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(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


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#17701 3 years ago
 
MBW

mbwalker

Pinside+ Frequent

7y 135K 5,325 9

Quoted from pookycade:

RM: Quad Assembly will provide rapid and dynamic on-demand manufacturing abilities that current pinball manufacturers will have a hard time to match. We’ll be able to throttle and provide process fluctuations with flexible distribution. Following this concept allows for cross-functional staffing resulting in higher productivity and decreased manufacturing costs.
If I threw words into a blender I couldn’t come up with a more non-sensical and meaningless series of sentences than that.

The only buzz word missing is 'synergy'. That's been really popular for maybe 20-25 years.

But I do think they nailed the 'decreased manufacturing costs' because we haven't seen any production pins yet.

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#17702 3 years ago
 
DLA

ufotofu

Pinside member

6y 30,650 95

Quoted from TheCapn:

The (at that time) floor space for production was approximately 2-3,000 sq ft. with literally nothing but empty harbor freight workbenches (less than 10 of them). (something like this https://www.harborfreight.com/48-in-workbench-with-light-60723.html )

This really goes a long way towards explaining their emphasis on "trade secrets". They don't share anything because there's nothing to share. If nothing else, I hope the information you have will help convince some of the preorder folks to take their money back when/if Deeproot offers.

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#17703 3 years ago
 
MEO

beergut666

Pinside member

US Minneapolis, MN

6y 122K 1,482 3 53

Quoted from pookycade:

RM: Quad Assembly will provide rapid and dynamic on-demand manufacturing abilities that current pinball manufacturers will have a hard time to match. We’ll be able to throttle and provide process fluctuations with flexible distribution. Following this concept allows for cross-functional staffing resulting in higher productivity and decreased manufacturing costs.
If I threw words into a blender I couldn’t come up with a more non-sensical and meaningless series of sentences than that.

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#17704 3 years ago
 
JJZ

toyotaboy

RandOM Pinball

US Allyn, WA

12y 184K 11,937 3 14

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#17705 3 years ago
 
BEN

benheck

Pinside member

US Madison, WI

11y 115K 5,507

Maybe it's called octo-manufacturing because after refunds they'll only have 8 games left to build?

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#17706 3 years ago
 
JH

NoQuarters

Pinside+ Frequent

8y 128K 3,011 13 1

I think it involves using an octopus to build games but they are having trouble sourcing one.

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#17707 3 years ago
 
BEN

benheck

Pinside member

US Madison, WI

11y 115K 5,507

Quoted from NoQuarters:

I think it involves using an octopus to build games but they are having trouble sourcing one.

They hired one but it got so bored listening to John tell stories of the "bally Williams Golden age" it rage quit.

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#17708 3 years ago
 
JAS

Sinistarrett

Pinside member

US Freeport, FL

8y 81,850 1,623 3 12

I wish I could rage quit this thread but I keep coming back for more.

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#17709 3 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside+ Frequent

US Honolulu, HI

8y 101K 4,726 1

Quoted from Sinistarrett:

I wish I could rage quit this thread but I keep coming back for more.

Why? It's produced more entertainment than some small pinball manufacturers (and also whatever you'd call deeproot).

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#17710 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from TheCapn:

Hey guys. Just to be clear on my actions recently with deeproot. Lots of speculation so let me be clear:
I was fine with this company doing it's thing because it wasn't really hurting anyone, but when he took money (when specifically stating in the past he wouldn't) and seems to be failing to deliver - I felt that things needed to be brought more into the light. I understand that some of you have your hopes and that is also fine. It's just extra difficult for me to have faith in deeproot because I was at ground zero - the only other person that sounds to be right there with me is Ben Heck. I had high hopes for this company - I was expecting to be impressed and gitty with info and videos to show everyone. Sadly, this wasn't the case at all. I believe I may be going on Kaneda's show in the future to divulge more, but in the meantime I'm willing to help anyway I can - including with the floor plan some of you have interests in. For instance, the lab manufacturing area was where the video about the Pinpod took place. The recording took place about 20'' to the left of the image posted with the roll up door in the background. This wasn't where they planned to have their ''quad-manufacturing'' located. That was deeper into the facility. The (at that time) floor space for production was approximately 2-3,000 sq ft. with literally nothing but empty harbor freight workbenches (less than 10 of them). (something like this https://www.harborfreight.com/48-in-workbench-with-light-60723.html )
I'm willing to help any way I can, guys. I'll check back here every once in a while. I have been dodging this thread ever since my experience there. lol.

