Is this a deeproot thread? I feel like I'm in the wrong place.
(Topic ID: 203700)
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4 months later
I haven't been able to follow this thread but I just listened to the interview and I don't see any point in "waiting for deeproot" anymore. I went from having no expectations to expecting the worst.
Edit: I think kaneda failed pretty hard in pressing him when he dodged questions. He clearly wanted to stay friendly with the guy.
8 months later
1 month later
Quoted from DaveH:Unfortunately my expectation is so low that I assume 9.21.20 will be the date they will start teasing the next set of teasers leading towards the date of the teasers after that, followed by an unfortunate email stating that they are reorganizing to change their structure for the teasers that will follow that right around the corner.
This post needs to be moderated because of spoilers.
1 week later
Quoted from JodyG:Robert says the launch is delayed, according to Kaneda.
This is really embarrassing for them.
So clearly deeproot became the laughing stock of the pinball world today. Even Dutch pinball probably has a more favorable impression in people's minds. So what are they going to do for damage control? Clearly they aren't close to shipping or revealing anything. Are we going to see another podcast interview that tries to retcon past statements and reframe the narrative? This is really fascinating.
When my kids are in trouble, I usually tell them they are in deep doo doo, but now I tell them they are in deep root.
Quoted from drfrightner:Kaneda has lost his spine... people keep saying Robert whatever his name is an attorney who freaking cares. He needs to consider returning to that profession because clearly he has no talent for pinball. Kaneda is either afraid Robert will stop talking to him (A) or (B) for some strange reason he actually thinks Robert will sue him but for what? Kaneda or myself for that matter can share any information we learn and state here is the rumor we heard.
So all of a sudden Kaneda has become a spineless wimp c'mon.
This Robert guy isn't sueing anyone on what grounds. Kaneda SPOILED 110% Sterns Stranger Things launch did he get sued nope!
Lastly and probably unfairly the media has been granted all kinds of leeway by congress, Kaneda can speculate or share information he learns all he wants. Hence when you see SPY photos of the new Camaro or Challenger its done up in this camo wrap because they know they can't hide anything. SHARE AWAY they can't stop you!
Find your courage Kaneda!
I figured kaneda was keeping quiet in hopes of getting another exclusive interview.
Quoted from zaphX:Can we please leave partisan political bullshit off of Pinside?
We're here to argue about pinball.
It's sad that acknowledging how dishonest CNN is is considered partisan.
Quoted from TreyBo69:but is this a cabinet just for this one game, or is it going to be the uniform look for all their games?
It'd be interesting, but a huge waste of money, if they made unique cabinet designs for all their LE's. Why not throw another pile of money on the fire.
I don't know if I like the look or not. It's canceling the release at the last second because of apparent serious problems that would make me weary of buying. If it was a great game that was built well, I don't think the look would bother me much. It might be nice to have something different.
Some cool stuff revealed. Real bummer they pulled the trigger too early. Some of those games sound ridiculous though.
Quoted from flerp:Features of PINBAR:
News, Ads, Custom Content
Because of course, ADS
People buy pinball machines because they want a mechanical game, not an iPad with extra features.
Some of these cheesy games like food truck must be aimed at redemption locations. You can see a ticket counter on the pinbar in one of the pictures, so their strategy must involve redemption gaming in some major way.
2 months later
Quoted from dc2010:I've not been around much recently due to health reasons , and while I would love to be able to read through the 100+ pages since March, I read the past few
So, the promise to bring an innovative product to market cheaper than stern without taking pre-order money was......bs
I live 35mins from the factory, wasn't allowed to the factory tour/press release, and after being approached about employment never offered anything
Today I went to the site, and to see stern pro pricing for the "arcade " model, and stern LE pricing on the upscale
My support is there in the sense I hope they make it, however I'm OUT on Deeproot as my first NIB,
Some may downvote me for saying this, but I'm really disappointed they became the SELLOUTS they hate
I forgot about deeproot for a while, then I read some of these updates and it just feels like they want to nickel and dime you for everything. I don't know if the game is any good, but it certainly feels like the company burned out all its goodwill before launch.
Did I hear this right in the interview? They wasted 3 months removing the pinbar from the game so they could show the game without it at a show? That sounds like the worst management decision in history.
3 months later
Deeproot should box up their prototype and ship it to themselves so they can finally say they shipped a game.
Quoted from JodyG:I said overact, not overreact...he goes way over the top on his mannerisms like he is some kind of acclaimed self-important movie/food/wine critic. I just can't watch it. Maybe I am just getting old, or maybe I have had my fill of edge-lords these days.
