Vid's Guide to Ultimate Playfield Restoration

(Topic ID: 33446)

Vid's Guide to Ultimate Playfield Restoration


By vid1900

6 years ago



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142 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 20 (Show topic index)

There are 6395 posts in this topic. You are on page 128 of 128.
#6351 15 days ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

I believe it's just the brand VM&P. Same stuff. Awesome stuff.

OK, good. I thought the regular naphtha was a little different. I do not want to do any damage.

#6352 15 days ago
Quoted from scampcamp:

Naphtha vs vm&p naphtha ... Is there a difference? Because I cannot find just plain naphtha.

VM and P Naphtha just means "Varnish Maker & Painter's Naphtha"

That's the good stuff

#6353 10 days ago

I'd like to share a new trick that I discovered this weekend. I have a Stars playfield that I'm working on for a friend who wanted a simple touch up and clear-coat. The problem is that after cleaning the playfield with alcohol and ME, I was left with a lot of white semi-circles in certain areas. The ball swirls were obviously through the paint layer and the alcohol cleaned out the dirt and paint all the way to the white layer under the art. This is right after cleaning and a light sanding, so no clear coat yet.
20190209_165828 (resized).jpg

The thought of frisketing off the area, airbrushing black, and then repainting the white stars was giving me a headache. I did a test area anyway hoping that I could still see the stars through a light layer of black and then hand paint them with new white. No dice, so I grabbed some alcohol and ME and cleaned of the test airbrushed black area. After the light cleaning, I noticed that the ball swirls had been filled in and it looked pretty good. This gave me an idea. I grabbed a rag and dipped it in a tiny bit of opaque black and just rubbed a small area like you would when polishing your dress shoes.
20190209_170031 (resized).jpg20190209_170040 (resized).jpg

Sure enough, the ball swirls filled in. I did my best to stay away from the blue areas, but some still got slightly covered. I cleaned the whole area with alcohol and ME and I'm really impressed with the results. This should be a huge time saver.
20190209_170414 (resized).jpg

The white ball swirls are throughout the various colors, so my plan is to try this all over the playfield. With luck, I'll only need to frisket and airbrush the really bad areas. The rubbed areas should blend in nicely after clearcoating.

#6354 10 days ago

looks good. clay utilizes the same technique in one of his guides for the same reason-to avoid masking and airbrushing.

#6355 10 days ago
Quoted from beadwindow:

looks good. clay utilizes the same technique in one of his guides for the same reason-to avoid masking and airbrushing.

Just like Columbus, it turns out I wasn't the first one there.

I'm not familiar with Clay. Can you point me in the direction of the right thread?

#6356 10 days ago

http://www.pinrepair.com/restore/index2.htm#pf1
Tons more info and playfield touchups throughout the site. In short, whether it’s ball swirls or those minute little flecks of paint that are missing, you can apply paint and then rub the excess off. The remainder stays behind and fills in the imperfections.

#6357 10 days ago

You polish shoes?

#6358 9 days ago
Quoted from DropTarget:

You polish shoes?

Shoes are over-rated...

hobbit-feet1 (resized).jpg
#6359 9 days ago

I've always wanted Hobbit feet!

#6360 8 days ago

I just picked up a project Stargate and I'm not sure what to do about it. The playfield is a mess of what appears to be cracked clearcoat/lacquer. I've been searching Pinside threads but haven't seen anything quite this bad before. Does anyone think I will be able to aggressively sand enough to remove the cracks without also taking the paint off? Or should I try alcohol and ME?

Any thoughts are appreciated.

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#6361 8 days ago

Ok Vid, give me a solution. After applying mylar, for some reason 3 areas decided they were going to "cinch up" and not adhere, causing a bubble-like tube to form. At first I scored the mylar, then cut away some of the lifted area, but the bubbling would migrate more so I stopped. What type of adhesive should I use to shoot into those areas to make the gd thing stick?? If I run my finger over the bubbled area it sticks nice n flat, but only for about 30 seconds, so some type of adhesive should work, I have water-thin crazy glue but that may be too watery for this?? Thanks.

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#6362 8 days ago

Following up my earlier post:

The cracks can be sanded out...but it's very easy to go too fast with a power sander.

