(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread


By pin2d

2 years ago



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  • Latest reply 3 days ago by razorsedge
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Topic index (key posts)

10 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #111 Firsthand information from the Magic Girl programmer. Posted by applejuice (2 years ago)

Post #3026 RAZA promotional video Posted by vireland (9 months ago)

Post #5771 First RAZA gameplay video Posted by ZMeny (71 days ago)

Post #5874 RAZA video with more audible game sounds Posted by zaphX (70 days ago)

Post #5926 First RAZA video with successful ramp completion Posted by zaphX (70 days ago)

Post #5967 Another RAZA gameplay video Posted by flynnibus (70 days ago)

Post #6050 Closeup pictures of key playfield features Posted by Potatoloco (69 days ago)

Post #6133 Video of display animations Posted by LateCenturyMods (68 days ago)

Post #6329 Summary of Robert Mueller's interview Posted by jeffspinballpalace (66 days ago)

Post #6724 RAZA Gameplay video Posted by DS_Nadine (60 days ago)


Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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-28
#5606 72 days ago

Thinking this is a nice effort pinball machine, but non licensed theme is not going to cut it or hold value, like traditional licensed machines do. Zombies are so passé now. Like the effort to reduce crazy pricing in pinball, but until licensed games are released, they’re no threat to Stern. Who wouldn’t rather have a licensed popular theme that already has a huge following like JP, over RAZA for similar money? Could be good if it is selling way below a Stern Pro and then not being worried about resale value, because most can afford to just keep it.

Also, who wouldn’t be willing to pay $5500 for JP theme over RAZA (unknown theme) if sold even as low as $5000? Haven’t we learned that unlicensed themes don’t sell well to 2nd hand market? Octoberfest? Houdini? Cosmic Carnival? America’s Most Haunted? Whoa Nellie?

But do hope this all goes well, because we need the pricing competition so badly. Stern pricing has to stabilize and even come down. JJP is way out of whack pricing wise.

-4
#5613 72 days ago

To “humble the competition” and not worry about it being a non licensed theme, think it needs to sell around the $3k to $3500 mark. That would have the power to change the crazy inflated high pricing in pinball. Many people would then become interested in pinball, instead think we are crazy paying such ridiculous current high prices.

-2
#5618 72 days ago
Quoted from Coz:

Medieval madness, AFM, CV, Theater of Magic, cactus canyon, etc are all unlicensed themes that not only held their value but are now worth 2-4 times their original price. I’m curious to see how these new Deeproot games are priced. If they are less than a stern pro, then it will be very interesting

Agree with your examples, but that was a very different market 25 years ago. None of those machines were meant for the home and sold for far less than today’s in home machines. They command prices because of nostalgia, from so many playing years ago in an arcade.

#5628 71 days ago

Issue with this prototype is, what on it is actually real and not just a placeholder???

A. PF is not actual DR PF.
B. All artwork is place holder, not real.
C. Even innovative mechs not present.

How may we judge anything, when nothing is the actual finished product?

However, if this drives down pricing and creates better competition, seeing something is better than nothing. Hoping this all works out. If it does, it can only be good for us.

-27
#5658 71 days ago

This is hilarious: a new Trojan horse rolls into town with some on lookers fawning all over it. Something smells, as DR investors might be being scammed (For example: DR built an unneeded auditorium, instead of building and selling even their first machine - do like everyone else does and show at a convention and save investor money for building up inventories of something that actually brings in revenue - pinball machines). Some people are giving DR kudos for JPop work done years ago when he had Zidware.

Sure they haven’t taken pinball money yet, so some are giving DR a pass, but what about the poor DR investors??? Their money is being spent like no tomorrow $750,000.00 (DR claimed expenditure figures, not mine) a month and this is all they have to show for years of work??? A machine that DR claims is not the finished version and almost everything on the machine is going to change? Wow, are we expected to believe the Trojan horse is a great gift? Looking at this, causes great concerns. Hope the investors don’t lose out on their hard earned investment monies, because if this is all they have at this point in the business cycle that began 2016/17 and I we’re an investor, I’d be worried big time. Hope what appears to be possible isn’t. Just my opinion from looking at it closer.

DR confirmed game list is JPop titles he began years ago.

(Unless observations are nothing but positive...downvotes)

#5663 71 days ago
Quoted from JodyG:

I am as big of a DR skeptic as anyone, but for the love of god...at least get your facts straight. Its 750k a month, not 7.5 million.

Thanks, corrected it. Still a very high figure for what has been shown to date.

-5
#5831 70 days ago

After watching that video, Stern, JJP, CGC and Spooky have nothing to fear, unless it is priced really well.

#5998 70 days ago
Quoted from zaphX:

I spent most of my time at the show playing RAZA. I really like it and I’m excited about it.
I’ll go into more detail later, but here’s the best quality video I was able to get. It was right when the show opened, so it wasn’t very loud yet. You can hear the game sounds.

Don’t beat up on anyone’s videos. One machine was under a super bright light, the other was super dark. Neither was easy to shoot, especially if the person playing was not someone you know. You wanted to give them space.
I do wish I’d had my streaming rig for this.

Thanks for sharing this video. Gives a better feel for RAZA imo. It does look fun to shoot. Were you able to get a ball in the Ferris wheel? Haven’t seen anyone do that yet?

