Honolulu, HI
Multiple companies have mentioned supply chain challenges. However, only deeproot (that I can recall) has used supply chain challenges as a reason to no longer be able to communicate anything about when anything will happen.
(Topic ID: 203700)
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Quoted from benheck:Supply chain issues in this small industry are held close to the vest, like a hand in a card game. You don't want the other companies to know what cards you have or need, lest they take advantage of it.
I know ya'll consider Stern a monolith but compared to Apple, Samsung or Nintendo they're a lemonade stand. I'm sure they've had issues like everyone else.
They are the Apple of pinball. Everyone else is a very distant second. Actually it’s not even a good comparison when you consider total market share. Stern dominated Apple in that category.
They enjoy stomping on the competition. More power to them. Even though they scooped up Godzilla out from under Spooky there are still plenty of other scraps to get. Halloween is a good example! 
Stern can’t make them all.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Multiple companies have mentioned supply chain challenges. However, only deeproot (that I can recall) has used supply chain challenges as a reason to no longer be able to communicate anything about when anything will happen.
The only thing that will satisfy the Hunger Games is actual games going out the door!
No more words, promises, excuses etc will matter. So you’ll just have to be patient to find out what’s coming or not
Halifax, NS
Here is another long shot possibility. Say nothing because you are looking for outside contractors to actually build your games. Yes people outsource builds all the time. We all know that you can start with a small core & work your way up. It will not be from a pinball known company, but another likely that has or getting experience to actually do pinball production.
Seems real strange to keep silent if you are ready to fold up & bail on pinball production in mass. After spending many millions & a serious pinball talent group. Not a JPOP fan but he is in the business along with other big names at Deep Root over the years.
Like I said maybe things are moving forward minus the useless pinbar! People know I will talk about my small experience the last 15 years if they ask about uv inkjet production for glass & playfields. My business was sold to a new group of buyers, who are not Deep Root!
There is lots of area for growth for many to enter the pinball manufacturing market around the world. You can use Spooky as a good example that did not stumble out of the gate like other producers.
Finally of the low hundreds of new or restored playfields I have done. None had ink loss or chipping issues with the process used the last 15 years. Spooky may be coy about the secret formula being used since he is now the worlds 3rd largest pinball manufacturer. Seems like Mirco has problems over the years & has not got it perfect or maybe he does so many playfields there are large numbers people complain about. Same with Stern ones at times over the last 15 years or more (I had my first new Stern pin CSI delaminate the ink from the wood). That took me years to get a free replacement after years of complaining, & likely from being a new Stern dealer in Canada.
Seems odd that Stern buying all the parts up is keeping Deeproot from manufacturing. Robert himself told us that they would be producing all the parts and assemblies from the ground up in their "heavy manufacturing area". So what parts exactly are Stern keeping them away from? I thought Robert said they already had most of the parts on hand back in January? The main holdup back then was the UL certification.
Melbourne
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Anyone else find it odd that Iceman is such a regular on this thread, does parking lot recon, and talks a lot about being a lawyer and Robert being a dumbass, yet he hasn't responded to multiple requests to pull the court cases for the active suit alleging DR isn't paying a contractor?
I want some parking lot pics, not just a static number. Give us the google shot referenced earlier, but every Friday. Some pics of the underground tunnels would be choice, too. I wanna know when the pins arrive from Mexico.
Do not think it is a parts supply issue holding up Deep Root. Likely finally figuring out they cannot manufacturer in house. Contract out all your parts & production. Games finally ship starting in 2022 or bust! Playfields, plastics, ramps, glass, cabinets, & other pinball parts can be readily sourced out!
Quoted from greatwichjohn:Do not think it is a parts supply issue holding up Deep Root. Likely finally figuring out they cannot manufacturer in house. Contract out all your parts & production. Games finally ship starting in 2022 or bust! Playfields, plastics, ramps, glass, cabinets, & other pinball parts can be readily sourced out!
