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(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread

By pin2d

6 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 33,574 posts
  • 1,149 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 days ago by stubborngamer
  • Topic is favorited by 309 Pinsiders
  • Topic is sticky in its sub-forum

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#6551 4 years ago
 
LEV

CrazyLevi

Crazy Levi's Pinball

US New York, NY

10y 148K 33,545

Quoted from razorsedge:

Oh dear, a post based on sensible reasoned observation and knowledge!! ... but wait, no, pinsiders in this deeproot bashing joke "boutique" pinball thread won't have that! . How will the stern fan club deal with such reason? ... my bet is there will be dozens douche bag trollers come along and downvote this post, and start waving around pitchforks in a rage of disgust!!
The thread is more entertainment than valit information. Seems to be why most are here.... stiiring and entertainment

Really? That impressed you?

Tell me, what did you find most “vallit” in that buzzword salad professor bullshit just presented us with.

Are you blown away by “lean-agile thinking?” Or were you hot and bothered by the architectural runway that has been established?

Do you think “reacting to data and pivoting” is what is going to break the logjam here?

Also I have a special 10 week course on flipping houses that is gonna make you rich within 2 months. Credit card operators are standing by, please PM me for info!

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#6552 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from Richthofen:

You know what they say, those who can't do, teach.

... and those whom can't do Or teach come to pinside to make being a troll an occupation.

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#6553 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Wow this is Hillarious!!! .... .... Great entertainment!

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#6554 4 years ago
 
???

silen7ce

Pinside member

US Easton, MA

6y 50,600 309 11

I may be in the minority here but I'm actually really looking forward to seeing how this pans out into a complete game...

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#6555 4 years ago
 
LTG

LTG

Pinside member

US Hopkins, MN

12y 191K 56,984 24 7

Quoted from silen7ce:

I may be in the minority here but I'm actually really looking forward to seeing how this pans out into a complete game...

No. There are people here who hope they are successful.

LTG : )

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#6556 4 years ago
 
X

notaflyingtoy

Pinside member

10y 67,900 403

Quoted from razorsedge:

... and those whom can't do Or teach come to pinside to make being a troll an occupation.

... says the person who has posted 100 times in this thread in the last eight days - how do you like your new job?

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#6557 4 years ago
 
MAN

Manic

Pinside member

US Alexandria, VA

10y 60,400 2,381 17

Quoted from Richthofen:

You know what they say, those who can't do, teach.
People love bullshit. They love it so much! they love getting sold a big heaping pile of bullshit because ordinary life is just so fucking boring.
Robert is a straight up old fashioned bullshit artist.

Well for a "bullshit artist" RM did accomplish something that was NOT bullshit: he actually got CASH back to people that were screwed by JFlop. To ME... that was damn important and bought him considerable goodwill.

Despite how people love to rant and pile on when they see an easy target... if a good product gets produced *people will buy*. Sometimes it seem like THAT is what worries some of the posters over here. I'd hate to think that's the case but that seems pretty obvious.

Remember nobody loved IP before the MM remake got rolling and then people bought... and bought... and all was forgiven.

Even Mike's pugnacious attitude would have been forgiven and forgotten if Thunderbirds had turned out to be a great looking and great playing game.

So despite being his own worst enemy I'd like to see this succeed. If it does well it means they are producing a good product and who wouldn't want that? Why would you seriously NOT want to see something new?

Back to your regularly scheduled mudslinging and undoubtedly precise predictions from the armchair experts over here.

MOST of which, I gotta add... seem like pretty good guys when they are not feeling threatened or triggered. And of course I've been guilty of this myself.

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#6558 4 years ago
 
DAV

adol75

Pinside member

US San Francisco, CA

5y 57,300 2,078 2

Quoted from silen7ce:

I may be in the minority here but I'm actually really looking forward to seeing how this pans out into a complete game...

I honestly wish them success and hope they release some good games, I just won’t be the one to buy them.

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#6559 4 years ago
 
HAZ

hank527

Pinside+ Addict

13y 128K 5,426 249

Quoted from razorsedge:

Oh dear, a post based on sensible reasoned observation and knowledge!! ... but wait, no, pinsiders in this deeproot bashing joke "boutique" pinball thread won't have that! . How will the stern fan club deal with such reason? ... my bet is there will be dozens douche bag trollers come along and downvote the above post, and start waving around pitchforks in a rage of disgust!!
Heck this post on it's own will probably get a 4 to 1 DV ratio from the troll sector on it's own! ... in a thread like this, that is merely a compliment
The thread is more a joke than valid information (everyone goes elswhere for info with validity). Seems to be why most are here.... stiring crap and entertainment
Continue!

Please go away with your b.s. babble. You refuse to see the truth in what RM and Deeproot currently is. I'm anxious to see other designs when the owner matures.

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#6560 4 years ago
 
DMB

PismoArcade

Pinside+ Frequent

US St. George, UT

12y 143K 4,102 3 134

Quoted from LTG:

No. There are people here who hope they are successful.
LTG : )

Exactly. You can hope for their success and still ask questions regarding RM's past statements.

Sycophants can be just as counterproductive as trolls.

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#6561 4 years ago
 
DRM

iceman44

Pinside+ Pro!

US Boerne, TX

13y 162K 26,892 28 49

Quoted from frolic:

Is it possible to "disrupt" the pinball market with another mid to high tier manufacturer? We already know Stern Pros outsell everything else by a large margin, and everyone else is fighting over a small piece of the pie.

And they make FUN games. I'm loving my JPLE and ElviraLE.

Frankly, the RAZA theme itself is just ok.

I've decided I'm waiting for Alice in Wonderland or Magic Girl.

