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(Topic ID: 33446)

Vid's Guide to Ultimate Playfield Restoration

By vid1900

11 years ago


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Topic index (key posts)

143 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #6 Removing mylar and the adhesive left behind. Don't clear over it. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #7 Playfield damage assessment. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #8 Insert damage assessment. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #15 Removing inserts, step one - cut around it so you don't remove artwork with the insert. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #23 Removing inserts, step two - how to heat it, what to push it out with. Don't remove them if you're not replacing them. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #26 How a playfield is made and why your new inserts must be sanded flat before installation. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #34 How to sand your new inserts flat. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #35 Cleaning old glue out of the insert holes. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #36 Removing old mastic with a burr tool on a rotary device such as a Dremel. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

Post #37 Prep your insert for gluing by sanding it with 100 grit. Epoxy can be chipped off the insert without this step. Posted by vid1900 (11 years ago)

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#3297 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Hey Vid, I picked up a Harlem Globetrotters with full playfield mylar (and sling mylar semicircles *under* that mylar, grr), and no wear under the mylar (so I don't want to remove it, plus I like the way mylar plays). However near the top there was a small rat's nest, and in a few places the edge of the mylar has lifted, and there's dirt underneath.

The most important spot is here on the lower right, because it's visible to the player
IMG_20160622_162555_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162555_(resized).jpg

But there's also some problems near the upper hole:
IMG_20160622_162611_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162611_(resized).jpg
IMG_20160622_162620_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162620_(resized).jpg
IMG_20160622_162605_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162605_(resized).jpg

and around the pops
IMG_20160622_162641_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162641_(resized).jpg
IMG_20160622_162648_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_162648_(resized).jpg

is there anything I can do with these? The only things I can think of are either cutting out those areas and living with the slight bump, or attempting to scrape out and clean the dirt somehow, then heat the mylar and maybe stick a bit of clear glue under it...

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#3299 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

Cut out the bad sections carefully with an Xacto knife, clean up any filth and old adhesive, and just patch with a new piece of Mylar.
You can keep trimming the new Mylar with the backing still on, until you make the perfect puzzle piece.
(Good pics, BTW)

Thanks, anything to fix the kickout hole (looks like they might have been nibbling the edge, unless that's just wear). Just Bondo?

I had started just cleaning off other bits of the playfield, and the left outlane (no mylar) had a piece of paint come up, there's about a 2 inch section with a different texture. In the future I'll feel each area before cleaning it (I was just using a bit of Novus#2 to get the dirt off after vacuuming it and then wiping with a dry cloth), but is there anything you'd recommend for cleaning any other areas as best I can? And would it be best to just stick another patch of mylar on afterwards to protect it?

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#3302 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

Novus2 might be too harsh of an abrasive.
Many old Bally have flaky fragile paint.
Wipe carefully with Naphtha, and don't try to clean too much.

The main reason I'd used novus was because there was a good amount of 'gunk', that definitely shouldn't later be trapped under mylar. I guess I should have chipped at the gunk with something soft first, before giving it a wiping with naphtha. IMG_20160622_185417_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_185417_(resized).jpg

Not sure how I could get it or this one other place clean without major paint loss, but oh well.
IMG_20160622_185429_(resized).jpgIMG_20160622_185429_(resized).jpg

1 week later
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#3338 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

Novus2 might be too harsh of an abrasive.
Many old Bally have flaky fragile paint.
Wipe carefully with Naphtha, and don't try to clean too much.

Was fairly successful cleaning this up by first dabbing with a soft cloth and naphtha, then rubbing lightly, making sure that the only flaking areas were around where the paint had already coming up, then cleaning the rest of it lightly with novus to remove the dirt the naphtha wouldn't get:

IMG_20160625_125105_(resized).jpgIMG_20160625_125105_(resized).jpg

I also trimmed some of the dirty lifting mylar
IMG_20160627_194904_(resized).jpgIMG_20160627_194904_(resized).jpgIMG_20160627_194916_(resized).jpgIMG_20160627_194916_(resized).jpg

I've run into problems where, no matter how carefully I cut, I'm still occasionally cutting into the wood with the exacto knife and leaving annoying white lines (much worse than the very occasional lifted paint). Is there anything I can do to make the cutting safer?

Finally, I ordered a sheet of mylar from the pinball resource, and just fit and attached my first piece (after waxing the area), only to realize that it's probably 3-4 times thinner than the existing mylar. Do you know of any place to buy thicker mylar? As it is, this isn't going to make it okay any better and stands out even more than if I don't put down any mylar all. I'm half tempted to just not do it, besides from putting new rings around the pop bumpers Am I at much danger of the mylar ripping up more from ball travel if I don't put more down? (if so I doubt the thinner mylar would help much either)

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#3340 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

I usually just score it

I haven't been able to score enough for it to tear without pulling up the other mylar...