#6002 70 days ago
Quoted from zaphX:

Yes I did! I think one of the two videos shows a ball cycling through the wheel.

Have only seen the one video you took. Is there another one?

#6003 70 days ago
Quoted from razorsedge:

It is hard to notice but the ferris wheel operation is seen in some video linked in here. Watching again you see things happening that you didn't see, or happened too fast, the first viewing. The video quality does make it a challenge of course, but it is good to have something rather than nothing.
Thankyou to everyone putting up videos for us! ... please don't stop, most of us appreciate it and take it for what it is.
The first video provided by Zach may have missed the ball actually going around the right ramp.... but it does show that the ball makes it all the way, easily, and the rection of the player making the shot... which sounded to me like it was a very Positive reaction. So thanks Zach, the video you sourced is as good as any of the other videos put up here so far. Cheers!

Zach’s video is appreciated. I wonder if rather than trying to scour this thread for these videos, if the videos mentioned showing the main mechs working could be posted in one post?

3 weeks later
#6909 45 days ago
Quoted from doghouse:

Yeah, it doesn't feel like free unless you kissed the money goodbye years and years ago like I did. Then it kinda feels "free".

Absolutely. If they don't succeed it'll just be plain depressing. All that wasted talent, time and resources.... And there are dozens of factors that could cause Deeproot not to succeed as a company. The top three in my opinion: 1. The initial games are full of lots of Jpop-inspired "stuff," but just aren't any fun to play. The videos I've seen on-line of the RAZA prototypes worried me a little. Until we see/play the finished games the jury is still out. 2. The company has spent too much on start-up and can't sell enough games to recoup before they just run out of money. 3. They just can't get the hardest part right-- i.e. manufacturing the actual games.

Yeah, Jpop really does seem like a fraud. In my worldview he would now have a much different reputation if he had just admitted in public that he screwed up and didn't have any business running a company. And if he had ever apologized to ANYONE. Which to the best of my knowledge, he never has. We as human beings tend to be VERY forgiving of those that sincerely admit they screwed-up. And because Jpop never did this he will always seem to people like us, who he screwed, a true asshole and fraud.

If DP doesn’t have all the markings of a Ponzi scheme, I don’t know what does.

1. Instead of Jpop messing with early adopters money: DP instead is messing with investors money. To date not Manufactering a thing, except showing an old prototype that was probably mostly done when JPop began working on RAZA 8 years ago. Can’t believe that is all they have to show for DPs 5 years of effort.

2. Working on a dozen prototypes, instead of trying to get game one done and out the door is very fishy. How can any company survive, pay all those people and building/buisness overhead and keep their head above water??? It makes zero sense in the world of business, unless investor money is just being burned through: which appears to be almost reckless abandon.

3. They had to show something to satisfy investors, so they showed a prototype game and pushed launch date back again. To date, there has only been Robert shooting his mouth off about how DP will change the industry. And now, saying he is losing interest in pinball, which smacks of a Ponzi scheme running out of things to tell people. All the while, putting their money into the hype train chain letter.

We in the pinball world are willing to believe DP is going to change pinball for the better, because DP promises more pinball, quality, etc.; all for less money. Seems to good to be true. We will find out next year, end of March, unless they move the date again.

1 week later
#6944 34 days ago

R&M announced....Stranger Things announced....

RAZA...

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#6965 30 days ago
Quoted from Extraballz:

I don’t care if DR is likable
I don’t care if DR bragged
I don’t care that DR is behind where they thought they would be
I only care that there is a new pin company that could possibly make quality machines with features and mechs like the 90s B/W. I am still excited with what DR could possibly do. I mean do we ever think a company like Stern is going to make machines like the 90s B/W? Maybe companies like Spooky or CGC will keep making better and better quality pins. Imagine a pin company starts making pins and people start comparing these new games with the greats of old. That company would just take off in the pin world. The appetite is certainly there for pins with the 90s features and quality. Question is will any company figure this out and actually pull it off. I for one hope so..........good luck Deeproot!

We all want to see prices come down and better quality for those very high prices, but come on, 90s B/W quality is a huge fallacy and not really true. I was just speaking with a guy that has been an operator for over 45 years in the pinball business. He refurbs pinball machines as well.

He states that there never was any high quality coming from 90s B/W and those machines broke down all the time. Had so many issues, but because there wasn’t any internet or home owners, just locations running them, issues were fixed on location without any fanfare, unlike today.

He pointed to his locations huge selection of 90s B/W machines and told me of all the many issues each one had (I was intrigued, because of always hearing what quality came from 90s B/W). (Cover your eyes Stern haters, cause your not going to like what he said next). He said pointing to all his Stern machines, they just work and he hardly has to touch them, other than routine maintenance, that every pinball machine needs from time to time.

That said, Stern needs to continue to be vigilant on better Playfield quality and bring prices down. Sad day: Stern releases Stranger Things and ups prices again. When Stern are you going to stop this price raising madness? Hopefully DR can give some kind of competition with lower pricing and even higher quality. Just wonder if DR will eventually file for chapter 7 as well? The way they are spending money, with no real product ever being sold and delivered. Kind of sounds like Zidware 2.0, doesn’t it???

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