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(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

2 years ago

Topic Stats

  • 13,767 posts - Hot topic!
  • 869 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 12 minutes ago by russdx
  • Topic is favorited by 231 Pinsiders


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Topic index (key posts)

17 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #111 Firsthand information from the Magic Girl programmer. Posted by applejuice (2 years ago)

Post #3026 RAZA promotional video Posted by vireland (1 year ago)

Post #5771 First RAZA gameplay video Posted by ZMeny (1 year ago)

Post #5874 RAZA video with more audible game sounds Posted by zaphX (1 year ago)

Post #5926 First RAZA video with successful ramp completion Posted by zaphX (1 year ago)

Post #5967 Another RAZA gameplay video Posted by flynnibus (1 year ago)

Post #6050 Closeup pictures of key playfield features Posted by Potatoloco (1 year ago)

Post #6133 Video of display animations Posted by LateCenturyMods (1 year ago)

Post #6329 Summary of Robert Mueller's interview Posted by jeffspinballpalace (1 year ago)

Post #6724 RAZA Gameplay video Posted by DS_Nadine (1 year ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#836 2 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Supposed to see 5 different model games at Texas Pinball Festival 2019 and all available for purchase with no wait time. That's my recollection and I would feel better if Robert or someone can confirm or correct me.

Ok so that is what the 5 days of Deeproot is?... a new game reveal everyday for 5 days?

1 month later
#999 2 years ago
Quoted from Fulltilt:

I got NOTHING but a t-shirt from Jpop.

Wait!, what? You got shirt? Some kind of favoritism going on here, I didn’t even get a shirt from JPOP.. you are one of the lucky ones

2 weeks later
#1086 2 years ago
Quoted from bob_e:

First you have to make a PROFIT for tax write off.

Reminds me of the underwear gnome episode of South Park...

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2 months later
#1597 2 years ago
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3 months later
#2348 1 year ago


Quoted from TigerLaw:

No...he did something much worse, he sued his own customers that he took money from when he failed to deliver the product.

I try not to be bitter about that little nugget of insanity I take comfort in the fact that John used our money wisely... Range Rover's, Vanity plates and 1000+ trips to Starbuck for Pinball/Macchiato brainstorming sessions.

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2 months later
#2713 1 year ago
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

Deeproot will be #1 in pinball soon enough. Trust me.

They certainly seem to have some sort of plan...

1 week later
#3038 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

People tend to reap what they sow.

Playing arts and crafts ?

You really need to read the threads when things were coming apart and people started legal proceedings. The word "good" doesn't come to mind with what was going on.
LTG : )

100% agree with LTG!

#3218 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

You aren’t in the lawsuit are you Fulltilt?
Hopefully you took the credit?

Is it a printable credit or do you get a certificate in the mail?

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1 week later
#3276 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Regardless, a “credit” is worth 1000x more than some BS lawsuit

As long as your “credit” is good towards a commercial grade machine and not a Zizzle

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#3309 1 year ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

Sorry I pushed your buttons. Hopefully we get some good news from deeproot soon!

Quoted from iceman44:

It's all good Matt! And all on me, i acted terribly out of frustration so let's all carry on in good fun and peace brother.
Robert confirmed receipt of my Goodwill Agreement so it seems like some news is around the corner for us all. Thinking first of June after deadline of May 31st to get claims finalized?

Good form guys

1 month later
#3706 1 year ago
Quoted from branlon8:

Grammar and spelling mistakes are an indication that people can‘t be bothered to proofread their posts.

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3 weeks later
#4118 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

What do you mean there "aren't that many zidware customers getting anything from Deeproot"?
If you had spent money with John you are getting back in the form or cash or a game/games

Ice when you have a moment please post your Deeproot game unboxing pics or a picture of your refund check!?
The point is that until you can do one of these two things, you have received nothing but promises and you and I have gotten a belly full of those over the last 5 years on this journey.
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#4124 1 year ago
Quoted from wolfemaaan:

So when are these machines coming out?

#4155 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

Not everyone thinks the guy is a clown because he was willing to give up his career to point out that some cops are fucking assholes.

Get this bullshit out of here! .. let’s get back to pinball, anyone have any thoughts on Octo-manufacturing?

2 weeks later
#4331 1 year ago
Quoted from Drano:

I opted for a payout and have been made whole.
I won't get into details, but due to the amount of my deposit, the terms of the payout were more beneficial than taking a machine.
I have refrained from any comment to this point and opted to simply wait and see if Deeproot would 'walk the walk'.
Say what you like, but Robert has lived up to his word and, regardless of what happens next, I say his actions have earned him a seat at the table.
I will certainly be watching Deeproot more closely and, if I can support them in future, I certainly will.

