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360 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items. (Show topic index)

Quoted from Richthofen:
Imagine blowing tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars on machines that might make, what, optimistically, 5,000 boards a year?

Considering they never made an actual production machine...
Yeah. That's pretty optimistic.

Quoted from guitarded:
Considering they never made an actual production machine...
Yeah. That's pretty optimistic.

Imagine blowing millions & millions on labour, plant & equipment on a developing a product that had the demand of less than 122 customers

12621 Silicon Drive B.D. (Before Deeproot) - click for pdf

12621silicondrive-old.pdf

surprised there are yet more deeproot features on TWIP I had forgotten about

https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-pinball-retro-atomic-zombie-adventureland-plus-interviews-with-john-popadiuk-steven-bowden-and-robert-mueller/

Screen Shot 2021-08-28 at 8.11.56 PM (resized).png

https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-update-plus-interview-new-hire-new-building-new-creative-studio-new-licenses-and-help-offered-to-those-who-lost-money-on-pre-orders-from-other-companies/

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Listening back to the December 2020 pinball news interview with Robert Mueller makes me realise just how much of a pathological liar he is......he was just making it up as he went along. Confident in everything he said, but it was all smoke & mirrors....playing the role of Pinball CEO with other people's money - with no realistic likelihood over ever being able to return the funds (much less with the interest promised to investors).

The current condition of that office space and the presence of fully baked leasing documents on the street prove that DeepRoot has been dead for months already. The smoke and mirrors and pathological lying and diversion tactics with cryptic non-updates where then death knell that no one was paying attention too. RM jumped ship on this months ago.

How he kept all these ex-employee victims quiet this long while the SEC built their case and the offices were already abandoned is the real question now for me. What goodwill (or threats) did this man have over this group of people? You can’t NDA someone to not address their own lack of employment and collapse of their former employer.

Quoted from Dkjimbo:
You can’t NDA someone to not address their own lack of employment and collapse of their former employer.

Legally, no, but can you make them scared? Most people buckle receiving the most generic of Cease & Desist letters.

I can easily see how a culture of fear still exists with the now ex-employees.

Quoted from Dkjimbo:
The current condition of that office space and the presence of fully baked leasing documents on the street prove that DeepRoot has been dead for months already. The smoke and mirrors and pathological lying and diversion tactics with cryptic non-updates where then death knell that no one was paying attention too. RM jumped ship on this months ago.
How he kept all these ex-employee victims quiet this long while the SEC built their case and the offices were already abandoned is the real question now for me. What goodwill (or threats) did this man have over this group of people? You can’t NDA someone to not address their own lack of employment and collapse of their former employer.

Baked leasing documents on the street?

Quoted from Darscot:
Ha ha people think I’m a broken record. I have no idea why you are so infatuated with me.

I literally forgot you existed until you started telling professional artists what art is.

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
surprised there are yet more deeproot features on TWIP I had forgotten about
https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-pinball-retro-atomic-zombie-adventureland-plus-interviews-with-john-popadiuk-steven-bowden-and-robert-mueller/[quoted image]

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-update-plus-interview-new-hire-new-building-new-creative-studio-new-licenses-and-help-offered-to-those-who-lost-money-on-pre-orders-from-other-companies/[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Thanks for reminding us about these two dr communications. I remember reading them and thinking at the time, well maybe Robert really does know manufacturing and he sounds intelligent. Now I know it was pure bullshit. Robert took that opportunity to use TWIP to spread lies and misinformation.

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/deeproot-update-plus-interview-new-hire-new-building-new-creative-studio-new-licenses-and-help-offered-to-those-who-lost-money-on-pre-orders-from-other-companies/[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

All these TWIP articles really shine a light on how much attention TWIP gave for years to RM's bullshit, and so far has only reported 3 sentences on the fraud.

Employee: Hey Robert shouldn’t we be thinking about how we are going to build these machines ?

RM: Don’t worry about it we will use state of the art advanced octo manufacturing ?

Employee: What’s Octo manufacturing ?

RM: I read it in a book. Supposed to be (air quotes) lean and agile, and it utilizes advanced (air quotes) 6S procedures, whatever that is.

Employee: Oh. OK. Do I need to order some parts or something like that so we can start octoing ? What about that big machine you bought that waves ?

