For 8k you could have 2 really nice HUO machines and you won't have to worry about selling the VP machine for a huge loss when you get tired of it in a month and want the real thing

Seriously though, if you're dead set on a Virtual Pinball they are a super solid and reputable company.

VP Cabs made a big splash at SFGE. Their machines are really great. I say this as someone who does not like video pinball in general. That said, I would take the Vertigo. It is a very unique form factor and can be put in a small area that does not take up nearly the space of a full pinball cabinet. It plays tons of great pinball machines and tons of video games too. For $3500 it is a good deal. If I did get one, I would have to get the saw out and cut off the lip at the right and left hand side of the control panel. It is really painful to play pinball on it for very long in its stock form. Hopefully they will fix this soon...

Solid company , solid build, play before you buy. My opinion, they were a little laggy, but maybe just me

Is the vertigo the one with the screen vertical standing up?

Great for arcade emulation... Terrible for pinball, the physics are too hard to stomach

My wife and I got to play the Vertigo cabinets at SFGE and really enjoyed them. Additionally seeing some old arcade games running on them, like Time Pilot, hit my Nostalgia button really hard. Brad was helpful and friendly with all of our questions.

My main concern with these machines apply to all of this style of in-home computerized systems:
These are basically a computer (Windows in this instance), attached to your local WiFi at home. Most of the companies deploying these systems know little about configuring OSs in a mature and secure manor. Additionally, most of these companies tell you in their documentation to *not* apply updates to the OS. Look at their docs. This is asking for a time-bomb down the road. The #1 rule in owning a computer is to keep your software as up to date as possible at all times.

These machines could be protected from your home network with some additional configuration & equipment, but this isn't even on the radar of the companies deploying them. Nor is it in the skillset of most home users/collectors. Perhaps this leaves some room for after-market manufacturers to create a router/firewall device that would keep these machines in their own sub-net?

All in all, I like what I saw but am concerned about the maturity of these products. They seem a bit beta, at least in regards to security of the platform.

These machines do not need extra security. They are headless running a specialized front end. They are not running web browsers, email, being used to browser the Internet at all. You do not have to connect these to your home network at all to get them running. Wifi is only there as a convenience for updating the tables.

Yup

If this is a concern though, you could always do the security yourself.

On mine, I plug in an Ethernet cable, update steam, update the tables I want in vp, and then unplug the Ethernet when I don't need it

Actually my friends and I all preferred the stand up format and enjoyed playing pinball on it. Personally the horizontal games just don't work for me for two reasons. One, they are trying to be something they are not. As long as they don't have a real steel ball rolling around, they are not a pinball machine. It is a video game and the VP Cabs have dozens of great non-pinball video games that work amazing in the Vertigo cabinet. Second, the Vertigo hardly takes up any room. Like many, I am a little limited on room and none of these machines are worth the space that a pinball machine could fit into. The fact that it is by far my favorite format and it is also the least expensive does not hurt either!

DocOck I am thinking the same as you. VPCabs played great and I am considering buying one near Christmas time. Vertigo is the model I am leaning towards and it runs $4.2k ($3.5k base model plus $500 for bigger pc and $200 for shipping). Compared to a full-sized cabinet, it is less cost, smaller cabinet footprint and smaller main screen (32 vs 40 inch). A downside of the Vertigo model is lack of a second monitor to always show the translite. Width of Vertigo is also narrower than full table version. That may bother purists who demand the experience be "the same", but this is a plus to me, because narrower width results in the flipper buttons being in a more natural feeling position. The one element not reduced from the full size cabinet is the fun factor, which I'd call even.

Thanks for the reply Markmon.

I understand that they are headless, and stripped. That's a necessary first step. Do they auto-update themselves? What happens once deployed and new security updates come for the OS? Does anyone know which version of Windows they are deploying?

Perhaps my concern is directly related to my lack of knowledge about the platform itself. That is completely my fault. I need more access to determine exactly what they are doing. In no way do I mean to spread FUD. I like these guys and wish them success.

