(Topic ID: 33446)

Vid's Guide to Ultimate Playfield Restoration


By vid1900

6 years ago



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There are 6801 posts in this topic. You are on page 136 of 137.
#6751 48 days ago

I slept on this and gave it much thought the last couple of days and decided that the mylar was the path I was going to take. Vic's warning that sometimes peeling the factory mylar off will take the paint with it is what really forced my hand. If it took the paint off the playfield is ruined, defeating the whole point of the exercise of trying to save the playfield!

So tonight I carefully waxed the playfield and finished my template which I transferred over to the mylar and carefully applied using a wallpaper roller and then a heat gun to warm everything up. I think it came out rather spectacular with no air pockets or other funny voids. And since the playfield is waxed it should come off fairly easy if need be in the future.

20190902_182922_resized (resized).jpg20190902_184639_resized (resized).jpg
#6752 48 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

I slept on this and gave it much thought the last couple of days and decided that the mylar was the path I was going to take. Vic's warning that sometimes peeling the factory mylar off will take the paint with it is what really forced my hand. If it took the paint off the playfield is ruined, defeating the whole point of the exercise of trying to save the playfield!
So tonight I carefully waxed the playfield and finished my template which I transferred over to the mylar and carefully applied using a wallpaper roller and then a heat gun to warm everything up. I think it came out rather spectacular with no air pockets or other funny voids. And since the playfield is waxed it should come off fairly easy if need be in the future.[quoted image][quoted image]

Looks great, should last for years to come!

#6753 47 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Looks great, should last for years to come!

Thanks! Great to be moving forward again after being stalled out for several days. Though when I fired it back up, a lamp transistor had gone dead and one of the displays is now not displaying a few segments. Changed out the transistor, replaced the left slingshot kicker head, converted another socket over to LED. Tonight I'll finish my touchup work on the upper playfield and cover that in mylar too.

I think the display just has a few bad components, moving the display from one to four the problem went with it so buying a kit and replacing everything on that display board is now added to my to do list.

#6754 47 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Thanks! Great to be moving forward again after being stalled out for several days. Though when I fired it back up, a lamp transistor had gone dead and one of the displays is now not displaying a few segments. Changed out the transistor, replaced the left slingshot kicker head, converted another socket over to LED. Tonight I'll finish my touchup work on the upper playfield and cover that in mylar too.
I think the display just has a few bad components, moving the display from one to four the problem went with it so buying a kit and replacing everything on that display board is now added to my to do list.

PinLED is the way to go.
I have them in my Diner, really nice.

#6755 47 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

PinLED is the way to go.
I have them in my Diner, really nice.

My displays work perfect aside from one or two segments acting flaky on one digit. If one or two were outgassed new would be the way to go. I could just leave it in the #4 position and not worry about it but I'm OCD so it has to work. $11 kit will set everything right.

#6756 46 days ago

Back together and playing wicked fast, love it! She may have a few gremlins here and there but tracking them down one by one..

20190904_093907_resized (resized).jpg
#6757 46 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Back together and playing wicked fast, love it! She may have a few gremlins here and there but tracking them down one by one..[quoted image]

That is the fun part, tackling all the gremlins. Enjoy!

#6758 45 days ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

And since the playfield is waxed it should come off fairly easy if need be in the future

That really looks nice.
It is protected and will stand up to home use forever.
If the time comes to remove the mylar, I have had good results with freezing it though I do not use the dust blower stuff.

1 month later
#6759 10 days ago

I have a question about painting...I'm touching up areas on a MGOW playfield before clearcoating, and I'm having some trouble. I've mixed my colors from either Createx (as recommended here) or Liquitex, so nothing super cheap.

I have areas worn to wood or places I've had to fill gouges, and in testing the paint isn't covering that in one coat. So should I prime those areas beforehand (and if so, any recommendations)? What is an acceptable amount of paint thickness when fixing and touching up playfield art?