RM: So according to my reading you only need parts 2 days before you build something. It’s all the rage. Are we ready to ship in 2 days ?

Employee: I can’t see how we can possibly do that. I’m the only one left, you furloughed everyone else due to COVID, remember ?

RM: Well then you don’t need to order parts until you are within 2 days of being ready to build the machine. I’m going to go up and try our new octo elliptical while reading this new deposition request I received.

Employee: Octo elliptical ?

RM: Yeah you know those 8 elliptical I brought in. I read you can get a great workout if you set them each to different resistance levels and switch machines every couple of minutes.

Employee: OK, I’ll be in the break room using the Keurig. I don’t see how we are going to get thru all these Starbucks coffee pods and creamer now that John isn’t around anymore.

RM: I miss John. One of the most productive people I’ve ever met.

Employee: Really ? You should know that’s not how most of us viewed him.

RM: I don’t care what others say. If you look at the rate he was ordering purple spray paint from Amazon I mean that guy had to be making like 20 playfields a month.

Employee: Uh yeah well he was actually taking most of those home with him. Listen, I’ll just drop off the Keurig at his house on my way home. He needs it more than we do.

RM: Most underrated pinball designer ever. I’ll make sure he gets a good letter of recommendation. He deserves to be celebrated in this industry for the genius he is.

Employee: Remember to chain the door on your way out. They’ve told me paparazzi has been showing up recently.

Quoted from Stuieb84:
Baked leasing documents on the street?

Leasing packages by CBRE have been posted in this thread which take weeks to prepare and negotiate contracts with CBRE so the owner of that building knew for quite some time this was a sinking ship and was prepared to look for sublease tenants or new lease tenants for the space. The photos in the lease package show an abandoned DeepRoot space.

Which season episode is iceman on the show?

Quoted from wcbrandes:
Oh and what you saw on TV no longer exists, all six Hotel buildings have systematically been replaced. So you wouldn't recognize it.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Did anyone notice the famous pinball designers only spot is the handicap spot?

Also a violation of the ADA

684EA9C9-2D26-4564-AA05-3E427C3DF999 (resized).jpeg

Quoted from TreyBo69:
Did anyone notice the famous pinball designers only spot is the handicap spot?
Also a violation of the ADA
[quoted image]

No blue background is also a violation.

images (resized).jpeg

Quoted from TreyBo69:
Did anyone notice the famous pinball designers only spot is the handicap spot?
Also a violation of the ADA
[quoted image]

Also looks like there's a wheelchair lift between floor levels
8f960f236459a7a8d83c7060472e96b5728d530e (resized).jpg

Wait.. this makes perfect sense! Pinball designers only. JPOP is handicapped, he's psychotic

Quoted from TreyBo69:
Did anyone notice the famous pinball designers only spot is the handicap spot?[quoted image]

Quoted from jellikit:
No blue background is also a violation.[quoted image]

Can't be for jpop. Background would be purple.

Quoted from jellikit:
No blue background is also a violation.
[quoted image]

I can tell the ramp is non compliant by eye balling it.

Quoted from Dkjimbo:
How he kept all these ex-employee victims quiet this long while the SEC built their case and the offices were already abandoned is the real question now for me. What goodwill (or threats) did this man have over this group of people? You can’t NDA someone to not address their own lack of employment and collapse of their former employer.

Robert is a crazy litigious vindictive asshole. Remember when an employee came on here a few years ago and simply said they had quit? Robert said in an interview he was going after them for "breaking multiple covenants"

The real threat with human waste like Robert is it costs him very little to threaten you - and as a defendant the greatest danger is the cost of your defense. You don't have 58 million stolen dollars in your pocket like he does. This has already happened you just haven't heard about it.

That's why these games are toxic trash that Elon Musk needs to fly into the Sun.

Quoted from jwilson:
I literally forgot you existed until you started telling professional artists what art is.

Yeah that is exactly what happened. Dude I’m fully aware of myself. I know I can get into it when people post shit I find stupid. I try and do better so people can discuss what the want to discuss.
pasted_image (resized).png

Quoted from Darscot:
Dude I’m fully aware of myself.

