(Topic ID: 203700)
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Pinball is the memorable angle. Otherwise it’s just another jackass stealing from retirement plans. Those are a dime a dozen.
He didn’t even steal that much in the grand scheme of things. It’s what he spent it on that’s so unique.
Although I think it’s hard to convey how insane some of Robert’s pinball ideas were to the layperson. Most people still don’t know they still make pinball machines, let alone how difficult they are to make and what they cost. So some of the stuff that we know is batshit insane doesn’t easily translate to normal people
Luckily Robert said lots of dumb stuff on record
I hope to see all the footage they filmed that day of the deep six reveal. They only put out a small amount. Based on the PinPod video, I’m sure there’s lots of gold on a hard drive somewhere.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:The pinball stuff (which includes deeproot tech and deeproot studios) was surely the primary money sink that sunk the fund. It wasn't deeproot sports and entertainment (though I'm sure Robert wasted $ there too).
So I think it's a major part of this disaster, and hope that some reporters will pick up on this because that's one of the angles that could really help this get some mainstream coverage.
Normies hearing that a guy broke however many laws that ended up trashing a $60 million fund and 300 people's investments trying, and failing, to build pinball machines, which most people don't even realize are still a thing? That's one hell of a story
i'll be looking forward to the actual numbers and details of the fund's origins, what money went where, and how it dissolved. there's still a lot to be unpacked.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Pinball is the memorable angle. Otherwise it’s just another jackass stealing from retirement plans. Those are a dime a dozen.
He didn’t even steal that much in the grand scheme of things. It’s what he spent it on that’s so unique.
Although I think it’s hard to convey how insane some of Robert’s pinball ideas were to the layperson. Most people still don’t know they still make pinball machines, let alone how difficult they are to make and what they cost. So some of the stuff that we know is batshit insane doesn’t easily translate to normal people
Luckily Robert said lots of dumb stuff on record
I hope to see all the footage they filmed that day of the deep six reveal. They only put a small amount. Based on the PinPod video, I’m sure there’s lots of gold on a hard drive somewhere.
I would LOVE to see the "hammer test" video, where Rob explains to everybody that, yeah, the playfields resemble Orbiter One but don't worry, that's a just a small detail we'll "smooth" out.
Quoted from TreyBo69:I hope to see all the footage they filmed that day of the deep six reveal. They only put out a small amount. Based on the PinPod video, I’m sure there’s lots of gold on a hard drive somewhere.
Would definitely bid on this at a bankruptcy auction.
Quoted from bigehrl:i know it's fun to think about, but the reality is the Pinball Division was just a small part of the grand scheme. it would get a small mention in any kind of screenplay about him. let alone, make up the title.
For a movie narrative, it would be so much more interesting to see a bunch of bumbling idiots trying & failing to make a pinball business while other companies succeed, and the third act twist is Robert’s bigger criminal schemes & getting caught.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:I would LOVE to see the "hammer test" video, where Rob explains to everybody that, yeah, the playfields resemble Orbiter One but don't worry, that's a just a small detail we'll "smooth" out.
I want to see Robert break the pinbar while showing off the lift system.
Quoted from soren:Somebody gots to keep an overview of what we have seen emerge since Saturday. And a timeline. I am getting dizzy.
Dreams of Ice: the slow melt of a Pinball Ponzi Scheme.
What ever happened to Iceman anyway? Texas heat make him go all Frosty the Snowman on us?
Someone look for a hat in a puddle of water. It may smell a little like Jack, then you know you found the right one.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Too bad the film crew wasn't there to capture the ceremonial lighting of the raza
5krngx (resized).jpgQuoted from Rarehero:For a movie narrative, it would be so much more interesting to see a bunch of bumbling idiots trying & failing to make a pinball business while other companies succeed, and the third act twist is Robert’s bigger criminal schemes & getting caught.
Yeah showing a company like Spooky and Stern alongside deeproot would help make the good guys v bad guys who are clueless narrative translate to a general audience. Show them how it’s actually done while letting the audience realize how little Robert knew what he was doing.