#6760 10 days ago
Quoted from vipe155:

I have a question about painting...I'm touching up areas on a MGOW playfield before clearcoating, and I'm having some trouble. I've mixed my colors from either Createx (as recommended here) or Liquitex, so nothing super cheap.
I have areas worn to wood or places I've had to fill gouges, and in testing the paint isn't covering that in one coat. So should I prime those areas beforehand (and if so, any recommendations)? What is an acceptable amount of paint thickness when fixing and touching up playfield art?

Hi,
If you make or have your playfield flat, and if after cleaning you've have sealed it with 2k clear, sanding the clear (220 to 400) to get slight grit is enough... No need for primary... Of course, for clear colours as white, yellow or orange, a prime coat may be useful (but after clearing) for a better covering.

The thinner the paint coat is the better... Spraying is the rule. Better to have several thin coats than one thick one...

#6761 9 days ago
Quoted from vipe155:

I have a question about painting...I'm touching up areas on a MGOW playfield before clearcoating, and I'm having some trouble. I've mixed my colors from either Createx (as recommended here) or Liquitex, so nothing super cheap.
I have areas worn to wood or places I've had to fill gouges, and in testing the paint isn't covering that in one coat. So should I prime those areas beforehand (and if so, any recommendations)? What is an acceptable amount of paint thickness when fixing and touching up playfield art?

What I do know is that wood is pourous so the first coat will soak in and won't give you a accurate visual of the color you mixed. Thats why People say here to seal the bare spots with 2 part clear first. But a dab of clear nail polish or oil based primer should be good enough no? If its a chip and you can see and feel a edge around it, might be better to fill it with bondo or wood filler and sand it smooth after.

#6762 9 days ago

I think also laying down white acts like a primer. I believe it’s back in the 1 million post somewhere lol.

#6763 9 days ago
Quoted from bssbllr:

I think also laying down white acts like a primer.

Createx makes a primer, however I simply mix left overs to make a light grey and use that as a primer.
It sure makes light colors cover up much quicker.

#6764 9 days ago

I would sure like to hear from VID on his thinking of the subject. VID are you out there please come back and guide us once again great leader.

#6766 9 days ago
Quoted from yellowghost:

.... seal the bare spots with 2 part clear first. But a dab of clear nail polish or oil based primer should be good enough no? If its a chip and you can see and feel a edge around it, might be better to fill it with bondo or wood filler and sand it smooth after.

Make sure all the paint, sealers, etc are all compatible with each other. Automotive clear is an acrylic clear coat. I would not recommend using acrylics with oil paints (like Testors) or oil based enamel products. Automotive bondo is compatible with automotive acrylic urethane clear but oil based enamels are not. Spraymax and all 2PACs are all considered acrylic urethane clears and Createx paints are also acrylic based.

#6767 9 days ago
Quoted from Tommy-dog:

Automotive clear is an acrylic clear coat

No.

Automotive paints tend to be urethane with a catylist.

Acrylic paints are brittle and wont last unless covered with mylar or 2PAC.

Dont use acrylic clear.

I see it in spray cans used as jamb clear. Dont use it.

Spraymax 2k is s good aerosol urethane for pinball.

Or use something more elaborate.
It will cover oil based paint.

#6768 9 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

No.
Automotive paints tend to be urethane with a catylist.
Acrylic paints are brittle and wont last unless covered with mylar or 2PAC.
Dont use acrylic clear.
I see it in spray cans used as jamb clear. Dont use it.
Spraymax 2k is s good aerosol urethane for pinball.
Or use something more elaborate.
It will cover oil based paint.

By "acrylics" you are referring to " acrylic enamel" . Acrylics such as stuff used in arts and crafts is more soft and rubbery even when cured . Not a good choice unless its sealed. The door jamb stuff is made by PPG and is pretty durable but I agree thats not best thing to use.

#6769 9 days ago

Just stick with Createx and 2PAC or the Spraymax 2k and you will be fine.
There is a Spraymax topic you can check out also:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-spraymax-2k-auto-clear-in-a-can-club

#6770 9 days ago

Thanks everyone for the responses. I've been reading/following this thread, but nothing seemed to really mention dealing with areas that aren't covering in 1-2 coats with Createx. I suppose I could just seal the whole thing with a coat of clear and then paint, but I'd rather get all the painting done before clearing. I'm not sure which path to take.