One could do that but it’s not cheap at all. And unless you have all the build docs done it’s a nightmare to ask someone else to make your machine. I saw someone trolled the RAZA potential buyers thread with a “picture of DR manufacturing room” which was actually Spookys production room. They may not even have the funds to build the machines and are buying time right now looking for a solution. If they are actually building machines their behavior is very odd. A single picture of their manufacturing floor with 10 machines being built would shut all of us up, even if it were entirely staged or major sub assemblies missing. And it goes on. I keep hoping for better for everyone’s sake but expecting more of the same since that’s probably the safest bet right now.
Read into what I have said today. If Deep Root is up to what I am saying they will likely be silent until everything is finally arranged. Same with any other parts or pinball manufacturers that may enter into the market. You can read into my business sale & that NDA before that group comes out of the closet. Same with others that I may have a verbal NDA about what they are up to.
Not drinking the last few days. So I will leave this one topic alone for now. Said what might be going on with Deep Root & other groups. People can go back in this thread about what I have posted & decide for themselves. Hope for the best for Deep Root, & any other future pinball manufacturers. I will just say one last thing about manufacturing in that we all have high hopes for Australia, Europe, Asia, & North America to produce more game choices! Do not think anything will be coming from Mexico, but you never know since it is close to Texas!
I was also helping out Andrew Heighway in the early days, but most of my advice was not used wisely!
Quoted from greatwichjohn:Read into what I have said today. If Deep Root is up to what I am saying they will likely be silent until everything is finally arranged. Same with any other parts or pinball manufacturers that may enter into the market. You can read into my business sale & that NDA before that group comes out of the closet. Same with others that I may have a verbal NDA about what they are up to.
Not drinking the last few days. So I will leave this one topic alone for now. Said what might be going on with Deep Root & other groups. People can go back in this thread about what I have posted & decide for themselves. Hope for the best for Deep Root, & any other future pinball manufacturers. I will just say one last thing about manufacturing in that we all have high hopes for Australia, Europe, Asia, & North America to produce more game choices! Do not think anything will be coming from Mexico, but you never know since it is close to Texas!
I was also helping out Andrew Heighway in the early days, but most of my advice was not used wisely!
Hey John, a verbal NDA is worthless. Just saying?
I think you might have cracked the code though. Mexico? Maybe right next to it in the valley.
Not too long ago, David Fix said Robert is welcome to call him up if he wants to talk contract manufacturing for RAZA. I even helpfully flagged that for Robert in this thread as a way out.
If that's what actually ended up happening, I expect a referral commission from AP and a thank you in Robert's victory speech when machines ship.
Yes a agreement to not formally spill the beans from others that did not buy out my business. Think of gambling, Deep Root I believe has moved from being a long shot of manufacturing. To finally really thinking this out. Maybe the business hints might be going somewhere or not. Right now they are at the bottom, so they can only go up, or tits up. I would also get a good PR person, & start showing plans of contract manufacturing very soon. The last quarter of this year showing production of games & lots of parts. That Spooky production picture looked good, but even their production could likely be improved for line work.
I have not really talked to Dave Fix about what is going on there. Might be another possibility or a new vendor(s)!
Idk why any established pinball maker would even want to help them. They’re all backlogged making their own stuff or prepping their own next game
Plus there’s also the mad trash Robert said to everyone, and JPop ripping off AP in the past.
Quoted from greatwichjohn:Do not think it is a parts supply issue holding up Deep Root. Likely finally figuring out they cannot manufacturer in house. Contract out all your parts & production. Games finally ship starting in 2022 or bust! Playfields, plastics, ramps, glass, cabinets, & other pinball parts can be readily sourced out!
It wouldn't be wise for anybody to contract for them. They have too much stink on them and everything they have said is flat out been late, goofy, arrogant or made up stuff - octo manufacturing , etc, etc, ect. They are done. Doubtful in practice that any good company would want to actually contract for them. Miniscule chance it would happen. Looks like they have lost the big building. If they were going to do it they were going to do it themselves. Looks more and more like it's over.
