Twilight Zone
Bally, 1993Hello, I'm having two problems with my TZ.
1) This just started, my TZ seems to restart some of the times when I press both flippers at the same time.
2) This has been happening for a few months, my sound occasionally goes out for about 2-5 seconds, then comes back. I've tried wiggling all of the wires from the board to the speakers and can't cause it to happen, though there's two wire connections I could redo to see if that fixes it.
Any help would be much appreciated!
Simple answer. Re-cap your power supply.
The machine is 20 years old, the electrolytic caps in the supply are dry and about to give up the ghost. 90% of the time troubleshooting older machines that ends up being the cause after months of troubleshooting and pain... Short circuit the pain, recap the supply and then worry about any problem if your in the 10%. 
Most likely your +5vdc is dipping below the threshold where the watchdog circuit on the MPU is set to cause the MPU to do a reboot so that it will not hurt itself.
http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/Category-45.asp
Ed is closed until May 1st, so you can wait or just order the piece parts elsewhere.
Your probably looking at the
http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=W12246-PEC-KIT
I 'think' that is most of the caps on a DCS platform.
Yes, rebuild the 5V section. While you have the board out, replace the capacitor, the bridge rectifier (replace with 35A version), and the 5V regulator. Don't scrimp, replace all while you have the board out of the game.
Jim Knight
256 677 5300
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Game_resets
Go through the Pinwiki resets first.
Long shot would be replace bridge rectifier 2, but just don't start shot gunning parts and risking major board damage.
LTG : )
Quoted from LTG:http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Game_resets
Go through the Pinwiki resets first.
Long shot would be replace bridge rectifier 2, but just don't start shot gunning parts and risking major board damage.
LTG : )
Leave it to LTG to give good advice! I had a loose ground screw in one of the boards that meant ground was ~10-20mV off between boards, and meant the rom/cpu was @ 4.76V when the test point was @ 4.96V. Tightened the screw and no resets after 2 games, where previously it would reset every time I hit both flippers simultaneously. Thanks for the link LTG!
The only problem is clearly the screw socket is bad...I can keep screwing forever, but I stopped at the tightest part, and it's ok for now. May have to fix that, or the next time it gets transported it might come loose...
Quoted from hoby1:I dont know about that.
I'm the guy that added that step to the Wiki...trust me, it matters. Why wouldn't good ground be important?
Quoted from johnnyfive:The only problem is clearly the screw socket is bad.
You would think, but take one of the screws completely out. Look at the threads near the head. Stripped, aren't they? The female side fails much less frequently than the male side... 
Find some appropriate length 10-32 (IIRC) Phillips head screws and replace the damaged ones.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info
Quoted from bballfan:More than likely changing the BR2 and C5 will fix it.Also jumper them together to ensure the connection.
How long will this old mantra live?
I know you are trying to help, and good on you for that, but that conclusion isn't supported by the facts or by the now known experiences. Leave the soldering iron in the box until you've exhausted a LOT of other possibilities, as outlined in the Wiki.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info
Quoted from bballfan:In my experience this solved it every time on around 10 games.Only one time on a CFTBL it restarted because of a connection problem.
Were you able to change the cap and bridge without reseating the connectors?
The problem with the BR2/C5 logic is that it fails to take into consideration ALL of the other differences that simply removing and reinstalling the board creates as a matter of course. At the very least, removing and reinstalling the board reseats the connectors (temporarily improving the connection at J101, another significant cause of resets, and also at J114), and may improve the power/driver board ground to the game backplane by tightening all of the mounting screws.
It's not a controlled experiment and therefore, the conclusion has not been proven.
I've seen far too many boards hacked by inexperienced pinball enthusiasts who were given this advice. Removing the filter caps, as you know, is not easy to do without damaging the through-holes.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info
I hope I'm not "derailing" this thread or if etiquette requires I start a new one. My TZ resets when pushing flippers at the same time only in the first couple of games. Once "heated" up, it seems to work fine. However, the clock seems "slower". Any ideas or is my problem exactly the same as johnnyfive's? Sorry if I broke any rules or should have started my own thread.
Quoted from jcpinny:I hope I'm not "derailing" this thread or if etiquette requires I start a new one. My TZ resets when pushing flippers at the same time only in the first couple of games. Once "heated" up, it seems to work fine. However, the clock seems "slower". Any ideas or is my problem exactly the same as johnnyfive's? Sorry if I broke any rules or should have started my own thread.
Step 8...but definitely warranted to jump there in your case.
Check it out...
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Failed_Thermistor
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info
Quoted from hoby1:Another big one is to check the Z connector . Common problem on Tz causing resets.
Excellent...Step 6...
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Poor_Connections_between_the_Power.2FDriver_board.2C_the_CPU.2C_and_other_PCBs
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info
Quoted from beefzap:For me it was the circuit that the machine was on. Originally the same circuit as a major appliance and the TZ would reset. Plugged it into another outlet and it never reset again.
Yes...Step 1...
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Williams_WPC#Low_Line_Voltage
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info
Yup that did the trick on my roadshow it resetting on multiball 2 caps and 2 brs later running like a champ.
Quoted from jcpinny:Thank you ChrisHibler. I appreciate the input so much.
My pleasure. Let us know how it works out.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info
Wow, thank you Chris Hibler. My Twilight Zone just started having this problem, I Google it, it sends me to this page, I scroll down, read Chris's post, go back to the machine and reseat J101 and J114, and voila! Problem gone. Was getting into a tizz that it might be something serious and complicated but the first thing I try works. Brilliant!
Quoted from ChrisHibler:Were you able to change the cap and bridge without reseating the connectors?
The problem with the BR2/C5 logic is that it fails to take into consideration ALL of the other differences that simply removing and reinstalling the board creates as a matter of course. At the very least, removing and reinstalling the board reseats the connectors (temporarily improving the connection at J101, another significant cause of resets, and also at J114), and may improve the power/driver board ground to the game backplane by tightening all of the mounting screws.
It's not a controlled experiment and therefore, the conclusion has not been proven.
I've seen far too many boards hacked by inexperienced pinball enthusiasts who were given this advice. Removing the filter caps, as you know, is not easy to do without damaging the through-holes.
Generally, it is very unsound advice to replace components without knowing that they are bad. Replacing a good component can and often does lead to more problems.
My TZ resets were eliminated by reseating the in-line Z connector.
Definitely follow the wiki steps to avoid unnecessary work and possible damage.
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Tilton, NH
Melbourne