#6771 9 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

No. Dont use acrylic clear.

You are wrong about this. Automotive clear is a two component (or three with a reducer), high build, acrylic urethane clear for topcoating automotive base coats.

#6772 9 days ago
Quoted from vipe155:

I suppose I could just seal the whole thing with a coat of clear and then paint,

^ THIS

Quoted from vid1900:

Shoot a thin coat of clear over the playfield to lock down any loose pant and seal the surface.

He is speaking about this procedure for water slide decals but the same holds true for touchups.

#6773 9 days ago
Quoted from vipe155:

Thanks everyone for the responses. I've been reading/following this thread, but nothing seemed to really mention dealing with areas that aren't covering in 1-2 coats with Createx. I suppose I could just seal the whole thing with a coat of clear and then paint, but I'd rather get all the painting done before clearing. I'm not sure which path to take.

Actually, you are supposed to lay down a thin coat of clear to seal the bare wood and stabilize the loose wood fibers,

Before touchups.

#6774 9 days ago
Quoted from Tommy-dog:

You are wrong about this. Automotive clear is a two component (or three with a reducer), high build, acrylic urethane clear for topcoating automotive base coats.

Yes.

Dont use acrylic enamel clear

Use acrylic urethane clear instead.

2 part automotive clear coat.

#6775 9 days ago
Quoted from Atari_Daze:

^ THIS

He is speaking about this procedure for water slide decals but the same holds true for touchups.

Quoted from pinballinreno:

Actually, you are supposed to lay down a thin coat of clear to seal the bare wood and stabilize the loose wood fibers,
Before touchups.

I've thought about it and I suppose this would be the best thing for me anyway. I have to decal a few inserts as well, and this way I can lay down that initial layer of clear I needed to apply the decals and wait to do the touchups then as well.

#6776 9 days ago

if you clear before your touch-ups and a mixed color goes wrong, it is much easier to clean up.

#6777 9 days ago

Also, I know it is forbidden but I use all kinds of paints under the 2PAC.
I use a lot of spray bomb paint.
Sometimes I spray it , sometimes I mix it and brush it (if it is a small touch up)

I use createx and the air brush.
I occasionally use the craft paints.

#6778 9 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

... I know it is forbidden but I use all kinds of paints under the 2PAC.
I use a lot of spray bomb paint.
Sometimes I spray it , sometimes I mix it and brush it (if it is a small touch up)
I use createx and the air brush.
I occasionally use the craft paints.

Most craft paints are acrylic and Createx airbrush paint is acrylic so that is automotive acrylic urethane clear coat safe. Some spray paints are also acrylic based. Sharpie markers, Testors and most oil based products will not work with acrylic clears. That is why if someone signs a playfield with a Sharpie marker and you try to clear coat over it, it (Sharpie ink) will run/bleed.

#6779 8 days ago

I am not sure if Rustoleum or Krylon rattle cans are acrylic but I have used them with 2K Glamour spray bomb clear and have not had any lifting.
I always let the touch ups dry out for a month and I usually use a base coat of clear but not always.
I also mist on the first couple of coats of clear to try to seal the touch-ups before laying on heavier coats.

#6780 8 days ago

Has anyone here done any work on allied leisure cocktail playfields? Touching up my eros one and whatever clear they used is A: Brushed on and B: cant be cleaned with naptha because it gets cloudy. Had to buff it out with Novus 2 to decloud it. Trying to clearcoat it with automotive but afraid its either gonna react funny or not adhere right. I also don't know if I can even sand it with 600 grit ahead of time because of the brush strokes from the factory clear

#6781 8 days ago
Quoted from vipe155:

I've thought about it and I suppose this would be the best thing for me anyway. I have to decal a few inserts as well, and this way I can lay down that initial layer of clear I needed to apply the decals and wait to do the touchups then as well.

This is the safest way to proceed . Lightly sanding the playfield and using naphtha to remove any trace of oils will make sure that the subsequent initial clear coat adheres well.

Places that are bare wood and deep gouges can be filed with clear. If you fill them with bondo you will need to clear over that area before painting.

