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(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


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#29051 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from catwoman:

Does anybody know the deal with equipment and supplies from the Utah studio? Apologies if I missed that info, but I don’t recall seeing anything about what happened to items from that facility?

Quoted from TreyBo69:

That studio shut down years ago as far as I'm aware. Likely already sold off the office stuff a while ago.
Don't know about all the assets they made and who owns them.

Quoted from Scandell:

Robert gave/relocated all of Deeproot Studios (utah-based) expensive vfx-capable computer systems and servers to FutureHouse Studios. (The company that is falsely claiming to have created the Food Truck and Merlin's Arcade animations. (History revisionists.)) Knowing how fast and loose Robert plays with his business and toys...i doubt he did this with the appropriate paperwork or protocols. I wonder if this equipment will be located by the feds and liquidated to pay back the victim's stolen money.

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#29052 2 years ago
 
DLA

ufotofu

Pinside member

7y 30,650 96

Quoted from ForceFlow:

Personally, I'm assuming the RAZA games are paperweights and don't have any functional software installed. That probably won't prevent crazy high bidding, though.

Apparently a banned Pinball podcaster who shall not be named called the auctioneer and confirmed that the games do not have software installed and don't work. It is, of course, up for debate whether he's being honest or not.

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#29053 2 years ago
 
DSM

okgrak

Pinside member

6y 66,300 637

Quoted from ufotofu:

Apparently a banned Pinball podcaster who shall not be named called the auctioneer and confirmed that the games do not have software installed and don't work. It is, of course, up for debate whether he's being honest or not.

Sounds pretty easy for anyone to verify this claim.

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#29054 2 years ago
 
JSS

JStoltz

Pinside member

6y 64,050 838 3

On the zoom, counted 3 neckties so far, seems like this might be pretty serious!

Edit: One appears to be a double windsor. Yikes.

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#29055 2 years ago
 
MDB

Mbecker

Pinside+ Frequent

US Seattle, WA

10y 104K 4,333 5 14

Quoted from ufotofu:

Apparently a banned Pinball podcaster who shall not be named called the auctioneer and confirmed that the games do not have software installed and don't work. It is, of course, up for debate whether he's being honest or not.

Why would they wipe the software on them? Everything else seems abandoned in place essentially, seems weird they’d go to any effort erasing software.. I’m assuming these units were the only functioning ones unless someone ran off with those and these were ‘extras’ that never ran?

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#29056 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from JStoltz:

On the zoom, counted 3 neckties so far, seems like this might be pretty serious!

Lawyers chit chatting about their hair.

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#29057 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Quoted from Mbecker:

Why would they wipe the software on them? Everything else seems abandoned in place essentially, seems weird they’d go to any effort erasing software.. I’m assuming these units were the only functioning ones unless someone ran off with those and these were ‘extras’ that never ran?

Could have been a laptop running all the software someone took out to work on. Who knows. It being broken doesn't seem implausible

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#29058 2 years ago
 
DLA

ufotofu

Pinside member

7y 30,650 96

Quoted from Mbecker:

Why would they wipe the software on them? Everything else seems abandoned in place essentially, seems weird they’d go to any effort erasing software.. I’m assuming these units were the only functioning ones unless someone ran off with those and these were ‘extras’ that never ran?

Could be that the auctioneer doesn't have the technical knowhow to verify if there's actually code present on an SD card, hard drive, etc. They might have just tried to flip the switch, gotten nothing, and shrugged.

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#29059 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

SEC lawyer looks like a badass. Mueller lawyer and father + step mother lawyer more good old boys.

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#29060 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Judge asks if we have any update about the criminal proceedings. SEC

Met with Bill Lewis and Bill Harris. Says criminal probe started with SEC complaint. Not aware of any subpoenas. No search warrants. Doesn't know much more.

Judge says client was asked to appear before grand jury. Did he?

Lawyer: No.

Judge re-asks, did he decline?

L: Says didn't get enough details about when it would be. So hasn't come to it.

Says from sense from Lewis is that they understood settlement discussions were underway with SEC. Maybe wanted to see how it would shake out.

