(Topic ID: 18292)

VID's Guide to Upgrading/Rebuilding Flippers

By vid1900

11 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 2,884 posts
  • 487 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 32 days ago by RichWolfson
  • Topic is favorited by 1,367 Pinsiders
  • Topic is sticky in its sub-forum

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

PXL_20240210_205855844 (resized).jpg
PXL_20240210_205917909 (resized).jpg
PXL_20240210_205848057 (resized).jpg
fliptronicarm (resized).jpg
PXL_20231109_233632597 (resized).jpg
Flipper_coil_sfl-19-400_lg (resized).jpg
20230928_083731 (resized).jpg
Screenshot_20230927_012258_Drive (resized).jpg
IMG_1733 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1719 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1726 (resized).jpeg
IMG_9736 (resized).jpeg
70881237416__8D01E86C-86A6-4FC5-BC46-EA5EA935BDA3 (resized).jpeg
IMG_0007 2 (resized).JPG
IMG_0005 2 (resized).JPG
IMG_0006 2 (resized).JPG

Topic index (key posts)

15 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items. (Show topic index)

There are 2,884 posts in this topic. You are on page 38 of 58.
#1851 6 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Replaced the pawl, link and plunger on my GOT Pro right flipper. All was well until I noticed the flipper would get caught up sometimes. Brand new parts. I opened up the game and noticed that the pin that holds the plunger to the link was sliding through due to vibration and catching the flipper base plate when it would actuate. Weird.
So I hammered it back through, but 50-100 plays later it worked its what through again. I am trying to think of a way to mess with that pin to not let it slide through anymore. I thought about taking pliers or a wrench to bend it up so it cannot slide through, or try and bang it with a hammer to bend it in a way that wont let it slide through anymore.
Thoughts? Don't have time to order a new one.

On loose split pins sometimes you can hammer a small drill bit thru one side to make it a little conical then hammer it in.
It sounds like the hole is drilled too big and not compressing the split pin enough to make it permanent.

#1852 6 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

On loose split pins sometimes you can hammer a small drill bit thru one side to make it a little conical then hammer it in.
It sounds like the hole is drilled too big and not compressing the split pin enough to make it permanent.

Good idea. Not sure I have a bit that small. I'll check.

#1853 6 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Good idea. Not sure I have a bit that small. I'll check.

I have also used small screwdrivers and ice picks or awls to widen split pins.

#1854 6 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

I use a small drill bit into the hole then under the rubber

I use a small allen wrench.

#1855 6 years ago

I think it's good now. Thanks!

#1856 6 years ago

Hey Vid, just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to make this guide. I just rebuilt my flippers on my Taxi. It was my first rebuild and reading this thread was a huge help. The new flippers are installed and are working without any issues. Making that left ramp now is a piece of cake.

#1857 6 years ago

My existing old style williams shafts are completely mangled and impossible to adjust appropriately. I tried to smooth out the shaft with dremel sanding flap wheel but there is just too much material gone.

I can't find a single source for old style shafts, and it seems like the only way forward is with modern flippers. Advice?

Quoted from vid1900:

NEVER PUT A MODERN FLIPPER INTO AN OLD STYLE MECH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ever.

#1858 6 years ago
Quoted from grandy:

My existing old style williams shafts are completely mangled and impossible to adjust appropriately. I tried to smooth out the shaft with dremel sanding flap wheel but there is just too much material gone.
I can't find a single source for old style shafts, and it seems like the only way forward is with modern flippers. Advice?

Yeah, it seems like everyone is out of them.

If your father in law has a small lathe, you could turn a groove into a new flipper shaft.

You could grind a relief into a new flipper shaft, using a Dremel and 1/8" disc.

You could update the game with a modern flipper mech, and never worry about expensive replacement parts again.

#1859 6 years ago

Hey Vid, just got myself a decent Haunted House and its my first Gottlieb . No idea how to properly rebuild these flippers as all my pins have been Bally/Williams. Im not even sure what flipper kits i need to do all the flippers. Any advice ? Not sure if you went through these setups early on .

#1860 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

You could update the game with a modern flipper mech, and never worry about expensive replacement parts again.