950CF27A-B6E6-4F7E-ACDE-4A840FD2351F (resized).jpeg

Quoted from benheck:
Robert is a crazy litigious vindictive asshole. Remember when an employee came on here a few years ago and simply said they had quit? Robert said in an interview he was going after them for "breaking multiple covenants"
The real threat with human waste like Robert is it costs him very little to threaten you - and as a defendant the greatest danger is the cost of your defense. You don't have 58 million stolen dollars in your pocket like he does. This has already happened you just haven't heard about it.
That's why these games are toxic trash that Elon Musk needs to fly into the Sun.

Thinking about what type of people make for horrible bosses. If they —

* run a shady business that is prone to fielding customer inquiries and complaints.

* manage all incoming and control all outgoing comments.

* then stir the pot by making many outlandish public comments about how they are going to build what everybody wants and needs.

* has many outstanding business related lawsuits.

* has many lawsuits and counter lawsuits against own employees.

* are controlled at the top by a megalomaniac.

These would all be red flags and I know it would suck being an employee under such disfunctional conditions and horrible boss. However it could also have been pretty fun working there at times.

https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/twip-munsters-to-tpf-deeproot-pinball-price-range-nyc-pinball-championship-more/

Screen Shot 2021-08-29 at 6.33.02 AM (resized).png

https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/twip-deadpool-pinball-revealed-gomez-interview-dennis-nordman-interview-expo-schedule-more/

Screen Shot 2021-08-29 at 5.54.23 AM (resized).png

https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/twip-deadpool-premium-le-stream-spooky-talks-godzilla-stern-tna-steve-ritchie-interview-george-gomez-interview-more/

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https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/retro-atomic-zombie-adventureland-pinball-deep-dive-in-depth-overview-of-the-machine-features-rules-and-more/

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What if Pinside didn't list your company under "Game Manufacturers" until your company actually shipped a manufactured game? Then it would mark an achievement, a major milestone hit.

Leasing a commercial space, buying equipment you don't know how to operate, making a couple prototypes and engaging in some massive "productivity theater" does not make you a Game Manufacturer.

As a community, we should be self regulating. We can cheer for our own to be successful and congratulate them when they achieve something significant. We can be supportive through challenges and have the tough conversations when it might be time to just pull the plug.

If we can do this, maybe we can keep history from repeating itself again... and again... and again...

Aaron
FAST Pinball

Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:
Thinking about what type of people make for horrible bosses. If they —
* run a shady business that is prone to fielding customer inquiries and complaints.
* manage all incoming and control all outgoing comments.
* then stir the pot by making many outlandish public comments about how they are going to build what everybody wants and needs.
* has many outstanding business related lawsuits.
* has many lawsuits and counter lawsuits against own employees.
* are controlled at the top by a megalomaniac.
These would all be red flags and I know it would suck being an employee under such disfunctional conditions and horrible boss. However it could also have been pretty fun working there at times.

I know Robert’s act impressed people who are susceptible to the charms of allegedly rich blowhards, but many were pretty taken aback that this guy was supposedly starting a pinball company.

That’s not how people who are serious in business act. Taking to a hobby forum to fight with commoners?! Constantly trashing all of the established players in the business and making outlandish promises about outdoing them all within months?

It all seemed so amateur hour from the jump. Still can’t believe how seriously some people took him, and the respect and prominence afforded to him by the “pinball media” from the get go.

Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:
Thinking about what type of people make for horrible bosses. If they —
* run a shady business that is prone to fielding customer inquiries and complaints.
* manage all incoming and control all outgoing comments.
* then stir the pot by making many outlandish public comments about how they are going to build what everybody wants and needs.
* has many outstanding business related lawsuits.
* has many lawsuits and counter lawsuits against own employees.
* are controlled at the top by a megalomaniac.
These would all be red flags and I know it would suck being an employee under such disfunctional conditions and horrible boss. However it could also have been pretty fun working there at times.

Sounds like Tommy Tallarico, the RM of the video game world lol …I’m betting the Intellivision Amico never ships, just like RAZA. The stories are very similar.

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
And please share any treasures you unearth.

@blueberryjohnson, you are a treasure. Maximum respect for pulling everything together.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:
I know Robert’s act impressed people who are susceptible to the charms of allegedly rich blowhards, but many were pretty taken aback that this guy was supposedly starting a pinball company.

That’s not how people who are serious in business act. Taking to a hobby forum to fight with commoners?! Constantly trashing all of the established players in the business and making outlandish promises about outdoing them all within months?