They're aware of those negotiations. Negotiations continue in good faith, but not complete. That convo was two months ago.

Judge: He's wondering, regarding this stay, if there is any other discovery or motion practice in which they can engage, short of a deposition of Mueller (to side step issue of fifth amendment)?

SEC: Yes, in lots of cases they have defendants that take the fifth. Feels this motion to stay is premature. In view of SEC, should proceed. We have a target letter from five months ago (holding things up) and SEC filed five months ago. On that basis, see no prejudice at this stage with respect to Mueller, to proceed.

Key post
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#29061 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Judge: What other kind of discovery to do you want (other than Mueller deposition)?

SEC: Wants docs from Mueller and others, deposition of third party witnesses, potentially third party experts. All things they'd like to move forward.

Judge (to Bobby lawyers): Why shouldn't I deny this motion to stay except for deposition of client, do everything else, and then return to Mueller last in three months?

Bobby: Doesn't think third party would be problem, some documentation. There is an answer that Bobby produces. It contains the fifth amendment. Currently, SEC could utilize that to put Mueller in "Hobson's choice"

Way to go around that would be a deadline to amend pleadings late to allow decision to decide to fight or not. However, if allowed to go all the way through to summary judgment, would force them to concede the civil case (b/c of fifth amendment deal).

But there are middle grounds: could move forward with quite a bit of discovery.

Their concern is with their answer being the way it is, because of the criminal case being the way it is, they're put in a box because they have to choose to sacrifice civil or criminal case for the other.

Thinks there are middle grounds, but have to be careful and judicious about which ones they choose.

He notes that, although this case is preliminary, there are cases out there that have placed stays this early on. (Cites some case where this allegedly happened. I have no idea to the viability of this argument and don't want to try to write out everything he's saying).

Key post
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#29062 2 years ago
 
JSS

JStoltz

Pinside member

6y 64,050 838 3

Judge considering opening discovery partially (allowing depositions from non-Mueller entities)... that would be very, very interesting for the pinside gallery.

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#29063 2 years ago
 
DLA

ufotofu

Pinside member

7y 30,650 96

If I understood correctly, Robert's lawyer just mentioned that their long term strategy is to seek a declination from the US Attorney- that is, to have them decide not to prosecute the case.

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#29064 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Bobby Lawyer (BL): This is bankruptcy case ongoing. There was a hearing where Bobby appeared and mostly took the fifth. There's an auction going on and so money is being raised for the creditors.

The entity defendants did not answer and appear to be heading to a default. SEC could take that, work out whatever they have to work out with them,

Court has already frozen Bobby's assets. So all the stay would do is stay the case with respect to Bobby, allow them to go after everything else. That may be cleaner than trying to carefully stay different things.

Judge: asked what he meant about waiting for some things to get resolved.

BL: Says this may be showing the hand, but basically there's some dispute between the SEC and BLs about how a particular case does or does not apply to the case.

Judge: You're not saying that the bankruptcy proceedings would stay Judge Xavier's proceedings?

BL: (basically says correct)

No, saying that the bankruptcy proceedings are getting some money for creditors. Same deal that SEC would want. Since entities look like they're going to default (this means all of Bobby's LLCs). Bobby's assets are frozen. So nothing changes money wise if you just stay Bobby's case until they see if they can get a declination with the SEC. Doesn't have to be for ever! They can come back and do this again in three months or six months.

Judge: Still leaning toward opening limited discovery. Let Bobby off the hook for now, doing third party depositions, interrogatories that wouldn't impact fifth.

Judge: What do you think about this, daddy and step mommy mueller lawyer?

Daddy: He's there mostly for the bankruptcy. There's someone here on the call (Leslie Hyman), who is the partner of someone who he understands plans to sue them. So he's worried about too many cases conflicting.

SEC: Two points. One: the law says it's pretty clear what he said isn't enough to stay. Two: the notion that somehow based on the motion alone is not realistic.

Judge: it's not realistic and I wouldn't grant it.

-note: someone with the name 'jpop sux' is in zoom meeting-

Key post
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#29065 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Quoted from ufotofu:

If I understood correctly, Robert's lawyer just mentioned that their long term strategy is to seek a declination from the US Attorney- that is, to have them decide not to prosecute the case.

