Alice in Wonderland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2013
Celts
Haggis, 2021
Magic Girl
Zidware Pinball USA, 2017
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2012
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Arcade Edition)
Deeproot, 2020
Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland (Xtra Edition)
Deeproot, 2020Quoted from toyotaboy:didnt his early workers also voluntarily work extra hours for no extra pay because they believed in the company?
I do believe everyone working there believes in the company and love what they are doing.
No idea on the early workers. I think Spooky started with all family members and Ben Heck. And they all worked hard to make Spooky a reality.
Charlie's family lived on macaroni and cheese for a year. Everybody sacrificed not just labor.
LTG : )
Quoted from LTG:Charlie's family lived on macaroni and cheese for a year. Everybody sacrificed not just labor.
LTG : )
Macaroni and cheese for a year?
And this is a sacrifice how, exactly?
Quoted from RobT:Macaroni and cheese for a year?
And this is a sacrifice how, exactly?
They gave themselves the diabeetus....FOR PINBALL!
Quoted from LTG:Charlie's family lived on macaroni and cheese for a year. Everybody sacrificed not just labor.
LTG : )
It wasn't THAT bad... One time I made them chicken wings.
Quoted from benheck:It wasn't THAT bad... One time I made them chicken wings.
What the hell was that thing you made the chicken wings in? Like a vac-u-lux or something? I just remember there being a metric shit ton of chicken. So good.
Quoted from NoQuarters:Deeproot sold 130 - that is probably inflated. No Question though as to how many games out the door - 0
How many of those "sales" were zidware claimants?
Quoted from pinghetto:What the hell was that thing you made the chicken wings in? Like a vac-u-lux or something? I just remember there being a metric shit ton of chicken. So good.
It was a Nuwave infrared oven. They're become quite popular!
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
From Brink of destruction to going gang busters, it changes by the minute... come back when post count reaches 36k...
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
Robert is currently having an affair with his Dr., a stately red thread. Er, red head.
So production - and all external expectations- is delayed.
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
Read the whole thread. In a few weeks, present us with your findings.
Quoted from Zablon:tl;dr
Nothing.
Quoted from Bublehead:From Brink of destruction to going gang busters, it changes by the minute... come back when post count reaches 36k...
My prediction:
By the time this thread reaches 36000 posts DR will have shipped a game. And declared some form of insolvency.
Quoted from BC_Gambit:My prediction:
By the time this thread reaches 36000 posts DR will have shipped a game. And declared some form of insolvency.
Ahhh, I give you way more credit then that! I am Certain the DR hate tribe will come up with WAY more posts then that!!!
Quoted from BC_Gambit:DR will have shipped a game.
But how far? From the prototype area to the nonexistent shipping dock?
Quoted from rai:What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
They don't seem to have any current affairs.
Quoted from Yelobird:Ahhh, I give you way more credit then that! I am Certain the DR hate tribe will come up with WAY more posts then that!!!
lol 
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
Read the last 100 posts on this thread.
Then go read the last 100 on the preorder thread.
Then scratch your head.
Bottom line though, there’s still only more delays and no game in anyone’s home. That’s where we stand.
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
woodworker - That one is good. Yeah, Deep Root is hiring people - huge eyeroll. Ha Ha. I wonder what the mid May spiel will be for the Raza Refugees.
Quoted from rai:I haven’t read this whole thread. What’s the current state of affairs with DR?
Check here for all your Deep Root needs...
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/tech-tom-issues-1/page/33#post-6177646
Quoted from LTG:I do believe everyone working there believes in the company and love what they are doing.
No idea on the early workers. I think Spooky started with all family members and Ben Heck. And they all worked hard to make Spooky a reality.
Charlie's family lived on macaroni and cheese for a year. Everybody sacrificed not just labor.
LTG : )
That’s the issue. Robert is not that type of person. If anyone is to blame it’s him.
Read Extreme Leadership and come back to this thread and evaluate Deep Root. The company does not have the leader they need. It will never go well. Add in Jpoop and the rate for success is very low.
All is ego and arrogance.
Seeing a lot of Spooky comparisons. There's a lot of reasons why Spooky succeeded and DR is still floundering, and its not just CM's passion for pinball. I don't doubt RM is passionate about pinball, too. The difference:
Charlie came from a print background. He had strong knowledge about deadlines, project management, producing real things in the real world, and printing (lots of things in pinball get printed, playfields, cabinet art, etc etc).
Charlie didn't waste any time trying to reinvent anything. His first game was a fan layout without any fancy mechs. Lots of things 3D printed. No ridiculous cantilever playfield patents or pin-bars.
Charlie didn't hire any big time talent. There really isn't a need to, because the hard part of making pinball is manufacturing the games. Charlie didn't hire a team of animators in a studio in SLC.
Charlie set reasonable, achievable goals and limited his promises to what he knew he could accomplish. 100 units on purpose for the first game.
It's amazing to think about 6 years ago but the hard part was actually selling the orders for the games... I remember Spooky podcast talking about schlepping the game to shows and generating interest and sales at a time that the market was less hot and people were picky about where they got their games.