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#6363 7 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

Following up my earlier post:
The cracks can be sanded out...but it's very easy to go too fast with a power sander.

Looks like a half-assed touch-up and clearcoat job gone wrong.

#6364 7 days ago

I've got a question regarding waterslide decals and when to apply them. My playfield is pretty bad, the color is flacking in some areas and many parts are beyond a simple repaint.
My plan is as follows:
1.Get the dirt off using ME and isoprop and take off the mylar and the glue. Since it's an old playfield I assume using a heat gun should do the trick.
2. Give the playfield one or two light coats of clear.
3. Apply the decals (a lot of them) to all areas and repaint the others with acrylics.
4. Give the playfield a light and a heavy coat of clear.

Now I'm totally unsure how long I have to wait to apply the decals to the first clearcoat? The clear I'm using is dry after 12h (according to the manual), is this enough or should I wait longer? Next question would be the time the decals have to "sit" on the playfield before they are ready to be coated?

playfield (resized).jpg
#6365 7 days ago

Wow, that is a serious undertaking! Just FYI there is a hard top for that one. Not trying to sway you at all. Just a suggestion.
Start from post#290 in this thread. Should help with your question.

#6366 7 days ago
Quoted from Frogger1108:

I've got a question regarding waterslide decals and when to apply them. My playfield is pretty bad, the color is flacking in some areas and many parts are beyond a simple repaint.
My plan is as follows:
1.Get the dirt off using ME and isoprop and take off the mylar and the glue. Since it's an old playfield I assume using a heat gun should do the trick.
2. Give the playfield one or two light coats of clear.
3. Apply the decals (a lot of them) to all areas and repaint the others with acrylics.
4. Give the playfield a light and a heavy coat of clear.
Now I'm totally unsure how long I have to wait to apply the decals to the first clearcoat? The clear I'm using is dry after 12h (according to the manual), is this enough or should I wait longer? Next question would be the time the decals have to "sit" on the playfield before they are ready to be coated?[quoted image]

One of the techniques is the smell test.

Outgassing of clearcoat can make the decals lift or blush.

However if the decals melt into the clear this wont happen.

If the paint smell is drastically reduced you are good to go.

Proper temperatures, reducers and catalyst are in play here.

#6367 7 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

The playfield is a mess of what appears to be cracked clearcoat/lacquer.

It has frozen in a garage.

#6368 7 days ago
Quoted from Pinball_Nate:

After applying mylar, for some reason 3 areas decided they were going to "cinch up" and not adhere, causing a bubble-like tube to form. At first I scored the mylar, then cut away some of the lifted area, but the bubbling would migrate more so I stopped.

If the Mylar is not sticking, it's probably an old batch - or there is silicone on the playfield; because even if you wax it first, Mylar sticks like a SOB.

I'd get some fresh stuff from a dealer that sells a ton of it (like marco maybe?).

#6369 7 days ago
Quoted from Frogger1108:

Now I'm totally unsure how long I have to wait to apply the decals to the first clearcoat? The clear I'm using is dry after 12h (according to the manual), is this enough or should I wait longer? Next question would be the time the decals have to "sit" on the playfield before they are ready to be coated?

When your clear stops stinking, it's cured (put your nose on it).

I've cleared over waterslides the same day, when it's 80*f in the shop

#6370 7 days ago
Quoted from vid1900:

It has frozen in a garage.

I'm guessing the cracks go all the way through the clear and paint and into the wood then. Will it be ok to clear over this and just play it as it is?

#6371 7 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

I'm guessing the cracks go all the way through the clear and paint and into the wood then. Will it be ok to clear over this and just play it as it is?

Hard to say without more pictures.

Does it look like someone put aftermarket clear on it?

Is the cracked material firmly attached to the wood?

At a low angle, does it look wavy?

#6372 7 days ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Hard to say without more pictures.
Does it look like someone put aftermarket clear on it?
Is the cracked material firmly attached to the wood?
At a low angle, does it look wavy?

I don't think there is aftermarket clear on it. Most of the cracked material seems attached. It is flaking a bit near post holes. In some areas I can feel the crack running a finger over it...in other areas I cannot.

It does not look wavy at a low angle.

Some more pics (including sanding under the apron). As you can see the whole playfield is a mess.

