(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


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Topic index (key posts)

357 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #111 Firsthand information from the Magic Girl programmer. Posted by applejuice (6 years ago)

Post #3026 RAZA promotional video Posted by PinMonk (4 years ago)

Post #5771 First RAZA gameplay video Posted by ZMeny (4 years ago)

Post #5874 RAZA video with more audible game sounds Posted by zaphX (4 years ago)

Post #5926 First RAZA video with successful ramp completion Posted by zaphX (4 years ago)

Post #5967 Another RAZA gameplay video Posted by flynnibus (4 years ago)

Post #6050 Closeup pictures of key playfield features Posted by Potatoloco (4 years ago)

Post #6133 Video of display animations Posted by LateCenturyMods (4 years ago)

Post #6329 Summary of Robert Mueller's interview Posted by jeffspinballpalace (4 years ago)

Post #6724 RAZA Gameplay video Posted by DS_Nadine (4 years ago)


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#471 6 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I'm just happy this super strong pinball economy will be able to support all these new machines they are talking about making, along with all the other manufacturers out there.

Who are you and what have you done with O-din?

2 months later
#804 5 years ago
Quoted from wcbrandes:

I don't know but if this is drafted up by the lawyer himself

Well, at least they clarified their unjustified denial on a public forum and not through private communication. You know, like all the professionals do.
Wow.

2 months later
19
#1056 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

If nothing else, this could end up being one big tax write off for deeproot.

Kramer : It's just a write off for them .

Jerry : How is it a write off ?

Kramer : They just write it off .

Jerry : Write it off what ?

Kramer : Jerry all these big companies they write off everything

Jerry : You don't even know what a write off is .

Kramer : Do you ?

Jerry : No . I don't .

Kramer : But they do and they are the ones writing it off .

#1103 5 years ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

The one who can't be named cause it gets you permabanned.

Thanks, I didn't get that either.

2 weeks later
#1305 5 years ago
Quoted from toyotaboy:

you wouldn't be able to tell the difference

Yes. I would.
Virtual pinball is OK for what it is, but I'll stick with a real, physical ball.

1 month later
#1512 5 years ago

Article says cabinet looks conventional, but the head does not.
Some type of Pin2k-ish setup?

2 weeks later
#1725 5 years ago
Quoted from HOOKED:

Five days of root will be five titles released at once

That seems like a sure way to sell fewer of each title.

1 month later
#1956 5 years ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

More full time heads than all the other manufacturers combined? That seems overstated. Either that or potentially pushing up against Brooks' Law.

Is it possible that many Stern employees are not direct, full time employees? Maybe through a third party service?
Otherwise that statement is nuts.

2 months later
16
#2344 5 years ago

Then he sued the people he ripped off. Classy.

1 month later
#2494 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The "losers" will be confined to the investors.

Yeah, and at least they will be real investors in the company, not JPop purchaser "investors".

1 month later
#2998 4 years ago

Can't wait to see the arguing really blow up in this thread once something actually happens.

#3020 4 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I hope not.
I hope Deeproot gets their game or games out, and I hope it's all we hope for.
That would be great for pinball, great for Pinside.
LTG : )

I hope they make lots of great games.
But if they do, there will still be arguing here.
Probably better natured arguing than if disaster befalls, but still arguing.

2 months later
#3941 4 years ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

much little stuff that adresses things that you won't argue about anymore/ are used to

'Cmon man, we all know that we will argue about ANYTHING.

1 month later
#4353 4 years ago

Gotta admit, I thought you guys would never get refunded.
I was wrong, and very happy to see that I was.
Great news for those involved!
Hope DR keeps moving in a positive direction.

2 months later
#5066 4 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Oh I wouldn't worry about that.
Pinsiders are known for keeping their expectations in check and being completely resistant to overwrought disappointment.

I'm probably the most sarcastic person I know, coming from a long line of sarcastic folk. But Damn!, that's some real sarcasm there.

2 weeks later
#5153 4 years ago

Does DR have any patents that others would want to steal?

1 month later
#6949 4 years ago
Quoted from Richthofen:

Deeproot pinball's website appears to have launched. I'm probably not VIP enough to get info.
https://deeprootpinball.com/

So this is an announcement of an announcement coming in three months.

#6967 4 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Look at the filing and see who is paying for Zidware's chapter 7... wait for it... it's deeproot (paying the attorney).

Also note that it looks like at least one law firm didn't get paid for previous work.
Venis and Copp, LLP shows up as a creditor for $6,500.00.

Sad to see lots of good folks on that list.

#7006 4 years ago
Quoted from Richthofen:

The numbers don't add up to me

This!
Have been having similar thoughts for a while.
You can only sell as many pinball machines as folks want to buy, no matter who you are.
The market is limited.
The strategy of introducing multiple titles at the same time also seems to be a sure way to sell fewer of each, making it more difficult to cover the substantial development cost of each title.

1 month later
#7529 4 years ago
Quoted from razorsedge:

Pretty funny Lol
The only people whom seem to be relentlesly whinging about how DR is conducting its startup, looks like either people with a history of being fu@#€d by preorder companies (which has nothing to do with DR, in fact they helped, so why hate?), or some people whom for whatever reason took it personally when RM called out the value standard from pinball makers as being crap. Which was in fact a perfectly justified and reasonable statement. Stating the obvious, except to those with the blinkers on. For brickheads it's a given I guess
Just a bunch of the same regulars, grinding their axes and pitchforks. Grumpy people bitching about their random, barely relevant, stuff in the new pinball threads. Pinside... meh.
Luckily I'm usually happy enough to ignore the mindless bs and negativity of "the grumpies". The fantastic elements of Pinside in general is more than fun enough to overpower having to look through their rubbish.

I would just like to say that pointing out that the simple economics make no sense is not "bitching, whinging, axe grinding, or hating."
It's saying that something doesn't add up.
There seems to be too much money going in to ever come back out through sales.
Yes, it's not "our" money. But it's someone's. They will want it back. With interest.
Hopefully it's legit somehow, but it doesn't look right.

3 weeks later
#7949 4 years ago
Quoted from romulusx:

These virus’s start in China.Their marketplace is a combination market and slaughterhouse.Blood and virus’s from bats rats and civet cats oh my.Something in China needs to change call me a racist!

O.K. You are a racist.