It sounds like they've been trying to negotiate a settlement. Though the SEC seems ready to roll forward

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#29066 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Robert's lawyer just rambles on and on....

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#29067 2 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,726 6 21

Quoted from TreyBo69:

Robert's lawyer just rambles on and on....

If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.

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#29068 2 years ago
 
REM

pudealee

Pinside+ Frequent

9y 76,300 839

These proceedings are boring, but fascinating nonetheless.

"Bifurcate"

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#29069 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Stay has been denied in full except for a full deposition of Mueller for now. (Though the judge says Mueller needs to answer some basic questions during discovery)

SEC's discovery can go forward otherwise

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#29070 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

SEC: Doesn't think going forward would prejudice court against Mueller to the degree they assert. Also, the connecting of some case Bobby's lawyer mentioned is basically bullshit, so don't worry about that.

Lastly, the Mr. Snyder's point (daddy lawyer), he's sure they can come up with a way to be able to coordinate discovery between bankruptcy and this case. (Also, earlier he said they feel like they're making progress with BL on a possible settlement).

BL (Jay Hullings): Says doesn't disagree with SEC on the law. There are some intermediate steps. Cases are very fact specific. Judge, you can see we're picking apart very carefully these cases we're using for our argument. (He describes another case he wants to use as precedent for why the judge could do what they think).

Bottom line, well within court's discretion to not just stay the entire case, but to also stay certain parts of discovery, allow certain things and not. There's a lot of precedent for court to use its discretion. (Describes another possible precedent where the staying of certain things was even trickier than this one). You can think about all of these cited cases together and a way to keep Bobby's rights protected without significant adverse consequences while allowing bankruptcy case to move forward without negatively impacted recovery of some money for the creditors.

Meanwhile, parts of this case can move forward, BL keeps trying to work out a deal with the SEC. Kick Bobby's part down the road, allow some relief to investors.

Judge: I don't believe I received a scheduling proposal from you right?

BL: Yeah, talked this over with the SEC. We were going ask for two weeks extra.

5th circuit conference will be held sometime in May. Judge has invited her as the chairwoman of San Antonio bar association. Any objection from SEC, BL?

SEC: Nope

BL: Of course not, I'll be attending too

DL: Nope.

Judge: What do you think about this discovery stuff, Ms. Heyman?

Heyman: Actually, I can't go to the ball. Something came up with the kids.

Judge: Well there goes that.

Heyman: They want to move forward with client. There are some things with the estate that are incurring costs to maintain them. Don't think they have particular feelings about this case and how it moves forward. However, as they've said, they're cool with SEC moving forward. Ideally, US Attorneys will decide what they want to do with Mr. Mueller, because Bobby has info they'd like to ask him about it.

So, in the end, they just want things to move forward.

Judge: Motion is granted in part, denied in part. Almost completely denied. Discovery will move forward, parties to meet to make a proposed scheduling order. Scheduling should have bifurcation of depositions. Bifurcate any Bobby deposition. For now, that can't go forward in this case until parties approach X and he lifts that stay.

Any interrogatories or admissions related to Mr. Mueller should be drafted to avoid any admissions of fifth amendment by Bobby. Should be able to ask about confirmation of documents that wouldn't impact that.

Third party depositions allowed.

With regards to dispositive motions, you should probably have a deadline, in case SEC intends to go forward. He's giving advanced notice to SEC that he will keep staying motions for summary judgments, so don't play that shit. Won't be well received, as he keeps trying to balance case with Bobby's rights.

Key post
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#29071 2 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,726 6 21

The SEC side of this is going to take YEARS.

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#29072 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Judge: Anything else?

SEC: What about timing on the schedule?

Judge: Two weeks from today.

Anything else, Mr. Hulings?

BL: Nope, all good for now.

DL: We're cool too.

Heyman: Fonzi.

Judge: Aiight, at this point I think we should have intermittent status conferences to see where we're at.

In your scheduling order, how about putting something on the calendar for about four months where we can see where we're at.

Thanks, everybody! (Thank you, Judge!)

