(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 33,437 posts
  • 1,148 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 23 hours ago by blueberryjohnson
  • Topic is favorited by 308 Pinsiders
  • Topic is sticky in its sub-forum

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

deeprootcapital-321-2024.02.27.pdf (PDF preview)
Screenshot 2024-02-05 at 7.56.45?PM (resized).png
SEC-140-2024.02.05.pdf (PDF preview)
SEC-139-2024.01.25.pdf (PDF preview)
pasted_image (resized).png
Screenshot_20240112_175938_Chrome (resized).jpg
403765574_876339380515815_4670370081257223759_n (resized).jpg
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.41.36?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.29.19?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.27.08?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.26.42?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.26.05?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.25.18?PM (resized).png
Screenshot 2024-01-11 at 10.24.27?PM (resized).png
pasted_image (resized).png
pasted_image (resized).png

Topic index (key posts)

357 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items. (Show topic index)

There are 33,437 posts in this topic. You are on page 254 of 669.
#12652 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I sent an email asking for setting up my official factory tour per the Goodwill Agreement and Bob responded that I was “escalating it to a legal matter and to never contact him, his company or employees ever again”. Lol

for someone who likes to throw shade all over the place, Robert certainly has a thin skin.

When you stand on a soap box and loudly yell how you are going to be the best, going to deliver more games than anyone, that you are going revolutionize pinball and all the other companies are just clueless idiots, and then all you do is miss every deadline and every deliverable you bragged about, and then have an epic face plant on the 'reveal', you would think he would have grown some thicker skin.

Robert strikes me as someone who is both a bad winner AND a bad loser. Although not sure sure they will ever see him have a win for us to confirm his also a bad winner.

#12653 3 years ago

Hard to blame Rob on this one Iceman has a famous talent for getting under people’s’ skin.

I’m sure most of us would tell him to F off too in the same situation.

#12654 3 years ago

Yeah I have a hard time rooting for either side of a loudmouth Texas lawyer spat.

#12655 3 years ago
Quoted from yancy:

Yeah I have a hard time rooting for either side of a Texas loudmouth lawyer spat.

LOL

#12656 3 years ago

I think what a lot of you keep forgetting is that ultimately, deeproot owes nobody nothing. They were trying to be nice with giving people refunds/discounts on a machine, but really, they never had to. Also, they never have taken a single dime of anyones money for a deposit, etc. It was Jpop that made the bad deals, not deeproot. I think some people dont understand that.

19
#12657 3 years ago
Quoted from BrewNinja:

I think what a lot of you keep forgetting is that ultimately, deeproot owes nobody nothing. They were trying to be nice with giving people refunds/discounts on a machine, but really, they never had to.

They didn't do it out of kindness. It was an attempt to rehab jpop's toxic reputation. But that was botched, like everything else.

They could have NOT hired jpop and NOT continued with the zidware games that harmed tons of pinheads. But they did, and they get everything that goes with it.

#12658 3 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

They didn't do it out of kindness. It was an attempt to rehab jpop's toxic reputation. But that was botched, like everything else.
They could have NOT hired jpop and NOT continued with the zidware games that harmed tons of pinheads. But they did, and they get everything that goes with it.

Then they simply don't need Jpop. He brings nothing to the table.

16
#12659 3 years ago
Quoted from yancy:

Yeah I have a hard time rooting for either side of a loudmouth Texas lawyer spat.

Gee, that really hurts my feelings. Coming from you? NOT

I have no "spat" because i don't care, although i do have an interest in RAZA for many years. I have a hard time responding to a smartass but i just did. . What's your excuse?

Put me on "ignore", i hate to bother your delicate sensibilities. It's satisfying when you see that "ignored user post" pop up. It's a much better experience when you use it. Try it.

Not sure if you can use that feature though if you don't contribute to Pinside?

#12660 3 years ago
Quoted from Napoleon:

Then they simply don't need Jpop. He brings nothing to the table.

