Thanks... not sure if your games have these metal guides but how did/would you put them back in? Cut spots where the holes are on pf?

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.

Interesting, my protector had all the areas cut out where the wire guides were so there wasn't a need to remove them. You may have read through this thread already but this user installed one on a Firepower also, maybe there is some helpful info here- https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/lexan-playfield-protector-install-and-review

Thanks.. I think/hope they should go in ok with a tap with a small hammer.

Question on installing the rail guides on a cleared playfield. I swear I've read the info somewhere, but I can't find it right now. I'm putting back together my cleared Stern Stars playfield. I followed the info on putting the posts back in, and that worked great. How would you go about putting the metal ball rails back in? Obviously don't want to crack any clear or screw something up.

The Ron Kruzman playfield thread, and possibly the HEP game thread.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-re-populating-playfields#post-4526507

Thank you! That's the one I was looking for, and knew I read it in the past! Thanks a ton!

I've been restoring my Miss-O playfield. So far its been going great, I scanned in the playfield, created paint masks and have been painting the various colors. I used createx paints right from the bottle as so far I have been doing primary colors - red, yellow and white. I decided to lay down a thin coat of clear (rustoleum crystal clear enamel) to lock in the paint so I don't lift it while masking other areas.

Thats when disaster happened, for some reason the white reacted and it now looks like this. you can see the red and yellow areas had no trouble. Does anyone know why it would have happened, what I can do to fix it and how to prevent it in the future? The white was not the last color laid down, is it a bad bottle or something?

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The clear lifted the paint.
Poor paint adhesion or too thick of an initial clear coat.

Any thoughts or suggestions on the best way to clean this playfield up before I attempt my first repaint? This machine isn't worthy of a high end restore, but I would like to make it look as presentable as possible. Plan is to repaint and then put a playfield protector on (no clear coat). There is no repro playfield or hard top avail for this machine (Target Alpha).

The blues and greens are all not original colors. They were (poorly) added by previous owners.

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AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!

I had a players condition F14 playfield with quite some raised inserts:
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I had to come up with a plan how do make it playable without going the full way of disassambling-removing mylar-airbrushing-clearcoating.
´Quick´n´dirty raised insert leveling tool´ (patent pending) :
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worked very well in the end:
1. set the heatgun to ~150°C
2. gently heat bottom side of the insert via the hollow shaft of the C clamp
3. torque C clamp till you feel the insert settling down
4. let it cool down
5. remove clamp and check if insert is level. If not go back to step 2 and apply more torque
6. redo for all raised inserts
7. done- enjoy the game and a beer

exactly

that is going to take a lot of work. for info on clearning, check out Vid's guide: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/cleaning-and-waxing-pinball-machines-vids-guide

Also, this thread - check out the index.

If you plan to repaint freehand more power to you, if you plan to use a paint mask, check out the cameo thread: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/silhouette-cameo-pinball-restorers-club

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Something in the white paint is reacting with the restoleum clear. This could happen if you either did not let the paint to dry long enough , and/or you did not set it with heat. Createx needs to be heated to set. Other than that you may have a paint / clear incompatibility. I am using createx paints , with 2 part auto clear and had zero problems so far.
To correct this , and if you cannot use something other than restoleum , wet sand the playfield and see how things look. If white areas are ok then re apply another coat of clear. Other wise , re-coat the white areas with multiple thin layers of paint setting each layer with heat. Leave the playfield alone for a week and reapply clear.

I thought CPR made these playfields. At this point, you should just go Repro. They did make the backglass for them, as I have bought one from them. I'd think they did the playfields as well.

Thanks for the link to Vid's cleaning and waxing guide, I'll check that out, although this will require more of a crappy paint removal than a cleaning I tried denatured alcohol & magic eraser last night (I didn't have regular isopropyl) and it made a mess of the new paint - kind of spread it all over. Forunately, it did leave whatever original paint was left underneath.

I would love to go repro and I did check with CPR. They have no plans to make Target Alpha repro playfields. I checked with everyone who has a gottlieb license - same story - so repainting by hand seems to be my only option. Buying a Silhouette Cameo seems like a great idea, but by the time I added up the costs of the machine, vinyl, learning curve, it started getting really expensive for one machine. I'm hoping that the big shapes on this playfield will allow me to mask off with frisket and airbrush by hand. I can use waterslide decals for the lettering. Once I repaint, I'll just slap a protector over the whole thing and call it a day. I've got a decent picture of a pristine playfield to aid with colors and frisket matching. Just need to get up the nerve to get started. I really don't think I can make this much worse than it already is.

Did you use their "wicked" line or "spray colors" line? I had a similar situation with a createx "spray color" purple that I had mixed; for me the clear reacted with the sprayed area but fortunately as it dried the paint laid back down ok. I did not have the lifting I see in your photo.

I was told by createx that the only way that would happen is if you sprayed your color too thick and it didn't cure properly and/or you didn't allow enough time to fully cure.

THEY RECOMMENDED I USE THEIR WICKED line of colors as they hold up to clears much better than their spray color line. Have had no issues spraying the wicked line of colors ever since.