I'd never seen him before but I was expecting some expert explanation and insight into what's going on. Instead he just read the statement and acted like everyone's an idiot by explaining the obvious, and not even very well. Of course he starts the video by asking for subs. This is just filler trying to amp up YouTube stats.
Deeproot should just scrape together whatever money they have to hire a lobbyist to bribe someone in congress to sneak a bailout into the next multitrillion dollar spending bill that they will pass without reading.
Quoted from Zablon:Well if these guys are anything like many here claim they are...I would assume they got millions in PPP(?) already....gee wonder where that money went.
I'm sure they did. The company that I work for got PPP. The CEO/owner of the company literally complained about not getting any help from the government at a company meeting, and then the PPP data dump showed they had gotten millions before the meeting. So much dishonesty attached to PPP.
But yeah... Deeproot got PPP:
Recipient
DEEPROOT TECH, LLC
Location
San Antonio, TX
Business Type
Limited Liability Company(LLC)
Loan Amount
$625,652
Date Approved
May 8, 2020
Recipient
DEEPROOT STUDIOS, LLC
Location
San Antonio, TX
Business Type
Limited Liability Company(LLC)
Loan Amount
$535,272
Date Approved
May 13, 2020
Here's some more going out of business speculation. Why did deeproot get PPP last year but not the second round of PPP more recently?
Perhaps they didn't qualify because they were laying people off.
1 week later
Quoted from Mr68:I'm just an end user that likes bright and colorful leads.
Here you go!
alec-baldwin-glengarry-dlen-ross-sales-leads-contactous_1_orig (resized).jpgI doubt deeproot planned to produce much of anything at the time of that last update, but I could totally see RM, reading this thread and being driven by an overwhelming desire to make everyone here eat their words, miraculously deliver games on little more than sheer willpower. Reading this kind of stuff is like the recipe for creating super villains.
2 weeks later
I've been out of the loop. How's RAZA? It was supposed to ship a few months ago, right? Are you guys enjoying it? Was it worth the wait?
2 weeks later
3 weeks later
I'm actually interested to see food truck. At first it sounded like a really dumb idea but the pinball catalog is full of amazing games with premises that didn't sound appealing at first. I think it could be great, or terrible, or anywhere in between... But I hope they get to it eventually.
Quoted from Matthew2000tx:All the Project Pinball Charity things are up online for bidding
Here are the links to the 5 Raffles we have ready to start fundraising. We will not end these raffles until they have all reached their goals.
https://projectpinball.rallyup.com/gilbertelijah-benefit-signed-raza-playfield
https://projectpinball.rallyup.com/gilbert-elijah-benefit-signed-starwars-translite
https://projectpinball.rallyup.com/signed-barryoursler-pinballposters
https://projectpinball.rallyup.com/signed-tmnt-pro-playfield
https://projectpinball.rallyup.com/signed-brianallen-translite
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Hey guys... You can win a RAZA playfield and build your own game before deeproot ever builds one.
1 week later
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Manufacturing Update
Would it appear that the DR gravy train continues to chug full steam ahead, landing another cool $1 million of PPP in April 2021 to put towards the retention of 65 jobs?
https://www.federalpay.org/paycheck-protection-program/deeproot-tech-llc-san-antonio-tx
https://www.federalpay.org/paycheck-protection-program/deeproot-studios-llc-san-antonio-tx
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Paired with iceman's intrepid car counting, I'd say all signs point to plentiful paid personnel packing piles of PinPods™ behind closed doors as we speak!
Wasn't there a requirement that to be eligible for the second draw of PPP, you have to show that your revenue was down 25% or more quarter over quarter? How can that possibly apply to deeproot?
Quoted from DakotaMike:Mmm, maybe pre-orders could be classified as revenue? So without any more orders this quarter, then PPP? Or you know, lawyers and loopholes.
Preorders didn't come until December 2020. If anything they would have an increase in revenue from Preorders.
Here are the official rules:
A borrower is generally eligible for a Second Draw PPP loan if the borrower:
Previously received a First Draw PPP loan and will or has used the full amount only for authorized uses
Has no more than 300 employees; and
Can demonstrate at least a 25% reduction in gross receipts between comparable quarters in 2019 and 2020
I was thinking about the second draw PPP requirements and it occurred to me that the delays could have become intentional at some point. If deeproot the larger company took the second draw PPP payments, then they might want to avoid incoming revenue until the end of the quarter in order to show a revenue decline sufficient enough to make the PPP loans forgivable. In that case, they may have intentionally delayed the games until after the second quarter as the payments for those games could have caused them to lose the PPP money. I suspect that the company that I work for did something similar by deferring contracts until the start of July, so it made me wonder...
