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(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


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#2751 5 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,104 2

Quoted from Rondogg:

It's really odd they haven't made some kind of announcement/tease. With BK3 and WONKA released you would think they would try and prevent some of those sales with some kind of announcement before people make financial commitments. Silence does them no good.

Announcing something and not being able to deliver is bad as well.

I don't think it's good that JJP showed us Willy Wonka allready while not being able to ship for 60 days (wich was the intended schedule for Pirates as well). We all know people jump off after a while. Not because the game is bad but because the buzz is gone and the next new thing is allways interresting, at least if the game is not 95% tailored to your interrest.

If I'd have the money I've ordered the new Black Knight at first sight.
I couldn't. - Now that I've waited a couple of days I notice what I may not like (too hard, knight does not shake, repetitive music) so I want to play it first.

The best game of all time is available new from CGC, wich is Medival Madness!
I just don't want to afford a 20+ Year old game at Stern LE price.
(Maybe they Re-Release it at the Monster Bash Pricepoint.)

When I got into pinball it was because of Arabien Nights, and I wanted one!
But I never got one, because I would not pay more for an 20+ year old beat down game as for a new Stern Pro.
If Deeproot can manage to make Magic Girl work (and plz don't change the tone/ artistic style of the game) at a Stern Pro pricepoint I'm in at day 1. Even at Premium pricepoint propably at day 2.

So I am very much looking forward to this.
(And I can only win. Either I get a great game or save me some money. )

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#2752 5 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,104 2

Quoted from lpeters82:

first hire was JPop.

People love his games, that's why they all fell for him... again, and again and again...

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#2753 5 years ago
 
PJF

rai

Pinside member

20y 169K 18,758 34

Following

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#2754 5 years ago
 
DAV

adol75

Pinside member

US San Francisco, CA

5y 57,300 2,076 2

Quoted from DS_Nadine:

Announcing something and not being able to deliver is bad as well.

Bragging about spending millions, then saying 12 whitewoods on the work while pushing a reveal date is even worse communication in my opinion.

And doing it to an audience of educated people in the field while throwing JPop’s name in the middle who is known for having fooled his early supporters makes it the worse buzz launch in the history of pinball.

So if I would ever consider buying a Deeproot it would be cash on the glass and straight in my truck.

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#2755 5 years ago
 
LRP

lpeters82

Pinside+ Frequent

12y 132K 5,282 8

Quoted from DS_Nadine:

People love his games, that's why they all fell for him... again, and again and again...

Yet, he hasn't produced a functional game in the last 20 years. Again, I want them to succeed AND for their success to be an overall positive for pinball.

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#2756 5 years ago
 
CJC

cjchand

Pinside member

US Allen, TX

5y 53,800 566 1

Quoted from DS_Nadine:

So I am very much looking forward to this.
(And I can only win. Either I get a great game or save me some money. )

Sums up my sentiment exactly.

If they ship and it's awesome, great. If they never ship, the tables suck, cost too much, etc, then take your money elsewhere.

Speaking of money, I don't get why people are concerned about how much money they're burning through. It's all coming out of Robert's wallet, so why should we care?

Anyway, happy speculating, everyone!

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#2757 5 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,104 2

Quoted from cjchand:

Speaking of money, I don't get why people are concerned about how much money they're burning through. It's all coming out of Robert's wallet, so why should we care?

It's just frolic.

Well, to be fair:
Robert mentioned it himself, when they announced the delay but couldn't give a new date.
"We are spending over $750k a month now on this project, and that will increase through launch. That is unsustainable without a launch in the short term."
via https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-pinball-launch-postponed/

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#2758 5 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,612 6 21 1

Quoted from cjchand:

Sums up my sentiment exactly.
If they ship and it's awesome, great. If they never ship, the tables suck, cost too much, etc, then take your money elsewhere.
Speaking of money, I don't get why people are concerned about how much money they're burning through. It's all coming out of Robert's wallet, so why should we care?
Anyway, happy speculating, everyone!

It's not Robert's wallet, they are using private investor monies.

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#2759 5 years ago
 
CRD

chad

Game Guy

11y 140K 15,150 9 5

Following.

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#2760 5 years ago
 
CAP

clempo

Pinside member

CA Laval, QC

6y 31,800 376

With so many machines in the works, obviously their catalog will include many games available at the same time. Could it be that octo manufacturing means they can produce up to 8 different titles on the same line, constantly mixing what is built depending on current orders?