Maybe that is a hint if they are winding down the big building. For all the bullshit big talk companies & vendors will still work with Deep Root. Cash is king if you pay your staff & vendors. I am not here to sway or convince people towards Deep Root. Maybe I know or have a hint of what might be going on. I have no knowledge of American Pinball or what Dave Fix is up to since we have cordial emails after his move. But you never know cards might be not shown unless stuff is happening. Same with Homepin, this world is strange at times but another source for parts. Same with electronics, all kinds of new sources now.
Quoted from roffels:Homepin and Deeproot belong together.
No, Homepin makes games.
Sorry, I down voted you.
Quoted from JodyG:Robert himself told us that they would be producing all the parts and assemblies from the ground up in their "heavy manufacturing area"
More JPOP nonsense.
Don’t check the parking lot on fridays… Deeproot Studios in Utah was on a 9-80 schedule.(80 work hours spread across 9 days) (Every other Friday off) might be the same for Texas.
That being said…one of the early warning signs I noticed when I joined…was that most of the employees were doing more of a 9-55. There was a solid two-three hours every evening where I was one of the three people that stuck around until the end of the work day.
My “manager” left at 2pm every day.
I've gotten the impression that a good chunk of the DR staff just saw a crazy lawyer "making it rain" and slurped up as much cash as they could.
It's kind of like Chris Roberts and Star Citizen. Who cares if the game ever gets done? A bunch of space-crazed neckbeards buying 3D models of ships will keep multiple studios payroll going FOR A DECADE.
Just for fun, I compared the "About" descriptions on the facebook pages of a few pinball manufacturers to see how many words into each you can go before reaching an error. I've copy-pasted the results below.
Stern
“STERN PINBALL, INC. is the leading maker of REAL pinball games in the world!”
Error found at word: n/a (accurate statement)
JJP
Jersey Jack Pinball is the industry leader in quality and technical innovation, designing groundbreaking, premium pinball machines.
Error found at word: 9 (“quality”)
Spooky
“Wisconsin's only pinball manufacturer, and the worlds oldest active pinball podcast.”
Error found at word: 9 (“active”)
Deeproot
“Built with innovation and value from the ground up, deeproot Pinball has redefined the pinball machine for the next century with narrative driven pinball experiences and cutting edge graphics”
Error found at word: 1 (“Built”)
Quoted from greatwichjohn:Maybe that is a hint if they are winding down the big building. For all the bullshit big talk companies & vendors will still work with Deep Root. Cash is king if you pay your staff & vendors. I am not here to sway or convince people towards Deep Root. Maybe I know or have a hint of what might be going on. I have no knowledge of American Pinball or what Dave Fix is up to since we have cordial emails after his move. But you never know cards might be not shown unless stuff is happening. Same with Homepin, this world is strange at times but another source for parts. Same with electronics, all kinds of new sources now.
Nah - all the real pin companies are busy building their own pins and have back orders to fill. No legit company would whore themselves for Root. Too risky and that dirty smell would just rub off on them. No company with any sense is going to get in bed to build a hundred games or so for them. Not worth the bother and would just turn into a you know what show.
wonder what's going on with this?
https://www.loopnet.com/property/12621-Silicon-San-Antonio-TX-78249/48029-171610030190/
Quoted from Rocketrob:wonder what's going on with this?
https://www.loopnet.com/property/12621-Silicon-San-Antonio-TX-78249/48029-171610030190/
It's been discussed. The sales flyer says the current tenant is leased through 2023, so it's probably a routine change in landlords.
Quoted from Mr68:Isn't that the property that shuts down whenever the Panama Canal backs up?
“Yeah…. like, all the RAZA parts we ordered were on that big boat that got stuck in the canal…. Suez, that is. And the window for refunds has closed. Thank you. DR”
Where did Ben go, you on a another coffee run break? . Jk
The torment and torture is killing you guys that this thing hasn't closed up yet. I truly do have some "sympathy" for your extended agony and pain!
