Alice in Wonderland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2013
Celts
Haggis, 2021
Magic Girl
Zidware Pinball USA, 2017
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2012
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Arcade Edition)
Deeproot, 2020
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Xtra Edition)
Deeproot, 2020Quoted from Jjsmooth:Dodge Daytonas and Plymouth Superbirds were considered sales failures at the time, and sat on dealer lots.
But they are very appreciated today.
I'll hang onto my CV.[quoted image]
The fact that they cut Medieval Madness production short to make Cirqus Voltaire because they thought it was the next big thing always chapped my hide. Were they blind?
I always found this interesting. Was this because arcades were on the way out at that time and home use was...well just a few of us? Or were ops genuinely not interested in it? I never even saw a CV until many years later and I loved it immediately.
Quoted from Jjsmooth:Dodge Daytonas and Plymouth Superbirds were considered sales failures at the time, and sat on dealer lots.
But they are very appreciated today.
I'll hang onto my CV.[quoted image]
Well that's kind of my point. They can't wait 20 years for RAZA to become appreciated and triple in price warranting a remake. They need games that will sell NOW.
Big difference between a Superbird and a Super Turd ...
Superbirds and Dodge Daytonas were only made as production cars so they could compete in Nascar. They really weren't meant to be mainstream sales production. Just enough to meet the rules to qualify to be used in Nascar.
Quoted from Jjsmooth:Dodge Daytonas and Plymouth Superbirds were considered sales failures at the time, and sat on dealer lots.
But they are very appreciated today.
I'll hang onto my CV.[quoted image]
I completely agree this is a beautiful machine and I would love to have it in my collection. But as Ben alluded to, commercial success it was not. If you run a company the last thing you want is a machine that sells so poorly that it becomes a collectors item in the future. Might help recover JPOPs rep eventually but does nothin’ for DR. This is rubber meets the road kinda stuff. A profit isn’t turned until you get at least to 500 units and likely 1000+. You can’t get the quantity pricing breaks and operational efficiencies needed to do so at lower sales volume. Dialed In is a wildly under-appreciated game, but doubt JJP will make that mistake again since I strongly suspect the lost $s on that one. And I just bought a 1948 Buccaneer for $125 which is a travesty given a machine so seminal and beautiful can go for that. But it is what it is. Running a business is unfortunately a lowest common denominator affair, you need the highest volumes thru thru the largest customer base you can possibly get to make it scale properly for the multi-million investment that was made. They missed their Econ 101 class obviously on price-demand-COGS. “If we build it they will come” only works in movies, not real life. And their FOMO move only works if you are really really good at social media. They were not and so they have 130 orders sorts kinda. When you have that many millions to run thru you become blind that you eventually have to make a product people want (and want a lot of) so you can make a profit. The whole Steve Jobs thing of giving your customer what they don’t even know they want is a bad Vegas bet to make for most people unless your name is Steve Jobs. And yet here we are. I do hope that RAZA turns out to be all that so at least the collectors are made whole in a decade or two as their machine appreciates back to MSRP.
Quoted from Jjsmooth:nevermind
Hey really not trying to bash you. You have a valid point. They could produce a great machine. Optimism for a good outcome here is an admirable quality and way too many of us are jaded. Hope for the best, plan for the worst.
This thread is mind blowing. Fast approaching 20,000 posts and the mythological DR has produced and shipped zero games to date. Unbelievable still discussing this obvious shell of a pinball company that still has no manufacturing, this many years later.
Quoted from Mr68:If you guys want a cargument I will suggest Ferrari vs KIA.
Crashing your car is easy, not looking at a car crash is hard
Quoted from Jjsmooth:Yeah, I hear you. And agree
But its getting tired.
Let's see what happens. We have time.
You nailed it. Deep Root is getting VERY tired. I mean, how long does this go on?
5 months ago
----
Is there a production line?
Are you going to show pictures of your production line?
We made the mistake of trusting the VIP’s to keep things confidential; and the supposed secret that leaked (that we had no production going, or that we have none now) are all false. So yes, there is a production line set up for the first month’s anticipated volume. And no, we are not going to show pictures. We don’t have anything to prove other than putting quality RAZA machines in boxes and delivering them to customers as quick as our production schedule anticipates.