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#2761 5 years ago
 
JJZ

toyotaboy

RandOM Pinball

US Allyn, WA

12y 184K 11,930 3 14

Quoted from DS_Nadine: If I'd have the money I've ordered the new Black Knight at first sight.
I couldn't. - Now that I've waited a couple of days I notice what I may not like (too hard, knight does not shake, repetitive music) so I want to play it first.

i would.. its hard, music is repetitive (hope they fix in code update).. also shield is also falling off already

20190419_145955 (resized).jpg20190419_145955 (resized).jpg
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#2762 5 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,104 2

Quoted from toyotaboy:

i would.. its hard, music is repetitive (hope they fix in code update).. also shield is also falling off already[quoted image]

I've listened trough the music in pinball browser and I'm very positive that'll get more variety.

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#2763 5 years ago
 
DAV

adol75

Pinside member

US San Francisco, CA

5y 57,300 2,076 2

Quoted from clempo:

With so many machines in the works, obviously their catalog will include many games available at the same time. Could it be that octo manufacturing means they can produce up to 8 different titles on the same line, constantly mixing what is built depending on current orders?

Or a playfield with 8 themes !

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#2764 5 years ago
 
C F

frolic

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 149K 9,809

Some deeproot news posted here:

https://arcadeheroes.com/2019/04/19/deep-root-pinball-holds-a-panel-at-fanx-salt-lake-comic-convention/

For us in this thread, this seemed to be the biggest chunk of new info:

They have a strong team of experienced animators, “around 40 people” with experience at Disney (Disney Infinity was specifically mentioned), Lucasfilm, Weta, EA and others. While this talent favors the film industry, they also have people with experience in creating video games. Because of this, expect their games to have high-quality animations and artwork.

I'd be curious how "40 animators" compares with the entire compliment at Stern or JJP. Isn't it just Jean-Paul de Win who does ALL the JJP games?

I don't doubt that all the talent at deeproot can produce some very exciting stuff. But I'm a business guy and this still doesn't make sense.

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#2765 5 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,612 6 21 1

40 animators? Are making video games or pinball machines? Or virtual pins?

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#2766 5 years ago
 
STK

flynnibus

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 134K 13,220

Quoted from frolic:

Some deeproot news posted here:
https://arcadeheroes.com/2019/04/19/deep-root-pinball-holds-a-panel-at-fanx-salt-lake-comic-convention/
For us in this thread, this seemed to be the biggest chunk of new info:

I'd be curious how "40 animators" compares with the entire compliment at Stern or JJP. Isn't it just Jean-Paul de Win who does ALL the JJP games?
I don't doubt that all the talent at deeproot can produce some very exciting stuff. But I'm a business guy and this still doesn't make sense.

It's been mentioned before that DR bought into or has spun up a software group offsite.. and they were doing the media/interactive stuff. My guess is like most DR activities, it is a layered thing trying to multitask. This group is likely working on other initiatives, as well as pinball. Same way pinball was able to move into a facility intended for other uses too.

So I've read it as... one of DR's 'companies' is a game/media software group.. and they've leveraged that group to work on the DRP software. This in contrast with trying to land some 'big name' pinball software guy like they did with designers.

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#2767 5 years ago
 
WLC

BMore-Pinball

Pinside member

12y 122K 4,981 33

How is this thread 56 pages without any real info on the machines yet.

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#2768 5 years ago
 
AK

Coolpinballdino

Pinside+ Frequent

9y 188K 4,800 477 2

Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

How is this thread 56 pages without any real info on the machines yet.

The power of hype.

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#2769 5 years ago
 
MCB

mcbPalisade

Iron Transfer

US Parachute, CO

6y 46,300 771 4

Quoted from JodyG:

40 animators? Are making video games or pinball machines? Or virtual pins?

Typo, should read "40 animations"

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#2770 5 years ago
 
ABB

Aurich

Mods and Opinions

US Torrance, CA

11y 144K 23,395 3

The 40 animators thing is real.

Seems crazy, but who knows what they’re actually up to. I’ll admit it has me curious now though.

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#2771 5 years ago
 
LRP

lpeters82

Pinside+ Frequent

12y 132K 5,282 8

Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

How is this thread 56 pages without any real info on the machines yet.