But if you are telling me that because the machine isn't used to 'browse the web' it is 'secure' then I remain concerned.

$8K for $2600.00 in materials (As declared on Shark Tank) is insane. I knew they were CHEAP, but c'mon!

If you're really looking for a high quality virtual pinball machine, at least look into VirtuaPin. Commercial-grade components, GENUINE WPC cabinets, and a LOT less expensive!

http://virtuapin.net

Here's what one customer had to say about the comparison between the two ... http://virtuapin.net/index.php?main_page=product_reviews_info&products_id=2&reviews_id=29

I'll be forthcoming and say our BOM is nearing $4K. You definitely get your money's worth.

I would highly suggest downloading the multiple pinball emulators and playing with them before you invest in a virtual cab. I swear to god I think I spent more time updated tables on my virtual pinball table then I did fixing problems on my real games. The software is constantly evolving and the tables with it making it a bit of a pain in the ass to keep up to date. In the end I sold mine and I'm just as happy doing my digital pinballing on my iPad. If I had to do it again I'd be more incline to get the more portable builds like the one Pinbulbs offer over a full sized cab. They're cheaper and don't take up the space a real pin could fill.

Buy an Oculus, then build this for ~$100 in parts.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/4/1/11345624/pinsim-pinball-fx-2-vr-machine-replica

I love mine and have had it for a few years,I played it quite a bit and it does satisfy Me thought not real you get to hear the real roms and with feedback it is even better,I was jonsing for a funhouse a while ago and after paying my vp I was good and was satisfied and the best part is pinball fx,new titles all the time and for just a few dollars they are amazing,I would have a vp just for fx,they are expensive and the resale is not what a real pin is so keep that in mind,I would have built my own if I had the skills but if you don't there games are very nice,I was going to buy from the other well known vp builder and that is all I will say

If you are not technically inclined or do not want to bother they seem to be the best off the shelf approach. With anything DIY will be cheaper and possibly better but DEFINITELY more work and headache. Who cares what the BOM is, they are a for profit company. I can guarantee the BOM for a Stern LE is under 4k.

The bottom line is that VP is not as good as a real pin but they are a blast to play. There will always be people on these forums that hate the idea of a "video" pinball machine. If they are fun to you then do not hesitate. This is the only hobby I know that people freak out if they lose a few bucks when they decided to change things up. If you can afford an 8k toy then enjoy it until something else piques your interest.

As always YMMV

Virtual pinball sucks so bad. I cringe when I see people considering them because I built one using the best hardware I could find and the software just isn't good. No knocks on Brad or Noah as they're not supporting the software and their cabs look nice. I really implore you into spending a while playing one before you decided. The main flaws for me were the physics are awful and the game just looks flat since there's no depth.

Try playing thru a few modes like on afm try and get to total annihilation and you'll probably find it to be much harder than real pinball because so!e of the shots just done work. I built mine just to learn the rules on games but couldn't progress far enough to accomplish that.

Broken pinball machines on route sucks so bad. I cringe when I see people trying to play them when the maintenance just isn't any good. No knocks on Stern or Williams as they ship/shipped good product and their cabs look nice. I really implore you into spending a while playing one before you decide to buy a real pinball machine that needs to maintained periodically. The main flaws for me were the broken rubbers, cracked ramps and weak flippers. Sometimes the game looks playable, but you feed the beast and one of the flippers doesnt work.
Try playing thru a few modes like on afm try and get to total annihilation with a broken flipper and you'll probably find it to be much harder than virtual pinball because the flippers just don 't work. Virtual pinball is not for everyone, but it can be just as fun to play and it helps learn the rules on games, more games then you could ever fit in your game room

Seriously, though. Virtual pinball is not trying to compete with real pinball. You have to be comfortable with PCs and tinkering with software if you are going to enjoy the virtual pinball hobby. Physics has improved drastically with Visual Pinball X and Physmod5 sw updates. Best thing to do is setup Pinball FX2 and/ or Visual Pinball on your existing home PC before you invest $1500 - $8000 on a virtual cab setup. I can play any of 500+ pinball tables at home, and I appreciate real pinball even more when I have the opportunity to play them. If they are 100% functional...