Manufacturing lines don’t just spring to life. Make 1 and ship it. Let’s people know you are alive. Then make 5 and ship those, refine your build practices. Then make 20 and ship those as you have more people involved and have figured out efficiencies to allow this to happen. Then make 50 and you almost have a real production line. You eat an elephant one bite at a time. And make sure as you come to the end of the shipping units you have another game to run on that line so you don’t have to start over at zero again.
Quoted from FalconPunch:5 months ago
----
Is there a production line?
Are you going to show pictures of your production line?
We made the mistake of trusting the VIP’s to keep things confidential; and the supposed secret that leaked (that we had no production going, or that we have none now) are all false. So yes, there is a production line set up for the first month’s anticipated volume. And no, we are not going to show pictures. We don’t have anything to prove other than putting quality RAZA machines in boxes and delivering them to customers as quick as our production schedule anticipates.
We are Deeproot - you know a well known pinball manufacturer.
If you are a pinball manufacturer where is your production line ?
Production line ? We ain’t got no production line …. We don’t need no production line…. We don’t need to show you no stinkin production line
Reminds me of this:
Quoted from Mr68:If you guys want a cargument I will suggest Ferrari vs KIA.
They can't even get a KIA build done, much less a Ferrari. Maybe they had this all ass backwards.
What they designed was the Edsel of pinball when they were all done. ( Pinbar and so forth) Though they probably thought they were giving us the Tucker.
Welp, it's not looking great but I'm going to hang on to my Extra Edition spot until they deliver it or fold. It's too interesting to bow out. The upside of getting a pretty game with low numbers is appealing enough to me. Looked like it is fun to play if they can finally make one.
I'm just wondering if I'll wait longer for my TBL or my RAZA.
Quoted from NoQuarters:They can't even get a KIA build done, much less a Ferrari. Maybe they had this all ass backwards.
What they designed was the Edsel of pinball when they were all done. ( Pinbar and so forth) Though they probably thought they were giving us the Tucker.
But this is backwards as well, Edsel sold 116,000 units and Tucker built only 50 Torpedoes... I will not cargue that the Torpedo was better, because it obviously was, but Tucker was backstabbed by the auto industry. Does anyone think RAZA will rise above the noise and become the one of the most ahead of its time pinball machines of all time? Not bloody likely, even if it shits rainbows and pisses liquid gold.
Quoted from NashtyFunk:Welp, it's not looking great but I'm going to hang on to my Extra Edition spot until they deliver it or fold. It's too interesting to bow out. The upside of getting a pretty game with low numbers is appealing enough to me. Looked like it is fun to play if they can finally make one.
I'm just wondering if I'll wait longer for my TBL or my RAZA.
I can't believe im saying this, but at this point, Id say RAZA. TBL incredibly is shipping..
After 367 pages of worthless chatter about a company that isn't ever going to make a single pinball game, we have to ask will it ever end?
Will we ever stop talking about the company that never was, never will be? Lets all guess how many more pages will be dedicated to the pinball company that never produced a pinball.
Quoted from drfrightner:After 367 pages of worthless chatter about a company that isn't ever going to make a single pinball game, we have to ask will it ever end?
Will we ever stop talking about the company that never was, never will be? Lets all guess how many more pages will be dedicated to the pinball company that never produced a pinball.
Take the over
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Take the over
I'll bet your right. BTW for those interested one betting site has odds on if Deep Root will ever ship a game. You get 30 to 1 if you bet yes they will ship a game in this lifetime. Bet 1000 and win 30000... who would risk the 1000? LOL
Quoted from drfrightner:I'll bet your right. BTW for those interested one betting site has odds on if Deep Root will ever ship a game. You get 30 to 1 if you bet yes they will ship a game in this lifetime. Bet 1000 and win 30000... who would risk the 1000? LOL
How on earth do you collect on a bet where the time horizon is forever?
Deeproot Beta the Crowdfunded Third could ship a game in 2026.
