Quoted from yancy:Those look like crap too.
IN MY OPINION, relax people.
You are especially invited to come over too.
Quoted from yancy:Those look like crap too.
IN MY OPINION, relax people.
You are especially invited to come over too.
A touchscreen to interact with the player could be a really great idea. However, what they have with that hideous lockdown bar needs to be thrown in the trash. Sometimes innovation isn't worth it.
I might be in the minority but I'd rather see them leave the basics of pinball alone and just build some fun pins to play.
Quoted from razorsedge:That backbox looks terrible!
I actually like the backbox for this theme. But please don't do it again.
Pretty unique pin and if it turns out to be a nice playing machine and priced fairly all you gals talking smack now will want one. Just the usual Pinside haters. Once Bob said what he said and hurt some feelings here he was never gonna win with some of you.
Ok girls now get back to your hate and tough talk! I’m sure Bob is shaking in his boots!
Quoted from pinballwil:Use the new steep cabinet to make room for a bigger under glass world (and the apron lcd).
Stop complaining! This game has world (and flippers) under lockdown bar which is in an innovative industry first.
So re-reading the note from today. They considered this to be a beta review and are going back to the drawing board on this first game. That certainly implies at least months if not a year before we see another reveal. Not to mention that this is a single game. Hopefully they don't actually have multiple games at prototype stage that need to be redesigned to a new platform... Another reason the five games on day one release thing was an incredibly stupid idea.
And yes, that backbox looks terrible. I can just picture it shaking and rattling on those two small support posts. Whatever that thing is on the lockbar needs to go too. Haha, how could anybody think that is a good idea? It hurts my hands just looking at it and it blocks the view of the flippers for anyone less than seven feet tall.
Quoted from teekee:Pretty unique pin and if it turns out to be a nice playing machine and priced fairly all you gals talking smack now will want one. Just the usual Pinside haters. Once Bob said what he said and hurt some feelings here he was never gonna win with some of you.
Ok girls now get back to your hate and tough talk! I’m sure Bob is shaking in his boots!
Yeah Bob has a bit more to be worried about than what we think
Bob needs to account for this business to others
Shaking in his boots? Lol
Sorry Teekee, flipper days ala DR aren’t returning
Quoted from John_I:So re-reading the note from today. They considered this to be a beta review and are going back to the drawing board on this first game.
Re-read it again. "they" didn't consider this a "beta review" until their handpicked collection of eager-to-please-in-return-for-scoop pinball pundits let them know that it's a dumpster fire. It was decided this was a "beta review" around halftime of last night's Patriots game most likely.
You've gotta be looking at another year to redesign that cabinet into something playable. This was really supposed to be the actual game as it would ship, or they wouldn't have presented it to this crew with such fanfare. This is the game they planned on shipping innovation-hungry pinball buyers.
The time for a "beta review/focus group" was about 2 years ago, when Robert was telling us that we are all morons and that all the other pinball companies are doofuses who don't know anything about what today's buyers want and are staid dinosaurs stuck on lame outdated concepts like "makeable ramps" and "lockdown bars that don't draw blood and allow you to view flippers." They really could have used the feedback at that time, rather than now.
Let it sink in what an unprecedented pinball reveal disaster this is, when you consider the hype, the money spent, the time spent, the "A List" staff assembled, and the massive size of this entire project. Nothing even close. Not even Jpop bringing empty cabinets to a pinball show to calm his "investors." That wasn't accompanied by this kind of hype or promise.
Quoted from woody76:This did not age well...
We want to personally thank Jody Dankberg, Stern's director of marketing and licensing, for this wake up call back in 2016:
"There are others trying to make pinball machines, I think it would be fantastic if someone else came along and was really successful at it. Because that would make an industry ... I want someone to be successful [as we] probably do 99.9 percent of the games shipped. That's not an industry, it's a monopoly." *
!! Challenge Accepted !!
Just a few days left in the pinball world Before deeproot...