2 weeks later
#8176 3 years ago

Edit - Removed my own post at the request of the person whose previous post I was discussing.

#8209 3 years ago
Quoted from okgrak:

Anyone else looking forward to the Netflix release of Pinball King next fall? Could be fun to see the cast of crazy characters behind deeproot.

You had me for a second there.

#8243 3 years ago

You have to admit that Deeproot is managing to provide pretty good entertainment value, by doing nothing.

#8259 3 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

It's nice when the ordinary peasants can celebrate a moment of glory, isn't it?

Count De Monet - Sir, the peasants are revolting!
King Louis - You said it. They stink on ice.

#8292 3 years ago
Quoted from toyotaboy:

* Team ready to turn on production at a moments notice.

At what pace?
Didn't he also say they just received 15 board sets? That does not sound production ready.

2 weeks later
#8464 3 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Yeah, I've been following that also snice Frax pointed it out on April 26th. Good job, Frax frax
Also down is Deeproot Tech
https://deeproottech.com/
Deeproot Funds
https://deeprootfunds.com/
And Deeproot Pinball
https://deeprootpinball.com/
The only one still up and running is Deeproot Studios but I don't see much there.
https://deeprootstudios.com/

The website specific to to one of their investment funds (the "575" fund) is also still down.
the575.com

1 month later
13
#8642 3 years ago

Deeproot knows they can start selling games without giving tours and putting on a show, right?

1 month later
#8813 3 years ago

This is probably irrelevant, but does this seem odd to anyone else?

From the deeproot funds website:
Phone
Please call us toll-free at (888) 316-2935. Extensions include:
Opt 1 – Fund Customer Service
Opt 2 – Sales
Opt 3 – deeproot Pinball
Opt 4 – Broker, Advisor, or Representative
Opt 5 – Executive Offices

Deeproot pinball doesn't have their own phone number?

1 month later
#9178 3 years ago
Quoted from wfumed2:

[quoted image]

Well, it looks like the last missing number is "2021", when 9-20 will be on a Monday.

#9235 3 years ago
Quoted from wesman:

Even if they don't produce a single game, I kinda feel they'd still be less disappointing than Stern's titles.

Well, then they certainly have the right designer working for them.

#9317 3 years ago

And $500 worth of t-shirts buys Derproot several more months of stalling time.

1 week later
#9544 3 years ago
Quoted from marlboroman:

that means you can back it

You must be new here.
RM has been spewing this type of garbage for YEARS and has produced nothing.

#9689 3 years ago
Quoted from SadSack:

Just like Indy Jones was a Pedo. You don't catch on to it until you see how depraved it is from an adult viewpoint. Sad Sack to the rescue. Whannn, whanaaanannanh.

What are you talking about?!?
On second thought, nevermind...... I don't want to know.

#10704 3 years ago

So I guess there is no warehouse full of games ready to ship.

10
#10894 3 years ago

I just can't get past the idea that the event was originally supposed to be in March.
Wow.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

deeproot Launch Media & VIP Information

On Wednesday March 25, 2020, deeproot Pinball is hosting a day long launch event starting at 8:55am Central.

This invitation-only event will feature the long-anticipated launch of the deeproot Pinball company after several years of safeguarded R&D.

A tentative schedule of events is as follows:

Start End Description
8:00 AM 8:45 AM Arrival / Registration
8:45 AM 8:55 AM Seating
8:55 AM 10:40 AM Launch Presentation *
10:40 AM 11:10 AM Break / Facility Tours
11:10 AM 11:45 AM Launch Pres Q&A *
11:45 AM 11:55 AM Bowden RAZA Play through *
11:55 AM 12:00 PM Break / Transition to Luncheon
12:00 PM 12:55 PM Tex-Mex Luncheon / Play Games
12:55 PM 1:00 PM Transition back to Auditorium
1:00 PM 1:30 PM Mechanical Engineering Panel (Q&A) ^
1:30 PM 2:15 PM Game Design Panel (Q&A) ^
2:15 PM 2:45 PM Sales & Distribution Panel ^
2:45 PM 2:55 PM Break
2:55 PM 3:30 PM Electrical Engineering Panel (Q&A) ^
3:30 PM 4:15 PM deeproot Studios Panel (Q&A) ^
4:15 PM 5:30 PM Wrap up / Linger Longer / Play Games

* Streamed to public on delayed broadcast

Event Details
We welcome invited VIP’s, qualified members of the pinball or broader technology media, and select others to apply for credentials to deeproot Pinball’s launch. Limited spots are available. Network infrastructure for live streams will be available. With notice, rooms for recording or interviews can be made available.

Discounted hotel rooms are available for Tuesday night March 24th and Wednesday night March 25th. Free drinks and snacks, as well as a luncheon, will be provided to all attendees on March 25th. Please inform us of any food allergies.

Flights or other transportation costs are attendees’ responsibilities unless a waiver is requested.

Please do not make plans or arrangements to attend until you receive a confirmation from us approving your credentials. We expect a lot of requests and may have to regrettably deny some requests. Since there is limited space in the auditorium, we reserve the right to provide alternate viewing rooms by video feed for guests if the approved guest count exceeds the auditorium capacity.

#11582 3 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

The "innovative" PinBar (tm copyright) ignores millions of years of evolution. Human hands are meant to grasp round objects, namely tree branches and the limbs of other animals.
That's why your rake, steering wheel, shifter, gun handle, dildo, pan handle, drinking glass... ARE ROUNDED.

While I agree with this, I think that one of the examples was not primarily designed to fit "hands".

2 weeks later
#12761 3 years ago

What are the current odds that Derproot eventually sells games?
I'm starting to think it's less than 50:50. Maybe 60:40 against.
Seems like we may just see an announcement that "adverse conditions and factors beyond our control dictate abandoning the pinball market".

2 weeks later
#13027 3 years ago
Quoted from pinlink:

I agree, Rich, but it's how it was pitched to the investors. And I will tell you from experience that there are some VERY gullible investors out there just looking for something to throw their cash at.
Robert has convinced the investors that he can dominate the pinball category with all of these new and badass innovations that they are working on. They just need time to get them right. We all know how far these "innovations" will take them, but these are rich kids who don't do their homework when deciding what to do with their money. They were probably impressed with a shitty powerpoint Robert put together.

Hi-
Could you please introduce me to your gullible investor friends?
I have an awesome bridge building startup company to pitch to them.