IMHO there's two types of business people out there: people who build something cool then try to sell it, and people who sell you on the potential for something cool, then have to build it. I obviously value the former over the latter. Coming from the software world, the biggest challenge I see in a lot of businesses is, Go To Market strategy, which is, how do I get customers to pay for, (or pay the right amount for) this cool, productivity-enhancing software I built? People who start with the GTM strategy and build later tend to fail. Spooky started out as Ben and Charlie building a pinball probably for themselves, to see if they could do it, and only later became a business IIRC.
Quoted from Richthofen:Seeing a lot of Spooky comparisons. There's a lot of reasons why Spooky succeeded and DR is still floundering, and its not just CM's passion for pinball. I don't doubt RM is passionate about pinball, too. The difference:
Charlie came from a print background. He had strong knowledge about deadlines, project management, producing real things in the real world, and printing (lots of things in pinball get printed, playfields, cabinet art, etc etc).
Charlie didn't waste any time trying to reinvent anything. His first game was a fan layout without any fancy mechs. Lots of things 3D printed. No ridiculous cantilever playfield patents or pin-bars.
Charlie didn't hire any big time talent. There really isn't a need to, because the hard part of making pinball is manufacturing the games. Charlie didn't hire a team of animators in a studio in SLC.
Charlie set reasonable, achievable goals and limited his promises to what he knew he could accomplish. 100 units on purpose for the first game.
It's amazing to think about 6 years ago but the hard part was actually selling the orders for the games... I remember Spooky podcast talking about schlepping the game to shows and generating interest and sales at a time that the market was less hot and people were picky about where they got their games.
IMHO there's two types of business people out there: people who build something cool then try to sell it, and people who sell you on the potential for something cool, then have to build it. I obviously value the former over the latter. Coming from the software world, the biggest challenge I see in a lot of businesses is, Go To Market strategy, which is, how do I get customers to pay for, (or pay the right amount for) this cool, productivity-enhancing software I built? People who start with the GTM strategy and build later tend to fail. Spooky started out as Ben and Charlie building a pinball probably for themselves, to see if they could do it, and only later became a business IIRC.
Charlie was also (still is) a likeable person doing a great pinball podcast, who then decided to make a measly 150 pinball machines because he's not greedy, he just loves the hobby and wanted to see it expand. At the time there was no American pinball, no Homepin, No Dutch pinball, No Heighway pinball, Chicago gaming wasn't even building pinballs yet (they had just announced they would be remaking medievel madness at expo the 5 months prior).
Robert from the beginning has been a smug ego driven guy claiming he's going to make more pinballs (and better ones) than anyone else, so he's already dug himself into a hole with more to prove.. and the delays only dug him deeper (not just financially, but people lose trust that new company is going to deliver, and stick around for support later)
Quoted from Yelobird:Ahhh, I give you way more credit then that! I am Certain the DR hate tribe will come up with WAY more posts then that!!!
If there is a hate club, then there must be a Love club.
What does this club love about dr?
Note the lack of negativity that Haggis is getting in comparison. Many are now comparing Haggis to being Spooky down under. In fact, I don't know of any other manufacturer that garners nearly as much distrust as Deeproot does.
You reap what you sow and I'm surprised that those job listings didn't include a Public Relations person. They desperately need one.
Quoted from Mr68:Note the lack of negativity that Haggis is getting in comparison. Many are now comparing Haggis to being Spooky down under. In fact, I don't know of any other manufacturer that garners nearly as much distrust as Deeproot does.
You reap what you sow and I'm surprised that those job listings didn't include a Public Relations person. They desperately need one.
Haggis seems to understand manufacturing - where Robert is just a dreamer
It all comes down to "you work a lot harder for money that isn't already in your wallet"
John was mostly pre paid for Zidware games. Where's the motivation? Also he's lazy as hell. Seriously the guy belongs in a hippie art commune not a business.
Deeproot is funded by a bunch of dumb rich people, you've got AARP designers being paid 6 figures, what's the rush? Do you think Ousler really gives a shit if his games get made when he's able to stuff a few extra hundo K in his retirement account?
At Spooky we didn't make ZILCH until games went out the door. This tends to light a fire under one's ass.
Quoted from blueberryjohnson:I'd suggest scrubbing this comment or at least not including something similar in your cover letter if decide to apply for any of these fantastic opportunities: https://deeproot.bamboohr.com/jobs/
[quoted image]
They missed janitor. And CEO of operations.
Both deal directly with the shit.
Quoted from benheck:Deeproot is funded by a bunch of dumb rich people
I would not call them dumb, just ignorant
The world of finance is so far removed from Manufacturing ... they just didn't have a clue
Quoted from NoQuarters:woodworker - That one is good. Yeah, Deep Root is hiring people - huge eyeroll. Ha Ha. I wonder what the mid May spiel will be for the Raza Refugees.
Streeetching the facts again. Mid May was Never said though it does help fuel your fires.
Quoted from Yelobird:Streeetching the facts again. Mid May was Never said though it does help fuel your fires.
Is it better if they say nothing at all? I guess I'm not following your "gotcha" here.
Quoted from Yelobird:Streeetching the facts again. Mid May was Never said though it does help fuel your fires.