Speaking of complete frauds, the Elizabeth Holmes of Theranos trial starts soon.
https://www.cnet.com/how-to/elizabeth-holmes-theranos-trial-here-is-what-to-know-about-the-hotly-anticipated-case/
Once 'worth' nine billion dollars. Critics shouted down. Business darling at the time, based on nothing but hope. People just wanted to believe.

History repeats itself - again. https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/videos/a31953/the-dale-1970s-three-wheel-gas-saver-scam/

The details are always different but as long as people want things there will be scammers trying to get their money without giving them the things.

CE06786E-9B90-499E-B49B-554BDE1C2AF4 (resized).jpeg

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
Deeproot Studios org org chart (circa ?) courtesy of Kaneda and my best guess at who already left (if anyone is even still there) based on public info:
[quoted image][quoted image]

And Scott Danesi's Total Nuclear Annilation is one of the very best pinball machines made too!

You walked into the hobby
like you were walking into a yacht.
Your plan was premised
upon one huge lie.
Your color theme was purple snot.

You had one eye in the mirror
as you watched yourself gavotte.

And all the preorders dreamed
that they'd be an owner

They'd be an owner.

And you're so vain.
You probably think this song is about you.

You're so vain.
I bet you think this song is about you.
Don't you?
Don't you?

Jpop had me several years ago
when I was still quite naive.
RAZA and AIW were such a pretty pair.
And Magic Girl was the game to lead.

But he gave away the deposits we left
after Heckendorn set himself free.

Original themes swirled like
clouds in his coffee
clouds in his coffee

And you're so vain.
This target bank
is surely about you.

Screenshot_20210829-151921_Chrome (resized).jpg

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:
He does have $6,069.79 in deeproot store credit.

Untitled 1 (resized).png

Q:How many people does it take to build a working pinball machine ?

A: If you are Danesi -> ONE
If you are JPOP -> no amount could ever be enough.
If you are RM -> its not the number of people that’s important it’s how much money you have to spend. How much money do we have again ? $58 million ? …. yeah more than that.

Quoted from ZNET:
You walked into the hobby
like you were walking into a yacht.
Your plan was premised
upon one huge lie.
Your color theme was purple snot.
You had one eye in the mirror
as you watched yourself gavotte.
And all the preorders dreamed
that they'd be an owner
They'd be an owner.
And you're so vain.
You probably think this song is about you.
You're so vain.
I bet you think this song is about you.
Don't you?
Don't you?
Jpop had me several years ago
when I was still quite naive.
RAZA and AIW were such a pretty pair.
And Magic Girl was the game to lead.
But he gave away the deposits we left
after Heckendorn set himself free.
Original themes swirled like
clouds in his coffee
clouds in his coffee
And you're so vain.
This target bank
is surely about you.[quoted image]

I always found it profoundly cringey on the RAZA backglass when they had the names listed similar to a movie poster. MUELLER front and center like he was the main star of the movie.

Screenshot_20210829-151514_Chrome (resized).jpg

Yeah Mueller definitely had a narcissistic personality disorder. Look how big the typeface is?

Quoted from thechakapakuni:
Yeah Mueller definitely had a narcissistic personality disorder. Look how big the typeface is?

I know it’s a big font, but to be clear; listing the names of every little old lady and every other “investor” that was truly responsible for “directing” this project wouldn’t have left any room on the translite for the stunning artwork, So I think it’s fine it was all distilled down to “Mueller.”

Say what you will, but he was truly the mastermind behind it all!

Quoted from Haymaker:
I always found it profoundly cringey on the RAZA backglass when they had the names listed similar to a movie poster. MUELLER front and center like he was the main star of the movie. [quoted image]

That poster really tells the story of RM's priorities and who he values (the "stars"), when we're told time and time again that the engineers and coders are the real magic workers.

Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:
Speaking of complete frauds, the Elizabeth Holmes of Theranos trial starts soon.
https://www.cnet.com/how-to/elizabeth-holmes-theranos-trial-here-is-what-to-know-about-the-hotly-anticipated-case/
Once 'worth' nine billion dollars. Critics shouted down. Business darling at the time, based on nothing but hope. People just wanted to believe.
History repeats itself - again. https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/videos/a31953/the-dale-1970s-three-wheel-gas-saver-scam/
The details are always different but as long as people want things there will be scammers trying to get their money without giving them the things.