Thanks - i was planning on doing this "someday" so I guess i better bite the bullet and get on with it.

#1861 6 years ago
Quoted from grandy:

My existing old style williams shafts are completely mangled and impossible to adjust appropriately. I tried to smooth out the shaft with dremel sanding flap wheel but there is just too much material gone.
I can't find a single source for old style shafts, and it seems like the only way forward is with modern flippers. Advice?

First let me say thanks Vid for some great posts! Helpful beyond words.

So I just completed a total flipper mec upgrade on a Williams Flash. Went relatively smooth. I would say it was worth the effort.

So Brandsilence I have 3 old style flipper bats that I would be willing to part with. I would actually like to sell the whole lot of 3 complete old school mechs. See the picture. These include 3 Pinball Resource rebuild parts less than a year old, 3 coils 2 of which are new and all the original mounts etc. PM if you are interested otherwise ebay in a week or two.

20170821_185519 (resized).jpg20170821_185519 (resized).jpg

20170821_185534 (resized).jpg20170821_185534 (resized).jpg

#1862 6 years ago

Had to rebuild my flipper on GOT. I went through 5 of these switches before I just said screw it and went with the same EOS that comes stock on the game.

IMG_6471 (resized).PNGIMG_6471 (resized).PNG

For whatever reason. These do not play well with spike games. Or at least not my spike game. I was getting intermittent weak hits from the flipper because these were not registering as closed at times when they should have been. So weird. But when I switches to one that was just like the stock one, all is well again.

I thought these were the gold standard of EOS switches and would be the best to use in any era that needed a NC switch. No so in this case. FYI for others so they don't beat their brains in like I did.

#1863 6 years ago

Those look like high-current switches, which - if they are - could give bad connectivity with lower current digital signals, IMHO..

#1864 6 years ago
Quoted from Coyote:

Those look like high-current switches, which - if they are - could give bad connectivity with lower current digital signals, IMHO..

Well that could've very well been my issue. These work fine on every one of my games except GOT. I guess the same current is not running through the new EOS switches.

#1865 6 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Well that could've very well been my issue. These work fine on every one of my games except GOT. I guess the same current is not running through the new EOS switches.

Also, don't take my word for it - let someone else chime in. I'm just going by memory from a long, long time ago.

#1866 6 years ago

Vid: what do you propose to do when you're getting conflicting info on a flippers coil size?

My BTTF manual lists a 23-900 while later updates from Sega/Stern list a 22-900.

Your thoughts?

#1867 6 years ago

OK here goes, I'd like to completly rebuild my Jack Bot flippers. What would be the best kit? Thanks.

#1868 6 years ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

OK here goes, I'd like to completly rebuild my Jack Bot flippers. What would be the best kit? Thanks.

Just go to pinball life and find the kit for your game. Pretty easy.

#1869 6 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Just go to pinball life and find the kit for your game. Pretty easy.

Thanks, that's what I was thinking, just didn't know if there was a better way to go then a pre-made kit.

#1870 6 years ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

Thanks, that's what I was thinking, just didn't know if there was a better way to go then a pre-made kit.

Never failed me. Rebuilt my WCS flippers a while back with their kit and it went smooth. Just make sure you get bushings separate if you need those too. They don't come in the kit.

#1871 6 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Never failed me. Rebuilt my WCS flippers a while back with their kit and it went smooth. Just make sure you get bushings separate if you need those too. They don't come in the kit.

That's good to know, thanks chuck.

#1872 6 years ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

That's good to know, thanks chuck.

And make sure they look like this when you are done.

IMG_1617 (resized).JPGIMG_1617 (resized).JPG

#1873 6 years ago

I just picked up an Eight Ball Champ and I want to rebuild the flippers. The strange thing with this game is that it came out in 1985 but doesn't have linear flippers. The flipper mechs look similar to early SS flipper mechs from the late 70's but slightly different. The coils are also 43 volt. Does anyone have any recommendations on what to rebuild them with? I'm thinking about upgrading to Fliptronics but not sure which options as far as coil/coil stop to select when selecting the full assembly from PBL? thanks!