Yea, wonder how that foot tastes!
Stern just ate there lunch and dinner.
Quoted from Mr68:Why does everyone keep overlooking, Multimorphic P3?
Russell, you need to stop over sometime and play my Heist game and Lexi. Real pinball innovation is already here folks.
Invitation accepted. Seriously, we should get together some time soon, once it's safe and all.
Quoted from hank527:I'm curious what those paper shreds are on the touch screen.
[quoted image][quoted image]
I believe those are reflections of lights on the ceiling.
Quoted from mbeardsley:I believe those are reflections of lights on the ceiling.
Another innovation!
Reflections show the poor workmanship that's gone into that screen thing. It's not close to being even across the horizontal, and the gap between bezel and screen varies as well. I don't think you can even make something like that look good even if it wasn't warped.
This was my prediction yesterday...
Quoted from mbeardsley:People here expecting multiple machines at prices of $3500 are out of their minds.
I believe we will just see a slightly-improved RAZA with more code/animations and an adjusted ramp. The pricing will be just below that of a Stern Premium (but they will talk about what a great "value" this is). Their big "innovation" will be that you can order it with a choice of armor colors, even though most of those choices will look bad with the colors of the actual machine.
There will also be a bunch of vague talk about "lots of other amazing titles" coming "soon", maybe with some pictures of artwork for those machines.
If you're lucky, they will give a definitive shipping date for RAZA, though I wouldn't be surprised if they simply say it will be "very soon".
...unfortunately I was way too optimistic.
The entire cabinet design is tragic.
Amazing that they would waste engineering time on garbage like the new back box and the lock down bar.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Re-read it again. "they" didn't consider this a "beta review" until their handpicked collection of eager-to-please-in-return-for-scoop pinball pundits let them know that it's a dumpster fire. It was decided this was a "beta review" around halftime of last night's Patriots game most likely.
You've gotta be looking at another year to redesign that cabinet into something playable. This was really supposed to be the actual game as it would ship, or they wouldn't have presented it to this crew with such fanfare. This is the game they planned on shipping innovation-hungry pinball buyers.
The time for a "beta review/focus group" was about 2 years ago, when Robert was telling us that we are all morons and that all the other pinball companies are doofuses who don't know anything about what today's buyers want and are staid dinosaurs stuck on lame outdated concepts like "makeable ramps" and "lockdown bars that don't draw blood and allow you to view flippers." They really could have used the feedback at that time, rather than now.
Let it sink in what an unprecedented pinball reveal disaster this is, when you consider the hype, the money spent, the time spent, the "A List" staff assembled, and the massive size of this entire project. Nothing even close. Not even Jpop bringing empty cabinets to a pinball show to calm his "investors." That wasn't accompanied by this kind of hype or promise.
So this is where they made a grave mistake. Ship the damn game. Price it at cost or just above to lower expectations. The most absolute worst thing any company can do is to ship no product. Because the number one way you can guarantee failure is to sell nothing and ship nothing. Better is the enemy of good enough or even in this case not good enough. Now this has the possibility of catastrophically failing, but tell me that isn’t the likely outcome anyway. So better to go down with product in the world than no product. I mean even Suncoast and Thunderbirds is ahead of them on that count. What is most worrisome here is that their CEO should have enough sense to know what he has without having to ask people, if he has half a clue. And there should be people all around there going “this is not ready for prime time”. Reaching this conclusion at the 11th hour really only demonstrates total incompetence from top to bottom here. And the most incompetent move was hiring JPOP. When you have to have an entire team just to manage your designer and your designer is well know for not finishing games, man you are in trouble. Your investors are already gonna come with pitchforks at this point. At least demonstrate a game you can build and a customer, any customer really at any price, for what you have available to sell.
Quoted from flynnibus:crazylevi - did someone use a lockdown bar to beat you as a child? You've got it on for this
Owning a stellar wars for a year was pretty traumatic.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Owning a stellar wars for a year was pretty traumatic.