Things like this make me think this company is legit, good form Deeproot!

1 month later
#4838 1 year ago
Quoted from Manic:

Like when we furiously built model car and airplane kits as kids. Not knowing the high was the real addiction.

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1 month later
#5069 1 year ago

So nothing out of the Deeproot team at expo?

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#5083 1 year ago
Quoted from Fulltilt:

Because Houston is the promise?

I thought I heard they were bringing some cabinets and maybe a white wood game to expo, I must have heard wrong.

#5106 1 year ago
Quoted from pinballonthemark:

Let’s see what Deeproot showcases at Houston Pinball and Arcade Expo and go from there. We are all making speculation until they deliver something for us to see and play. Keep in mind many pinheads were fascinated by the white wood of TNA at TPF and there obviously was no artwork, but people really liked the design and how it played. It ended up being a huge hit for Danesi and Spooky. And it didn’t have any special mechs. It is all about how fun the game plays. If we get that from Deeproot it will not matter how it looks, but how it plays.
If Robert wants us to focus on the mechs as well as test them I think that is the right approach. He wants input from us Pinsiders. If the mechs have contraptions that do things to the ball that are revolutionary and are reliable, it will be something we all want in pinball like we experienced in the 90’s era of Williams and Bally as kids/young adults. If not, then people have valid arguments for all the statements Robert promises to deliver. I think it is a smart move to not show the finished product as of yet. They want to field test it and see people’s reactions and listen to their feedback. Then they make the improvements and modifications to manufacture the game and it will be shipped in a timely manner. Better than having a game displayed in production stage and then have complications causing delay in shipment like we experienced from other companies. If we are intrigued and mesmerized by the design and shot layout by itself, it will be safe to say the game will speak volumes when it is at its finished state.
We can express our opinions after we see what Deeproot reveals, but all this negativity towards a company promising to deliver a world under glass is disheartening. Don’t we want any pinball company to succeed so we can play more variety of games? It seems like the majority of this thread wants to see Deeproot fail! Don’t we want to see competition in the pinball market so we have better pricing, better features, and better themes that we expect from pinball companies? We spend our hard earned money on EXPENSIVE toys. We deserve to have games that wow us. Lately, we have experienced the same cookie cutter designs that are getting old and not showing any innovation. But even with the cookie cutter approach the games can still be fun to play, if the rules are set up in a way that makes us as pinball players want to have that one more game feeling to beat the game.
Now imagine if the rules are deep, but simple to understand, mechs are new designs we have never seen, artwork blows our mind, coding/animation is top notch comparable to the video game industry, and pricing is at lower costs with high quality we have a winner on our hands. That is what Robert is conveying. Let’s hope Deeproot delivers our expectations.
Here are the 5 Positive Things About Deeproot we can reflect on:
1. Robert reimbursed money lost from Popadiuk‘s business failure to people who got burned not receiving their machines.
2. Deeproot has a collaborative mindset dream team of experienced designers/engineers that made awesome games in the past that we loved as kids and enthralled us into that magical experience what got us into pinball in the first place.
3. Deeproot has Steven Bowden employed with rules and code development in a collaborative team of experts in the industry.
4. Deeproot has a huge manufacturing facility ready to produce games.
5. Deeproot has its own animation department to develop original stories and themes to go along with the games.
Let’s wait and see and reserve judgement. Then when everything is ready to go let the Pinside Forum about Deeproot become more relevant and meaningful in our conversations.
I want Deeproot to succeed and for Popadiuk to redeem himself as one of the most prolific designers in the pinball industry! For those that express disappointment for Popadiuk let’s give him another chance to wow us as kids all over again with his designs and allow Deeproot to make this happen. For the remaining designers and engineers I can’t wait to see what they imagine and make into reality. What a great time for pinball to succeed and flourish in our lifetime. Let’s focus on that!

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3 weeks later
#6048 1 year ago
Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

Such a Dark Knight for pinside watching all these veteran pinsiders pushing their agenda over their hard on for John

John is not a good guy! I know this from my personal dealings with him, that said I will reserve judgement on RAZA until I play it myself.

#6054 1 year ago
Quoted from Potatoloco:

A few minutes of gameplay video including zombie multiball.

Your video went from good to great when the music blaring the same lyrics over and over again in the background stopped. The game looks fun to shoot, I wonder if it was suffering from the low voltage issues that are common at shows. Seems like a bit more flipper strength and the ramp shot would be makable.