They don't need him and would probably be better off without him, its Robert's dumb ego and fascination with Jpop though. He WANTED Jpop and thinks jpop will be one of the contributing factors to their success. A lot of their troubles begin and end with jpop but Robert never cared.

#12661 3 years ago
Quoted from Haymaker:

They don't need him and would probably be better off without him, its Robert's dumb ego and fascination with Jpop though. He WANTED Jpop and thinks jpop will be one of the contributing factors to their success. A lot of their troubles begin and end with jpop but Robert never cared.

I think you guys are underselling the Jpop factor. There are STILL people here who are blinded by the neon bullshit "genius" of the single-most overrated pinball designer of all time. As useless as he is, a huge part of the Deep Root "splash" came the fact that he was on board, and yet again, the zidware suckers were gonna be made "whole" and finally get their fabulous Magic Girls.

#12662 3 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

They didn't do it out of kindness. It was an attempt to rehab jpop's toxic reputation. But that was botched, like everything else.
They could have NOT hired jpop and NOT continued with the zidware games that harmed tons of pinheads. But they did, and they get everything that goes with it.

Pretty much sums it up

"But that was botched, like everything else."

#12663 3 years ago

There was a story in the SA Express newspaper about Deeproot when they hired Jpop. The headline read something like "local pinball company hires the Rembrandt of the pinball industry".

#12664 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I have no "spat" because i don't care,

Okay.

#12665 3 years ago
root_time.gifroot_time.gif
10
#12666 3 years ago
Quoted from BrewNinja:

I think what a lot of you keep forgetting is that ultimately, deeproot owes nobody nothing.

While this was true in the beginning I no longer see it that way. According to Deeproot's Goodwill agreement, they owe the money now. They have publicly and contractually assumed the debt and have made promises. And with each failed deadline, its Lucy yanking the football away.

Jpop set everybody on a roller coaster to no-where and so far Deeproot has only laid additional track.

#12667 3 years ago

I don’t care enough to file a breach of contract claim right now which I would win without contest

The aggravation of getting the $4950 isn’t worth it unless I’m further provoked

The replies I received from my fellow nice guy attorney are satisfactory.

And I want them to succeed despite Bob’s poor attitude. Still trying to give a little benefit of the doubt considering the immense stress they are under

#12668 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I don’t care enough to file a breach of contract claim right now which I would win without contest
The aggravation of getting the $4950 isn’t worth it unless I’m further provoked
The replies I received from my fellow nice guy attorney are satisfactory.
And I want them to succeed despite Bob’s poor attitude. Still trying to give a little benefit of the doubt considering the immense stress they are under

No stress. Pinball is easy.

#12669 3 years ago

Questions, questions, questions...

Is the DeepRoot Funds business not doing well?

When you select "BD Sales Agreement Mtg" you see that Robert J. Mueller has no future appointments at all:
https://my.setmore.com/bookingpage/1c556a26-7acd-4d26-a20f-e6285a702673#

Did they give up? Their primary page is still black: https://deeprootpinball.com/

Or not? https://www.indeed.com/q-Deeproot-l-San-Antonio,-TX-jobs.html

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1606191/000137647414000186/dr_s1.htm
You invest at least 10k in his fund for 5 years and you get 7% per year but if you decide to stop early you lose not only the interest but also 15% of what you invested?

Is this Deeproot pinball? "A private placement is the purchase of an illiquid or restricted investment position in another enterprise which is typically privately held, with the anticipation of significant return of income or capital, if the enterprise is successful. There is an extreme risk of loss in this type of investment. We will seek to minimize this risk by limiting private placements to ten percent (10%) of its total portfolio value."

25
#12670 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

There was a story in the SA Express newspaper about Deeproot when they hired Jpop. The headline read something like "local pinball company hires the Rembrandt of the pinball industry".

I didn't realize Rembrandt hired people to do his art for him then take credit for it!