See the below thread; Createx reply to my issue is on post 13:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/paint-bleed-on-3rd-varathane-coat-wtf

I guess I did something like that. I used regular old created but now I’ve scraped the old white/clear off, roughed it up with some 800 grit, sprayed some primer then white over the primer. I waited overnight and I have sprayed 3 very light coats of clear and no problems. So I guess I did something wrong the first time

Glad you were able to work through your issue!

Its amazing how much brighter the white is than the old

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it is, thats' why you have to yellow up the new white, or it looks out of place. Even originally, it was never that white.

My first post in this amazing thread. Thank you, Vid.

I'm wondering what you recommend I do with the apron in my Road Show. The paint has flaked off in spots and there's some blistering. Is it possible to freeze the decals off (something I've never tried), repaint the entire apron, and then re-apply the decals? If so, can I just use black satin spray paint? How do you re-affix the decals (what kind of glue), etc.?

I know I can get a set of replacement decals, but before shelling out $50 I like to see if I can do this myself.

I've scanned most of this thread and don't recall seeing anything that specifically addresses this issue -- if I missed it, or it this is too far off topic, please forgive me and just point me in the right direction.

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Satin black is a good look, I like appliance gloss black too.

Decals are available from various sources or make your own from scans.

I used “vanilla” on my bank a ball repaint. White was way too white.

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Something I have been contemplating on my Flash Gordon, the "white" areas are not white at all but a cream color or so it seems. Have to finish the cabinet before I start on the playfield issues.

Cream, buttermilk, ivory, parchment etc etc anything but white

if you only have white. Add just a touch of raw sienna. That will give the original white look.

If your paint is lifting when pulling up on your masking something else is not right. I can apply paint and dry it with a dryer and remask over that in minutes and do another colour without any lifting.

What paint you using ? What clear you using ? Seems like the paint is not properly adhering.

Following Vid's guide to the letter, Createx paint, 2PAC, rough sanding between applications.

Also, there was a Createx announcement *against* using heat curing a while back. I'd love to know conclusively about that. Probably not that important ultimately since plenty of people are doing it and disaster has not ensued. But still...

Man, that's a good tip. I usually use some yellow and translucent brown ("sand") to mimic it, but it's kind of a PITA. I'm not seeing raw sienna on the Blick website - is it a different brand from Createx?

yes, I use liquitex. it's just a redish brown. dark redish brown. almost like a brown rust look.

I'm about to take the plunge and try my first restore/clear. I've read all 139 pages of this Forum (much of it twice), but still have some questions I'm hoping you pros can help me with:

How would you approach the section of the playfield in the photo?

1. In what order would you paint each of the 5 colors (i.e., black, magenta, orange, cream, white)?
2. In the central column, would you paint each color it's actual width, allowing for some overlap, OR would you paint so that successive layers fully extend beneath the next layer? For example, assuming black is first color, would I paint the full width of the entire column black, then, assuming orange is next, paint the orange all the way to the right edge of the column (covering the black underneath), then the cream over the orange (covering the orange underneath), etc? (Hope this makes sense).
3. How would you handle the black outlines of the boxes? Would you paint & mask, or go with decals? If decals, how would you section them up?
4. How about the white "Same player shoots again" lettering -- white decal paper?
4. Am I out of my mind?

Any guidance is greatly appreciated.
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That's a really doable restoration project, and I'd say a really good choice for your first project.
Just looking at it offhand, I don't think it's gonna matter a whole lot what order you take on the colors. As I have mentioned elsewhere, I have had some problems with frisket leaving residue when I've tried to mask over freshly painted areas, so depending how this goes for you, you might be well served by using some intermediate lock-down coats of clear. (that also gives you a couple of stages where you can fill low spots that you missed the first time)
At a glance, I'd probably plan to take it on this way:
1) Scan everything. put some tape on the playfield with a few inches marked off clearly and accurately. This way you can check the scale later. Things don't always come up 1 to 1 after scanning.
2) clean playfield gently, level and re-glue or replace inserts.
3) Lockdown layer of clear. Eye dropper the inevitable low spots around the inserts, allow to cure.
4) Gently sand with 400 grit.
5) Frisket mask, re-spray all that pink background.
6) At this point, I'd probably opt for a clear layer. Other folks might keep going, and mask/spray the other colors at this point. If you can, great, it's more efficient.

As to how to mask, you're in luck because mostly you have straight lines to follow. I would spray right over all the numbering/lettering. You can mask crudely around the inserts, as you'll do that keylining in a later step. I'd probably do all the colors, then do the black and white. Having a clear layer will make those adjacent color stripes much easier to execute well. Your idea about overlapping them makes sense, as long as you're sure to lay down enough color on the second pass to cover the overlap fully.

I'd do all that black line/arrows/numbering and lettering with waterslide decals.
For the white letters, a mask cut with a Silhouette or Crickut cutter will probably work really well, though I'm leaning toward trying out dry rub transfers for things like that from now on. (Though I can make masking here at home,whereas dry rubs have to be sent out for.)

