Madison, WI
Iceman is gaslighting.
(Topic ID: 203700)
Linked Games
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Deeproot, 2020
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Quoted from Stemmy:I disagree. This was an utter ponzi scheme screwing with old people and stealing their money. For all raza deposits etc may need to join this as a class.
You don’t join a “class” with the SEC
There will be other litigation I’m sure, against Robert himself personally etc etc
Quoted from spinal:I’ve hear octo is twice as efficient as quad production.
Octoponzi
Quoted from zaphX:Is this phase “denial” or “bargaining?”
Sarcasm phase.... With a bit of satire on the willful ignorance that many have had to the writing on the wall.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:I have no idea how this works. Maybe ice can weigh in.
How deep do the tentacles go when they try to claw back the stolen money? Do they go after folks like PAPA or TPF who were unwitting recipients of stolen money? The JPop buy outs like you mentioned? I would think those people are at high risk of some kind of effort to reclaim the stolen money they received to buy them out of the initial JPOP scam.
It’s small potatoes in the scheme of things but who knows. I gladly would have accepted money from RM for NYCPC if he’d offered. If he’d given us the kind of money he gave to the TPF tournament I’d would have been happy to say inane things into a hot mic like “a pinball for every home. A home for every pinball. Deep root.” So let’s just say I’m glad we dodged that bullet.
Personally, I’d be sweating balls if I had ever received a check from deep root in any capacity. Somebody is gonna come looking around for their money.
That money was handled in normal good faith activities by the llc so no one is coming after zidware refunds or tpf sponsor dollars etc.
What will happen is deeproot pinball the llc will have tens of millions judgement against it… they’ll declare bankruptcy … liquidate and the judgement will take some of the proceeds.
The pinball activity isn’t scrutinized here except in the insider dealing of RM giving pinball money without normal expectations. So the suit (for DP) is simply ‘we want our money back from deeproot pinball’ that you got unjustly.
Its the end for Deeproot pinball because they don’t have the money to give back… and of course RM is f’d individually and has no way forward for deeproot pinball.
Quoted from benheck:Iceman is gaslighting.
Gaslighting who or what?
Maybe I’ll be picking up the pieces with others for pennies to finish off this wonderful project. Lol
Quoted from iceman44:Gaslighting who or what?
Maybe I’ll be picking up the pieces with others for pennies to finish off this wonderful project. Lol
I found you an investor greatwich
Quoted from iceman44:Congratulations for you.
It was NOT a complete and utter scam from the beginning.
The Raza Jpop story was OVER years ago until DR stepped in and made it a possibility again.
It didn’t work out. Pinball is just part of a MUCH bigger story here.
As bad as it looks for Robert he didn’t set out looking to steal $58 million. At least I don’t believe that
Stupid and horrendous management? No doubt
Why is it always you, sitting on the sidelines of all these failed ventures? Pumping them up to the pinside masses?
Even now - when it’s so clear that many were right from the jump - you have the gall to say it wasn’t a scam?
Hope I see you at a show sometime.
Quoted from iceman44:Congratulations for you.
It was NOT a complete and utter scam from the beginning.
The Raza Jpop story was OVER years ago until DR stepped in and made it a possibility again.
It didn’t work out. Pinball is just part of a MUCH bigger story here.
As bad as it looks for Robert he didn’t set out looking to steal $58 million. At least I don’t believe that
Stupid and horrendous management? No doubt
If the SEC filing allegations are true, him and his 2nd and 3rd wife's used credit cards drawn against the funds for their personal expenses. He was buying jewelry, sending his kids to private school, and bough a condo in Hawaii. Was there are point at which Robert said to himself, I'm tired of running this as a legitimate investment fund, time to make it a scam? The second those millions hit the bank account he was probably off and running to fund his desired lifestyle.
https://twitter.com/DeeprootFunds/status/1258074035176366082
Screen Shot 2021-08-21 at 5.35.05 AM (resized).png
Quoted from benheck:Somehow worse than I imagined. (though a few weeks back I suggested the SEC could get involved)
This is really bad for the hobby. What if this had happened right before Stern was saved by the angel investors? How will this affect new companies seeking investments and loans?
Nah… for pinball this is nothing more than a lesson in scrutinizing ‘where is the money coming from’. RMs scumming was more about his slush fund investment peddling.