#13045 3 years ago

Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Deeproot's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

1 week later
11
#13121 3 years ago

Seems like we're moving from "Is it a scam?"
to "What kind of scam is it?"

That's progress, I guess.

3 weeks later
#13830 3 years ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

I'm more sad we've forgotten about Vonnie D already!

I wonder if that guy is out of jail yet. What was his name? Wes Somethingrather?

Edit- Wes Upchurch.
Looks like he might have another 8 months or so in prison.
https://www.justice.gov/usao-wdmo/pr/columbia-man-pleads-guilty-smuggling-k2-china

13
#13888 3 years ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Please do not send this company any pre-order money.

I cannot possibly give this comment enough thumbs up.

#13958 3 years ago

Am I seeing the purchase info correctly?
Are orders only being taken from Dec. 8 to Dec. 30?

Yeah, great plan to sell games only for a three week window between Thanksgiving and Christmas during a global pandemic.

#14015 3 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

Ok, so just so I'm clear:

They want to order parts based on the number of non-refundable deposits they receive.

But we've not seen a hint of who or what is building these things?

I missed that. But yeah, that's what it says.
That also means that they won't even be ordering parts until the game purchase window closes.
Speedy delivery is assured!

Also, availability of replacement parts would seem to be a concern if this is how they roll.

#14026 3 years ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

After talking to Robert yesterday I am happy to support a new pinball era. A gamble yes but I enjoy the game and this new direction appeals to me so we now proudly have (2) Xtra Editions on order paid in full. (one for a local collector I'm not greedy...) Looking forward to this new pinball adventure.
[quoted image]

I wouldn't, but I sincerely hope this works out well and you get great games quickly.

#14432 3 years ago

Waitress: Hey, who ordered all this food from the pinball machine?
Random Customer: I dunno, the guys playing pinball left 20 minutes ago.

#14442 3 years ago

Wow, RAZA had zombies at one time.

11
#14584 3 years ago
Quoted from Mercifull:

Deeproot might... just might... have a production line set up

If they did, why wouldn't they have a few, say ten, games built and ready to ship to the first few customers who sign up and pay in full?
That would be a huge demonstration of results, rather than more talk.
The idea that orders will only be taken before any games ship is absurd.

#14742 3 years ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

deeproot is on pace to make more RAZAs than Spooky’s first title AMH or American Pinball’s third and even licensed title Hotwheels

I don't think they have made ANY games that have shipped yet.
That's not much of a pace.

#14795 3 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

So about $1500 difference? When is that due?

I think he meant that his original $5K deposit gets him that package with no upcharge.
I hope it happens.

2 weeks later
#15394 3 years ago
Quoted from Zablon:

The idea of 'food truck' doesn't bother me. I like non licensed themes as generally they seem to be more imaginative with less constraints. I will say the name is lacking. They need to rebrand it into a bit more exciting name similar to RAZA.

ZOMBIE FOOD TRUCK!
(But with no zombies, because it's really an alien named Ned)

2 weeks later
#15541 3 years ago
Quoted from rwmech5:

Where's the pic of Clinton having a nap?

George-Clinton (resized).jpgGeorge-Clinton (resized).jpg
3 weeks later
#15935 3 years ago
Quoted from pbwizard14:

We must be talking about different things because RAZA was sold during that month and only that month with a no refund deposit.

Yes. Different groups of people.
You are speaking about folks who just ordered games in December from Derproot.
The other discussion is regarding people owed games or money through the goodwill agreement for Zidware customers from YEARS ago.

12
#16045 3 years ago
Quoted from underlord:

Was reading the preorder thread. They are hating everyone here.

Aren't they all busy playing their new RAZA machines?

(Seriously, I don't think anyone WANTS derproot to fail. We just want them to be honest along the way. Makes it hard to root for them when RM is constantly a tool.)

1 week later
#16505 3 years ago
Quoted from Dr-pin:

So the building is beeing sold by the owner, and DR gone into total silence mode?
As of yet, is there any indication that the company still exists?

Lets not get carried away.
One of the real estate listings for the building indicates that Deeproot's lease lasts through 2023. Most likely the building owner listing it for sale is unrelated to Deeproot as a company.
Also, it sounds like Iceman is local to the facility and has seen vehicles in the parking lot when he drove by very recently.
It seems as though Deeproot Funds and Deeproot Tech also run from the same building, so who knows what folks are there, but it sounds like there are people there.

1 week later
#16598 3 years ago
Quoted from TheFamilyArcade:

And DeepRoot hasn’t provided any competition in the pinball market. In any form. Ever.

Does competition in marketing BS count?

1 week later
#16947 2 years ago

Why doesn't Deeproot have the full warranty on their website?
Can someone who has it please post the whole thing?

#16950 2 years ago

Seems like there should be more. Like how to make a claim, what "Covered" means, replacement, pro-rated, etc.
It also seems like that post is showing that you would see the warranty information AFTER making the purchase. It would be nice to know what warranty and other terms and conditions you are agreeing to, before you agree to them.
Also appears like no warranty outside the US.

#16953 2 years ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

Incorrect. The warranty was laid out in its entirety prior to signing the contract which completed your order.

Thanks, but I'm not sure I understand.
Where can we see the warranty terms? Are you saying that you had to ask? Or that they were visible during the order process, but not before?

#16977 2 years ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

The warranty was clearly defined during the preorder process BEFORE you signed the contract which then completed your order.

I was trying to determine if one would get to see the full warranty terms and other conditions before making payment.
Usually the payment completes the order.
Did you get to see the contract before making your payment?
Were you aware that there would be a contract to sign?

2 weeks later
#17525 2 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

I seriously thought RM orchestrated a ddos attack lol.

Nah. He set fire to the generator at the WebNX server farm in Ogden, Utah.

1 week later
12
#17812 2 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

good lord, can't believe that interview is 6 years old now. This is like a modern Sisyphus story. RAZA is jpop pushing a rock up a mountain for eternity.

Nice, but I think Jpop IS the rock.
With everyone else pushing.

18
#17847 2 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Is, this the end, is dr unofficially over? In with a bang, out without so much as a whimper?
What a saga..

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?
It's not over until RM stops threatening to sue people.