So what? It might even be good.
Quoted from davjoszie:With a reasonable timeframe, at 30-1 odds, I'd bet the farm they never ship a game.
It would be tempting!
Anyone else surprised by today's Stern reveal? Figured after last week's teaser the next announcement would be of a six-month delay due to ul certification challenges
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Anyone else surprised by today's Stern reveal? Figured after last week's teaser the next announcement would be of a six-month delay due to ul certification challenges
Yeah, but Stern doesn't have PinOVATION! (tm)
Quoted from drfrightner:After 367 pages of worthless chatter about a company that isn't ever going to make a single pinball game, we have to ask will it ever end?
Fair point. The story of Zidware should have ended SIX YEARS AGO when Bill revealed MG to be a fake box of lights. But JPOP keeps grifting and "failing up"
Quoted from benheck:Fair point. The story of Zidware should have ended SIX YEARS AGO when Bill revealed MG to be a fake box of lights. But JPOP keeps grifting and "failing up"
Could he actually fail up from DR ? Is there anyone to buy out their assets and promise to make Zidware AND DR customers whole ? Is this some karmic pinball reincarnation miracle we are all witnessing. Nobody ever gets a pinball machine because it can never actually be finished.
Quoted from drfrightner:I'll bet your right. BTW for those interested one betting site has odds on if Deep Root will ever ship a game. You get 30 to 1 if you bet yes they will ship a game in this lifetime. Bet 1000 and win 30000... who would risk the 1000? LOL
Link please
Has anyone received an update on the delivery time for this game that has made a purchase? I put a deposit and don't ck the forums much.
Quoted from Mark1971:Has anyone received an update on the delivery time for this game that has made a purchase? I put a deposit and don't ck the forums much.
Lol.
Quoted from Mark1971:Has anyone received an update on the delivery time for this game that has made a purchase? I put a deposit and don't ck the forums much.
Have you tried emailing Robert? That would probably be your best bet. Sometime ago he said the next update would come mid May.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:Have you tried emailing Robert? That would probably be your best bet. Sometime ago he said the next update would come mid May.
May 2022
Quoted from jonesjb:Are these on location to play yet? I’d like to finally give one a try.
There's one in San Antonio, in a pretty empty office building. I think the address is 12621 Silicon Dr, San Antonio, TX 78249.
Quoted from pookycade:Could he actually fail up from DR ? Is there anyone to buy out their assets and promise to make Zidware AND DR customers whole ? Is this some karmic pinball reincarnation miracle we are all witnessing. Nobody ever gets a pinball machine because it can never actually be finished.
“There’s a sucker born every minute and two to take him.”
P.T. Barnum.
So, yes, there is another follower of the jpop great pumpkin that will scream from the roof tops, you’ll see. This time it’s for sure!
We(insert latest rube here) have the most sincere pinball factory anywhere!
The jpop will see we are the most sincere and deliver his wonderful creations to the people with candy, and popcorn, and balloons!
You’ll see! This time it will be different!
Oh, and when all finally collapses, Robert will blame pinside. And all the chumps over at the raza buyers and Mark’s thread will piss n whine that it’s all our fault. Especially Ben heck! If we would have only drank the cool aide and chowed down on jpop cock like all the other marks then everything would have been Jim dandy!
It’s all Ben heck’s fault because he would not tow the party line and play along that jpop is the messiah.
I'm sure many have said it already, but pinball is a manufacturing business first and foremost. It might not be the most glamorous aspect, but if you don't have the manufacturing, you don't have a pinball company.
Quoted from mrgone:It’s all Ben heck’s fault because he would not tow the party line and play along that jpop is the messiah.
If I were Robert I'd be more worried about my investors / SEC than some drunken Irish asshole.
Quoted from benheck:If I were Robert I'd be more worried about my investors / SEC than some drunken Irish asshole.
Wait...you're Irish? 
Quoted from guitarded:It is Officially Mid-May.
No no, tomorrow is officially mid-May, and + some hours if you count that there are 31 days. The question is, how many days/months past that until we hear something?
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