Deeproot pinball and his other gigs is just more ‘guy with no idea starts business and fails”. The story is RM - not pinball viability or associations.
It is easy to distance any ‘normal’ pinball upstart from what RM did… and the scrutiny from investors in the future will be about leadership and structure.
Heighway pinball is conceptually more ugly for pinball. Deeproot is more about wheres the money coming from…embezzlement and lying about it.
one thing ill never understand is how these people spend money that isnt earned. robert living like some millionaire, jpop buying a range rover and paying himself 100k salary during zidware days. its like that movie dumb n dumber. is robert going to hand over a briefcase of IOU'S?
Ignorance, arrogance, and fraud. That’s an ugly combination and it’s beyond me why some pretend otherwise. Good riddance Bobby Pinball!
Quoted from iceman44:Congratulations for you.
It was NOT a complete and utter scam from the beginning.
Based on the “guaranteed return”-ish language put into the prospectus, the SEC will disagree
As pinball hobbyists, and self claimed experts about the subject, it was easy for us to look almost anything Deeproot Pinball claimed ( and any word that came out of RM's mouth) as complete and utter bullshit.
My wife works for a large private equity company, and has spent most of her career working with investment and private equity funds. With absolutely zero context, I showed her the deeproot funds site and asked for her opinion. Her immediate thought was "this looks like a scam or phishing site".
Quoted from Robotoes:Why is it always you, sitting on the sidelines of all these failed ventures? Pumping them up to the pinside masses?
Even now - when it’s so clear that many were right from the jump - you have the gall to say it wasn’t a scam?
Hope I see you at a show sometime.
You want to see me at a show sometime?
Are you threatening me? What a joke. Lol
Quoted from CrazyLevi:More to it than that really. Probably a last-gasp effort to appear “legit” legally and provide cover for the scam. “Look! We are selling pinball machines!” Way too little way too late obviously.
The dude was leveraging what he had to get loans to pay the fund’s obligations (Cuz he knew that was the audience that could sink him… not lame preorder buyers). While co mingling funds…. I don’t doubt for a second that pinball money would have gone to investor payments instead of pinball progress.
No pre payment amount would have been enough to get games made when starting from nothing if they didn’t already have a much larger piggy bank already. It had to be about generating free cash.
I guess its more clear why RM invested in the video production for his lame open house. High production quality video to have something to market the investment with…
Quoted from benheck:Iceman, take the L as the kids would say.
We won't ask you to apologize. But we can ask you to STFU.
I will take the L Ben, win some lose some. I’m off to play some golf now while you spend all day here breaking it down for us
I’ve got ZERO to apologize for regarding my Jpop experience. Is it what it is.
It’s always been much more important to YOU and your Jpop hatred to see this chapter end so why don’t YOU take the W and then STFU!!
He will pop up again somewhere to continue to torment you. Lol
Quoted from Richthofen:How, as a lawyer, did he not think this would happen?
That’s the problem with scumbags. They think they can get away with anything.
Quoted from iceman44:Are you threatening me?
ice (resized).jpgQuoted from iceman44:As bad as it looks for Robert he didn’t set out looking to steal $58 million. At least I don’t believe that
So which wedding (or divorce) funded with investor money would you pinpoint as the moment he stepped over the line?
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:So, biggest scandal in pinball history, right? This is the SEC we're talking about.
I guess Robert really was an innovator after all.
Well this was money from the fund. That money was not from income received from pinball, as that was a very small amount, overall. So while this is obviously a huge deal, and RM can wind up in jail, pinball played a small role.
Quoted from Richthofen:How, as a lawyer, did he not think this would happen?
Because he is smarter than everyone else.
Quoted from iceman44:That’s their problem to work out. Not mine
And I’ll be back the following week. Watching, waiting…..
I have lawyers (bigger and badder) I have $$$. “Venue” is in Bexar county where I live.
Quoted from Mr68:This is the second time that Iceman has offered free legal to the Deeproot people. He will establish a ton of credibility with me if he finally walks the walk. And I mean that.
I'm quoting his comment in case the time comes and his memory falters.
Quoted from jonesjb:Could anyone at Deeproot go to jail over this?
Robert. The SEC will finish their civil case to reclaim as much as they can for the investors, then at that point they can refer it to the FBI.