#17881 2 years ago
Quoted from TaTa:

Technically the Germans did bomb Pearl Harbour. They were the Axis powers at that point so in essence the Germans did bomb PH! Get a life and realize that the game is going to get made and you can all SUCK it afterwards!!!

And Poland dropped the atom bomb on Hiroshoma, because they were allies of the US.

I really hope that Derproot makes all the games that they took money for, and many, many more.
I hope I end up owning multiple awesome Deeproot games.
Any dumb jokes I crack about that are unlikely to affect.that one way or the other.

#18095 2 years ago
Quoted from PismoArcade:

Anyone know if JPop is still making this?
[quoted image]

Is this a Zen question?
"What is the difference between Jpop making a game, and Jpop not making a game?"

#18217 2 years ago
Quoted from rai:

What’s the current state of affairs with DR?

They don't seem to have any current affairs.

1 week later
#18531 2 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

I am pretty sure this is unfolding with the sane help of good legal counsel, and that an exit strategy is in motion. There has to be good legal reasons for everything coming out of DR's "updates" and this is dragging on because Robert has not yet legally established his "this is not my fault" defense that could or would sway a judge or jury "beyond a reasonable doubt". That is all this is amounting to, a setup for the reduction of (or out right elimination of) legal actions against Robert by investors. When you have so much evidence against you, the fabrication of an "alternative facts" based defense takes some time and BS to sell it.

Are you sure that you should be giving legal advice without a license?

15
#18652 2 years ago

Founder, president, and spokesman for company: We're making progress, next update in a few weeks.
Reaction: Argle Bargle! All is lost! Bail out of this mess!

Un-named, anonymous, unconfirmed source: Parts are way backordered. It's gonna be months.
Reaction: Hurray! Proof that all is well!

How did we get to this point?

#18707 2 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Didn't Robert try to claim there were no investors in the project?

If I remember correctly, RM did say there were no individual investors in Deeproot pinball.
That does not mean that Deeproot Funds can't invest in Deeproot pinball.
As Ice has been pointing out, Deeproot Funds investors are owed a specific return, and as long as that happens, they have no interest or say in how Deeproot Funds invests the money to make that return happen.
That said, investing significant amounts in a losing venture makes it harder to achieve the required return with the remaining funds.

14
#18717 2 years ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

The only strongly implied they had Goonies. They said they have The Who and still have that on their site. You’d think that would be imminent. And it’s an ok licensed theme. Dad rock sells. I’d think The Who does as well, if not better, than The Goonies.

This all seems right.
However, none of it matters since they can't build and ship even a single game.

What do you call a dog with no legs?
It doesn't matter. He won't come to you anyway.

1 week later
#18784 2 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

The pre-order thread is eerily quiet concerning the refund requests that began this past Tuesday. With Deeproots history, could it be a new round of legal contracts and NDA's?

More likely just silence in self interest, but who knows.
I hope everyone who has the sense to bail out gets their money back with no hassle.

2 weeks later
16
#19115 2 years ago

More games than Stern!
No prepayment!
Multiple titles available at launch!
Five Days Of Deeproot!
No preorders!
Ferrari quality at Kia pricing!
Quad manufacturing... no, wait..... OCTO manufacturing!

Man, I sure am looking forward to this sweet, sweet launch.

11
#19119 2 years ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

Did that ever happen?

Don't be silly. Nothing Deeproot ever actually happens.

#19175 2 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

If my theory is correct then the "we give up" update will be pretty soon.
Unless they are actually going for it in which case I'd expect more delay announcements.

Is that legal advice?

That sounds like legal advice.

1 week later
#19341 2 years ago

I like pinball.
Anyone hear any news about that Deeproot company recently?
Their early stuff looked pretty good, but it's been quite a while now.

#19518 2 years ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

Does this mean they are getting out of the lease? Why would CBRE be advertising the space?

Also for you office real estate moguls: what does “large floor plates” mean?

CBRE is advertising the building for sale to a new landlord, not looking for a new tenant.

"Floor Plates" seems to be real estate language for separate, or potentially separate, office spaces within a multi-tenant building.

#19612 2 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Disclaimer: I have no scientific evidence to prove my theory but I have been drunk in a bar.

I find this much more convincing than having stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

#19643 2 years ago

DMD's were also just making all pinball machines look dated.
Of course people had no idea that they were still being made, when brand new games looked like they were built when dot matrix printers with green-bar paper were still being used.

2 weeks later
#20764 2 years ago

This thread is getting boring.
When is RM going to say or do something else ridiculous?

#20839 2 years ago

Still on the Deeproot pinball website right now:

We plan to ramp up our lines in a slow, controlled manner using phases with a goal to finish and ship all RAZA orders in less than four months. The first three phases will only be games meeting UL certification for North America/Canada. As CE and other international certifications will still be ongoing, we will not ship international orders until the fourth phase at the earliest.

Phase 1: Approximately six weeks as the first games reach customers, with us alternating between Arcade and Xtra editions (backlit side panels being the primary delays for Xtra editions).
Phase 2: Approximately four weeks, with the goal of increasing games leaving per week to 30.
Phase 3: Approximately four weeks, with the goal of increasing games leaving per week to 40.
Phase 4: The balance of domestic orders and all International orders.

#20865 2 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

How long can this possibly go on for?

Workin' for Deeproot
Goin' on down, down
Workin' for Deeproot
Oops, about to slip down
Workin' for Deeproot
Goin' on down, down
Workin' for Deeproot
Oops, about to slip down
Five o'clock in the mornin'
I'm already up and gone
Lord, I'm so tired
How long can this go on?

#20986 2 years ago

Unexpected legal issue:
"Oh crap, we took money for games and now they actually expect us to build those games."

#21302 2 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

From what's been said, the pinball division had been cut off of more money from the deeproot fund. If the PPP money is also gone, and no machines can be built to make any money, can this be the end of the runway?

Robert has claimed to be personally wealthy and prepared to use his personal money to run Deeproot Pinball.
At least that's how I interpreted what he said about funding.

#21607 2 years ago
Quoted from Chuckwebster:

he'll have to go into bankruptcy and the courts will sell the assets to the highest bidder. I've seen similar situations where the principles form a new corporation and buy the assets for pennies on the dollar to get out of paying back the debt and then restart the company.

What assets?
The building is leased, and they have no production line.

#21904 2 years ago
Quoted from dr_nybble:

If deeproot had just designed great games — no B.S. innovation that no one was asking for — they’d be in good shape.