Hope that's helpful, of course follow up if you have other questions (or pm if you want). Good luck! You got this!

Using heat with it is fine. Lots of airbrush artists use a heat gun to quickly cure work. Even with no heat it would be dry in a few min with thin coats being used.

A clear coat to lock stuff down is a smart and good procedure but doing it for every application and colour is not required. Too many layers of clear on a colour and then a layer application of an adjacent colour will actually show the paints with vertical separation. It then starts to look like a 3D layered picture.

Also for others to keep in mind is locking in with clear is not the solution fir making the colour stick down. The clear will lift as soon as you mask over it as it’s only relying on the bonded colour below it.

Stay away from frog tape and other utility masking tapes. Only use thin masking like FBS or similar. Help air masking removal by simply just quickly using a hair dryer to just heat the tape as you pull it up. No need to heat soak the tape but simply heat quickly as you pull it.

Constantly wash hands and forearms. Washing hands is pointless if you lay your forearms down on the playfield when working.

Get in the habit of using naphtha to wipe down the work. The paint will not be removed by this procedure unless you pour the naphtha on the playfield and very aggressively rub it. Use the nice soft blue paper towels, for a naphtha rub down. Done right you will see the table go all shiny where you just wiped and will quickly evaporate.

Using naphtha is also a method that’s good to use when checking blending or colour matching. The few seconds the naphtha takes to evaporate simulates a wet look like it’s under the final clear coat.
Colour matching after a lock in clear has been put down and rough sanded is not also going to be easy. The sanded clear causes the colours below to slightly look lighter and softer so if you match that you might be in for a jolt when you spray the clear.

I'll +1 the two above posts and add one thing I experienced. When removing frisket, pull it at a 180 degree angle (back on itself).
DO NOT PULL it at 90 degrees (directly up). Let me repeat that, DO NOT PULL 90 DEGREES, it can and likely will lift. I had this happen over and over back on a previous restore.
I had to make it a mantra, PULL 180, PULL 180...
I hope you can imagine what I mean by 180 degrees. I tried to look for an image I made to illustrate it but can't locate it at present.

Interesting, i'll keep that in mind. i only tried Frisket once and it immediately pulled up paint so i never tried again, wonder if this was in the mix.

Looks like a good project to start with.

Strip the playfield and as mentioned check inserts and fix accordingly. Note the inserts that are low and get ready to eye drop them prior to the clear. Clean up with a 600 ish grit, through naphtha wipe then lock it in with a clear coat.

Sand with 400grit orbit sander under its own weight. The first few passes you will see what’s high and what’s low. Low spots will remain a gloss as the sander is not making contact. High spots will show a glossy rig like pattern and a dull point in the center. Don’t play hero and try to spot sand the high points as it’s easy to go too far too quickly and your right into your base paint damaging it. Make note of the low spots and address them during the next future clear coat.

I personally would mask off and paint the magenta, large white, large black and large orange area for the first pass. Then lock it with clear.

Painting the magenta is not just a easy spray. If you were to just apply colour directly over it the shade will change from the areas with colour below and areas with wood exposed. Using a white base coat just over the wood areas would cause the magenta to appear a different lighter shade. Leaving the wood Exposed could cause the magenta to look a darker shade. This is easy to work around with a simple base coat of tinted white with a drop black. It’s best to test spray an area and then just wipe it off with 99% isopropyl.

Then I would go back and do all black key lines, insert lines, White and black text and then final clear.

Follow VIDs method and you can do it!

Living proof attached.

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That looks great. Good job!!!

I stopped using frisket because it would wrinkle around the edges when airbrushing around it. I’m on another brand now and it does not do it. If the frisket leaves behind any residue a simple wipe with naphtha takes it right off.

All I can tell you is that I have done some projects where I could mask over paints without incident and others where I had trouble with residue. Where I had residue, naptha on a blue shop towel was enough to smear the paint. I've used lockdown clear layers on several restoration projects now and no, it does *not* make the colors look like a 3-D photo, nor does the clear lift with the masking. Every project is different, and depending on how badly damaged a playfield is it can require different approaches. I can generally keep things to 4 coats max. With sanding in between, it's not too heavy - I agree that too many layers seems risky. There are a million variables, and folks who are doing this for the first time should know the potential issues and be ready, and not freak out if they have a problem. Stuff happens.

I'm sure we'd all like to know what you're using instead of frisket film?

I'm with Benjamin. What's the point of mentioning some other product you like using in an educational thread without linking to it? Madness.

Clarification, please -- do you paint black key lines or wet slide decals? Not sure how I do the white text -- if paint, do I create a stencil? (And thanks!)

Paint, very easy to do

Thanks to everyone for the great advice and especially the encouragement. Will take me a few days to get supplies and get going, but I'm sure I'll have more questions as I go ... so, probably not the last you'll hear from me.

Use whatever you like, but personally I like to use some nice Liner brushes. Around 4-5 a pop at Michaels but they are better balanced and higher quality. You can see the 2 on the right here, opposed to a standard "mixed back of small brushes" you're usually choosing from on the left. And the cutting the bristles down etc
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I would hand brush only as a last resort.