Just a reminder, if you haven't had any laughs yet today, Deep Root actually said this about the pinbar:
“The PinbarTM is the most powerful, revolutionary innovation ever to be added to a Pinball machine. We want to challenge the last few decades of pinball by changing from a habit of walking up to a deeproot machine and saying, “Where is the start button?”; to walking up to any non-deeproot machine and saying “Where’s the Pinbar?”
----
Well, at least they got that right. Many disappointed "owners" are certainly asking, "Where's the pinbar?"
Quoted from TreyBo69:Yeah showing a company like Spooky and Stern alongside deeproot would help make the good guys v bad guys who are clueless narrative translate to a general audience. Show them how it’s actually done while letting the audience realize how little Robert knew what he was doing.
Just imagine the ending - Charlie & his family glowing, Gary & crew popping corks after their newest LE sells out in 10 minutes…..and Robert sitting in a cell, Jpop trying to con another sugar daddy, and Barry living in his car & selling MAGA shirts at rallies.
Quoted from Beechwood:What ever happened to Iceman anyway?
I think he finally blocked all of Pinside. And why not, he was 85% there already.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Just a reminder, if you haven't had any laughs yet today, Deep Root actually said this about the pinbar:
“The PinbarTM is the most powerful, revolutionary innovation ever to be added to a Pinball machine."
"We want to challenge the last few decades of pinball by changing from a habit of walking up to a deeproot machine and saying, “Where is the start button?”; to walking up to any non-deeproot machine and saying “Where’s the Pinbar?”
----
Well, at least they got that right. Many disappointed "owners" are certainly asking, "Where's the pinbar?"
On the victory lap episode of pinball profile from December he also said that RAZA is the most innovative pinball machine of all time.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Yeah showing a company like Spooky and Stern alongside deeproot would help make the good guys v bad guys who are clueless narrative translate to a general audience. Show them how it’s actually done while letting the audience realize how little Robert knew what he was doing.
Yet in Robert's world (and I'm sure at deeproot) THEY are the good guys! Seriously!
Quoted from benheck:Let's workshop a name for the inevitable documentary!
Pinball terms the public knows: wizards, tilt, game over
Go!
Pinball Ponzi: The Fall of deeproot
Full Tilt Ponzi
Pinball Ponzi Wizards
Besides a working title, it needs a tagline: "Every inmate needs a pinball...Every pinball needs an inmate"
In the steaming age it needs a LOGLINE not a tag line.
"A lawyer cons hundreds of old people out of their life savings trying to build a revolutionary new kind of pinbdall machine"
It's basically the text that pops up when you hover over a title on Netflix.
Also this is like 3 times bigger than Fyre Fest and scammed old people not rich millenials. A doco is inevitable.
Decided to do a search for goonies license. I'm not seeing anything filed from texas, pinball related or otherwise in the last decade:
https://www3.wipo.int/branddb/en
There's a reason Robert teased "hey you guys", legally he could say that. he couldn't say "I have the goonies license"
WIPO IP portal (resized).png
*edit: It's possible that website doesn't cover everything. I can't find any of Stern's licenses either. Anyone know where that stuff is looked up? US trademark website isn't helping either.
Quoted from toyotaboy:Decided to do a search for goonies license. I'm not seeing anything filed from texas, pinball related or otherwise in the last decade:
https://www3.wipo.int/branddb/en
There's a reason Robert teased "hey you guys", legally he could say that. he couldn't say "I have the goonies license"[quoted image]
He specifically talked about goonies by name several times.
Not that it means they had the license. The guy obviously has no problem lying.*
*Allegedly
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:He specifically talked about goonies by name several times.
Not that it means they had the license. The guy obviously has no problem lying.*
*Allegedly
He danced around it in his pitch decks. He tried to avoid a paper trail
A lot of the SEC allegations point out Robert documented very little, which he probably thought would help but likely just made it all worse for himself.
He’ll plead the fifth and make people unravel the web of lies.
Quoted from toyotaboy:Decided to do a search for goonies license. I'm not seeing anything filed from texas, pinball related or otherwise in the last decade:
https://www3.wipo.int/branddb/en
There's a reason Robert teased "hey you guys", legally he could say that. he couldn't say "I have the goonies license"[quoted image]
Entering "The Who" and "pinball" also comes up bupkis.