My plan is to clear and decal the big areas and live with the cracking if that seems feasible. I would be willing to try sanding it down to the original paint if that might get rid of the cracking effect...but it doesn't look like it will? Let me know if more pictures are needed.

I guess I can also repaint the entirety of the black and purple sections. I do have a high res scan of the playfield. That just sounds like a major undertaking.

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#6373 7 days ago

I have a Waterworld playfield that has some of the exact same cracked clear in the wood areas. Same year and same manufacturer. 1995 Gottlieb.

#6374 6 days ago

Has anyone done scans of the rubber guides under the plastics on Williams system 11. I am redoing a high speed playfield . Under the plastics on the white sections there are little rubber ring size and orientation guides.
Does my question make sense?
I want to make some water slide decals after I repaint the white.

#6375 6 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

I would be willing to try sanding it down to the original paint if that might get rid of the cracking effect...but it doesn't look like it will?

Probably impossible.

You are going to have to degloss the whole playfield with 400 grit, then press paint into the solid color cracks.

Then put a thin layer of clear down to lock it all in.

A lot of work for sure.

#6376 6 days ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Probably impossible.
You are going to have to degloss the whole playfield with 400 grit, then press paint into the solid color cracks.
Then put a thin layer of clear down to lock it all in.
A lot of work for sure.

You rock vid! Progress is slow and tedious, but noticeable.

For anyone curious about the method, I am using Createx with a brush and letting it sit for ~30 seconds, then dabbing it with a microfiber cloth. Most areas I have done 2-3 passes.

#6377 2 days ago

Starting a new learning experience following this guide. I have a beat up Bally Star Trek that I got pretty cheap to do this with. So I can damaged with out to much loss. And if it looks good I will hang it on the wall.
Going to start by re reading this thread!!!!!
Then ask a ton of question's!
And then some more question's!
Last night I removed rails, and fish shank screws. Need to remove roll overs and inserts next.
Ordered frisket,exacto, and createx paint.
I will sand shooter lane and any bare wood.
First question, should I sand any of the pf?
It was sanded at some point in its life and looks to have some rubbing done to it.
What do you think I should do?

#6378 2 days ago

Sorry, pic did not show.

#6379 2 days ago

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#6380 2 days ago
Quoted from heni1977:

First question, should I sand any of the pf?

You've got to sand it. Any gloss won't stick to the lockdown clearcoat.

#6381 2 days ago

What is the issue with these inserts, and can it be repaired?

SAM_0413 (resized).JPGSAM_0414 (resized).JPGSAM_0415 (resized).JPG
#6382 2 days ago
Quoted from mjenison:

What is the issue with these inserts, and can it be repaired?

Looks like ghosting.

Light them up with a flashlight and make sure they are not cracked, then:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration/page/2#post-551833

#6383 1 day ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Looks like ghosting.
Light them up with a flashlight and make sure they are not cracked, then:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration/page/2#post-551833

Well, looks to me like all three are cracked.

So my options are:
1) Have them replaced by a professional, but they end up looking different than the others because no one can replicate the "fog" of the original clear coat.
2) Buy a new playfield from Mirco; his clear coat won't have the fog effect either, but at least they'll all look consistent, though not original.
3) Leave the inserts as-is and repair per your guide (is this an option if the inserts are cracked?)
4) ????

What are peoples' thoughts as the best option?

#6384 1 day ago
Quoted from mjenison:

no one can replicate the "fog" of the original clear coat.

Just use rice paper from the art supplies store.

Quoted from mjenison:

is this an option if the inserts are cracked?

You can rough them up from behind and drip in 2mm of 2pac

#6385 14 hours ago
Quoted from mjenison:

Well, looks to me like all three are cracked.
So my options are:
1) Have them replaced by a professional, but they end up looking different than the others because no one can replicate the "fog" of the original clear coat.
2) Buy a new playfield from Mirco; his clear coat won't have the fog effect either, but at least they'll all look consistent, though not original.
3) Leave the inserts as-is and repair per your guide (is this an option if the inserts are cracked?)
4) ????
What are peoples' thoughts as the best option?

Play it and enjoy it!