Step 1, hire JPop
Step 2, ?
Step 3, Profit

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#2772 5 years ago
 
???

Netzley_Crunch

Pinside member

Unknown

5y 22,300 19

The last day of MGC my spouse and I played a three player game of Black Knight with David Thiel and I asked about the Deep Root projects. He was kind and friendly.

We missed his panel so I assume what he told us he told everyone during his panel, that Raza will be the first game and he’s been working on it. He said the whitewood is being worked on now, he expects a prototype to work on in two months, and he can only guess at how long it will take to set up a factory line to produce the machines as that hasn’t even started yet.

His best guess was a machine 14-16 months from now contingent on the manufacturing guys making sure everything works. Sorry if this is cumulative with all knowledge already out there.

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#2773 5 years ago
 
DRM

iceman44

Pinside+ Pro!

US Boerne, TX

13y 162K 26,878 28 49

Quoted from Netzley_Crunch:

The last day of MGC my spouse and I played a three player game of Black Knight with David Thiel and I asked about the Deep Root projects. He was kind and friendly.
We missed his panel so I assume what he told us he told everyone during his panel, that Raza will be the first game and he’s been working on it. He said the whitewood is being worked on now, he expects a prototype to work on in two months, and he can only guess at how long it will take to set up a factory line to produce the machines as that hasn’t even started yet.
His best guess was a machine 14-16 months from now contingent on the manufacturing guys making sure everything works. Sorry if this is cumulative with all knowledge already out there.

Say what?

No F ing way

If Raza isn’t about ready to hit the line after all this time and $$$ AND the head start of years of Jpop doodling then stick a fork in it

He had to be f ing with you

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#2774 5 years ago
 
???

Netzley_Crunch

Pinside member

Unknown

5y 22,300 19

Quoted from iceman44:

Say what?
No F ing way
If Raza isn’t about ready to hit the line after all this time and $$$ AND the head start of years of Jpop doodling then stick a fork in it
He had to be f ing with you

I sure hope you are correct. Would love to see Raza earlier!

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#2775 5 years ago
 
CAP

clempo

Pinside member

CA Laval, QC

6y 31,800 376

Quoted from Netzley_Crunch:

His best guess was a machine 14-16 months from now contingent on the manufacturing guys making sure everything works. Sorry if this is cumulative with all knowledge already out there.

If this is true and they honor the Zidware claims, it means a boatload of cash is about to leave the ship at the end of June. Ouch.

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#2776 5 years ago
 
RON

Rondogg

Pinside member

11y 109K 3,341

14-16...months?

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#2777 5 years ago
 
C F

frolic

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 149K 9,809

Jpop working on these games for infinity seems like some sort of hell project. Like doing time in purgatory.

Not sure what to make of that estimate, but we know it won't be anytime soon as they would never have skipped TPF.

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#2778 5 years ago
 
DON

Fulltilt

Pinside+ Pro!

US Nowhere Ridge, TN

12y 114K 6,756 8

Quoted from frolic:

Jpop working on these games for infinity seems like some sort of hell project. Like doing time in purgatory.
Not sure what to make of that estimate, but we know it won't be anytime soon as they would never have skipped TPF.

I'll be f*ing dead before I get my RAZA machine. I'm going to get my attorney to put it in my will.... just in case it ever shows up.

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#2779 5 years ago
 
CJC

cjchand

Pinside member

US Allen, TX

5y 53,800 566 1

Quoted from Fulltilt:

I'll be f*ing dead before I get my RAZA machine. I'm going to get my attorney to put it in my will.... just in case it ever shows up.

Maybe you can ask to be buried in a RAZA cab. Might be the only one to ever exist.

Firsties!

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#2780 5 years ago
 
DON

Fulltilt

Pinside+ Pro!

US Nowhere Ridge, TN

12y 114K 6,756 8

Quoted from cjchand:

Maybe you can ask to be buried in a RAZA cab. Might be the only one to ever exist.
Firsties!

No, they exist alright... but where?

img_8881_2 (resized).jpgimg_8881_2 (resized).jpg
121 (resized).jpg121 (resized).jpg

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#2781 5 years ago
 
DON

Fulltilt

Pinside+ Pro!