What’s the purpose for waiting to divulge more information on Kenada’s podcast?
If you want to help share now....I don’t get the waiting - is this for ratings? If you are here to help please do so now.

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#17711 3 years ago
 
TMB

Roostking

Pinside+ Addict

10y 106K 8,566 2

Quoted from cpr9999:What’s the purpose for waiting to divulge more information on Kenada’s podcast?
If you want to help share now....I don’t get the waiting - is this for ratings? If you are here to help please do so now.

If this whole thread isn't one big warning flag, more information isn't going to move the needle. Might as well squeeze for ratings.

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#17712 3 years ago
 
CPN

TheCapn

Hardy

US Sherman, TX

9y 71,600 738 10

Quoted from cpr9999:

What’s the purpose for waiting to divulge more information on Kenada’s podcast?
If you want to help share now....I don’t get the waiting - is this for ratings? If you are here to help please do so now.

Because everyone absorbs information differently. Some do great with the written word - others with audio and/or video. Like I stated earlier I can help here too - just ask the right questions. That is mainly why I may go on his podcast, because the questions I would get asked are some that I wouldn't think of asking myself. I don't surf this site like a lot of people do here. I just so happened to hop on here within 10 mins of you posting this comment. lol. I can help here, but there will be some lag before a response more than likely.

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#17713 3 years ago
 
III

TreyBo69

Pinside member

5y 136K 8,451

Yeah, not everyone reads pinside let alone this thread. Go on the show with a couple thousand listeners

Some people still don’t realize just how many red flags there are.

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#17714 3 years ago
 
KEF

pinball_keefer

Jersey Jack Pinball

US South Elgin, IL

12y 80,800 1,253 12

Quoted from benheck:

Maybe it's called octo-manufacturing because after refunds they'll only have 8 games left to build?

Maybe it was ecto-manufacturing, done by ghosts.

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#17715 3 years ago
 
NTR

TheFamilyArcade

Pinside+ Frequent

US New City, NY

11y 104K 9,961 5 37

Quoted from pinball_keefer:

Maybe it was ecto-manufacturing, done by ghosts.

Who are we kidding folks? It’s rectum-manufacturing, because it’s coming straight out of Robert’s ass.

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#17716 3 years ago
 
HAN

QuickSilverShelby

Pinside member

CA Canmore, AB

11y 70,300 1,610 7

Quoted from Zablon:

To quote a comedian, it doesn't matter what word you use, once it is the 'mainstream' it will be co-opted into insults. Best to just let it go. In a few years 'mentally challenged' will be the insult that you can no longer say.

You got that right. I remember all sorts of slang that was common place and kinda accepted but now......whoa, whoa, whoa.

A few weeks back, while I was online on a poker site. I called a guy a c#ck sucker and he came back at me that I was homophobic and insensitive to the G's, the T's and the Q's. Not at all what I was going for when I called him "c#cksucker". I was just trying to thow him off his game and "enlighten him" that he was being a total d!ck wad (remember the good ole 90's slang "dick wad"). I'm not sure if calling someone a c#cksucker or a d!ck wad is insensitive or if it's just.............. run of the mill 90's slang.

Just my opinion so don't thumbs down me ya bunch a pussies.