That's all speculation, and I don't have any reason to believe that deeproot is on track to make anything... But if they suddenly say they are starting to make/ship games and collect payments this month... Sus.
Quoted from jawjaw:The whole Spooky comparison annoys me. Few if any were interested in Spooky in the beginning. You have to buy their pins based on fomo and whether you can flip for a profit. Little to do with actual gameplay. It's the same LE crap that everyone is doing but hard to argue with success. You can charge more and sell all games in one day. You can make people wait years to get a game and everyone loves it.
This is all true. It doesn't mean spooky's games are bad, but it's not ideal practice for consumers. Don't forget that you have to pay to join a club just to have a chance to buy a game. It's very well engineered to drive sales out of FOMO. You should be able to see game play, know the rules, know when you'll get your game, maybe even play the game before you commit to buying.
Quoted from guitarded:I don't know. Maybe try to suck less? At pinball. The one at my local shoots great.
Houdini is an OK game but it's the clunkiest game I've ever played. Blaming it on the player is unfair. It's a terrible shooter.
Quoted from VonPinball:They totally missed the opportunity to ask their employees work in an "outside the pinbox" environment...
https://deeproot.bamboohr.com/jobs/view.php?id=99
Who wants to help assemble the games...?
So they haven't hired any factory staff yet...
Quoted from benheck:Beats me. Are you trying to CANCEL Spooky?
You post here more than anyone punching down on deeproot. That's fine, but why can't we scrutinize other manufacturers in the same way?
Quoted from benheck:greenHornet was wage-baiting. He's from CA, "punching down" to our state's min wage, which is the same as the FEDERAL minimum wage, thank you very much.
Are you trying to CANCEL California?
I live here and it's the worst...
But I still think wage comparisons are fair. If you're all going to blast deeproot for trying to hire at low wages, then asking what other manufacturers are paying is totally fair. Maybe they all pay better than deeproot. I dunno. But it's a fair question given the context.
I've gone from wanting deeproot to fail to wanting them to succeed. This thread is so toxic. Everyone's just dying for an update so they can laugh at misfortune. I hope they pull it off. I hope the preorder people get their games. I hope the second game does better. I hope jjp and Stern have more competition (as if those companies don't have a checkered history).
It seems like RM is waiting to update for something to come in so he can post some progress. I'm sure everyone here will find new, creative ways to hate, but I'm going to hope for the best. I don't have a stake in it, but I would just like to see way less hate around here. This thread is toxic even for pinside. 
Quoted from RobT:Bottom line for me is that if those reports from alleged (former?) employees of Deeproot are true about not getting paid, things are pretty serious. Especially for a company that is supposedly cash rich.
I wonder what DR did to keep those unpaid employees from going to the Labor Commission? That shit is taken pretty seriously.
I seriously doubt they're not paying people right now if they had recent cash infusion from PPP. A single person complaining about that would jeopardize their ppp loan forgiveness.
Quoted from toyotaboy:about the only person kaneda hasnt pissed off is spooky and ben.. or are they just being cordial? im sure he did something to piss them off too but they're too nice.
Or they're all working together. I stopped listening a while ago but k's enthusiasm for spooky and spooky alone was... Odd.
Quoted from yancy:It's gonna be ugly when Chris turns on Spooky.
Given his track record, it certainly feels like a "when" and not an "if." I would keep my distance if I were spooky. There's a reason that everyone else in the industry won't touch the "number 1 pinball podcast."
Quoted from benheck:Schadenfreude is HOT in the doco world right now! I get a lot of ads for a new one on WeWork (landlords who pretended to be a tech company)
Maybe we'll get one one Deeproot!
WeWork was/is like a virus. Our company has three offices in different regions and each was being crowded out by WeWork. The one in Los Angeles was just opening in March 2020 after like a year of disruptive construction. I doubt that worked out well for them.
If, by some miracle, deeproot starts making and shipping games, will Ben Heck be OK? I imagine it would be devastating to have devoted so much effort to trashing the company only to see them survive.
1 week later
I can't keep up with this thread. Was anything officially stated by deeproot? All I see are pet pictures and the usual bs.
1 week later
Quoted from TheFamilyArcade:Wha? This entire thread has been a celebration of truth and skepticism for at least a year. Hard for Kaneda? What’s hard for Kaneda?
Wasn't kaneda trying to get someone to sell him their RAZA spot until very recently? It certainly seemed like the FOMO got to him until deeproot missed their update deadline. I can't remember when he jumped back on the hate wagon but he was actively trying to get someone to transfer their spot to him which suggests that he thought RAZA was happening until recently.
1 week later
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