Boulder, CO
.
(Topic ID: 203700)
Linked Games
Alice in Wonderland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2013-
Celts
Haggis, 2021
-
Magic Girl
Zidware Pinball USA, 2017
-
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2012
-
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Arcade Edition)
Deeproot, 2020
-
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Xtra Edition)
Deeproot, 2020
Topic Gallery
Quoted from adol75:Same page, this exact same comment marked the end of my interest for Deeproot.
I'm not that sensitive since I'm only a player. But this is the kind of attitude I personally want to see. I want them to shoot for the moon and I hope they don't step on their **** in the process. I want Deeproot to change the landscape and raise the bar, just as JJP has done.
Frankly, any new game must do something 'special' in order for me to 'upgrade' my current game collection.
Quoted from PoppyCock:You guys are waiting on games and some are waiting on refunds but it doesn't sound like either one is happening, good luck to all!
Robert is on Pinside, yes? It would be good to hear whether they still plan to launch more games in 2019 than any other manufacturer.
Quoted from Reznnate:I'm not that sensitive since I'm only a player. But this is the kind of attitude I personally want to see. I want them to shoot for the moon and I hope they don't step on their **** in the process. I want Deeproot to change the landscape and raise the bar, just as JJP has done.
Frankly, any new game must do something 'special' in order for me to 'upgrade' my current game collection.
It's the type of comment I would hope to get from players and clients, otherwise it's pure bragging.
Then putting down the competition while having done nothing, shown nothing and postponed some pseudo release dates for games that don't exist becomes a bit too much to keep any kind of excitement from me.
But then you know, as someone once said, Pinball is easy !
Quoted from johnnyutah:Interesting.[quoted image]
If they really exist, in the described scale, their animation studios and all the story boarding and code people certainly aren't primarily for pinball - how ever large they may dream of being.
Presumably any pinball machine they do will have game and digital pinball tie-ins, or vice versa.
The problem is, the former will probably end up either running hugely behind or holding up the latter, and involve much greater costs, lower margins & lower revenue.
If games or digital pinball sell decently well for them, and there's a viable business, I can see them abandoning physical pinball either before or very after shortly their first title(s) launch.
Friend of mine received his goodwill money from Deeproot today. He’s not on Pinside so figure I’d share his news.
Quoted from jonesjb:Robert is on Pinside, yes? It would be good to hear whether they still plan to launch more games in 2019 than any other manufacturer.
Again, whenever he speaks, its a public relations nightmare. Best he just get the financing and best Stern, and JJP and AP in the market. Thus far, its been more Robert, less besting.
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:Friend of mine received his goodwill money from Deeproot today. He’s not on Pinside so figure I’d share his news.
Interesting. There are a LOT of people on pinside who signed up, so they should be receiving similar payoffs soon
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:Interesting. There are a LOT of people on pinside who signed up, so they should be receiving similar payoffs soon
Assuming anyone took the payout and didn’t hold out for games - haven’t seen anyone on Pinside report that they asked for the cash yet.
Düsseldorf
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:Friend of mine [...is...] not on Pinside [...].
You have wise friends. 
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:Interesting. There are a LOT of people on pinside who signed up, so they should be receiving similar payoffs soon
And how exactly do you know this to be a fact?
For instance, I don't recall seeing a poll along the lines of, 'Are you part of the Goodwill claimants?'
Quoted from Roostking:Again, whenever he speaks, its a public relations nightmare.
Well if he refunds all those who asked for refunds then his public relations would go up tenfold. Actions speak louder than words... sounds like someone above got their refund so they just might be the real deal after all!
Quoted from mrbillishere:And how exactly do you know this to be a fact?
For instance, I don't recall seeing a poll along the lines of, 'Are you part of the Goodwill claimants?'
I don’t - I shouldn’t have stated it as if it was fact. There’s been a lot of discussion on the site - I suppose I should have said “there seems to be a lot of people on the site...” what I was trying to get at was that I would expect to see others mentioning this soon.
Quoted from deeproot:....You mean like a GB that won’t turn on half the time, the two brand new premium Batman 66’s I bought that are already more dimpled than the moon and with broken mechs already..
Now deeproot is going to build those elusive dimple-resistant wood playfields. I can't wait.