Quoted from mrgone:Ok Ben, it’s story time.
uncle bens bedtime stories can only pale in comparison to the sec complaint. in light of todays developments, do we really need to hear what a couple scatterbrained dreamers were telling people six years ago and how infatuated robert was with lazy-bones jpop? the only 'revelations' ben may still have will be found in his bible adventures game.
Quoted from greenhornet:uncle bens bedtime stories can only pale in comparison to the sec complaint. in light of todays developments, do we really need to hear what a couple scatterbrained dreamers were telling people six years ago and how infatuated robert was with lazy-bones jpop? the only 'revelations' ben might still have will be found in his bible adventures game.
Ben can buy Pixar quality cutscenes for Bible Adventures for dirt cheap now
Quoted from fosaisu:So which wedding (or divorce) funded with investor money would you pinpoint as the moment he stepped over the line?
Yeah I don’t know all the facts and I’m sure the SEC will get to the bottom of it, along with the investment advisors and other potential litigants.
The pinball money is a pittance by comparison. It’s also why I didn’t take any “refund” money in the first place, we knew where it was coming from and not Robert himself.
I will be calling Jason McKinnie on Monday
I had nothing before, I have nothing now. Life goes on. Carry on!
He likes poor customer service and chipping playfields as well. Par for the course.
Quoted from Robotoes:Why is it always you, sitting on the sidelines of all these failed ventures? Pumping them up to the pinside masses?
Quoted from spinal:Maybe we should celebrate those that discuss issues in the open instead of those like RM and others that shill and cover up the truth and just tell you what you’d like to hear, always carefull not to offend.
The shills of this industry bear some responsibility.
Wha? This entire thread has been a celebration of truth and skepticism for at least a year. Hard for Kaneda? What’s hard for Kaneda? 
Quoted from TheFamilyArcade:What’s hard for Kaneda?
Spinal, obviously.
Quoted from TheFamilyArcade:Wha? This entire thread has been a celebration of truth and skepticism for at least a year. Hard for Kaneda? What’s hard for Kaneda?
First rule of podcast speak - there is only podcasts speak. It didn’t happen if it wasn’t from a podcast
Quoted from iceman44:. It’s also why I didn’t take any “refund” money in the first place, we knew where it was coming from and not Robert himself.
I !
So you KNEW.
You KNEW he was stealing money from his funds to give refunds???
That is why you are hated here. You fucked a lot of people while hiding what was really going on.
No defense for this. PERIOD!
Quoted from flynnibus:At least when you know your name is gonna be in the news you wipe all your stuff so the reporters don’t have an easy go at it.
Imagine, the real media interviewing the pinball media about a fake company and non existent pinball machine.
Quoted from jonesjb:Could anyone at Deeproot go to jail over this?
Robert Mueller is 100% going to prison.
Quoted from NoQuarters:What does Ice buy into next ?
Hopefully rehab at some point
Quoted from iceman44:While you guys are all doing the happy dance, $58 million of investor $$$, placed by their trusted investment advisors, are going to get F Ed for at least some portion of their money.
And you were the fiddle player. Especially recently, with all your cryptic “I know something you don’t know” BS. Sit down counselor.
Quoted from iceman44:No one knew how bad the fund was actually performing…
Especially you, and yet you shilled on and on and…
Quoted from iceman44:For me, I’m happy now….
How nice for you. No one cares.
Quoted from PismoArcade:Can someone please archive the Deeproot website while it's still up for posterity?
https://deeprootpinball.com
Don't worry, that shit will live forever over at the Blueberry Institute.
I'm cross posting because Iceman has me blocked. Feel free to repost his quotes if you're unblocked by him and ask him wtf.
Don't expect results but you should.
Quoted from iceman44:As a lawyer myself that understands contract law and am here local, I could offer up a multitude of legal recourse options for all of us. It’s the LAST thing I worry about right now But It won’t be needed. Refunds were an option and still are an option and ALWAYS will be an option.
Quoted from iceman44:That’s their problem to work out. Not mine
And I’ll be back the following week. Watching, waiting…..
I have lawyers (bigger and badder) I have $$$. “Venue” is in Bexar county where I live.
Don't forget people. Mr. Bigshot has got all of you covered legally and at no cost to you.
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