QSS

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#17717 3 years ago
 
???

woodworker

Inactive member

Unknown

11y 43,550 245

Octo-manufacturing.gifOcto-manufacturing.gif

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#17718 3 years ago
 
MDB

Mbecker

Pinside+ Frequent

US Seattle, WA

10y 104K 4,313 5 14

Quoted from TreyBo69:

Yeah, not everyone reads pinside let alone this thread. Go on the show with a couple thousand listeners
Some people still don’t realize just how many red flags there are.

I think everyone that ordered one was or is mostly aware. It blind faith keeping their hopes alive. I’m always interested to hear more insider info but let’s be honest - it’s not swaying anyone (or very few) that were ‘lucky enough’ to get in on a deposit. A few will get out given an option next month. A lot will stick it out

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#17719 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from Mbecker:

I think everyone that ordered one was or is mostly aware. It blind faith keeping their hopes alive. I’m always interested to hear more insider info but let’s be honest - it’s not swaying anyone (or very few) that were ‘lucky enough’ to get in on a deposit. A few will get out given an option next month. A lot will stick it out

Sneak peak photo someone sent me.

3B898433-7728-497C-BE75-72058CC5AA77 (resized).jpeg3B898433-7728-497C-BE75-72058CC5AA77 (resized).jpeg
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#17720 3 years ago
 
MDB

Mbecker

Pinside+ Frequent

US Seattle, WA

10y 104K 4,313 5 14

Quoted from cpr9999:

Sneak peak photo someone sent me.[quoted image]

I’m confused, where’s the octopuses and unicorns??! This can’t be DR, clearly a fake!! Lol

Well interesting to see some cabinets and possibly *something happening

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#17721 3 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 150K 8,647

Quoted from cpr9999:

Sneak peak photo someone sent me.[quoted image]

That's an altered picture from Jersey Jack Pinball. Go back to the pre-order thread and play your silly games there.

ErJ22vDXYAEyP9w (resized).jpegErJ22vDXYAEyP9w (resized).jpeg
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#17722 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from Mbecker:

I’m confused, where’s the octopuses and unicorns??! This can’t be DR, clearly a fake!! Lol
Well interesting to see some cabinets and possibly *something happening

LOL - wrong thread - those sneak peak pictures were for GNR lines!

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#17723 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from Mr68:

That's an altered picture from Jersey Jack Pinball. Go back to the pre-order thread and play your silly games there.
[quoted image]

Common we are having fun entertaining.

Keeps the thread interesting.

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#17724 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

I found the business model being deployed......

D4D1723D-28F7-4D6C-8DAA-A0CAFF476D4E (resized).jpegD4D1723D-28F7-4D6C-8DAA-A0CAFF476D4E (resized).jpeg
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#17725 3 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 150K 8,647

Quoted from cpr9999:

LOL - wrong thread - those sneak peak pictures were for GNR lines!

What was the the purpose of the picture being altered? Why would someone sneak you JJP pictures that were posted back in January? ...Lame attempt at cover up.

Quoted from cpr9999:

Common we are having fun entertaining.
Keeps the thread interesting.

You mean like your bullshit comments to me in yesterday's pre-order thread, last one of which I gave a pass to?
Yeah, you're an entertaining guy.

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#17726 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from Mr68:

What was the the purpose of the picture being altered? Why would someone sneak you JJP pictures that were posted back in January? ...Lame attempt at cover up.

You mean like your bullshit comments to me in yesterday's pre-order thread, one of which I gave a pass to?
Yeah, you're an entertaining guy.

This is the gossip, entertaining thread - not the preorder thread. KNOW where you are posting Francis.

OR

Am I going to have to get out my Pin-Poke!

949C3609-905E-46E9-91B0-1BF723EA108B (resized).jpeg949C3609-905E-46E9-91B0-1BF723EA108B (resized).jpeg
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#17727 3 years ago
 
NAD

Bublehead

Pinside member

US San Tan Valley, AZ

8y 92,300 4,468 10

Quoted from QuickSilverShelby:

c#ck sucker

Actually you can hit them up with its original derogatory definition:
A town drunk who walked the alleys behind the taverns sucking on the stop cocks of empty ale barrels.