Quoted from SadSack:Now deeproot is going to build those elusive dimple-resistant wood playfields. I can't wait.
Transparent aluminum is the key tech here.
Quoted from SadSack:Now deeproot is going to build those elusive dimple-resistant wood playfields.
my recollection is that it was kinda/sorta guaranteed.
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:In this interview deeproot says that every playfield will be hit with a sledgehammer and if it leaves a mark the playfield will be rejected.
Quoted from deeproot:On the sledgehammer, maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but not a metaphor. Warranty for PF will be unheard of, so we take its durability seriously.
I requested a cash settlement and received my payment today as well. The deal was choose a game or half the amount deposited with JPOP if they had games available by the deadline. If they didn't have games available it would be the full amount deposited.
True to their word, I received my entire deposit back less a small charge for wire transfer. 
I hope they produce great games so I can give them their money back.
Quoted from Jvspin:I requested a cash settlement and received my payment today as well.
Did you get the cash from J.G. Wentworth?
Quoted from teekee:Well if he refunds all those who asked for refunds then his public relations would go up tenfold. Actions speak louder than words... sounds like someone above got their refund so they just might be the real deal after all!
I'm sure their investor team is pleased as well.
Quoted from o-din:I'm sure their investor team is pleased as well.
Happy customers spend more....
Quoted from rubberducks:If they really exist, in the described scale, their animation studios and all the story boarding and code people certainly aren't primarily for pinball - how ever large they may dream of being.
Their studio website only lists one developer, though they may have others in Texas.
Indie 2D video game timelines can sometimes be as short as 3-6 months -- when there are only one or two people involved. More people only increases dev time, it doesn't reduce it.
rubberducks I agree that making video games only complicates shipping pinball machines for them and adds a great deal of technical and financial risk to the entire venture. I'd like to see them succeed, and I want to believe this guy is the Elon Musk of pinball/video games, but there is no evidence of anything but a lot of smart people spending a lot of money.
They should never have opened their mouths until they had something to show. But now that they've made such astonishingly bold claims on so many fronts, they have to fulfill them or forever be the butt of many jokes, and every day they fail to show progress only creates more dogpiles.
Quoted from rubberducks:If games or digital pinball sell decently well for them, and there's a viable business, I can see them abandoning physical pinball either before or very after shortly their first title(s) launch.
I seriously doubt there is much money to be made in digital pinball. There never has been, not sure why there would be all of a sudden. Hell, there's not much money to be made as a pinball manufacturer! If there was, we'd see a big entertainment company like Electronic Arts making pinball. This is why Bally/Williams shut down their pinball mfg. They were selling plenty of pins, they just made way more cash selling slot machines.
Quoted from Brijam:I seriously doubt there is much money to be made in digital pinball. There never has been, not sure why there would be all of a sudden
I think there was a virtual pinball company that was trying to be coin-op with existing titles, I never heard anything more about them.
Then there was another company that was trying to turn digital pinball into a gambling device in vegas, I don't think anything went beyond a few test units in Ny, NY
Mississauga, ON
I opted for a payout and have been made whole.
I won't get into details, but due to the amount of my deposit, the terms of the payout were more beneficial than taking a machine.
I have refrained from any comment to this point and opted to simply wait and see if Deeproot would 'walk the walk'.
Say what you like, but Robert has lived up to his word and, regardless of what happens next, I say his actions have earned him a seat at the table.
I will certainly be watching Deeproot more closely and, if I can support them in future, I certainly will.
Good to hear some folks are getting cash payouts. That is good.
Still skeptical though that they can deliver on the manufacturing of multiple games etc to the tune of the hyperbole.
Time marches on.
Quoted from Drano:Say what you like, but Robert has lived up to his word and, regardless of what happens next, I say his actions have earned him a seat at the table
Does this mean that you think he’ll meet his word of delivering all those pinball machines in 2019 like he said? Even if they all launch in December it would still mean he’s done it.
Quoted from Drano:I opted for a payout and have been made whole.
I won't get into details, but due to the amount of my deposit, the terms of the payout were more beneficial than taking a machine.
I have refrained from any comment to this point and opted to simply wait and see if Deeproot would 'walk the walk'.
Say what you like, but Robert has lived up to his word and, regardless of what happens next, I say his actions have earned him a seat at the table.