Other than that , if you are using light colors , is better to use white as the base before applying them so as to easily achieve good and uniform coverage with correct colors.

Airbrush is preferable , especially for large single color areas , but you can also use hand brushes with great results. Whatever you use , multiple thin coats is the way to go.

#6782 5 days ago

Hi there, I'm new to pinball, just bought a Twilight zone.
It has some cracks next to the insert as you can see in the picture, and I don't know what would be the best way to fix it, as there is a colour gradient there. Luckily, apart from that, it is in really good shape having no worn parts next to the ball entrys. I know the crack is in a place next to the back of the playfield and is hidden by the clock, so you wouldn't see it during regular gameplay, and it's a really small thing, but I would prefer to fix it. As I know it's there, I notice it is there easily.
Thank you!

IMG_20191015_190434 (resized).jpg
#6783 5 days ago
Quoted from Islote:

Hi there, I'm new to pinball, just bought a Twilight zone.
It has some cracks next to the insert as you can see in the picture, and I don't know what would be the best way to fix it, as there is a colour gradient there. Luckily, apart from that, it is in really good shape having no worn parts next to the ball entrys. I know the crack is in a place next to the back of the playfield and is hidden by the clock, so you wouldn't see it during regular gameplay, and it's a really small thing, but I would prefer to fix it. As I know it's there, I notice it is there easily.
Thank you![quoted image]

I have several inserts like that on a World Cup Soccer that I recently obtained. I was just considering a piece of mylar to go over it, but I'd love to have a proper fix.

#6784 5 days ago
Quoted from ktownhero:

I was just considering a piece of mylar to go over it, but I'd love to have a proper fix.

Quoted from Islote:

it's a really small thing, but I would prefer to fix it. As I know it's there, I notice it is there easily.
Thank you![quoted image]

My strong advice is to not get too hung up on this. Playfield restoration is a BIG DEAL and it's easy to get way in over your head, particularly if you're new to the hobby. There are literally no quick and easy fixes. Unless you simply MUST have a perfect game (and are willing to shell out the money for parts, tools, professional work - and have your game out of commission for quite awhile) wax and play your game, enjoy it!

#6785 5 days ago
Quoted from Islote:

Hi there, I'm new to pinball, just bought a Twilight zone.
It has some cracks next to the insert as you can see in the picture, and I don't know what would be the best way to fix it, as there is a colour gradient there. Luckily, apart from that, it is in really good shape having no worn parts next to the ball entrys. I know the crack is in a place next to the back of the playfield and is hidden by the clock, so you wouldn't see it during regular gameplay, and it's a really small thing, but I would prefer to fix it. As I know it's there, I notice it is there easily.
Thank you![quoted image]

Ignore it.
Buy a new playfield. Both the mini and tha main.

Put it aside for a future restoration

Play the hell out of the game.

Restore it later on when you tire of the game.

Have fun.

#6786 4 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Restore it later on when you tire of the game

If I put a game in the game room before it is restored, it never gets restored.
Once I get to play them for a couple of years I grow tired of them and have no interest in restoring.
They have to be fairly new to me otherwise I wont do it.

#6787 4 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

If I put a game in the game room before it is restored, it never gets restored.

Pretty standard...which is why half the time when you buy an older game you get all the "extras." New plastics I never installed, new sound board, decals etc

#6788 4 days ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

If I put a game in the game room before it is restored, it never gets restored.

I like restoring them first. The "I can't wait to play it when it's done!" thing is a great motivator to complete the restoration. Then after a while if you don't particularly care for the game you've got a fully restored game to sell that's had all of the tweaks done to it to make it 100%.

-Paul

#6789 4 days ago

Any advice on a specific airbrush kit?

I read about using the createx paints.

But if I have zero airbrushing equipment I’m wondering if starting with a kit like one of these would be okay:
amazon.com link »

amazon.com link »

My intention is to first just play around with it on a variety of things to learn. Then to touch up arcade cabinets. At some point maybe pins if I feel confident enough with it.

So I kinda want a brush I can learn but also grow with.