#1874 6 years ago
Quoted from MikeS:

I just picked up an Eight Ball Champ and I want to rebuild the flippers. The strange thing with this game is that it came out in 1985 but doesn't have linear flippers. The flipper mechs look similar to early SS flipper mechs from the late 70's but slightly different. The coils are also 43 volt. Does anyone have any recommendations on what to rebuild them with? I'm thinking about upgrading to Fliptronics but not sure which options as far as coil/coil stop to select when selecting the full assembly from PBL? thanks!

I just worked on an eight ball champ for a friend of mine. We got all of the parts from Pinball Resource. Eight Ball champ seems to be a one off game for that era from what I have learned. To get the correct stroke on the flippers, I had to move the stop out so it had more room to travel. The end result worked great.
Give Steve a call and he will hook you up with the rebuild parts.

#1875 6 years ago
Quoted from MikeS:

I just picked up an Eight Ball Champ and I want to rebuild the flippers. The strange thing with this game is that it came out in 1985 but doesn't have linear flippers. The flipper mechs look similar to early SS flipper mechs from the late 70's but slightly different. The coils are also 43 volt. Does anyone have any recommendations on what to rebuild them with? I'm thinking about upgrading to Fliptronics but not sure which options as far as coil/coil stop to select when selecting the full assembly from PBL? thanks!

All ballys are 43v. Don't convert to fliptronics, you won't get the right throw

Super exclusive ad from the Pinside Marketplace!
#1876 6 years ago

Thanks guys! I was planning to order some other parts (drops, pop bumper caps, stand-ups, lane guides, etc) for the game through PBR but I'll give Steve a call and see what he recommends for flipper parts. I also need to ask him about stand-up targets since mine currently has 3 different styles.-I don't think you can get the original Bally targets anymore.

#1877 6 years ago
Quoted from SUPERBEE:

Hey Vid, just got myself a decent Haunted House and its my first Gottlieb . No idea how to properly rebuild these flippers as all my pins have been Bally/Williams. Im not even sure what flipper kits i need to do all the flippers. Any advice ? Not sure if you went through these setups early on .

I have not had to service any Gots lately, but I will document the process when I do.

Until then, PBR is your friend.....

#1878 6 years ago
Quoted from ypurchn:

Vid: what do you propose to do when you're getting conflicting info on a flippers coil size?
My BTTF manual lists a 23-900 while later updates from Sega/Stern list a 22-900.
Your thoughts?

Sometimes the manufacturer changes to a better suited coil after getting feedback from the ops.

F-14 would be one of those games where you want to use the weaker coils for the upper flippers. A great many games shipped with stronger coils that quickly ruin the plastics. Latter the games and manuals use the weaker coils.

So unless there is an error, use the more recent manual.

#1879 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I have not had to service any Gots lately, but I will document the process when I do.

Ok thanks.

Quoted from vid1900:

Until then, PBR is your friend.....

Yeah, the best place to shop for Gottlieb parts!

#1880 6 years ago
Quoted from Kawydud:

And make sure they look like this when you are done.

Yes SIR! I started with the pops, them and that area need help more.

#1881 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Sometimes the manufacturer changes to a better suited coil after getting feedback from the ops.
F-14 would be one of those games where you want to use the weaker coils for the upper flippers. A great many games shipped with stronger coils that quickly ruin the plastics. Latter the games and manuals use the weaker coils.
So unless there is an error, use the more recent manual.

thanks for your time and insight! Always appreciated!

#1882 6 years ago

Hi Vid >> I am in need of some help please. I searched the thread and dont think Game Plan flipper upgrade has been documented.

I am looking for some help as I recently got an ANDROMEDA and I am bringing it back to life.

I have been scouring the web and seems to be some different opinions and no clear info on exactly how to rebuild/replace the flippers on these. Some suggest pre 80 Bally, some suggest early Stern, some suggest sys11, some suggest WPC.

I would like to replace the entire flipper assemblies with all new backing plate, coils, bushings, etc... the full swap. However I also want to retain the most accurate feel and power with making sure I get the 'snap'.

http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=catalog&parent=107&pg=1

Looking at PBLIFE, which do you think is the best option for a full flipper assembly?
Do I need to get different bushings to get the correct height?
WHAT are the correct coils to use?
Should I order a specific coil stop to get the correct flipper travel?