I did not care at all for the vertical cabinets at SFGE, downright disliked them. This coming from someone who built their own virtual cabinet last year. Theirs didn't feel right at all, whatever emulator and tables were on them sucked imo. Didn't like at all that it tries to be a mame cab too, cheapens the experience imo, but maybe that's just me. Makes it not an ideal platform for either pinball or games... No way in hell would spend $4k on one of those.

All I run on mine is the PinballX front end and the best Visual Pinball X tables. Plays pretty damn well, superior to everything I saw at their display at the show imo.

Funny how two people can see the same machine and have a completely opposite opinion.

I can tell you this... I do IT for a living, am very familiar with PC's and tech, and I still bought a turnkey solution from brad. (see attached pic) I didn't want to have to fart around with the tech side, I have a MAME machine I built awhile ago, in its own dedicated cabinet, with a tank stick. And I was constantly fooling with the configuration. Initially I was not a big fan of virtual pinball although it has grown on me. I like the fact it also does the MAME stuff, so we have the classics (pac man, ms. pac man, galaxian, galaga, etc.) to go along with all of our pins. It never fails when people are over here and play pinball they always ask if we have ms. pac man, or pac man. LOL

I love the vertical nature of this machine. Love the small footprint. I do agree though spending too much time flipping on a virtual table the cabinet does tend to wear on your hands and cause some slight discomfort, but that is negligible. We are very happy with this machine. as far as updates go. I do have it connected to my own network here, and it gets the windows and steam updates as needed automatically. we do not use the machine for any kind of internet work whatsoever. only the steam and vpcabs software used to run the games. Have only had one issue where it had a problem with the software, (not due to updates) and I reached out to brad, and support was immediate and top notch!!

vertigo_(resized).jpg

This was all completely true - up until last year when a European genius implemented a new physics engine. Tables that support that physics engine are incredibly accurate especially on the flippers. There are also other simulations that have proper flippers. The days of installing hyperpin and using community made vp9 tables are gone.

I can second this. I did not want to build a virtual pin two years ago, the software was lacking then. Now however I spend the last two months building one from scratch and I just was able to play my first game on the fully completed cab tonight (Monster Bash it was), and I love it. Gamechanger is to use contactors so you have real feedback from the slingshots and popbumpers and flippers. Also a real plunger was used with an optical sensor. Works great.

I took measurements of my TSPP and copied the cabinet so I could use all real pinball parts like the hinges, coindoor, siderails and lockbar and everything. It houses a 40 inch Sony television with only 17ms lag, a 27 inch backglass monitor and a RGB LED DMD.

Which software did you use that you like the physics so much now? Curious..

This VPCabs owner got the cryptlocker virus by using it to download tables.

http://www.vpforums.org/index.php?showtopic=34858#entry345404

Yea. That's why I said you shouldn't be using your cab to browse the Internet. The cabs should be headless running no internet browsers etc. In those cases you do not need virus scanners or OS updates. Those would make headless operation impossible. They constantly are popping up to click away some confirmation box.

hmmmmm... I need to check this out.

I just bought a Vertigo from VPCABS, the entire experience from purchase to delivery and setup has been awesome so far.

To preface, I've bought 4 real pins in my life, and over a dozen arcade cabs; very well versed in what is out there and have owned pretty much every type of game, from the classics to Mortal Kombat, single player, 2 player, 4 player cabs...Etc.

This Vertigo is probably the coolest cabinet that I have ever seen; the footprint is super small, it looks awesome next to my 3 pins of T2, WWFRR, and TFLE. The quality in the build is very impressive, all suzo happ parts, an exit button and launch button that light up. This is key, as I've had a lot of jamma multiboards before, and they stink for guests that come over, un-intuitive and very difficult for them to switch games on.

So for the arcade/gaming version of this cab, major props...The screen is a 32" LED TV that is flipped vertically and the games look great on it, they aren't stretched, so the proportion is correct. Now on to the main reason to buy this, for the virtual pins.