Quoted from PismoArcade:Entering "The Who" and "pinball" also comes up bupkis.
I think that's a trademark search, not a licensing search (I was never able to find a free/public licensing search). Stern comes up if you just search stern pinball as the name, however all the results are Stern's own trademarks (which make sense). Trying to search something like Mandolorian or Deadpool and the category class of 28 (which is the one that relates to most stuff) doesn't get you anything related to pinball.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:I think that's a trademark search, not a licensing search
This. I'm pretty sure licensing agreements are private business (until someone chooses to make it known of course).
Merthyr Tydfil
Quoted from yancy:Pinball Wizard: Trials, Tribulations and Tilts
You could turn the Deeproot saga into an Ace Attorney case and players would say it's too convoluted and far-fetched.
Quoted from bigehrl:a 3 year old Facebook post from my good friend Molly, properly calling it like she saw it. I totally forgot I had commented on it, or even what I said. But boy, does it hold up.........
[quoted image]
Is Barry asleep in that picture?
Quoted from benheck:Let's workshop a name for the inevitable documentary!
Pinball terms the public knows: wizards, tilt, game over
Go!
Pinball Ponzi: The Fall of deeproot
Full Tilt Ponzi
Pinball Ponzi Wizards
Quoted from Manimal:How about "No Ball save.....the Deeproot Story"......
Quoted from EasternBloc:Deeproot: For Bemusement Only
Quoted from yancy:Tiger King: Murder, Mayhem and Madness
Pinball Wizard: Trials, Tribulations and Tilts
The perfect title exists already: it's called The Producers.
Toronto, ON
Quoted from benheck:Ben Heck's BIBLE FUCKING ADVENTURES!
Ben, NOBODY wants to hear what you get up to with a drill press, lube, and the Word of the Lord. This is a family game.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Quite simply, RM bought his credibility around here, and it was easy. We went from nobody knowing who this asshole was to people clamoring to send him money in a matter of a couple short months.
I can't imagine anyone who has been involved in this specific thread would have sent him even a nickel. The red flags were here from DAY 1. If they did then I really don't have anything to say except...I'm thinking of building a pinball company, can you send me some money too?
At first I was glad that the press coverage wasn't covering pinball, because do we want to be attached to this story, but now I realize there is no way this isn't going to blow up, big time. Bring on the Netflix docuseries.
I remain skeptical that this will bubble above the financial rags. It's a relatively paltry sum in a post-Madoff world, and the general public barely knows that pinball exists. Also doesn't help that Bob has the same name as a much more famous guy from a recent kerfuffle.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:How about this for our leading man?[quoted image]
I could picture RM on a Segway roaming his factory & offices. The Bally executives walked the plant floors in their suits and leather shoes. Not RM, he's too good, being a thief and all.
Quoted from Sinistarrett:Is Barry asleep in that picture?
[quoted image]
Kinda looks like Barry and Dennis are secretly texting each other:
Dennis: Hey Barry....WAKE UP!
Barry: I'm not sleeping, I'm thinking.
Dennis: What about?
Barry: Robert just asked if I wanted to invest my savings in the company.
Dennis: Oh yeah, me too.
Barry: What did you say?
Dennis: I told him to go blow it out his ass.
textmeoutahere (resized).jpgQuoted from toyotaboy:Decided to do a search for goonies license. I'm not seeing anything filed from texas, pinball related or otherwise in the last decade:
https://www3.wipo.int/branddb/en
There's a reason Robert teased "hey you guys", legally he could say that. he couldn't say "I have the goonies license"
[quoted image]
*edit: It's possible that website doesn't cover everything. I can't find any of Stern's licenses either. Anyone know where that stuff is looked up? US trademark website isn't helping either.
I knew that they didn't have the Goonies license. It was weird to me that they never officially said or wrote on that press day deal that they had the Goonies. All they had was a black picture that said "HEY YOU GUYS". If they really had the license they would have said The Goonies. Why put a line from a movie if you actually had permission to use the name of the movie?