Thanks in advance for your help.

I would love to get parts ordered today and would be happy to document the swap in with photos to help others in the future.

#1883 6 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

Hi Vid >> I am in need of some help please. I searched the thread and dont think Game Plan flipper upgrade has been documented.
I am looking for some help as I recently got an ANDROMEDA and I am bringing it back to life.
I have been scouring the web and seems to be some different opinions and no clear info on exactly how to rebuild/replace the flippers on these. Some suggest pre 80 Bally, some suggest early Stern, some suggest sys11, some suggest WPC.
I would like to replace the entire flipper assemblies with all new backing plate, coils, bushings, etc... the full swap. However I also want to retain the most accurate feel and power with making sure I get the 'snap'.
http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=catalog&parent=107&pg=1
Looking at PBLIFE, which do you think is the best option for a full flipper assembly?
Do I need to get different bushings to get the correct height?
WHAT are the correct coils to use?
Should I order a specific coil stop to get the correct flipper travel?
Thanks in advance for your help.
I would love to get parts ordered today and would be happy to document the swap in with photos to help others in the future.

I have not seen an Andromeda in years, so I can't remember even what the flipper mechs look like underneath.

You might need to call PBR and see what they have in stock.

#1884 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I have not seen an Andromeda in years, so I can't remember even what the flipper mechs look like underneath.
You might need to call PBR and see what they have in stock.

A few pics. I assume the one on the left is original.
Coil is 21-50008B. What would be a good replacement if i replaced with full assemblies?

IMG_1266 (resized).JPGIMG_1266 (resized).JPG

IMG_1267 (resized).JPGIMG_1267 (resized).JPG

IMG_1268 (resized).JPGIMG_1268 (resized).JPG

#1885 6 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

A few pics. I assume the one on the left is original.
Coil is 21-50008B. What would be a good replacement if i replaced with full assemblies?

I would keep your old coils and just get new mechs.

Looks like you can use classic Bally (or obviously Classic Stern) no problem.

#1886 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I would keep your old coils and just get new mechs.
Looks like you can use classic Bally (or obviously Classic Stern) no problem.

if I were to get a new coil when ordering this, which would be the closest?
http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=2411

#1887 6 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

if I were to get a new coil when ordering this, which would be the closest?
http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=2411

Your current windings I believe are 22-375 /30-800 , so none of those are exact matches.

I guess try the J25-450 and use your EOS switch gap to adjust the strength.

2 weeks later
#1888 6 years ago

I'm upgrading the flippers on my #Time Warp. Same machine example @Vid uses for the SS filipper upgrade. I'm just about certain that the wiring is correct. The flippers engage just fine, but when the EOS switch disengages, it isn't holding the flipper. It starts to travel back, which re-closes the switch, which fires it again. Rinse an repeat. The result is sparking at the EOS switch and buzzing. I'm attaching pictures. Anyone have any ideas what I've done wrong here?

Thanks!

20170911_174144 (resized).jpg20170911_174144 (resized).jpg

20170911_174152 (resized).jpg20170911_174152 (resized).jpg

#1889 6 years ago

Don't believe those are the right coils there. WPC coils should have two diodes, and the SFL nomenclature isn't right either, AFAIK.

#1890 6 years ago
Quoted from Coyote:

Don't believe those are the right coils there. WPC coils should have two diodes, and the SFL nomenclature isn't right either, AFAIK.

Technically, as long as it's not fliptronics, either a parallel or series wound coil should work fine, given the proper wiring, shouldn't it? If I remember correctly, the coils on pre-50V, post EM mech williams games are this style

#1891 6 years ago
Quoted from zacaj:

Technically, as long as it's not fliptronics, either a parallel or series wound coil should work fine, given the proper wiring, shouldn't it? If I remember correctly, the coils on pre-50V, post EM mech williams games are this style

Yes. These should be correct. I'm using exactly what vid1900 said to order from pinball life. It's the same coils and setup he described back from post 150. The original coils only had one diode as well.

#1892 6 years ago

Make sure that the single wire is your 28V and not the other way around.