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#17728 3 years ago
 
???

frobozz

Pinside member

US Chicago, IL

8y 46,650 506 9

Quoted from TheCapn:

Like I stated earlier I can help here too - just ask the right questions.

OK, in this too-small area deeper into the facility where they planned to octo-manufacture games but it was still just empty... what were their plans for getting those games onto trucks? Wheel them out the glass doors into the parking lot and hope the truck has a liftgate?

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#17729 3 years ago
 
NTR

TheFamilyArcade

Pinside+ Frequent

US New City, NY

11y 104K 9,961 5 37

RM’s goal the whole time seems to be sell out (all our innovative IP!) to Stern, JJP or American. No one wants his dreck.

If RAZAs get made that will be that. There will be no more. There will be no support or warranty parts when things go bad. All there will be is a stain. A little green globule on the pages of Pinside.

The game will be mediocre - deemed a failure - and not command any serious premiums for “rarity”

There’s no sex and drugs for DeepRoot.

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#17730 3 years ago
 
CPN

TheCapn

Hardy

US Sherman, TX

9y 71,600 738 10

Quoted from frobozz:

OK, in this too-small area deeper into the facility where they planned to octo-manufacture games but it was still just empty... what were their plans for getting those games onto trucks? Wheel them out the glass doors into the parking lot and hope the truck has a liftgate?

They didn't discuss that detail. But going soley by the layout they would have to bring the finished games into the lab room where the truck roll up door is at. Which means they would have to roll them passed the break area onto a lift elevator that was obviously installed for the purpose of getting items up a floor without using the stairs and it was installed within the last month or they chose not to polish out the construction of that area. Then they would have to roll them through that fab area. Quite a long trek honestly. Although there was a closer glass door exit - but wasn't designed for loading trucks.

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#17731 3 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,612 6 21 1

Quoted from TheCapn:

They didn't discuss that detail. But going soley by the layout they would have to bring the finished games into the lab room where the truck roll up door is at. Which means they would have to roll them passed the break area onto a lift elevator that was obviously installed for the purpose of getting items up a floor without using the stairs and it was installed within the last month or they chose not to polish out the construction of that area. Then they would have to roll them through that fab area. Quite a long trek honestly. Although there was a closer glass door exit - but wasn't designed for loading trucks.

Why would you lease a building with the stated purpose of delivering more games per year than all other pinball manufacturers combined, and only have one dock door. A dock door that is nowhere near your production area? Were they planning to modify the building? Or where they never planning to make games there? Were they ever even planning on making games? But hey, there is a workout center!

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#17732 3 years ago
 
HAN

QuickSilverShelby

Pinside member

CA Canmore, AB

11y 70,300 1,610 7

Quoted from Bublehead:

Actually you can hit them up with its original derogatory definition:
A town drunk who walked the alleys behind the taverns sucking on the stop cocks of empty ale barrels.

I did not know that. Amazing how the world has changed.

QSS

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#17733 3 years ago
 
BEN

benheck

Pinside member

US Madison, WI

11y 115K 5,507

<block quote cite="#6226599">Quite a long trek honestly. Although there was a closer glass door exit - but wasn't designed for loading trucks.

Not really a smoking gun considering forklifts exist

Did you see multiples of anything? More than one RAZA, a pile of boxes of the same component (like single board computers)...

Any tools? Solder stations, drills, angle cutter, drill presses... Again in multiples not for prototyping.

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#17734 3 years ago
 
ROB

RobT

Pinside member

13y 129K 21,266 3 40

Quoted from TheCapn:

The (at that time) floor space for production was approximately 2-3,000 sq ft. with literally nothing but empty harbor freight workbenches (less than 10 of them). (something like this https://www.harborfreight.com/48-in-workbench-with-light-60723.html )

Whoa.

