, cash it, and refund the difference.

    You guys put a lot of emphasis on my taking the check as some proof of guilt. You put no thought that I was told to take the check or no deal. Seller wrote the check, I did not.

    #39 6 years ago

    I say let Paypal sort it out. They can hear both sides, and their decision will be final either way. If the dispute/chargeback has already been filed, any of you saying to give back the money are dopes... he'll give back the 300 then what? Paypal decides to refund it and he's out ANOTHER 300? Screw that!

    They can get their money back if he feels like giving it back AFTER paypal makes a decision, and not a second before.

    #40 6 years ago

    Two wrongs dont make it right! The additional money is not yours .

    #41 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    Actually, what I was told was take the check or the deal is off. I took the check. I wasn't told the deal was take the check, cash it, and refund the difference.
    You guys put a lot of emphasis on my taking the check as some proof of guilt. You put no thought that I was told to take the check or no deal. Seller wrote the check, I did not.

    You sound easily manipulated. I would have told them to take a hike if I was really that uncomfortable accepting a check. Either way, the deal was still for $3,000.

    The honest and honorable thing to do is refund the $300.

    #42 6 years ago
    Quoted from dung:

    Actually, what I was told was take the check or the deal is off. I took the check. I wasn't told the deal was take the check, cash it, and refund the difference.
    You guys put a lot of emphasis on my taking the check as some proof of guilt. You put no thought that I was told to take the check or no deal. Seller wrote the check, I did not.

    You're being a stickler to a fault. Not a good thing to do...

    Full disclosure - no horse in this race as I know neither party.

    #43 6 years ago
    Quoted from PinballCompany:

    We have bought countless games from Pinsiders over the years and have had wonderful experiences as they can all vouch for and we very much appreciate the opportunity to buy such nice machines from collectors and hobbyists. We make all transactions about as easy as possible. I guess every now and again when doing this many deals, a deal is bound to go sour. In the end, we got the machine and the seller ended up with the $3000 agreed upon. I can think of a lot worse ways for this to have turned out. We are sorry for any ill-will associated with the transaction, but when he didn't respond to us, we were not just going to let him keep the money. - Brooke

    I sent this to your husband on Marc 1.
    "That should work just fine then. Having done this numerous times these are my stipulations. I ask for a 10 percent deposit, 300 in this case. You can pay the rest in cash on pickup if you like, no checks on pickup. I will hold the machine for you for 6 weeks which as of today would be april 12th. If you change your mind and decide to go navl that is fine too.

    Does that work for you?"

    He responded that day with this.

    "Sure. $300 via Paypal for deposit?"

    The deal was simple and this could have been avoided at many stages. I am sorry it has come to this, but please tell your husband to be a man of his word. Oh, and to please treat the people he deals with civilly.

    27
    #44 6 years ago

    And the only answer is: THUNDERDOME!

    wheel (resized).pngwheel (resized).png

    #45 6 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    OK I was gonna sit the rest of this thread out due to it's stupidity but then I saw this...
    I'm not sure which bank you belong to but you can't go to an ATM and take out anywhere close to $2700. I'm pretty sure it's $500 a day. I guess the guy should have just been Dung's houseguest for a week?
    And pinball isn't Wal-mart or Stew Leonards. The customer is frequently wrong in pinball...and in this case weren't the PBC the "customers" anyway? It's all so confusing.
    Anyway I have a big Coke deal to finish up I'm gonna go take $4,000 out of an ATM...

    Some banks have $2500 ATM limits per day. Closer than you thought and still less then $2700 so I apologize:

    Bank
    Daily ATM Withdrawal Limit Daily Debit Purchase Limit
    Bank of America $1,000 $5,000
    BB&T $500-$1,500 $3,000-$6,000
    Capital One $610 $2,500
    Chase $400-$500 $400-$3000
    Citibank $1,000-$2,000 $5,000-$10,000
    HSBC $500-$1,000 $3,000
    Huntington National Bank $400 $400
    M&T $500 $2,500
    PNC $100-$1,500 $100-$7,500
    Regions Bank $800 $5,000
    Santander $1,000-$2,500 $5,000-$11,500
    SunTrust $500-$2,500 $3,000-$30,000
    TD $750 $5,000
    US Bank $500 $1,000
    Wells Fargo $300 $1,500

    I would suggest draining this thread because every reply bubbles it back up and enough damage has been done already.

    #46 6 years ago

    Alrighty guys, as fun as it is to be a punching bag I am gonna sign off for a bit. If the court of pinside decides to execute me I please ask that my last meal be Arthur Bryant's and for death by firing squad.

    #47 6 years ago

    Give the guy back his
    Money
    and quit crying. Damn. You got your full amount and was shorted nothing. Nic has a wife and kid quit being a Dick

    #48 6 years ago
    Quoted from RCA1:

    And the only answer is: THUNDERDOME!

    Auntie's choice!

    17
    #50 6 years ago

    Sounds like there was fault on both sides of this story. If there's one thing I've learned from this hobby is that your reputation is EVERYTHING and the moment you do something to disgrace it then you might as well get out of the hobby because most people wont deal with you from then on. I'd recommend giving the guy the $300 back and shake hands, forget about it and move on. The money is not worth the time and trouble it will cause on both sides down the road.

    John

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