They may have designed great games. We'll never know, since pinball is a manufacturing business, and they didn't build anything.

10
#22146 2 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

I did a little exploring myself and was really surprised to see Ben Heck listed for a RZX edition!

Also paid extra up front to have Jpop come to his house for final assembly.

#22167 2 years ago
Quoted from pookycade:

So the most interesting question still to answer here is did DR not build games because they:
a) ran out of money
b) kept trying to find someone to bail them out or buy the company
c) have had a secret build lair where oompa-loompahs have been diligently working on them day and night
d) don’t have any staff left to put them together
e) PinBar and UL are insurmountable obstacles that we just don’t understand
f) desperately want to show us their manufacturing but are legally prevented from doing so.
g) Marco won’t sell them parts anymore
h) need a bigger warehouse to undertake a project of this magnitude.
i) waiting to hire VP of manufacturing - everyone else still working there only has a title of art director.
j) the company dog ate their build documents.
k) Stern and JJP paid them good money not to build anything so they don’t have to compete.

L) They (RM) never really planned to build games in the first place.

#22367 2 years ago

"It's Ben's fault" is one I was not expecting.

1 week later
13
#22840 2 years ago

"Legal issue"
HaHaHaHaHaHaHa...........HaHaHa!

I can't wait to see RM (eventually) go to jail.
The "American Greed" tv episode will be awesome.

#22843 2 years ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

I guess taking down the deeproot funds page and getting rid of all the Facebooks, LinkedIns, and phone numbers wasn't a big nothing burger after all. If someone were under investigation, would the government usually like someone doing that kind of stuff?

That's not going to matter one way or another after stealing MILLIONS OF DOLLARS from investors.

#22876 2 years ago

Thank goodness that Spooky stayed out and is not going down with the RM Deeproot Titanic.

28
#23383 2 years ago

Just remember that if it wasn't for all the negativity here, Deeproot would have been a huge success. This is all our fault for bashing Deeproot.

11
#23493 2 years ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

It does not mean any of these JPOP games or other titles done there will not see the light of day in the future

JFC!
NO ONE WILL BUY THIS SHIT!

10
#23878 2 years ago
Quoted from Gorgar666:

He will be forced to refund the money which is cheaper than producing a working Pin. It may take years in court to settle. He will Plea-bargain and it will hurt his pocket, but it can be done. Until then, wait. Sucks though. I feel for the guys that got F*****.

Did you miss the part explaining that he stole 58 million dollars?
He's going to jail.
He cannot possibly refund anyone.

#24471 2 years ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

If they had a production plan in place I believe things would of had a chance to move ahead

Again, let's not forget that Robert STOLE 58 MILLION DOLLARS!
There is no way a functioning pinball company could come out of a 58 MILLION DOLLAR THEFT!
That's not just a planning issue.

#24647 2 years ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

There are going to be more players in the marketplace in 2022.

You're doing a great job, if you are trying to convince those folks that hiring you would be a huge mistake.

#24783 2 years ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

They were trying to make the games. They just underestimated all aspects of manufacturing

And stole 58 million dollars.

#25425 2 years ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Popadiuk is awesome?

Popadiuk is assinine.

#25470 2 years ago
Quoted from ZNET:

Equally, it's impossible to scroll through a single Pinside page without encountering maddening grammar, punctuation and spelling errors. Typos and stream of consciousness posts are certainly understandable.
However, the most common unforgivable errors seem to be:
1) using "could of" and "would of" which are both nonsensical. The correct phrase is, of course, could HAVE and would HAVE;
2) incorrectly writing "etcetera" as "ect." The correct abbreviation is, of course, "etc." Further, one "etc." suffices. Multiples are redundant;
3) misuse of "your" when "you're" is meant, the latter of which means, of course, "you are." This is clearly the number 1 error;
4) misuse of "it's" to designate the possessive meaning when, of course, "it's" means "it is." To convey possession,
there is NO apostrophe in "its." (e.g. The deeproot company is a failed venture. Its assets have been depleted.)
Perhaps the most disheartening lesson is that these mistakes are repeated by the same folks even after a correction is noted by a fellow Pinsider. The educational collapse (in STEM as well) is evidently just as pervasive in Canada as in America. The western hemisphere is badly losing the global literacy race. It's embarrassing.

Your not wrong.

#25480 2 years ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

“Etcetera” in Latin means nothing whatsoever. We have come to accept it as meaning the same as “Et cetera” because people have become complacent.

It has been said that Pinsiders will argue about anything.
I think that has now been proven.

#25565 2 years ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

Fully capable without a struggle
Just a simple mistake I made by not fully paying attention

I agree, 1000%

12
#25603 2 years ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

What I meant was a PR person from day 1. Things may have been different from the start if you did not insult your competition. If they had a actual plan to start building actual games within days with a real production line.

You seem like a decent person.
So I don't think you are trolling us. But this is getting ridiculous.
I just don't understand how you keep failing to see that Deeproot was a massively corrupt enterprise from the beginnig. It was ALL STOLEN MONEY.

#25780 2 years ago

“He who represents himself has a fool for a client”
Abe Lincoln

#25846 2 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

And how is that accomplished? It was all spent on salaries.

I know how RM could pay back the money!
Just start a pinball company, take orders for games, and use the MASSIVE INSTANT pre-payment monies to pay back the investors.
Then take pre-payment for MORE games to fund the original games. Or something.

#25897 2 years ago

Yeah, and they would be really smart to start talking about that while the Feds are investigating and deciding who to charge criminally. Now would be a great time to talk about all those cool, valuable things you stole from the company that stole $58 million dollars from investors. It's not like the Government is looking for anything to sell as a way to make partial restitution to those folks or anthing. Hidden assets wouldn't interest them at all. And getting involved in all that by having stolen property on your hands would be a great idea.

#25904 2 years ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

This innovative DR box might become a collectors item. Since DR is not going to deliver any pinball machines: ordering the tree roots liquidators are selling off DR HQ property, to recover every dollar they can for stiffed investors….only this box is not as revolutionary as the original DR wooden collapsible pinball crate, which might have been their best innovation.
[quoted image]

The landscape products company is unrelated to the RM family of companies fiasco. And I feel bad for them for the coincidence.
That box is better than "Pinpod" though.