If they had slightly less than 10 (I am guessing it was 8 ) of those Harbor Freight workbenches lined up, I might have to reconsider my skepticism of this company. Seems like this is a sign of some serious octo based manufacturing!

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#17735 3 years ago
 
BEN

benheck

Pinside member

US Madison, WI

11y 115K 5,507

Ten benches? That's octo... Plus TWO!

Some serious Six Sigma shit right there I tell ya!

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#17736 3 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside+ Frequent

US Honolulu, HI

8y 101K 4,726 1

Quoted from JodyG:

Why would you lease a building with the stated purpose of delivering more games per year than all other pinball manufacturers combined, and only have one dock door. A dock door that is nowhere near your production area? Were they planning to modify the building? Or where they never planning to make games there? Were they ever even planning on making games? But hey, there is a workout center!

Maybe:

Quoted from blueberryjohnson:

And perhaps we've arrived at the true motivation for an alternative, revolutionary, works-in-a-typical-office-floorplan manufacturing paradigm: I signed a 60-month lease on a big playground building for my various companies and I want everything to happen there whether it makes sense for it to our not.

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#17737 3 years ago
 
RCD

Drewscruis

Pinside member

US Hamburg Usa, NY

11y 49,300 632 32

I took a few classes on plant layout and material handling in college. If this is their proposed manufacturing facility it has absolutely no flow at all. Where are incoming deliveries going to br dropped at? The shipping dock? The entire design of the place is a mess, that is an office with a pack an play room for r and d....

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#17738 3 years ago
 
AJP

parsonsaj

Pinside+ Frequent

6y 75,550 950

Quoted from benheck:

Ten benches? That's octo... Plus TWO!
Some serious Six Sigma shit right there I tell ya!

Must be some kind of RAID-like configuration where you can tolerate the failure of 2 benches and be able to keep on trucking with the innovative manufacturing process...

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#17739 3 years ago
 
WLC

BMore-Pinball

Pinside member

12y 122K 4,984 33

Quoted from Drewscruis:

I took a few classes on plant layout and material handling in college. If this is their proposed manufacturing facility it has absolutely no flow at all. Where are incoming deliveries going to br dropped at? The shipping dock? The entire design of the place is a mess, that is an office with a pack an play room for r and d....

college doesn't always translate to real world..........................

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#17740 3 years ago
 
PAY

pookycade

Pinside member

11y 95,300 1,842

Quoted from frobozz:

OK, in this too-small area deeper into the facility where they planned to octo-manufacture games but it was still just empty... what were their plans for getting those games onto trucks? Wheel them out the glass doors into the parking lot and hope the truck has a liftgate?

I think they used the wrong word there. What they mean to say was “pop-up” manufacturing. Now that’s guaranteed to be some revolutionary process. The fact there are currently no parts and no assembly line is all part of the plan.

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#17741 3 years ago
 
KIM

Mr68

Pinside+ Frequent

US Boulder, CO

12y 150K 8,647

The no loading dock issue was solved by Dynamic cross-staffing. They gave the solder guy a hand truck.

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#17742 3 years ago
 
C F

frolic

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 149K 9,809

This thread is the thread that just keeps giving. If only Deeproot could produce a product that was as entertaining, they WOULD take over the industry.

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#17743 3 years ago
 
CPN

TheCapn

Hardy

US Sherman, TX

9y 71,600 738 10

Quoted from benheck:

<block quote cite="#6226599">Quite a long trek honestly. Although there was a closer glass door exit - but wasn't designed for loading trucks.
Not really a smoking gun considering forklifts exist
Did you see multiples of anything? More than one RAZA, a pile of boxes of the same component (like single board computers)...
Any tools? Solder stations, drills, angle cutter, drill presses... Again in multiples not for prototyping.