>With current lead times on the certifications and parts, there will not be any significant updates in the next 6 weeks. Our goal is to update in mid May and at that time (if games are not imminently ready to start shipping) to offer some financial relief for the delays in the form of a return of store credit, discount of the RAZA purchase, or allow customers to rescind RAZA purchases for a refund with nominal interest.
Straight from the Notorious R.O.B.
Quoted from TreyBo69:>With current lead times on the certifications and parts, there will not be any significant updates in the next 6 weeks. Our goal is to update in mid May and at that time (if games are not imminently ready to start shipping) to offer some financial relief for the delays in the form of a return of store credit, discount of the RAZA purchase, or allow customers to rescind RAZA purchases for a refund with nominal interest.
Straight from the Notorious R.O.B.
Yet the paragraph ended "We will only be able to provide an idea of availability closer to end of May".
Quoted from Yelobird:Yet the paragraph ended "We will only be able to provide an idea of availability closer to end of May".
Yes but he was talking about something else
>To those on this mail list that are not RAZA customers but are waiting for surplus machines, we are so sorry that there will no longer be surplus machines. However, if some RAZA customers decide to rescind their contracts, we will offer those first-come, first serve machines to the list for the original prices. Please do not contact us about this yet. We will only be able to provide an idea of availability closer to end of May once purchasers decide if they want to rescind their purchase.
The mid-May update will be the general news update and let some people out of the preorder, and if anyone wants to take their spot there will be an update at the end of May to announce how many spots opened from the mid-May announcement.
Quoted from Yelobird:Yet the paragraph ended "We will only be able to provide an idea of availability closer to end of May".
Oh come on. I understand your frustration and I do my best not to downvote. But now we have your word salad interpretation of Deeproots word salad comment.
That's enough roughage for me.
I'm not certain but I think the pinball industry is close knit enough that if there was something to worry about, it would have already been leaked, NDA's not withstanding. That being said, it does surprise me that a disgruntled former employee (specifically from DR pinball division) has not quit in disgust and dropped trou or a dime on whats really going on. I mean, they MIGHT be close enough to actually producing machines once parts arrive, but if you were an employee, how long would you wait before looking for a new job? Seems some designers have already jumped ship, but I know if I was working in the industry, and wanted to stay employed by a pinball manufacturer, I certainly would know to keep my mouth shut. Once outed as an bean spiller, nobody in pinball would ever hire you again.
Quoted from Mr68:Oh come on. I understand your frustration and I do my best not to downvote. But now we have your word salad interpretation of Deeproots word salad comment.
That's enough roughage for me.
Word salad Or what was actually written. Your call....
Quoted from Yelobird:Word salad Or what was actually written. Your call....
Ill ask again, you call many in here part of the hate tribe.
What is it about dr that you love?
Quoted from Yelobird:Streeetching the facts again. Mid May was Never said though it does help fuel your fires.
Excuse me if I was wrong but I thought Deeproot said they would not have an update for buyers until Mid may. If I read that wrong somewhere my apologies.
Best of Luck to you too.
Also thanks to the Pinsider who messaged me a short time ago verifying my reading comprehension is intact. Thanks. 
My wishes of luck to the bird are genuinely heartfelt. From my perspective I am just not optimistic anything associated with the Root situation will turn out positive. Hope he and others do indeed get some update news SOMETIME in May.
Quoted from Yelobird:Word salad Or what was actually written. Your call....
whatever you want to call it — it was pretty clearly stated and nothing was streeeetched at all except patience with you calling people out when they in fact made an accurate statement.
In one week we will get an update from Robert. I am 99.9% sure what he will say ...
Forecasted May 15 Update - DR is still delayed on UL and has been slowly receiving ordered parts. 90% of parts to build the pins are received. No new forecast of completion but a promise to provide an update in six weeks. Now June’s update will be interesting. I believe it will signal what happens next.
Forecasted June 30 Update - announce 1) production will start August 15 (six weeks) or 2) state it is unknown when production will start. Option 2) signals Robert will be gone from this project and all employees sent packing. Option 1) is to promise a start by August 15 and if that date is missed, Robert will be gone. Maybe they will pull this out, but outlook is shaky.
In the meantime ... Spooky will be shipping their next title and Stern will have shipped Mandalorian LE’s.
Quoted from Yelobird:Word salad Or what was actually written. Your call....
Refer post #17660
Quoted from TreyBo69:>With current lead times on the certifications and parts, there will not be any significant updates in the next 6 weeks. Our goal is to update in mid May and at that time (if games are not imminently ready to start shipping) to offer some financial relief for the delays in the form of a return of store credit, discount of the RAZA purchase, or allow customers to rescind RAZA purchases for a refund with nominal interest.
Straight from the Notorious R.O.B.
Yes, but that is most likely an internal goal, not an external one...
Not to feed the flames and give vindication to some of the hyperbole spewed so far by some - as a Xtra pre-order paid in full (I'm dumb), I'm %100 going to take the refund option next week unless shipping is immanent. I'll buy a TMNT and something else and enjoy the game of pinball I grew up with without the risk.
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