1 week later
#26079 2 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Now that Deeproot has cut ties, where does Jpop go from here? He has a right to provide for himself/family and will need to do something.
Pinball seems out but he has surprised me a couple of times now. Who would hire him and for what?

Starbucks is probably hiring.

31
#26156 2 years ago
Quoted from Inside:

after being served with SEC investigative subpoenas in October 2020

Raza pre-orders were taken after he knew he was under investigation.

#26340 2 years ago
Quoted from BradyScribbles:

What’s next, electric powered pinball machines?

I'm waiting for V-8, gas powered, pinball.
Lots of modding to do then.

#26393 2 years ago
Quoted from okgrak:

partially completed pinball machines, manufacturing equipment, and pinball parts."

Anyone have any idea how many partially completed games exist? Volume of parts laying around? Leaked pictures so far sure don't show much.

2 weeks later
#26717 2 years ago
db6afccac70dc671b5ecf06b36b5d3f3 (resized).jpgdb6afccac70dc671b5ecf06b36b5d3f3 (resized).jpg
#26769 2 years ago

Wow.
The threat to call "law enforcement" to deal with leaked information is insane.
"Tell anyone that I'm not paying you, and I'll call the cops on you."

#26784 2 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

I was curious what I was missing out on. Maybe time to upgrade.
[quoted image]

What could possibly go wrong?

10
#26812 2 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Is this all still stolen money though? How can he continue to use that if it is.

Because in the American justice system, ANYONE is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
That's a good thing, because people are wrongly charged at times, but it also means that the guilty are slower to be punished.
Also, as noted above, if they don't let Robert live and put up a comptent defense, it's likely that a conviction could be overturned on appeal. It hasn't been proven in court (yet) that he stole the money. It would be easy to convict folks if you could prevent them from hiring defense lawyers, but not fair.
We all (I thnk) want to see RM convicted, but the process has to play out so it's done the correct legal way.

3 weeks later
#27252 2 years ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

There is lots of room for small operations to enter the market. Tap into those that have experience working on pinball machines & products. Some of us are very open to help out. Others do not want to see any more competition or drive out some of the smaller ones. Bad for pinball, more the better in my opinion.

The answer, as with most things, is "it depends."
Are they dedicated folks who want to make a living while putting out a quality product, or are they potential dreamers and scammers?

More like Spooky, Multimorphic, and American - Absolutely! Yes please!
More like Jpop, Deeproot, Vonnie D, and Heighway - Hard pass!

#27266 2 years ago
Quoted from soren:

Well, maybe somebody did. Maybe alerts was sent by people on the inside.

That seems to be the most likely way that the SEC investigation got started. With a tip from someone on the Deeproot Funds side, or one of the other associated businesses, like pinball.

1 week later
#27310 2 years ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

The listing details are in need of minor updates; the brochure, more significant ones.

Yeah, but "Suitable for operating a multi-million dollar Ponzi scheme" has limited market appeal.

#27427 2 years ago

Holy cow!
Looking through the list of creditors and there's a small local investment advisor on there.
Tiny firm that is run out of the owner's home, located about a mile from our office.
I feel bad for him and whichever of his clients are tied up in this mess. Hope they didn't have much "invested".

#27433 2 years ago
Quoted from Stemmy:

Anyone one know where the list of creditors are? It seems to be missing on the pdfs.

Quoted from Inside:

So there's a full list (70 pages) of creditors. JPOP is in there!
The grift continues
- link removed due to privacy concerns -

#27437 2 years ago
Quoted from NashtyFunk:

I wonder if I'm listed as a creditor. I got my refund in full via my credit card company dispute. That may mean that folks who were made whole are out of the 74 customers or whatever. If anyone has access to that, I'm Nash.

Looks like you are:
Nash PXXXXXXXXXX
1XXX BXXXXXX Rd
Keller, TX XXXXX

(Half-ass redaction by me.)

The linked PDF is searchable.

Also, glad you got your refund!

#27448 2 years ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Robert is a worthless troll that sues customers, employees, contractors, suppliers, vendors, parts manufacturers, other pinball manufacturers, podcasters, wives, in-laws, investors

not-anymore-not-anymure.gifnot-anymore-not-anymure.gif
#27457 2 years ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

One item of note from this request:

Whoa!
That's huge. I don't recall any previous "official" mention of a criminal case. As far as I remember it was all an SEC civil case.
My guess (hope) is that RM is working out a criminal plea agreement that would cover the civil issues as well.
That would (hopefully) include jail time.

Also possible that the Gubmint is ready to file criminal charges, and everyone is agreeing that the criminal case needs to play out before the civil issues are resolved. Either way it makes criminal action seem likely.

#27475 2 years ago
Quoted from NoQuarters:

Beer store on the list but no Escort services ?

Escorts don't provide services on credit.
They are also too smart to pre-pay for pinball machines.

3 weeks later
#27945 2 years ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

On page 3, they say they have $41K worth of pinball machines, but on page 11 they say they have $78K worth of pinball machines.

Wow, pinflation sure hits fast. 90% value increase in just 8 pages. Imagine what those games will be worth by the time this is all over.

#27981 2 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

Deeproot wanted first dibs on what they hoped would be gotcha patents (to troll with)
My question is HOW did DR funnel 500k into Zidware?

Deeproot and Zidware saying they did does not mean they actually did.
I woudn't put it past them to set up a fictional secured debt to give Deeproot seniority on claims, freezing out Zidware's real creditors with both Deeproot and Zidware knowing the fictional claim would never be paid.

1 month later
#28296 2 years ago

I think that I'm going to stop signing letters with "Sincerely", and start using "It is so ORDERED".

1 week later
#28320 2 years ago
Quoted from Inside:

Oh baby. That's a lot of stuff for sale.

Not quite $60 million worth.
They were closer to being able to open as a health club than as a pinball factory.

Pinball For The Masses!

PBFTM (resized).jpgPBFTM (resized).jpg
#28392 2 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

"It's a great idea! Well, I'm divorcing my wife because she got too ugly and I need to go meet my online dating match. Goodbye!"

I can't believe you didn't want to work with him.

#28627 2 years ago
Quoted from JStoltz:

(Eyes narrowing.)

He means the "American Greed" TV documentary show, which has had episodes about a number of ponzi schemes and other frauds, it's really good and Derproot would be a great episode.