Yeah, Laser Ball was an easier time because it was such a bad game you rarely wanted to play it, hence less pain.
Quoted from pookycade:Because the number one way you can guarantee failure is to sell nothing and ship nothing.
Maybe for some things but not for a pinball machine since they're not easilly returnable or serviced.
Better to wait and get it right.
If it's not good it won't sell well anyway. Look at Thunderbirds.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Owning a stellar wars for a year was pretty traumatic.
I concur. Sharpest lockdown bar ever.
Quoted from metallik:Yeah, Laser Ball was an easier time because it was such a bad game you rarely wanted to play it, hence less pain.
Lol
I at least liked stellar wars
Quoted from jarozi:I hit that ramp seemingly clean and true many times and it only made it round maybe 1/5 times?
If it makes you feel better, I never made it . I played the one in the darker area.
Quoted from pookycade:And the most incompetent move was hiring JPOP
I don't know about that, with this reveal, we are seeing incompetence reaching a whole new level
Quoted from ataritoday:want to give props to spooky
Mega props to Spooky. Rock on guys
"Don't fall in love with a dreamer
'Cause he'll break you every time"
Kenny Rogers -Kim Carnes
A touch screen is innovative, interested to see how it integrates with the game.
Oh wow, 800 new posts today. Must be a great reveal to have so much activity here.
Opens thread. Fooled again.
I would have liked to see Magic Girl finished, this?
"Thats pretty low mister, if I had a rubber hose I would beat you.."
Quoted from Thunderbird:Dennis Norseman
Everything’s on the butchers block today...
Quoted from Coz:Judging by the fingerprints, I assume this is a touch screen?? Or is it reflections? What are your thoughts?
[quoted image]
Yes looks like reflections if I look at the stainless apron in front of it. Probably still a display though.
Looks like fingerprints .If it is that touch screen has something to do with the story like options on what path to take .If so I’m in !
The cabinet they made does look like the patent they took out in 2018. I'm betting they have a hinged playfield glass and lift out playfield. I don't see any rivets on the steel around the glass.
Quoted from cpr9999:Yes looks like reflections if I look at the stainless apron in front of it. Probably still a display though.
Could be a display so the player could keep an eye on the animations while making a shot since animations are for spectators and not the player while the ball is flying around the playfield.
You guys??? Are we forgetting something ??? Pictures of the patented service, articulating arm monstrosity!! Inside pictures, post em you get lots of focus group feedback, I know several dozen guys on here that can troubleshoot with only a picture.
Out of all the bets that have been made on this reveal for the last 2 weeks I don't think anyone got the combo No reveal AND fake Twitch link !
If Robert's giant name remains on the backbox, I'm 100% out no matter what. I mean, I'm 96% out as it stands, but if Deeproot wants that four percent chance, they need to present a game that doesn't remind me of an inflated ego every time I walk up to it.
Who does Robert answer to? Is this endeavor really his own personal chocolate factory or is there a board of directors somewhere watching him flush all this money down the tubes for years with nothing to show for it and no viable path to profitability chasing a personal dream/hobby?
So clearly deeproot became the laughing stock of the pinball world today. Even Dutch pinball probably has a more favorable impression in people's minds. So what are they going to do for damage control? Clearly they aren't close to shipping or revealing anything. Are we going to see another podcast interview that tries to retcon past statements and reframe the narrative? This is really fascinating.
So having casually followed along the drama in this thread for the last few years... is this guy just mentally ill or something? Everything I’ve seen seems to go beyond egomaniac and narcissist with too much money.
Hope everyone that was screwed over by jpop get some resolution. If deeproot isn’t proof Karama exists I don’t know what is.
Quoted from Dkjimbo:Who does Robert answer to? Is this endeavor really his own personal chocolate factory or is there a board of directors somewhere watching him flush all this money down the tubes for years with nothing to show for it and no viable path to profitability chasing a personal dream/hobby?
Did Deeproot take the COVID assistance? There’s your answer
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