It cannot be overstated how obsessed Robert is with John. Instead of having him do what he's best at (theme, art direction, feel) they gave him the keys to the castle and put him in the driver's seat of the clown car.

#12671 3 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

............ in the driver's seat of the clown car.

That's a good one.

QSS

#12672 3 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

It cannot be overstated how obsessed Robert is with John.

Wasn't it theorized years back that Jpop's dog could hypnotize people into believing anything he said?

#12673 3 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

I didn't realize Rembrandt hired people to do his art for him then take credit for it!
It cannot be overstated how obsessed Robert is with John. Instead of having him do what he's best at (theme, art direction, feel) they gave him the keys to the castle and put him in the driver's seat of the clown car.

Really expensive clown car

#12674 3 years ago

I’m personally enjoying the silence from deeproot...crickets...perfect...just how it should be until they have something I can actually buy! I honestly don’t want to hear another peep out of them until I can order RAZA and have it show up on my doorstep within two weeks of ordering as they promised many moons ago.

#12675 3 years ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

I’m personally enjoying the silence from deeproot...crickets...perfect...just how it should be until they have something I can actually buy! I honestly don’t want to hear another peep out of them until I can order RAZA and have it show up on my doorstep within two weeks of ordering as they promised many moons ago.

Thats what we've been saying since 3 "gone silents" ago. They will do just enough to stir the pot again. They cant help themselves. Still hope they are successful though..

#12676 3 years ago

Still cracking up about the Pinbar.

Innovation!!!

#12677 3 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Still cracking up about the Pinbar.
Innovation!!!

Makes you wonder what they have been reviewing and redoing based on feedback. Have they reached out to other heavyweights in the industry, outside of dr for honest opinions and feedback? Doubtful, but if they intend to see this through, something must be happening..

#12678 3 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Makes you wonder what they have been reviewing and redoing based on feedback. Have they reached out to other heavyweights in the industry, outside of dr for honest opinions and feedback? Doubtful, but if they intend to see this through, something must be happening..

I think Robert read way too many “innovation!” Threads on pinside, without realizing most these people have no fucking idea what they actually mean when they beg for innovation, and that they don’t really want innovation they just like
The upvotes an innovation thread offers.

So Robert’s Mandate, while burning through millions of dollars of other people’s money, to his handpicked crew of pinball geniuses, was “INNOVATE! we need to give these people what they want; crazy shit they’ve never seen before!!”

They simply had to do something as outrageous and useless as the Pinbar to fulfill this directive, and this was what they came up with.

It’s not their fault, they were just following orders. But the fact remains “innovation” is just some nebulous, vague, ultimately pointless fantasy desire that pinsiders crave, even though they don’t actually want it. Pinball is pinball and it always will be and if that’s not enough for you it’s really the wrong hobby for you to be in. And if you are starting a new pinball company, “innovation” is a pretty bad basket to put all your eggs in.

#12679 3 years ago

So do you think Robert will start production of machines without the hammerproof clearcoat? Isn't this maybe the main reason nothing is being produced yet? Wasn't it said that the invited guests brought attention to the orange peel resembling clearcoat? deeproot realized it's not good enough yet. Will it ever be?When is Robert ready to abandon the hammerproof clearcoat idea?
They have been talking about the hammerproof non dimpling playfields for so long, but they still haven't worked out the formula. I'm absolutely no expert, but by the looks of it I don't think it's very likely they will invent the clearcoat formula any time soon, if they've been working on it for this long without succeeding. If it was easy, deeproot or someone else would have invented it already. What are they doing now? Watching the lab guy experiment on clearcoat formulas every day while the rest gather around and cross their fingers this time is gonna be it? How long can they wait?

#12680 3 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Pinball is pinball and it always will be

It doesn't mean it can't be done better than what it is now though right? Pinball is static and predictable and while static is largely what is necessary for league play it doesn't mean that creating a dynamic environment should be shunned either. THAT is where the line for "pinball is just pinball" lies. Something as simple as diverters in subways or ramp sections that tilt/drop/redirect.