Key post
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#29073 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

I hope Jake Danger didn't take off work for that.

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#29074 2 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 161K 8,897

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

-note: someone with the name 'jpop sux' is in zoom meeting-

That's our buddy, Cointaker. He's a crack up. lol

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#29075 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Here's the "fun" for anyone interested

http://sndup.net/s6tz

Not as entertaining as Robert pleading the fifth a couple hundred times, but interesting to learn about the justice system.

Key post
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#29076 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from Mr68:

That's our buddy, Cointaker. He's a crack up. lol

I was too busy court reporting to check to see how many people were on the call at the peak and if there were any other colorful monikers.

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#29077 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from TreyBo69:

Here's the "fun" for anyone interested
http://sndup.net/s6tz
Not as entertaining as Robert pleading the fifth a couple hundred times, but interesting to learn about the justice system.

Oh shit, if you told me I wouldn't have tried to write down everything!

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#29078 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Oh shit, if you told me I wouldn't have tried to write down everything!

You seemed to be having too much fun

And someone need to summarize it anyhow

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#29079 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from TreyBo69:

You seemed to be having too much fun
And someone need to summarize it anyhow

Very glad to have less fun in the future

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#29080 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

So in summary, mostly a win for the good guys. Bobby won't go under oath for who knows how long. Everything else can proceed, except written discovery requests to Bobby must be very narrow to avoid putting him a situation of asserting the fifth amendment. And even with that narrowness, I expect objections from the deeplawyers.

My favorite part of the hearing may have been the judge checking with the dude lawyers to make sure it was cool he takes the lady lawyer to the ball, the bros saying totally man, and then her saying she's got another thing that day.

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#29081 2 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 161K 8,897

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Heyman: Actually, I can't go to the ball. Something came up with the kids.

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Anything else, Mr. Hulings?

BL: Nope, all good for now.

DL: We're cool too.

Heyman: Fonzi.

I have a professional crush on Heyman.

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#29082 2 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 161K 8,897

Quoted from Mr68:

That's our buddy, Cointaker. He's a crack up. lol

Correction. Just found out that I made a wrong assumption on that. Still fun stuff though.

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#29083 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from Mr68:

I have a professional crush on Heyman.

Can you sum up her relationship to the deeproot situation?

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#29084 2 years ago
 
GAC

Rarehero

Pinside member

US Los Angeles, CA

12y 146K 23,694 22 119

As always, thanks Blueberry!

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#29085 2 years ago
 
SJF

fabsj82

Pinside member

US Green Bay, WI

6y 55,350 194 9

The stack of plywood is a hot item

2022-03-15_12-42-41 (resized).jpg2022-03-15_12-42-41 (resized).jpg
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#29086 2 years ago
 
GAC

Rarehero

Pinside member

US Los Angeles, CA

12y 146K 23,694 22 119

Quoted from fabsj82:

The stack of plywood is a hot item
[quoted image]

Maybe one of Great Sandwich’s secret buddies will buy the IP so we can all enjoy Deeproot presents: PLYWOOD.

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#29087 2 years ago
 
DGH

DudeRegular

Pinside member

7y 111K 3,505 109

Quoted from Rarehero:

Maybe one of Great Sandwich’s secret buddies will buy the IP so we can all enjoy Deeproot presents: PLYWOOD.

They are watching closely and keeping an eye peeled and monitoring the situation and keeping tabs and waiting in the wings and ready to pounce and conducting their research and and and

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#29088 2 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,726 6 21

Quoted from DudeRegular:

They are watching closely and keeping an eye peeled and monitoring the situation and keeping tabs and waiting in the wings and ready to pounce and conducting their research and and and

And he's not allowed to mention names!

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#29089 2 years ago
 
JSS

JStoltz

Pinside member

6y 64,050 838 3

Do the legal gurus monitoring this thread have any insight as to what we, the thirsty public, might get to see/hear of these third party depositions? Will they flow through the same channels, and will we be able to listen in like we did today and previously?