US Nowhere Ridge, TN

12y 114K 6,756 8

This guy knows but he ain't tellin'.

finger (resized).jpgfinger (resized).jpg

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#2782 5 years ago
 
MAC

frankmac

Pinside+ Frequent

9y 154K 5,098 4

Quoted from Fulltilt:

This guy knows but he ain't tellin'.
[quoted image]

BS!

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#2783 5 years ago
 
DDT

daudioguy

Pinside member

US Redmond, WA

16y 65,300 189 1

I was trying to be noncommittal on the day. If whatever I said was understood as as estimate of time let me clarify: I really have no idea and my NDA would prevent me from telling anybody if I had hard facts (which I don't).
I work 2100 miles from where the games will be manufactured and I am laser focused in my NW studio on creating the best audio I can make for Deeproot pinball machines (yes plural).
David

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#2784 5 years ago
 
DHF

fosaisu

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 142K 10,340

Quoted from Fulltilt:

This guy knows but he ain't tellin'.
[quoted image]

My, o-din has aged badly since quitting Pinside.

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#2785 5 years ago
 
BIL

billyboy

Pinside member

US Murrieta, CA

9y 54,050 171 2

Everyone has said this over and over, but I'll say it again :

The hobby isn't big enough for all these manufacturers. There's only so much money and space.

Look at the daily "for sales" in the market. It's huge everyday, because people are trying to sell to buy the next new pin. There will be an eventual semi-freeze in the market on both used and new games. The available space and money will reach a tipping point. Yes, I've seen the increase interest in the hobby and tournament/league play, but you're talking about 15k+ games a year being produced by all the manufacturers combined. Where the hell will all these games go?

Point is, that with every new passing game that any manufacturer puts out, that's one more game that puts Deeproot into a tougher spot. They need to get something out really quick! At this point, I'd try and get a piece of the shrinking pie.

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#2786 5 years ago
 
WLC

BMore-Pinball

Pinside member

12y 122K 4,981 33

Quoted from billyboy:

Everyone has said this over and over, but I'll say it again :
The hobby isn't big enough for all these manufacturers. There's only so much money and space.
Look at the daily "for sales" in the market. It's huge everyday, because people are trying to sell to buy the next new pin. There will be an eventual semi-freeze in the market on both used and new games. The available space and money will reach a tipping point. Yes, I've seen the increase interest in the hobby and tournament/league play, but you're talking about 15k+ games a year being produced by all the manufacturers combined. Where the hell will all these games go?
Point is, that with every new passing game that any manufacturer puts out, that's one more game that puts Deeproot into a tougher spot. They need to get something out really quick! At this point, I'd try and get a piece of the shrinking pie.

Agree, and it's going to drove the resale market down - and it seems like lots of people rely on good resale value to buy their next machine. I would guess the whole yearly market for new machines is smaller then the market for a new Madden video game.

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#2787 5 years ago
 
JJZ

toyotaboy

RandOM Pinball

US Allyn, WA

12y 184K 11,930 3 14

Quoted from billyboy:

Look at the daily "for sales" in the market. It's huge everyday, because people are trying to sell to buy the next new pin

agreed, nothing wrong with finally prying some older titles out of collector's basements. I'm seeing a ton of games go up for sale in the past week, and I think it's due to both black knight and wonka coming out.

Quoted from billyboy:

There will be an eventual semi-freeze in the market on both used and new games. The available space and money will reach a tipping point

Or perhaps the market just shifts. 8 years ago it was mostly high-end collectors had all the modern Williams DMD games, leaving only alphanumeric and early solid state to the bottom end collectors. With more and more HD display games with great animations and sound, it starts to make DMD look slightly dated.

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#2788 5 years ago
 
JGI

John_I

Space Coast Pinball

19y 179K 9,072

Quoted from billyboy:

The hobby isn't big enough for all these manufacturers. There's only so much money and space.

Deeproot is still a paper tiger, but... If these guys actually put out some good games designed by Dennis and Barry and the crew they have on board, it will take a bite out of other companies. A company like JJP that is holding on by an angel investor thread, might just go under. A smaller company like AP might have issues too. Now that MM, AFM and MB are out, the remake industry will probably slow considerably anyway and even more with another big player around.

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#2789 5 years ago
 
DRM

iceman44

Pinside+ Pro!