When I say glass door exit - I really mean NOT meant for moving big objects (including boxed games and forklifts) through or even around the area. The only place I saw to move fully boxed games with ease would be through the machine shop area.

There was only 2 RAZA's that were visible to us. One from the Houston show and the one everyone has seen via the first leaked image (a polished homebrew of RAZA). The Houston one looked to be parted out (more than likely to get the new version to be presentable). There was a row of covered machines in the same area - they were prototype games and we were not shown what was underneath them (quite a few - maybe 7-10). The cabinets were different sizes, and backbox size was different too. Maybe experimental cabinets they were building or mocks that were further revised over time? There were no boxes of parts. The only 'multiples' of anything I saw were in the machine shop area where it looked like they were making some of the metal parts for the RAZA playfield like the dirt bike ramp flap. They also had their vacuum machine for making their ramps.

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#17744 3 years ago
 
TMB

Roostking

Pinside+ Addict

10y 106K 8,566 2

Guys and gals, quit asking or stating "Why this" or "How did the plan to do that".

THEY DIDNT AND DONT HAVE A PLAN. End of story.

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#17745 3 years ago
 
JIM

cpr9999

CPR9999MODS.COM

17y 118K 4,768 29

Quoted from Roostking:

Guys and gals, quit asking or stating "Why this" or "How did the plan to do that".
THEY DIDNT AND DONT HAVE A PLAN. End of story.

Can’t do that this is the entertainment thread.

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#17746 3 years ago
 
BBJ

blueberryjohnson

Pinside+ Frequent

US Honolulu, HI

8y 101K 4,726 1

Legit question regarding commercial leasing: Is standard practice to sign a multi-year lease with no renewal option (as the posted doc indicates deeproot has done)?

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#17747 3 years ago
 
RCD

Drewscruis

Pinside member

US Hamburg Usa, NY

11y 49,300 632 32

Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

college doesn't always translate to real world..........................

No, it doesn't. But I've worked in a few factories before I went back to college. I have real world experience along with college experiences. So it helps me have a better idea of what really works, and what just works on paper. In deeproots case neither do...

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#17748 3 years ago
 
???

pinlink

Pinside member

Unknown

8y 72,150 2,205

Quoted from TheCapn:

There was a row of covered machines in the same area - they were prototype games and we were not shown what was underneath them (quite a few - maybe 7-10). The cabinets were different sizes, and backbox size was different too. Maybe experimental cabinets they were building or mocks that were further revised over time?

Those games that you saw that were covered up and made to look like super secret prototypes, were probably just RM's games from this picture.
Screen Shot 2021-04-14 at 2.22.57 PM (resized).pngScreen Shot 2021-04-14 at 2.22.57 PM (resized).png

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#17749 3 years ago
 
???

frobozz

Pinside member

US Chicago, IL

8y 46,650 506 9

Quoted from Drewscruis:

I took a few classes on plant layout and material handling in college. If this is their proposed manufacturing facility it has absolutely no flow at all. Where are incoming deliveries going to br dropped at? The shipping dock? The entire design of the place is a mess, that is an office with a pack an play room for r and d....

Exactly. We've all seen pinball plants on Expo tours - this looks nothing like that at all. Yeah, sure, buzzword buzzword new manufacturing techniques buzzword underpants gnomes, but there are inescapable logistics with getting vast quantities of parts in and vastly large and heavy machines out, and they don't seem to have given them even the slightest thought.

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#17750 3 years ago
 
POO

seenev

Pinside member

8y 62,050 2,181 17

I doubt deeproot planned to produce much of anything at the time of that last update, but I could totally see RM, reading this thread and being driven by an overwhelming desire to make everyone here eat their words, miraculously deliver games on little more than sheer willpower. Reading this kind of stuff is like the recipe for creating super villains.

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Bringing the Joy of Pinball to American Children’s Hospitals
Project Pinball
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