#6386 14 hours ago

Vid,

If you don't mind, could you clarify one thing in regards to laying down a thin clear before doing touch ups... When you say to do that, are you referring to going through the whole process of prep to lay down a quick 2PAC, or is there some sort of simpler clear coat that you use at that stage?

The way I'm interpretting dealing with the art is the following:

1) Clean
2) "Thin" clear with ???
3) Airbrush/waterslide touchup
4) Final clear with 2PAC

Thanks for sharing all of your experience, it's truly a blessing to have these guides.

#6387 14 hours ago
Quoted from ktownhero:

Vid,
If you don't mind, could you clarify one thing in regards to laying down a thin clear before doing touch ups... When you say to do that, are you referring to going through the whole process of prep to lay down a quick 2PAC, or is there some sort of simpler clear coat that you use at that stage?
The way I'm interpretting dealing with the art is the following:
1) Clean
2) "Thin" clear with ???
3) Airbrush/waterslide touchup
4) Final clear with 2PAC
Thanks for sharing all of your experience, it's truly a blessing to have these guides.

#6388 14 hours ago
Quoted from ktownhero:

Vid,
If you don't mind, could you clarify one thing in regards to laying down a thin clear before doing touch ups... When you say to do that, are you referring to going through the whole process of prep to lay down a quick 2PAC, or is there some sort of simpler clear coat that you use at that stage?
Thanks for sharing all of your experience, it's truly a blessing to have these guides.

Just do the usual.

Do the shooter lane and any other bare wood

Remove Mylar and left over glue

Touch up chipped or worn keylines around inserts.

Lightly sand with 500grit

Wipe with Naphtha

Spray with light coat of 2pac

#6389 14 hours ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Just do the usual.
Do the shooter lane and any other bare wood
Remove Mylar and left over glue
Touch up chipped or worn keylines around inserts.
Lightly sand with 500grit
Wipe with Naphtha
Spray with light coat of 2pac

OK, thanks for clarifying -- that all makes sense.

I'm working on a JOKERZ! that has a good condition playfield but the art under the mylar is now a different shade than the non-mylar'd areas; particularly the background blue. Do you have any suggestions for restoring the color of the non-mylar'd areas or should I just expect to have to repaint those areas?

#6390 14 hours ago
Quoted from ktownhero:

OK, thanks for clarifying -- that all makes sense.
I'm working on a JOKERZ! that has a good condition playfield but the art under the mylar is now a different shade than the non-mylar'd areas. Of particular notice is the blue background. Do you have any suggestions for restoring the color of the non-mylar'd areas or should I just expect to have to repaint those areas?

#6391 12 hours ago
Quoted from ktownhero:

OK, thanks for clarifying -- that all makes sense.
I'm working on a JOKERZ! that has a good condition playfield but the art under the mylar is now a different shade than the non-mylar'd areas; particularly the background blue. Do you have any suggestions for restoring the color of the non-mylar'd areas or should I just expect to have to repaint those areas?

You will probably have to repaint it all one color.

The mylar protected the paint from UV fade.

#6392 11 hours ago

Knocked out inserts they are special colors for some reason and some were raised.
Few issues
Lost some wood, what filler should I use?
Lost 1 insert, how to fix this
And how should I clean these inserts?
As always help is appreciated!!!

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#6393 9 hours ago
Quoted from heni1977:

Lost some wood, what filler should I use?

You can just fill it with 2PAC .

Quoted from heni1977:

Lost 1 insert, how to fix this

Look around on the floor. It's got to be somewhere in the shop.

Quoted from heni1977:

And how should I clean these inserts?

A Qtip dipped in Naphtha is a safe cleaner.

Generally, you never want to remove an insert unless it's damaged. They are fragile and many styles/colors have not been made in 40 years.

#6394 8 hours ago

No not lost, should of said broke
Wow glad I only broke one then.
Will clean those up and get them re installed. Shooter lane still needs some work.
I don’t know what happened to this pf but it has taken a beating. Glad this is a learning pf!!!!!!!!

#6395 8 hours ago
Quoted from heni1977:

No not lost, should of said broke
Wow glad I only broke one then.

Always warm them up with a hair dryer, and they just push right out with a ratchet socket.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-hardtop-restoration-comet#post-4468739

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