105c4e2ba7479df0928353b803f957705ceaf9b8 (resized).jpg105c4e2ba7479df0928353b803f957705ceaf9b8 (resized).jpg

#1893 6 years ago
Quoted from Kawydud:

Make sure that the single wire is your 28V and not the other way around.

Thanks. I did check that already. Even put a multimeter on it to make double sure.

This really has me scratching my head. I'm hoping that vid1900 pokes his head in and tells me where I went wrong. Especially since he loves Time Warp.

#1895 6 years ago

Do both flippers do the same thing? It is obviously getting power to pull in, but the high resistance power isn't holding it in, sort of like the ground is hooked wrong.

#1896 6 years ago

Finally figured it out. Poor solder job on the lugs. Not sure if pinball life didn't strip the coil wires or if I was expected to do that, but I ended up unwinding them from the lugs, stripping them a bit and it fixed the problem. I'm irritated that was what the problem was, but not sure who I should be mad at.

Thanks guys for all the suggestions!

#1897 6 years ago
Quoted from Sponge:

Finally figured it out. Poor solder job on the lugs. Not sure if pinball life didn't strip the coil wires or if I was expected to do that, but I ended up unwinding them from the lugs, stripping them a bit and it fixed the problem. I'm irritated that was what the problem was, but not sure who I should be mad at.
Thanks guys for all the suggestions!

Guessing the issue was the wire for the ground? Since it worked when the EOS was connected.

2 weeks later
#1898 6 years ago

Newb question for my MM flipper rebuild: when you insert the flipper bushing through the playfield, is it recessed or does it come out and protrude out the other side? (mine is recessed but this doesn't seem right)

#1899 6 years ago
Quoted from spinal:

Newb question for my MM flipper rebuild: when you insert the flipper bushing through the playfield, is it recessed or does it come out and protrude out the other side? (mine is recessed but this doesn't seem right)

Protrude. Can you show up pictures of the bracket and bushing?

Marc

#1900 6 years ago

Thanks Marc for helping as I admit to being perplexed right now. Purchased new bracket and rebuild kit as well as standard Williams bushing from Marco. Put into playfield and it's recessed

IMG_0945 (resized).JPGIMG_0945 (resized).JPG

IMG_0942 (resized).JPGIMG_0942 (resized).JPG

IMG_0933 (resized).JPGIMG_0933 (resized).JPG

IMG_0936 (resized).JPGIMG_0936 (resized).JPG

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 0.00
Playfield - Other
PinJewels
Other
From: $ 159.95
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
PinSound
Sound/Speakers
From: $ 30.00
Cabinet - Toppers
+CY Universal
Toppers
From: $ 55.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos LLC
Decorations
$ 13.50
$ 69.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lighted Pinball Mods
Toys/Add-ons
From: $ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
$ 959.00
Flipper Parts
Mircoplayfields
Flipper parts
$ 79.00
Boards
PinballReplacementParts
Boards
From: $ 55.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos LLC
Decorations
$ 15.00
Playfield - Decals
Metal-Mods
Decals
12,250
Machine - For Sale
Richfield, OH
$ 41.99
Lighting - Interactive
Lee's Parts
Interactive
$ 49.99
$ 22.50
Magazines/books
Pinball Magazine
Magazines/books
Wanted
Machine - Wanted
Newcastle, OK
$ 18.99
Tools
FlipMods
Tools
$ 63.95
14,000 (OBO)
$ 219.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Lit Frames
Decorations
From: $ 110.00
Playfield - Other
Arcade Upkeep
Other
$ 1,059.00
Flipper Parts
Mircoplayfields
Flipper parts
$ 69.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lighted Pinball Mods
Toys/Add-ons
$ 16.00
Boards
Lermods
Boards
From: € 30.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Pino Pinball Mods Shop
Toys/Add-ons
$ 59.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Hookedonpinball.com
Toys/Add-ons
From: $ 90.00
Tools
Pincoder Store
Tools
$ 20.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
2step’s shop
Toys/Add-ons
Hey modders!
Your shop name here
There are 2,884 posts in this topic. You are on page 38 of 58.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-upgradingrebuilding-flippers/page/38 and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.