For me pinball is like taking a car ride with a regenerated screen beside you playing the same video clip over and over. Right now the only dynamic play in a pinball machine is caused by either poor shooting or worn components.

And adding 20 to 30 year old technology into a pinball machine is tragically being considered as innovative. I just don't get it.
Just my .02

#12681 3 years ago

The crazy thing...almost every decision deeproot has made for these last several years was completely boneheaded. Usually companies have a mix of good and bad, but this was like out of a Monty Python skit.

#12682 3 years ago
Quoted from switch3:

So do you think Robert will start production of machines without the hammerproof clearcoat? Isn't this maybe the main reason nothing is being produced yet? Wasn't it said that the invited guests brought attention to the orange peel resembling clearcoat? deeproot realized it's not good enough yet. Will it ever be?When is Robert ready to abandon the hammerproof clearcoat idea?
They have been talking about the hammerproof non dimpling playfields for so long, but they still haven't worked out the formula. I'm absolutely no expert, but by the looks of it I don't think it's very likely they will invent the clearcoat formula any time soon, if they've been working on it for this long without succeeding. If it was easy, deeproot or someone else would have invented it already. What are they doing now? Watching the lab guy experiment on clearcoat formulas every day while the rest gather around and cross their fingers this time is gonna be it? How long can they wait?

The main reason nothing is being produced yet is bc DR does not have the ability to do so. If they could make pinball machines and sell them, they would have done so years ago.

#12683 3 years ago
Quoted from switch3:

They have been talking about the hammerproof non dimpling playfields for so long, but they still haven't worked out the formula. I'm absolutely no expert, but by the looks of it I don't think it's very likely they will invent the clearcoat formula any time soon, if they've been working on it for this long without succeeding. If it was easy, deeproot or someone else would have invented it already.

Someone already did invent the correct formula. Haggis Pinball on a low budget, garage type set up.

#12684 3 years ago
Quoted from m00nmuppet:

The crazy thing...almost every decision deeproot has made for these last several years was completely boneheaded. Usually companies have a mix of good and bad, but this was like out of a Monty Python skit.

"Is this the right thread for an argument?"
"I've told you once".

#12685 3 years ago
Quoted from switch3:

Isn't this maybe the main reason nothing is being produced yet?

No

#12686 3 years ago

Besides the need for Deeproot to skinny down their pc to lower build costs and the futility of withholding game production due to wanting to get it perfect the first time .... pfffft.

One thing that bugs me about dr design is you are encouraged to leave the game on all the time. This allows it to find and use the network. This is a major flaw for their sales to consumer market. I would not keep my game on for 24/7 just to be using it 1 hour per day. Waste of energy and money plus more maintenance. Do I want my pin’s pc to age faster by a factor of 23x when I get no benefit during the normally “off hours”? No I do not. It may work fine for locations who keep their pins turned on 16 to 24 hours per day. I see this requirement as misguided for home use.

Deeproot’s pinbar design is also a loser. It has way too many things it is trying to do. Seems Robert forgot the first rule of industrial design ... keep it simple, stupid. Deeproot needs to cut 70% of the advertised features on the pinbar until it can handle 5 or 6 features flawlessly. Pick the best and most important ones and focus on transforming the industry.

There is a longtime industry practice which says don’t release a pin with more than one new significant change. History shows when pinball companies try to get too far into the future, those pin always fail. People want different but can only embrace it in bite-size snackable pieces.

#12687 3 years ago

At the end of the day, Deeproot isn't JUST not a pinball company, but they're not even a company. In the real world, this type of shit doesn't exist. Imagine if a bakery opened up in your town 5 years ago to bake the best cakes in the world. Five years later, they show you pictures of what they're working on. If it ain't real, it ain't real.

#12688 3 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Someone already did invent the correct formula. Haggis Pinball on a low budget, garage type set up.

But they didn't get the logo and I heard that is hard as hell.