1 week later
#28912 2 years ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

I get the feeling it started small and spiraled over the years. Maybe first stealing a bit to sponsor a minor league soccer team for cheap, get some new investors, yadda yadda, $30m has evaporated to develop unfinished products no one will pay close for
In some way it’s a good thing Robert was delusional enough to think he could do it. At least the investors can claw back a few million from all this office and manufacturing equipment. A little cherry on this shit sundae investment

Yeah, better than zero.
But the Deeproot fund investors were supposed to get back a return plus their original investment, not just a small return.
Robert is lying, cheating, theiving, dirtbag scum.

1 week later
#29320 1 year ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

get custom stuff built if they are not a thief or fraud!

So, Jpop is out then.

#29708 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Did i say "it explains it away"? No. I've pointed it out many times that's how he did it and hid it.

Then what are we arguing about?

2 weeks later
#30393 1 year ago

This urban landscape products company with the unfortunately similar name has existed the entire time.
They are not new and have had that name. Not ever associated with Supergenius Robert.

1 week later
#30622 1 year ago

Not sure if I was the first to see it, or if no one else was dumb enough to buy it.
This appeared on Pinball Life's website, and it looked pointless, so I bought it.
About 20 pages of minor CAD drawings.
If anyone is interested, I can scan it.

20220417_190821 (resized).jpg20220417_190821 (resized).jpg20220417_190833 (resized).jpg20220417_190833 (resized).jpg20220417_190854 (resized).jpg20220417_190854 (resized).jpg
#30763 1 year ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Brief highlights from this week's new SEC motion and subsequent order.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Did anyone notice that "Further" is misspelled as "Furhter" in both "It Is Further Ordered" clauses?
Is that why BJ highighted those lines?

#30777 1 year ago
Quoted from slghokie:

I keep watching that video of the pull out rotating playfield and just laugh and laugh. It sums up the innovative failure that was deeproot

I keep trying to picture that with wiring a wiring harness attached to the playfield.

1 week later
27
#30823 1 year ago
Quoted from d0n:Deleted post

Lots of us "GAF" and are hoping to see scammer thief RM end up in jail.
This thread needs to stay open to follow that process, and to remind all of us pinheads that scammers and frauds are out there.
I, for one, really appreciate the updates, and back story information as it comes out.

2 weeks later
#30956 1 year ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

I am always available to help out with production.

Can you swing by the Stern factory? They seem to be way behind. Maybe they could use a hand.

#30957 1 year ago
Quoted from zombywoof:

There are couple of itemized entries referring to this "pinball blog":

That redaction blockout looks too small to say "blueberryjohnson".

#30984 1 year ago

The folks who believe that Predator would have happened if not for those meddling Pinsiders are bad enough.
That's just way beyond stupid.

#31084 1 year ago
Quoted from Mr68:

It's not what you're probably thinking. I wish I could explain but I can't at this point.

Have you been hanging out with Greatwich? You're starting to sound like him.

3 weeks later
#31275 1 year ago

I would like to buy a vowel please.

1 week later
#31327 1 year ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

If not, why not?

Well, for one thing, he hasn't actually been charged with any crimes yet.
I have confidence that he will end up behind bars, but such things take way longer in real life than movies or TV would suggest.
The wheels of justice grind slowly.

4 weeks later
#31521 1 year ago

Wow.
Intentionally associating your new company with a multi-million dollar scam is certainly one approach.
Not one that I would think any sane person would choose, but an approach.

#31613 1 year ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

On the razors edge.

e5e11d724b227a689be95b534bfbf8df (resized).pnge5e11d724b227a689be95b534bfbf8df (resized).png
4 weeks later
#31962 1 year ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Posting all related docs in case anyone wants to carefully review them because I sure as hell am not going to.

I didn't read all of it, but Cycladic is a company that deeproot's "Policy Services" entity bought and sold some life insurance policies through.
The bankruptcy trustee has requested records and documents from Cycladic. Cycladic is saying basically "No problem giving you what you probably really need, we already gave that stuff to the SEC. But you are asking for much more than that, and for various reasons, we want the scope of what we have to turn over to be reduced from what you requested."

At least that's what I get out of it.

2 weeks later
#32028 1 year ago

I vote for a return to vigilante justice. Old west style.

#32047 1 year ago
Quoted from Inside:

May 29, 2019: Closing of the mortgage? I don't understand exhibit G here at all, but it looks like they put in $330k in cash ($135K from policy services) and also took out a mortgage for $719k. That's $1.05M. From that $944k went towards the condo, and then other ~$100k was used to pay down credit cards and pay off cars?? Am I reading that right??

I think that's correct, plus $2,591.91 cash back at closing.

1 month later
#32069 1 year ago
Quoted from Roostking:

"Its apparent it should be a non-starter". Is she talking about the proposed settlement, or the whole attempt at starting a pinball company?

Referencing the proposed settlement, which does seem to be BS if the statements in the objection are accurate.

1 week later
#32115 1 year ago

A couple "serious" questions.
Does anyone know who the Texas UL tester and Washington State contractor are who apparently have the RAZA prototypes?
Does that mean that Robert was actually pursuing UL listing?

Goonies and The Who are both in the list of pinball IP. Does that mean that there are licenses that go along with those, or not?

#32133 1 year ago
Quoted from Inside:

Wow... that's an actual insurance one can get..

Yeah, but notice that the claim was denied. The denial was likely based on RM not being an "Employee" but being the head of everything.

#32135 1 year ago
Things-Are-Going-to-Start-Happening-FI (resized).jpgThings-Are-Going-to-Start-Happening-FI (resized).jpg
4 weeks later
#32243 1 year ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

The gist: Everything the SEC claims is BS, Bobby did nothing wrong, bring on the trial.

Also, if he did do anything wrong, it was only because his lawyer said it was OK, which makes it OK.
And he also wants the SEC to pay his legal fees, since he did nothing wrong.

I have no experience with anything like this, but I would guess that "Deny everything" is a standard legal defense tactic.

1 week later
#32305 1 year ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Robert is alleged to have started ponziing years prior to the pinball ventures

I have to say that I love the word "Ponziing", which I think Blueberry just invented.

And it doesn't matter WHY Robert decieved his investors and lost their money, he decieved his investors and lost their money.

#32374 1 year ago

Don't do the criming.