#6118 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Yep. That was 5 years ago when it all started to crumble down after that Expo. We were right there on the front row pushing and prodding Jpop right after that debacle weren’t we.
Hard to believe 5 years have blown by since then Frolic!
Jpop, on his own, had ZERO chance to deliver anything other than a box with random shit in it.

What the hell were we thinking back then? It all seems so clear to me now

#6572 1 year ago
Quoted from PoppyCock:

This place has RDS, Robert Derangement Syndrome.

More like Robert has PDS, Pinside derangement syndrome.

Disclaimer: I am an admitted member of the Pinside “sewer”

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#6580 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

We need a cool embroidered patch to wear at pinball events to show our membership. Like the biker gangs 1% patch.
LTG : )

Fantastic idea!

1 month later
#6954 11 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

How can they release RAZA when they do not own the IP?

Very interesting question/observation!

#6961 11 months ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

They have the rights to use it based on the deal zidware made with deeproot ages ago.
Zidware only just recently filed for chapter 7 (nov 21)... it would be a tall order for them to go all the way back to the deeproot deal and unravel it.
Cointaker is not the largest debior according to the chapter7 filing... it's American Pinball. Their filing lists IP assets, but the first and only secured debtor is... wait for it... Deeproot.
Zidware will liquidate... and deeproot will collect their IP pieces while everyone else fights for the scraps left as they sell off JPOP's garage contents.
Look at the filing and see who is paying for Zidware's chapter 7... wait for it... it's deeproot (paying the attorney).
Full chapter 7 filing
[quoted image]

We shall see

#6980 11 months ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

You are passing judgment without even understanding anything about the subject....

As are you, there is more to this story that will eventually come out and that is all I can say at this time.

1 week later
#7095 10 months ago
Quoted from russdx:

I remember the podcast quite well and I also noticed when he mentioned his own money and it was not investor money, thought this was a bit strange.

K-Man just reposted the original podcast

#7106 10 months ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Kaneda asked, "How are the investors feeling right now? Are they on board for the long run?"
RM replied: "There are no investors in pinball. It's company money, it's my money.
There's additional verbiage in that one minute segment by each, but that's the meat of it. Personally, I found it ambiguous and now understand the confusion.
Go to the 53 minute mark and listen for yourself.

I wonder if this means that RM paid for JPOP’s bankruptcy out of his own pocket?

1 week later
#7276 10 months ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Here is my pledge right now.
If i want a DR game in the future i'll buy one myself.
I want my $4950 that i lost to Jpop, refused to file a lawsuit against him, and got a credit from DR, to go to pinball charity guys, Ken Cromwell et al
Send a game or the $$$ if DR will agree to it. I see the airfare, hotel rooms etc. going to deserving people but i'd like to give my lesser amount to charity versus airfare, hotels and whatever else
Can we make that happen?

Your the man Ice!

2 months later
1 week later
#8360 7 months ago

I just listened to K-mans interview, I thought it was good but I take issue with Roberts statement that Deeproot created RAZA from nothing. I was an original RAZA buyer who gave JPOP my hard earned money and received nothing in return. I was in the owners blog for years and watched RAZA develop, there are plenty of things used from the original design that were funded by us JPOP customers and are now being used by Deeproot.

#8378 7 months ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Except that they didn't just hire a designer, they also bought and used his designs...designs which had been financed (some would say via fraud) by others.


#8382 7 months ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

To the point they created a settlement offer for zidware customers (including cash layout offers) to get people to 1) drop any lawsuits against zidware (and thus clean up the air around DR's absorption of the assets) and 2) become the first faithful cheering DR on. Maybe some of this was supposed to make DR look like a White Knight in the hobby and thus garner positive customer sentiment... but I think it was 95% about getting the stink off JPOP so DR could move forward with JPOP and Zidware assets 'free and clear'.
Problem was... not everyone took the offer. The anchors on Zidware still exist to this day.

Very good post! The only thing I would add is that I was never offered a settlement (free game) from Deeproot to drop out of the lawsuit, from what I saw only those not in the lawsuit were offered a free game.

5 months later
#12008 56 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

John proudly gave me a Bally Pinball Wizard t-shirt he'd faithfully reproduced. Between that and the couple nice Zidware shirts he gave me over the years, seems like dude missed his calling.

If JPOP’s calling was to be a T-shirt manufacturer I think he would of found a way to screw that up too!

I often wonder how many Frappuccino’s and Macchiatos John bought at starbucks with the money I sent him.

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