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

BRAND NEW XACTO BLADE, for sure.

I even bought a new handle!

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

Marcos has it

I was only able to find 3 mil, and if I had to guess I'd say this is closer to 10mil than it is to 3. Will search some non-pinball places....

2 months later
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#3528 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from nikpinball:

Vid i tried this recently and could not drill the circle holes without it cracking/breaking melting etc. What do i need to use to get it done right?

I'm trying a similar thing right now, but I traced it in CAD and got it CNCd. First attempt didn't come out too nice (they ran the bit too fast and melted the edges a bit) but no cracking problems. I know some people have done it with just a dremel

4 weeks later
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#3619 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Vid, I've been wondering about this 'wax before mylar' thing. If I put down a nice coat of wax and then mylar some spots, and five years later peel up the mylar, is the wax still going to protect the paint from peeling up, or is it just a temporary thing? Two years? Ten years? Is the reason why paint comes up on old games because they didn't bother waxing first back then, or....? How much safer does it make the mylar removal (in the short term)? Are we talking 0% chance of paint coming up (as long as the paint is in good condition), or just a 50%? What about over large wear spots? I've got some places on my Spectrum where there's two inch areas with no paint left, and was considering how/if to protect them from getting worse. Is the chance of taking up paint higher? (none of it seems to be flaking)

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#3621 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

There are a lot of variables to consider there.
Different companies made Mylar over the years, and different adhesives were used.
Playfields that have been in unconditioned spaces (like a garage) will loose paint much easier.
But waxing with a real paste Carnauba wax (not some fake liquid "wax"), and using the Mylar that Marco sells by the foot on a roll, it seems that any intact paint stays intact upon removal.

And you don't think that, all other conditions (humidity, temp, etc) being good, the wax will lose its effectiveness at paint preservation over time?

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#3626 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from Mr_Tantrum:

I followed this advice exactly. While vid can speak from experience, I seriously doubt he has documented the results of this advice over 5, 10, 15 year periods. Not sure what you are looking for but use some logic. The Mylar is adhering to a wax layer not the paint or even clear coat layer. You are then sealing the wax with an airtight layer off Mylar. While I guess the wax could melt or breakdown under extreme conditions, I seriously doubt that it is just going to disappear this causing the adhesive Mylar to come in direct contact with Playfield paint.

Not that you could know for sure, but Vid definitely knows more than I do

2 months later
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#3868 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from newmanoconnor:

Definitely considering it.
Man that's gonna suck to put on...

They're not too bad, especially for earlier games. Can be done in a few hours

1 month later
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#4032 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Vid, is Diamondplate any safer for mylar removal compared to older games? I've got a Black Rose with some mylar in front of the flippers, making the ball deflection from the cannon even worse, but I'm afraid to remove it as it's the most noticable area of the whole game and it's practically invisible right now.

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#4034 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

OP
Quoted from vid1900:

Diamondplate is a little safer, but if the game was ever stored in an unheated garage, all bets are off.

I don't know where it was stored but most of the metal needed to be derusted, etc, so that's probably a safe bet

1 month later
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#4155 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from kilmarnock1350:

Sorry as in the adhesive will not come off?

Or it will come off, along with part of your playfield

4 weeks later
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#4232 7 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from sohchx:

Yeah really!!! Looks like a hack of some sort that never got finished, unless the Op has already removed it?? Someone definitely inserted a screw into each side of that lane for some odd reason.

I have the same thing on my Black rose, no idea why. Also looks like the made a gouge where the ball goes from. The trough to the lane with a knife for some reason. Very annoying, ball gets stuck on it sometimes

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#4241 6 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Vid, is the process for installing star rollovers the same as inserts? I've got a game where most of them are falling out of the playfield.

Do you know if any places like Home Depot, Harbor Freight, etc carry the 3M plastic primer?

3 months later
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#4670 6 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Is the yellow that faded in person or is that just the camera? Almost didn't recognize the game at first...

1 month later
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#4817 6 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Quoted from Plumonium:

For you guys using the HP4600 scanner, does it run on windows 7 (drivers)?

I use it on my windows 7 laptop fine, but not in a USB 3.0 port, only 2.0

11 months later
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#6008 5 years ago
 
ZAC

zacaj

RPC

US Rochester, NY

11y 158K 10,387 85 122 1

Vid, if I wanted to hand paint a playfield that hasn't been cleared and be able to remove it down the line without too much effort/damage, is there any paint that fits the bill?

I figure if I manage to make a playfield protector for my game, it'd be nice to touch it up a bit first, but don't want anything I can't remove down the line

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