The Theranos fraud was different in a few key ways than deeproot. Theranos ginned up investors with a truthful statement on how they wanted to spend the money, to develop a revolutionary blood testing machine. And they built them. The problem is the blood testing machines were bunk and overhyped. Scientifically it was impossible to diagnose so many conditions with so little blood.

The Theranos fraud had validation. Walgreens partnering with them gave them so much runway with other investors. I think it was 50/50 who believed deeproot and who didn’t. With Theranos 90% of media believed the hype because the alternative would be knowingly endangering people’s lives and it seemed so unlikely someone would do that. Also to understand Theranos’ fraud you didn’t have to crunch numbers, you had to know a decent amount of science to know why it wouldn’t work. Deeproot was understandable to anyone who has ever done any sort of accounting.

Quoted from fastpinball:
What if Pinside didn't list your company under "Game Manufacturers" until your company actually shipped a manufactured game? Then it would mark an achievement, a major milestone hit.
Leasing a commercial space, buying equipment you don't know how to operate, making a couple prototypes and engaging in some massive "productivity theater" does not make you a Game Manufacturer.
As a community, we should be self regulating. We can cheer for our own to be successful and congratulate them when they achieve something significant. We can be supportive through challenges and have the tough conversations when it might be time to just pull the plug.
If we can do this, maybe we can keep history from repeating itself again... and again... and again...
Aaron
FAST Pinball

I completely support this. It should be listed as "prototype and homebrew" until a customer receives a working game that they purchased

Quoted from Haymaker:
I always found it profoundly cringey on the RAZA backglass when they had the names listed similar to a movie poster. MUELLER front and center like he was the main star of the movie. [quoted image]

Agreed. Ben Heck is also right about how much of a mess this title was thematically. The streams show how much of a jumble the narrative components of the theme are. The game would make so much more sense if it was streamlined to either: zombies, plus theme park; or aliens, plus theme park

Quoted from Stuieb84:
Agreed. Ben Heck is also right about how much of a mess this title was thematically. The streams show how much of a jumble the narrative components of the theme are. The game would make so much more sense if it was streamlined to either: zombies, plus theme park; or aliens, plus theme park

Just listening to a Nov 2019 interview with Steve Bowden from a Slam Tilt podcast episode I hadn't heard (http://www.slamtiltpodcast.com/2019/11/28/episode-137-rooting-atomic-zombies/).

Used to hearing Steve talking with great enthusiasm, I was surprised at how low energy he seemed when discussing RAZA. In particular, the first part of the interview relates to the storyline for the game, and Steve's responses made it sound like he thinks it's a convoluted mess. Even one of the hosts (neither of whom are deeproot fans) does a better job of selling the premise.

I may have cracked the code on why Deeproot started taking orders for Raza on the seemingly random date of December 8, 2020:

https://opengovus.com/texas-taxpayer/32056799128

Screen Shot 2021-08-29 at 12.17.20 PM (resized).png

Quite the eager beaver!

Quoted from ForceFlow:
Do you have the full resolution photos? These are all thumbnails

I asked for better resolution pictures of the inside and this is what I recieved. If I hear anything further I will pass it along.

thumbnail_IMG_3536 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3541 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3546 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3549 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3550 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3553 (resized).jpg

thumbnail_IMG_3554 (resized).jpg

Quoted from Mr68:
I asked for better resolution pictures of the inside and this is what I recieved. If I hear anything further I will pass it along.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

I can't make out the name of the 1 poor pinball machine left behind.
Wonder If someone just broke in over the last couple weeks and took the others.
This place has been empty for a while. This does not look like a July move out.

Quoted from Ericpinballfan:
I can't make out the name of the 1 poor pinball machine left behind.
Wonder If someone just broke in over the last couple weeks and took the others.
This place has been empty for a while. This does not look like a July move out.

Looks to me like a Black Hole. That's my guess. Appropriately named game for where the money went.

Quoted from Ericpinballfan:
I can't make out the name of the 1 poor pinball machine left behind.

Black Hole.

Sums it all up.

A foam core layout that cost millions to build

C2988931-B601-48E4-AA00-9CC032F8EF56 (resized).jpeg

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deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago

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Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!