WOW, what a difference a vertical screen like this makes, I've played a lot of VP on the pinball arcade on Xbox one and PS4, IOS with Pinball FX, and it never truly feels right, because of the camera angle. On this, it's perfect, this is truly the way to play the pinball fx games and VP tables.

I bought the upgraded Vertigo and it comes loaded with everything you need out of the gate. I have been extremely pleased with the service, theses guys get back to you asap on email and are almost always there to pickup a phone call. I've dealt with a ton of sellers and Mame cab builders, and no one has been this attentive. I don't want to speak outwardly negative about other MAME cab builders, but there is one that I dealt with out of Wisconsin, who would seem annoyed when I would ask him questions about a cab, or how to custom build mine...Not a good vibe. These guys are excellent; in my opinion this Vertigo cab is going to sell like hot cakes if they can get the right distro in place.

Get this in the hands of Todd Tuckey and Mike from Automated, and have them sell these things, they are that good; and the appeal I think is more to the casual, game room crowd. The ones that would be looking to buy an Arcade Legends 3 or maybe a pin or megatouch. This cab is so tight, beautifully crafted, definitely on par with build quality of an Arcade Legends 3 from Chicago Gaming Company; if not better.

In short, I highly recommend a Vertigo and VP Cabs to anyone that's on the fence, feel free to PM me with any questions on the cab.

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Yeah, I would not let my VP browse the internet.

At work we use old laptops running Win95 only to update the code on our 15 year old controllers.

These old laptops still have the DB9 serial connectors that new laptops no longer have.

Those laptops DO NOT ever go onto the internet, or get connected to ANY networks. The WiFi cards have been removed.

We never have to worry about viruses or Windows updates, because they don't go on any networks to catch any viruses.

For $1600 you can buy my project virtual pin. Fully loaded, just add your PC.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/virtual-pinball-club/page/31#post-3214105

Yeah OP and when you do "look into VirtuaPin," tell us if you see that Predator cabinet money lying around!

Edited...

I use Visual Pinball X. The physics are different with every table you load, but the designers of the tables are only just getting to know the differences. This month there was another big update which incorporates the decay of the coils, so you can tip the ball to the other flipper for instance. That has to be programmed again in the tables to make the best use of it.

I'll chime in again here...I don't think you need to debate VP vs. real Pinball...They are totally different; if you accept VP as more of a video game than a pin; and complement it with a couple of real pins; then you have the perfect mix.

I love this Vertigo, because it is an arcade cab first; so great; wife and my 7 year old son are loving it so far; it's easy enough for them to navigate around with and that's the true test of any cab in a game room...Super happy with my purchase thus far.

Whoa - That's a steal!

This is very true. It does NOT compare very well to the real deal. It is and always will be a simulation.

But it is nice to be able to play games that I want to play sometimes, but not enough to own. Every real machine takes up space and money. For instance I really like to play Whoa Nellie sometimes, but I would not buy it at the current price (6500 euro over here). To be able to fire it up on the vpin is very satisfying. Also no worries about insert ghosting like on SMVE or GB PRO

It is, especially if you already have a spare PC to use. But otherwise, a PC would cost maybe $500? I have all the software to include as well. Need to finish a few other projects and I've recently moved on to building touchgame jukebox systems. But if I do add a PC back into this, the asking price just shot up to $3000 at least. So a great deal for someone to jump on, even to play for a bit and then flip.

VirtuaPin makes a very solid, excellent product similar to VPCabs. I edited my post as I made some assumptions that weren't true about Paul, the owner. He's been very accommodating to me in the past and I owe him an apology. In light of this, I believe you can't go wrong with buying from either company.

Oh I don't know, I liked "VirtuaCrook" better

Just an update: I have had like 10 questions for Brad since I got the vertigo and everytime I email him, he literally emails me back within 5-10 minutes with the answer. He even called me to walk me through a minor issue I had with button assignment on MAME. You will not find better service from any vendor in this hobby. Major kudos.