Quoted from HookedonPinonics:I knew that they didn't have the Goonies license. It was weird to me that they never officially said or wrote on that press day deal that they had the Goonies. All they had was a black picture that said "HEY YOU GUYS". If they really had the license they would have said The Goonies. Why put a line from a movie if you actually had permission to use the name of the movie?
Also weird considering Robert had little issue lying about a lot of other stuff
Sheesh - imagine working at a revolutionary pinball company. Getting sold on an idea to add another milestone to your career, start a career or rise like a phoenix from the ashes. You sign up and take a slightly lower paycheck than you are accustomed to. Things are going pretty good until that meeting when someone flips on the prototype and smoke starts to roll out into the air. Someone says don't worry... this is the most revolutionary game in the market space right now. We are going to sell the hell out of these.. Looks like we sold about 100 of them folks. Keep up the good work, got crack a few eggs to make an omelet... something doesn't seem right as no one is making an omelet... pinball is hard. Good thing that Covid stimulus money starts rolling in right... We got this... We got this.. Couple lawyers come into an office space and managers say "keep your traps shut". Looks like something fishy is going on.. Couple folks jump ship. Some folks who ordered games get notices that their are some issues..... Pinside possee jumps in and gets to work.... and SEC investigation comes to light.. That company turns out to be a poorly construed cover up... What now?
Quoted from Palmer:They’re just being nice. I’d take that 5 year bet. If I want to play video games, I’ll fire up my Xbox.
Oh yeah, real or digital? Look closely at the picture and zoom in. You can't tell the difference. Even has the silk screen dots on the graphics. Its actually better than this without down sizing and taking a pixel photo causing a wavy pattern.
20210825_131903 (resized).jpgQuoted from Viggin900:Oh yeah, real or digital? Look closely at the picture and zoom in. You can't tell the difference. Even has the silk screen dots on the graphics. Its actually better than this without down sizing and taking a pixel photo causing a wavy pattern.
[quoted image]
I'd have to see how the playfield handles distance perspective. The paradox there though is that any photo of a real machine that shows the whole playfield won't give you the correct distance perspective anyway; you have to take the shot back from where you would normally stand, and from the playing position you would be tracking only a portion of the playfield at any time.
FROM: Mueller, Robert (Principal, deeproot technologies)
TO: deeproot pinball technical staff
All-
Please plan to gather in the break room today to celebrate our achievements and reflect on what is yet to come, as we have the celebratory first power on of the industry-leading and vastly innovative RAZA pinball machine that you have all been working so hard on for the past few months. We have all contributed to this amazing accomplishment and now it's time to revel in the glory of this game that is going to change the pinball world.
Attendance at this meeting is mandatory, as we want to have all hands on deck for the film crew that I've asked to attend to capture this glorious moment for future generations to see. All deeproot days are suspended for this day only, to allow you to place your full focus on being here and helping to celebrate. I've decided to have a complimentary Tex-Mex buffet catered to the site, so no need to plan for lunch.
While you've all helped in this amazing effort, we would not be at this point without the one who made it all possible, jpop! For this reason, we will be allowing him the honor of throwing the ceremonial switch on this game as it powers up for the first time.
I thank you again for your great work, and I look forward to literally setting the pinball world on fire with our amazing new creation.
Best,
RM
Quoted from Viggin900:Oh yeah, real or digital? Look closely at the picture and zoom in. You can't tell the difference. Even has the silk screen dots on the graphics. Its actually better than this without down sizing and taking a pixel photo causing a wavy pattern.
[quoted image]
That looks great... but what is missing on digital pinball are physics that feel right and an accurate modeling of nudging. I used to play a lot of digital pinball and if it is all I have I still enjoy it, but it feels fake.
With better ball physics that can model spin and more of the randomness it could come closer to a real pinball machine
With great accelerometers in a cabinet to catch movement and code to model it in the simulation it could really come closer.
We aren't there yet.
Quoted from toyotaboy:Virtual pinball 5 years ago.. sorta meh. 4k virtual pinball (has to be redone to take advantage of the higher resolution), beautiful. Watch this video and tell me that doesn't look good
I was never a fan of virtual pinball, as I'll always prefer the real thing. But I have to admit that thing looks great. I'd love to see one in person.
Berne
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