#32383 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

He was buying their life insurance policies. The whole business model was built around them dying sooner than later.

That was the "cover".
The real business was convincing people to give him money, which he promised to invest by buying life insurance policies, but in fact used for a badly pinball run pinball business and personal expenses.
The problem is that he wasn't buying life insurance policies like he claimed he would.

1 month later
#32412 1 year ago

I saw "No Cognizable Basis" open for "Criminal Prosecution" in 1985. Awesome show!

#32431 1 year ago
Quoted from toyotaboy:

I'd be curious if this was part of the 60 million, or is this beyond (which would make the total 70 million).

It reads as though about $500K was Deeproot and the remainder was some other separate scam.
So not really part of Deeproot, but I don't think would add the remainder to Deeproot as it's a whole other thing.
Too many scams out there to keep track of these days.

OOPs - OG below is correct. $1,500K not $500K.

1 month later
#32499 1 year ago
Quoted from ufotofu:

looks like Bobby's trial date is set for October 16th, 2023

I didn't know that criminal charges were pending.
Are you sure that's not a civil trial?

#32529 1 year ago

Recruiter : Have you ever been convicted of a felony or a misdemeanor? That's robbery, rape, car theft, that sort of thing.

John Winger : Convicted? No.

Russell Ziskey : Never convicted.

RM : Not yet, anyway.

1 week later
#32542 1 year ago

Greeeaaat.
Another drawn out series of non-informative teasers.
I can hardly wait.

Edit: Turner should do some sort of fantastic five day reveal!
Call it five days of Turneroot.

#32549 1 year ago
Quoted from Valorguy:

Am I missing a piece of info here - how does this relate to the Deeproot fiasco?

The suspicious part is that he provided computer services to deeproot and seemed to have a working relationship with RM.

#32599 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Stating something as serious as that without factual basis is careless, irresponsible, and could be considered libel. As a side effect, if someone actually believed you, they could potentially retaliate against him for the alleged action.

This sure sounds like giving legal advice without a license.
Seems like we've been warned about that before........................

#32637 1 year ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

Ben the waters are still warm, & the pool of new manufacturers keep on coming out of the woods. All the small pinball manufacturers around the world getting into the pool. You just need to be ready to burn a shitload of cash. Surprised no one is talking about Mirco getting into the cabinet business in Europe. You would guess he is looking into expanding with the European manufacturers. Chris Turner would likely know in Texas, where Deeproot Pinball was thinking of getting cabinets & playfields done. Like I keep dropping hints over the years the 2 parties were not up North for west to east that I was dealing with in the USA.
Those parties still might be thinking of testing the waters since the selling price of new games still has not hit the ceiling yet, & continue to drive up all old pinball games in price. Better than the stock market over the last 25 years. Pinball is super hot in the home market, & still cold on location. Very few operators buying multiple new games in my region, mostly just one from the pool of major pinball manufacturers.

Please stop.

14
#32656 1 year ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

Deeproot Pinball was interested in me moving to Texas & working there, but I was not going before I got my pension. Same with Andrew Heighway

Do you still not understand that both of those companies were GIANT SCAMS?

That's like saying you were offered an executive position at Worldcom or Enron.

1 month later
#32734 10 months ago

Well, when you have to defend the indefensible maybe "My lawyer said I could" is better than nothing.

2 weeks later
#32772 10 months ago
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

With all the hubbub about JJP and Harry Potter, surprised Robert never intimated deeproot would or did obtain that license.

Copyright enforcement is pretty agressive on something like Harry Potter. That would get shut down hard in an instant, and even Robert wasn't dumb enough to try a scam like that.

1 month later
#32804 9 months ago

Robert won't want to admit to anything with potential criminal charges yet to come.
A drawn out civil trial is nothing compared to a criminal trial.

4 weeks later
#32819 8 months ago

I'm still thinking Robert can't agree to any civil charge settlement without exposing himself (even more) to criminal liability, which I hope is still coming.

4 weeks later
#32859 7 months ago
Quoted from wolftownjeff:

This is one of all time best Pinside lessons in business.

Is that lesson "Don't be a crook."?
'Cause I think it is.

Edit: Also want to give Bbjohnson huge thanks for continuing the updates on ElRoberto, the crook.

#32885 6 months ago
Quoted from toyotaboy:

No it would be more like if I dropped off the car for an oil change, he asks for the money upfront. I drop it off and come back later. When I return the oil change isn't done because the mechanic spent my money on slot machines next door and lost, and now has no money to do said oil change. I ask for a refund and he tells me to take it to court.

This is good, and I don't want to get carried away, but.................
It's like he also borrowed money from widows and orphans to start the oil change business, and blew that on slot machines too.

1 month later
#33096 5 months ago
Quoted from sgtski1978:

SEC response is due today. Guessing the TL;DR of it will be along the lines of "Everything that guy just said is bullshit. Thank you."

Nailed it!

"Robert Mueller’s Response to the Securities and Exchange Commission’s (“SEC” or “Commission”) Motion for Summary Judgment (“Mueller’s Response,” cited herein as “Resp.,” Dkt. 108, 108-1 to 108-19),1 fails to identify any genuine disputes of material fact. Instead, Mueller manufactures questions of fact where none exist by making self-serving statements unsupported by the record or applying flawed legal interpretations"

2 weeks later
#33176 5 months ago
Quoted from Inside:

Holy crap, the entire fund had $1000 in its account on average:

If it wasn't for those meddling SEC kids, he would have returned all the money and provided a handsome profit through his shrewd pinball investment.

1 month later
#33354 3 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

I still don't understand what Robert was actually trying to accomplish with his pinball endeavor.

I think pinball was his "cover plan" for when the investment Ponzi scheme eventually collapsed. I think he aiways knew the "investment fund" scheme would inevitably implode, and he planned to point to the unsuccessful, but "legitimate" pinball business as where all the money went.

"See, I'm just a bad businessman, not a scammer and a thief."

1 month later
#33413 66 days ago

Thank you to Blueberry and Inside for all your work so the rest of us can play along.

Also, it would be interesting to end up on the jury for this fiasco, if and when it goes to trial. It would be mostly (I think) terribly boring with brief periods of hilarity when the defense presents its ridiculous arguments about how using money for personal expenses and a (hilariously poorly run) failed pinball company were completely legitimate under the advertised terms of the investment fund.

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