I will certainly be watching Deeproot more closely and, if I can support them in future, I certainly will.
Things like this make me think this company is legit, good form Deeproot!
There’s always been lots of cash and some very happy pin industry people with regular pay checks. Not sure a few refunds makes any difference with shipping machines.
Quoted from toyotaboy:I think there was a virtual pinball company that was trying to be coin-op with existing titles, I never heard anything more about them.
Then there was another company that was trying to turn digital pinball into a gambling device in vegas, I don't think anything went beyond a few test units in Ny, NY
I only watched part of the video but I didn't quite understand how they turned digital pinball into a gambling device, it seemed very confusing. Their pacman rip-off was funny though.
Quoted from Brijam:I only watched part of the video but I didn't quite understand how they turned digital pinball into a gambling device, it seemed very confusing. Their pacman rip-off was funny though.
Part of it was skill to earn money, I think part of it was gambling on whether you were going to make a shot? (IE put a set amount into a pot that says I'm going to make it). I agree its too confusing even to a pinball player. i cant imagine what the average person thought of it.
It's all looking a lot more legit now refunds are coming through. Genuinely pleased for all of you who got refunds. Brilliant news - and this will go a long way towards improving dR's public image. From a PR perspective, surely now is the time for Robert to reveal more about his games? Are you there, Robert?
Quoted from frolic:There’s always been lots of cash and some very happy pin industry people with regular pay checks. Not sure a few refunds makes any difference with shipping machines.
I think it makes a huge difference. How many other manufacturers could offer such a payment before their first production? To me, this shows they are very far from insolvent, which means we're very likely to see at least one title, possibly more. This inspires confidence in me for sure. I just hope the PR is a new priority. I don't think some companies realize how easy it is to get a bad rep on here and just how badly it can hurt your bottom line. The solution is not rocket science: stay positive and ignore the trolls.
Quoted from FlippinJB:From a PR perspective, surely now is the time for Robert to reveal more about his games?
Disagree. Assuming deeproot wants to sell games (and not just capture our collective attention for 48 hours until Stern or whoever announces the next hot title) the time to start talking again is when they're actually ready to go into production, and you can pay a distributor and get one in a month or less. Jersey Jack has said repeatedly that he's learned this expensive lesson, and won't be announcing future games until they're ready to roll.
Quoted from jonesjb:Does this mean that you think he’ll meet his word of delivering all those pinball machines in 2019 like he said? Even if they all launch in December it would still mean he’s done it.
I'm not willing to speculate on what he will or won't do. I'm simply stating that actions speak louder than words and, to this point, he has lived up to his word and acted accordingly... production delays notwithstanding. And, even then, he still lived up to the terms of the agreement and offered refunds. I think these are good indicators of character and intention. I'm not qualified to comment on Deeproot's ability to meet that production target.
Even if they don't, they would hardly be the first pinball manufacturer to overrun their project/delivery timelines and still be able to deliver solid machines.
Quoted from fosaisu:Disagree. Assuming deeproot wants to sell games (and not just capture out collective attention for 48 hours until Stern or whoever announces the next hot title) the time to start talking again is when they're actually ready to go into production, and you can pay a distributor and get one in a month or less. Jersey Jack has said repeatedly that he's learned this expensive lesson, and won't be announcing future games until they're ready to roll.
And he learns it again, every time. 
Sorry, no points are given for simply honoring a legally binding contract.
My opinion is that deeproot entered into a legal agreement with Zidware customers purely to reduce the threat of lawsuits.
deeproot chose to use Zidware's intellectual property. Given this decision, the need to shield deeproot from legal exposure from Zidware customers seems glaringly obvious to me.
I still look forward to playing what deeproot brings to market. But come on, honoring a legal contract doesn't prove good character. It's like saying paying your electric bill on time makes you a good person.
My hope for deeproot is that their CEO has all communication run through an editor, that they focus on one single kick-ass product, and they start rolling out at least monthly official updates to turn the tide of negativity and dog-piling that is trending.
Quoted from Brijam:deeproot chose to use Zidware's intellectual property. Given this decision, the need to shield deeproot from legal exposure from Zidware customers seems glaringly obvious to me.