#6790 4 days ago

I just started trying the airbrush thing as well. I took some earlier advice in this thread and went with the harbor frieght airbrush. Worked great for what I needed to do. Pretty easy to learn for a first time. Cheap too. About $40 for the airbrush kit, hose, and a couple in line filters.

#6791 4 days ago
Quoted from dashv:

Any advice on a specific airbrush kit?
I read about using the createx paints.
But if I have zero airbrushing equipment I’m wondering if starting with a kit like one of these would be okay:
amazon.com link »
amazon.com link »
My intention is to first just play around with it on a variety of things to learn. Then to touch up arcade cabinets. At some point maybe pins if I feel confident enough with it.
So I kinda want a brush I can learn but also grow with.

Get the harbor freight one.
It works great and us only $15_$20.

#6792 4 days ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Ignore it.
Buy a new playfield. Both the mini and tha main.
Put it aside for a future restoration
Play the hell out of the game.
Restore it later on when you tire of the game.
Have fun.

But I don't know if it is really worth buying a new playfield. The mini playfield is perfect and the main only has that tiny crack. Both have some ball marks, but nothing novus can't fix. I don't think it's worth paying 900€ to fix that small crack.

#6793 3 days ago
Quoted from Islote:

But I don't know if it is really worth buying a new playfield. The mini playfield is perfect and the main only has that tiny crack. Both have some ball marks, but nothing novus can't fix. I don't think it's worth paying 900€ to fix that small crack.

It's worth a complete ground up restoration.

There is nothing like TZ.

I'll be doing that on my next one.

#6794 3 days ago
Quoted from Islote:

I don't think it's worth paying 900€ to fix that small crack.

trust yourself.

#6795 3 days ago
Quoted from Islote:

Hi there, I'm new to pinball, just bought a Twilight zone.
It has some cracks next to the insert as you can see in the picture, and I don't know what would be the best way to fix it, as there is a colour gradient there. Luckily, apart from that, it is in really good shape having no worn parts next to the ball entrys. I know the crack is in a place next to the back of the playfield and is hidden by the clock, so you wouldn't see it during regular gameplay, and it's a really small thing, but I would prefer to fix it. As I know it's there, I notice it is there easily.
Thank you![quoted image]

Cut and put a small piece of mylar over it and forget it. It will stay like this for the rest of its life.
If you want to properly restore it , then you are looking for a complete playfield tear down , plus skill and time.

#6796 3 days ago

Hi, just started my sanctum repair on the shadow. A previous owner has cut a hole right thru the playfield and filled it with wood filler. I want to fill this with Bondo but wondering what I could use as a backing under the playfield between the magnet and the fillers.

6F940437-8B63-433F-A7DB-7D2A538A2461 (resized).jpeg
#6797 3 days ago

I would either use Fiberglass as the backing or glue/screw in a thin round piece of wood. Then use Bondo as you suggest. At least, that's would I would do. I might even make a wooden plug to fit the hole and fill accordingly. I've used the fiberglass/bondo method alot in the past for car rust. The experts will chime in with a better solution I'm sure.

#6798 2 days ago
Quoted from Catch86:

I would either use Fiberglass as the backing or glue/screw in a thin round piece of wood. Then use Bondo as you suggest. At least, that's would I would do. I might even make a wooden plug to fit the hole and fill accordingly. I've used the fiberglass/bondo method alot in the past for car rust. The experts will chime in with a better solution I'm sure.

You are right about this.

Clean up the hole.
Epoxy a wooden plug.
Thinset it with bondo or half-time for cosmetics.

There isnt any easier durable option.

#6799 7 hours ago

Not necessarily a play field question, but has anyone ever sprayed or Varathane their back glass to keep it from deteriorating? I've used the thick epoxy pour from Marcos and it just made a mess. It might have been to cold out. I was looking for a simpler solution.

#6800 6 hours ago
Quoted from trk12fire:

Not necessarily a play field question, but has anyone ever sprayed or Varathane their back glass to keep it from deteriorating? I've used the thick epoxy pour from Marcos and it just made a mess. It might have been to cold out. I was looking for a simpler solution.

Krylon triple thick clear works great for this, and won't yellow over time.

amazon.com link »

-Paul

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