US Boerne, TX

13y 162K 26,878 28 49

Quoted from daudioguy:

I was trying to be noncommittal on the day. If whatever I said was understood as as estimate of time let me clarify: I really have no idea and my NDA would prevent me from telling anybody if I had hard facts (which I don't).
I work 2100 miles from where the games will be manufactured and I am laser focused in my NW studio on creating the best audio I can make for Deeproot pinball machines (yes plural).
David

No problem David. We forgive you!

Btw, thank you for the best audio package on a pinball machine ever in Alien.

DR def did one smart thing in bringing you on board!

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#2790 5 years ago
 
DLG

dnapac

Pinside+ Frequent

US Alton, IA

19y 137K 2,687 6 30

Unless they plan to sell games at $3k or less...and maybe that’s their model...the money they (or their investors) are putting in, can never be paid back. This is a unicorn. If it works out, sweet for the buyers...like me. But, I doubt this is real. I don’t care what has been shown to “people in the know”. Just pure economics (and I’m not a business/economics person) does not compute. If it’s too good to be true...it’s probably too good to be true.

Down vote me all you want...if you’re right...it just benefits me...the consumer.

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#2791 5 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,104 2

Quoted from iceman44:

Btw, thank you for the best audio package on a pinball machine ever in Alien.

Off!!!

Back to your CGC-Alien Thread.

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#2792 5 years ago
 
???

Thunderbird

Pinside member

5y 96,550 2,780

No doubt the industry needs a pricing shakeup, because MSRP is getting way out of hand (going up and up with no sign of stopping in sight). If DR can change current craziness and do it, through their motto of “Pinball for the Masses”, this’ll be a new era for silver ball entertainment. Here’s hoping DR can bring some balance back, through decent pricing for the consumer, of top designs with fun and unique tables. Other industries figure this out, so why can’t pinball?

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#2793 5 years ago
 
LEV

CrazyLevi

Crazy Levi's Pinball

US New York, NY

10y 148K 33,526

Quoted from Thunderbird:

No doubt the industry needs a pricing shakeup, because MSRP is getting way out of hand (going up and up with no sign of stopping in sight). If DR can change current craziness and do it, through their motto of “Pinball for the Masses”, this’ll be a new era for silver ball entertainment. Here’s hoping DR can bring some balance back, through decent pricing for the consumer, of top designs with fun and unique tables. Other industries figure this out, so why can’t pinball?

The industry has figured it out. A Stern pro provides everything you are asking for.

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#2794 4 years ago
 
MJO

arcademojo

Pinside member

10y 131K 5,513 30

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The industry has figured it out. A Stern pro provides everything you are asking for.

And they will probably be priced at $6000 by next year. Sorry that’s not figured out.

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#2795 4 years ago
 
DHF

fosaisu

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 142K 10,340

Quoted from arcademojo:

And they will probably be priced at $6000 by next year. Sorry that’s not figured out.

Seems like they’re still making plenty of money and moving plenty of units, so Stern presumably views things as “fixed.” At some point Stern will price themselves out of the budget market, but it apparently hasn’t happened yet. If Deeproot applies real price competition for Stern at the low end of the market that’ll be great for buyers, but we’re not quite there yet.

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#2796 4 years ago
 
TKM

Daditude

Pinside Moderator

US Rockwall, TX

5y 266K 10,116 23 271

When was the last "confirmed" release or update info from DP?

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#2797 4 years ago
 
DWF

Chalkey

Pinside+ Frequent

US Chesterfield, VA

6y 69,550 2,971 18

Y'all are too funny. "Deeproot needs to get out of the media and make machines!" *deep breath* "Why isn't deeproot in the media talking anymore?!".

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#2798 4 years ago
 
BD

daley

Pinside member

12y 67,300 786 26

I did not see this posted in this thread (so sorry if already shared): https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=60&v=opAK-32MfJM

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#2799 4 years ago
 
DWF

Chalkey

Pinside+ Frequent

US Chesterfield, VA

6y 69,550 2,971 18

I hadn't seen it. For a non-gameplay pinball promo video it's awesome and it looks like they should be able to put together some badass LCD animations.

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#2800 4 years ago
 
DGH

DudeRegular

Pinside member

6y 111K 3,413 108

Quoted from daley:

I did not see this posted in this thread (so sorry if already shared): https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=60&v=opAK-32MfJM

I hadn't seen it. Thanks for posting!

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