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#29090 2 years ago
 
TMB

Roostking

Pinside+ Addict

11y 106K 9,032 2

Quoted from pudealee:

These proceedings are boring, but fascinating nonetheless.
"Bifurcate"

One of the lawyers in the Skit B shit show added the term "Accoutrements" to the pinball lexicon..

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#29091 2 years ago
 
C F

frolic

Pinside+ Frequent

12y 149K 9,811

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

Thanks, everybody! (Thank you, Judge!)

Thank you for the logging. I read it all.

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#29092 2 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 161K 8,897

Quoted from DudeRegular:

They are watching closely and keeping an eye peeled and monitoring the situation and keeping tabs and waiting in the wings and ready to pounce and conducting their research and and and

and time will tell

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#29093 2 years ago
 
---

ForceFlow

Pinside Moderator

10y 241K 32,562 282 14

Quoted from fabsj82:

The stack of plywood is a hot item
[quoted image]

Plywood with finished surfaces and 8+ ply isn't cheap.

4x8 3/4" Baltic birch is about $130 per sheet.

There's probably about $2600 in plywood in that lot.

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#29094 2 years ago
 
VIC

vicjw66

Pinside member

US San Pedro/port Of Los Angeles, CA

13y 96,550 5,373 4 6

Just looked through the whole auction lot. How many effing office chairs did Robert think they needed?
I took the Stern factory tour some years ago and they had nothing close to the type of machinery Deeproot had. Stern was most proud of their hydraulic Gottlieb Playfield pin press. How did they ever plan to use all that equipment to justify its expense? I wonder what the aggregate was spent on all those machines?

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#29095 2 years ago
 
VIC

vicjw66

Pinside member

US San Pedro/port Of Los Angeles, CA

13y 96,550 5,373 4 6

Quoted from ufotofu:

Apparently a banned Pinball podcaster who shall not be named called the auctioneer and confirmed that the games do not have software installed and don't work. It is, of course, up for debate whether he's being honest or not.

If these are the unfinished games, what happened to the game(s) that were playable at one of the reveals last year?

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#29096 2 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside member

US Oakland, CA

8y 103K 5,317

Quoted from vicjw66:

If these are the unfinished games, what happened to the game(s) that were playable at one of the reveals last year?

Working on this

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#29097 2 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,726 6 21

Quoted from vicjw66:

Stern was most proud of their hydraulic Gottlieb Playfield pin press.

Which blows my mind they are still using dimple locations and hand drilling to spot playfield features in 2022 and not just having all the holes pre-drilled in a CNC. Some poor schmuck gets to have carpel tunnel frim hand drilling thousands of holes every day.

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#29098 2 years ago
 
JJZ

toyotaboy

RandOM Pinball

US Allyn, WA

13y 184K 12,126 5 14

Quoted from JodyG:

Which blows my mind they are still using dimple locations and hand drilling to spot playfield features in 2022 and not just having all the holes pre-drilled in a CNC. Some poor schmuck gets to have carpel tunnel frim hand drilling thousands of holes every day.

cutting anything "wood or metal" you want the biggest bit possible to rip through that work as quickly as possible to keep costs and leadtime down. even if your machine has tool change ability, its preferred to not have to change bits. a whole playfield can be dimple punched in a matter of seconds, everything else can be cut with a 1/4" bit, maybe even 3/8"

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#29099 2 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

6y 155K 9,730 212

Quoted from toyotaboy:

cutting anything "wood or metal" you want the biggest bit possible to rip through that work as quickly as possible to keep costs and leadtime down. even if your machine has tool change ability, its preferred to not have to change bits. a whole playfield can be dimple punched in a matter of seconds, everything else can be cut with a 1/4" bit, maybe even 3/8"

And even after that dimple machine, they have another template put on the game for someone to drill a few more particular holes to certain depths.

I'm sure Stern knows how to make the process as quick as possible...

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#29100 2 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,726 6 21

It's archaic and imprecise, and I'm prepared to die on that hill. Just because they have been doing it that way forever doesn't mean it's efficient

Everything could be done with a 1/8" bit easily in that thickness plywood...it has to be done after printing and clear coating anyway. I've done it myself already on my CNC cut homebrew playfields ive been working on, and the results are excellent. You just need to use compression bits.

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