03910cb703e4a11ff79a085c3fab726247534576 (resized).jpeg03910cb703e4a11ff79a085c3fab726247534576 (resized).jpeg
#12689 3 years ago

Did anyone receive their t-shirts?

#12690 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Did anyone receive their t-shirts?

Nope but received a photo of it

#12692 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Did anyone receive their t-shirts?

B1VMTBKtipS._AC_CLa_2140,2000_51C1CwCMC8L.png_0,0,2140,2000+0.0,0.0,2140.0,2000.0_UL1500_ (resized).jpgB1VMTBKtipS._AC_CLa_2140,2000_51C1CwCMC8L.png_0,0,2140,2000+0.0,0.0,2140.0,2000.0_UL1500_ (resized).jpg
#12693 3 years ago
Quoted from bennyprofane:

At the end of the day, Deeproot isn't JUST not a pinball company, but they're not even a company. In the real world, this type of shit doesn't exist. Imagine if a bakery opened up in your town 5 years ago to bake the best cakes in the world. Five years later, they show you pictures of what they're working on. If it ain't real, it ain't real.

“No, no, you don’t get it..... we inverted the frosting. We call it CakeNovation (TM).”

#12694 3 years ago
Quoted from Bumper:

Questions, questions, questions...
Is the DeepRoot Funds business not doing well?
When you select "BD Sales Agreement Mtg" you see that Robert J. Mueller has no future appointments at all:
https://my.setmore.com/bookingpage/1c556a26-7acd-4d26-a20f-e6285a702673#
Did they give up? Their primary page is still black: https://deeprootpinball.com/
Or not? https://www.indeed.com/q-Deeproot-l-San-Antonio,-TX-jobs.html
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1606191/000137647414000186/dr_s1.htm
You invest at least 10k in his fund for 5 years and you get 7% per year but if you decide to stop early you lose not only the interest but also 15% of what you invested?
Is this Deeproot pinball? "A private placement is the purchase of an illiquid or restricted investment position in another enterprise which is typically privately held, with the anticipation of significant return of income or capital, if the enterprise is successful. There is an extreme risk of loss in this type of investment. We will seek to minimize this risk by limiting private placements to ten percent (10%) of its total portfolio value."

This last statement is a pretty common venture capital inclusion - you invest, but it’s very speculative and you could LOSE IT ALL! Although typically VC investors like to see more than a tiny sliver of profit for all that risk they’re taking. I still think this is a tax avoidance scheme

#12695 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Did anyone receive their t-shirts?

20201011_160912 (resized).jpg20201011_160912 (resized).jpg
#12696 3 years ago

Do we know when RAZA will be finalized and and available for purchase?

#12697 3 years ago
Quoted from jonesjb:

Do we know when RAZA will be finalized and and available for purchase?

Lol

10
#12698 3 years ago
Quoted from jonesjb:

Do we know when RAZA will be finalized and and available for purchase?

The goal isn't to finish a game it's for John to stay employed until he turns 64.

#12699 3 years ago
Quoted from jonesjb:Do we know when RAZA will be finalized and and available for purchase?

Seriously LOL

#12700 3 years ago
Quoted from jonesjb:

Do we know when RAZA will be finalized and and available for purchase?

A year maybe...if.....nevermind old news.
Should get 3 more machines released before this one. By then most will forget about this boutique game by then.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 299.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
$ 1.29
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Daddio's 3D Printed Mods
Toys/Add-ons
$ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
From: $ 18.00
From: $ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
$ 49.99
From: $ 1.49
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Daddio's 3D Printed Mods
Toys/Add-ons
$ 649.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
From: $ 8.99
Cabinet - Other
NO GOUGE PINBALL™
Other
$ 15.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
Gweem's Mods
Sound/Speakers
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu
There are 33,437 posts in this topic. You are on page 254 of 669.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/twip-is-deeproot-the-next-misadventure-or-a-pinball-revolution/page/254 and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.