Really? So you’re saying if I license technology from a company that has not honored its debts to other customers, I assume legal liability for those debts?
I interpreted the settlements with Zidware customers as a PR move to cover deeproot hiring JPop and using some of his old designs without immediately alienating 3/4 of the customer base. But I’m not following your legal argument.
Congrats to all those who got their money! I am truly happy for you as it breaks my heart when I am reminded of all the pinheads that have gotten screwed over the years by new companies. Every time I read the Lebowski thread, I want to scream, especially with what is currently happening with the 50 ARA games. Anyone who doesn’t respect the fact that Robert lived up to his word needs to get a clue! I feel he deserves a lot of credit and I plan on doing all I can to support this company in the future. I can easily forgive them for the foolish claims and hype they proudly boasted about when they first started............It was no more than excitement and passion for their product, which you have to have if you are to be successful. All I truly care about as a pinhead is a quality product from a quality company and as of now, they have 100% lived up to the second part. Go Deeproot!!!
I want to see the community made complete. Regardless of how large or small this action was, whether the intent was for PR or legal, I'm just glad individuals were made whole. Paying back a debt/obligation is a huge step in the right direction. Now we will hopefully see some games and people will begin to take delivery. I'm cheering for them because I think there can be a new creative vision added to pinball. They may not replace any of our current manufacturers. That's good. They can bring their own twist to the community and I will certainly support them in their venture once I see what they have to offer. Good luck. Hope to see your vision for pinball soon.
Quoted from thedarkknight77:Congrats to all those who got their money! Go Deeproot!
Is it wrong of me to hope that every payout is being deducted by Deeproot from Jpop's pay as part of a contract for his employment?
Quoted from SadSack:Now deeproot is going to build those elusive dimple-resistant wood playfields. I can't wait
Doesn't have to be wood playfields. If it is a wood, they will use some type of overlay like hardtop uses for playfield repair.
I opted for goodwill payment by check and received it today. So, I'm made whole too. Thanks deeproot!!!
Quoted from thedarkknight77:Congrats to all those who got their money! I am truly happy for you as it breaks my heart when I am reminded of all the pinheads that have gotten screwed over the years by new companies. Every time I read the Lebowski thread, I want to scream, especially with what is currently happening with the 50 ARA games. Anyone who doesn’t respect the fact that Robert lived up to his word needs to get a clue! I feel he deserves a lot of credit and I plan on doing all I can to support this company in the future. I can easily forgive them for the foolish claims and hype they proudly boasted about when they first started............It was no more than excitement and passion for their product, which you have to have if you are to be successful. All I truly care about as a pinhead is a quality product from a quality company and as of now, they have 100% lived up to the second part. Go Deeproot!!!
Renewed faith.
Quoted from fosaisu:Really? So you’re saying if I license technology from a company that has not honored its debts to other customers, I assume legal liability for those debts?
I interpreted the settlements with Zidware customers as a PR move to cover deeproot hiring JPop and using some of his old designs without immediately alienating 3/4 of the customer base. But I’m not following your legal argument.
So you're saying there's zero chance that a lawsuit would be brought without some kind of settlement offer like this? In my opinion, they did the math and this was way cheaper than fighting a potential lawsuit. Period.
I want deeproot to succeed and bring interesting pinball to the table. But no points should be awarded for honoring a legal agreement created to cover one's own ass.
I look forward to seeing any kind of update that shows an actual product is being worked on.
Quoted from Brijam:So you're saying there's zero chance that a lawsuit would be brought without some kind of settlement offer like this? In my opinion, they did the math and this was way cheaper than fighting a potential lawsuit. Period.
I want deeproot to succeed and bring interesting pinball to the table. But no points should be awarded for honoring a legal agreement created to cover one's own ass.
I look forward to seeing any kind of update that shows an actual product is being worked on.
If they acquired designs that are attached to debt, someone could sue. The company could just pay to license the designs and you could then sue Jpop for his profits. Or they could easily tweak the designs and have zero liability. We’d have to see if they even used any of his previous desires from zidware to see if there would be a chance for legal action. Doubtful that anyone wants to waste time and money to get their 7k or whatever back Anyway.
I personally see it as goodwill on their part as it would be easier to avoid any previous designs.
Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
Reply
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!
Donate to PinsideGreat to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