Also as an update, the vertigo is awesomesauce. So much fun to play both the virtual pins and classic arcade games. So great. Can't recommend this machine or VPCabs any higher. A 10/10 buy for me.

Most people run Windows 7 on their Virtual Pinball cabinets. It seems to be the most stable and run the programs the best. I have had customers upgrade to 10 with success though.

I run mine on 10. Works great. Reason why people do not want to upgrade is fear that something will go wrong that they have to try to solve it.

edit: btw there nothing wrong with that, not everybody likes solving PC stuff

Windows 7 is still modern enough to support everything. The main reason to avoid windows 10 on the cabinet is that it's more difficult to disable all the notifications and keep the system easy to run headless.

Anyone have a vpcabs mini that can comment on whether or not they like it? Any issues?

We are a VP Cabs distributor and we'll be at Allentown Pinfest in May with a full slate of VP Cabs machines - Wizard, Mini, and a ton of Vertigos ! Come see it there and take it home.

Or come up to see us and try one out prior to the show ! We have them in stock.

Joe Newhart
PinballSTAR Amusements
[email protected]
570-357-0042

I have a VP Cabs Vertigo #1308 and it's been nothing but trouble since I got it. The 1st issue is with the momentary power switch. This means that it cannot be left "on" and powered on and off by alexa or a wifi enabled outlet like other real arcade and pinball games can. Everytime you want to turn it on or off, you must press the power button on the back of the game. Seems like a minor thing until you want to use home automation to turn your games on.

Next issue is the speakers are in the back door panel. Why? They should be in the front to radiate sound forward, not into the wall behind the game. Also, when you remove the back door, the 4 connected speaker wires awkwardly make the still attached door have to be leaned up against the game instead of moved out of the way.

Next issue is the main TV doesn't always turn on with the game. My vertigo (that I bought from the original owner) didn't come with a remote control for the TV so I had to literally take the TV out from the back (because the cabinet bezel isn't removable) to see what brand and model it is and then go buy a remote on ebay. Since the bezel covers the IR remote port & it's not removable, it's a pain to turn the tv on with the remote when it decides not to turn on during game startup.

Next issue and the BIGGEST one that makes the Vertigo really suck, is the computer and HD system it uses. It is unlike a regular desktop computer you'll find in raw thrills, ea sports and other real arcade games. When you have an issue with the vertigos computer not starting up and loading the game/s (and you will!), you're totally screwed. Why? Because there's no restore disc, no dvd player to put one into and no way for an owner to restore the Hard Drive yourself. You'll have to deal with the ultra slow VPCabs Tech support to maybe get it fixed. And, their first solution to you will be to pack up the entire game, ship it to them in Ohio (for about $400), let them fix it for an (unknown amount of money) and you pay another $400 to ship it back to you. That's their solution?!!?! That's what they wanted me to do recently.

Honestly, I would not buy a VP Cab product until they make their games so the customer can restore the HD themselves AND they get a better tech support "team".

My experience in 6/2021 is that tech support is not brad anymore. It's Chris and he won't call you even if you email your cell number and ask him to call. You'll be lucky to get a response to your first email to VP Cabs tech support within a week. Usually you'll have to email him twice to finally get a curt response. And his response will be to ship the entire game back to ohio for them to fix it. That's about $800 shipping round trip and an untold amount in labor and parts. Seriously, that's VPcabs idea of customer service. If you are not the 1st owner and the game isn't under warranty... they do not care about supporting that game anymore.

They might have been awesome and cared about their customers and supporting their games 4 or 5 years ago when they were starting out, but these days, it's a different story. At least that's my personal experience with my POS vertigo and VP Cabs.

Hey Don. Sorry your having trouble. We’re doing everything we can to help you. Your machine is way out of warranty and bought second hand. We haven’t charged you a dime for tech support and always try to get back you you within a few days. Unfortunately since your hard drive failed we can’t remote in to your machine. If you don’t have a computer tech in your area you have to either send us your machine or send your hard drive and we will attempt to rebuild it. I’m not sure what else we can do to help.

Sending the HDD probably bit cheaper then whole machine