Drive by recon will occur today.
Quoted from iceman44:Drive by recon will occur today.
Brother, for your own edification, go for it. But I don’t think anyone in this thread cares.
Quoted from iceman44:Where did Ben go, you on a another coffee run break? . Jk
The torment and torture is killing you guys that this thing hasn't closed up yet. I truly do have some "sympathy" for your extended agony and pain!
Drive by recon will occur today.
Yes!
Quoted from Lounge:Brother, for your own edification, go for it. But I don’t think anyone in this thread cares.
I live for Ice's driveby updates.
I wish he'd have a few cocktails at lunch and just knock on the door instead of pussyfooting around the parking lot
Quoted from TreyBo69:I wish he'd have a few cocktails at lunch and just knock on the door instead of pussyfooting around the parking lot
For a guy named Ice he sure seems full of hot air.
Just walk up and go in. They owe you a tour.
Pretty sure the torment and torture is going on in the other thread. We've got nothing to lose. I can agree this thread has been out of line many times, myself included, but it's Deeproot that is abusing and disrespecting them.
Brief video is insider funny to this topic. Root Cause Analysis. (5 Levels)
Quoted from TreyBo69:I wish he'd have a few cocktails at lunch and just knock on the door instead of pussyfooting around the parking lot
He should go with Starbucks in hand, and JPop would let him in for sure.
I mean JPop IS at that location working his ass off, right?
New kaneda episode 601 is gold. I’m understanding why he’s number 1.
I can only imagine a few taking that bold of a stance in his position.
Chris is sharp in his profession and knows how to read this kind landscape well. Cheers !
Quoted from Mogg:New kaneda episode 601 is gold.
Thanks for the heads up. Great stuff!
https://soundcloud.com/kanedapinball/deep-thoughts-by-deeproot-part-1
Exciting it's only part 1
Quoted from TreyBo69:Just an idea...
[quoted image]
...or how to catch a lazysaurus with a wood crate and piece of rope... +100 bonus points are awarded if the Starbucks cup is covered in purple glitter
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Exciting it's only part 1
It's one thing when people say RM promised this and RM promised that - but it's a completely new level of cringe (for me) to hear it directly from the man himself. He's full of himself.
TWO WEEKS!! Where've we heard that before?
It’s been what was always missing in this thread, to actually hear it all in a neatly edited show. It definitely reinforces the quotes I’ve read which I thought were paraphrased. Nope
Quoted from Mogg:New kaneda episode 601 is gold. I’m understanding why he’s number 1.
For editing together what we all already knew, have discussed, and have said here for years?
Yes, quite the special genius to pull that edit together...
What would be more amazing is if Robert tasked his people to do the same exact thing to kaneda
Quoted from flynnibus:For editing together what we all already knew, have discussed, and have said here for years?
Yes, quite the special genius to pull that edit together...
What would be more amazing is if Robert tasked his people to do the same exact thing to kaneda
Yeah...because no one else did it or put in the work to do it. So he gets credit. It's a great 5 minute encapsulation of Robert's arrogance and hubris.
No one cares that Chris double talks. But by all means, edit together a montage of it and I'm sure people will approve. You think it's easy and you already listen to his show anyways 
Anytime he's mentioned you and a few others just can't let it go. I think it really bothers you that more people listen to his opinion than yours...
Quoted from Lounge:Brother, for your own edification, go for it. But I don’t think anyone in this thread cares.
Yeah, at this point parking lot inventory is meh, he needs to visit the actual office. C'mon Ice, you're their customer, go say Hi and see how your game is coming along! Tell 'em you need to see Ned now. Don't leave, just keep repeating "need to see Ned now" over and over til they let you in.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Thanks for the heads up. Great stuff!
https://soundcloud.com/kanedapinball/deep-thoughts-by-deeproot-part-1
Exciting it's only part 1
That's the best Kaneda episode i've heard...Cris talking = 0%
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