That interview that i just listened to was interesting to say the least. I just sent an email to get my factory tour so i can see Raza in person.

I don't get the marketing efforts of these people, Stern included, calling Pinside a "sewer". Yes it certainly can be but if you don't think Pinside is your market as a pinball manufacturer then you are completely F ED!!!

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#6562 4 years ago
 
VGC

VGC1612

Pinside member

9y 51,650 567 6 1

Am i the only one that always read deeproot as deepthroat by mistake?No ok im out ... lol

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#6563 4 years ago
 
JAS

Sinistarrett

Pinside member

US Freeport, FL

8y 81,850 1,623 3 12

I’m not going to post anything until I do some lean, agile thinking.

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#6564 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from notaflyingtoy:

... says the person who has posted 100 times in this thread in the last eight days - how do you like your new job?

Much more entertaining than my real job!!

My real job is so dull sometimes I spend half my working day in here for entertainment

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#6565 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from hank527:

Please go away with your b.s. babble. You refuse to see the truth in what RM and Deeproot currently is. I'm anxious to see other designs when the owner matures.

Awwww, cmon!? ... but I fit right in going by that description!

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#6566 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from Manic:

Well for a "bullshit artist" RM did accomplish something that was NOT bullshit: he actually got CASH back to people that were screwed by JFlop. To ME... that was damn important and bought him considerable goodwill.
Despite how people love to rant and pile on when they see an easy target... if a good product gets produced *people will buy*. Sometimes it seem like THAT is what worries some of the posters over here. I'd hate to think that's the case but that seems pretty obvious.
Remember nobody loved IP before the MM remake got rolling and then people bought... and bought... and all was forgiven.
Even Mike's pugnacious attitude would have been forgiven and forgotten if Thunderbirds had turned out to be a great looking and great playing game.
So despite being his own worst enemy I'd like to see this succeed. If it does well it means they are producing a good product and who wouldn't want that? Why would you seriously NOT want to see something new?
Back to your regularly scheduled mudslinging and undoubtedly precise predictions from the armchair experts over here.
MOST of which, I gotta add... seem like pretty good guys when they are not feeling threatened or triggered. And of course I've been guilty of this myself.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

But seriously though, totally agree with Manic!

I don't think anyone commenting on the toxicity of "pinside" was referring to anything more than the specific topic threads, speculation threads, such as this one. All the other aspects of Piside are great, and the main reason I ever came here. Pinside is invaluable for pinheads, just maybe not for manufacturers to engage with, in many circumstances.

After all, the descriptions of RM's "behavior" can be used just as accurately for far too many posters in this very thread. The pot calling the kettle black, so to speak. (hypocracy)

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#6567 4 years ago
 
MAN

Manic

Pinside member

US Alexandria, VA

10y 60,400 2,381 17

Quoted from razorsedge:

Much more entertaining than my real job!!
My real job is so dull sometimes I spend half my working day in here for entertainment

Let's just hope you're not a police or ambulance dispatcher

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#6568 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from VGC1612:

Am i the only one that always read deeproot as deepthroat by mistake?No ok im out ... lol

Where we come from "root" is a directly interchangeable word with "fv@k" .... (except in the context of being part of a tree/plant).

Geez, I'm feeling a bit Rooted!
Wanna root?
Who gives a root!
Get rooted!
How about you go root your boot!
I'd be up for a good deep root!
Would you like to get Deeply Rooted?

"I'm Definitely Down for five consecutive days of Deep Rooting!!" (assuming she loves me, and I find her physically and intellectually attractive)

F*c# that damn tree root, time to burn the sucker out!

Which makes the name extra funny for us!

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#6569 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from Manic:

Let's just hope you're not a police or ambulance dispatcher

No I maintain robots in an ice cream factory.

No lives on the line

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#6570 4 years ago
 
WYZ

wesman

Pinside member

US Pittsburgh, PA

5y 92,800 3,526 7 7

Quoted from LTG:

No. There are people here who hope they are successful.
LTG : )

Very much so!

We can hope for excellent game production, but also acknowledge how bizarre this first showing was, and also how incorrigible and brazen Robert can come across at times. It's not black and white, one or the other, with or against. Rational people settle in the gray towards some direction or none at all.

And his comments not just about this being a sewer, but leaving pinside this summer as the best decision he's made recently, and something about this site being poison weren't exactly inspiring to hear as a potential customer and Pinside user. There were a lot of unflattering comments made by him, which I don't understand, as this site isn't akin to a pinball version of 4chan. I've frankly never been around to witness completely gross or absurd behavior. I don't always agree with people, and at "worst" people offer fairly baselss criticism, and ideally at best constructive criticism, the same as any fan forum. So for me, this place is a valid arena to discuss ideas, and share passion about things.

Robert's attitude on here, frankly, seemed more poisonous, as a potential leader in the hobby, than anything that I've read from any particular forum member to another member on here. He criticized not just other manufacturers, but then the very userbase he wishes to sell to.

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#6571 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from iceman44:

I don't get the marketing efforts of these people, Stern included, calling Pinside a "sewer". Yes it certainly can be but if you don't think Pinside is your market as a pinball manufacturer then you are completely F ED!!!

So to translate , ".... as a pinball manufacturer then you are completely ROOTED!!!" Lol

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#6572 4 years ago
 
SMB

Concretehardt

Pinside+ Frequent

US Eugene, OR

11y 145K 10,075 2 27

Quoted from PoppyCock:

This place has RDS, Robert Derangement Syndrome.

More like Robert has PDS, Pinside derangement syndrome.

Disclaimer: I am an admitted member of the Pinside “sewer”

A988E980-96A1-4BC9-BEF2-23FAF96E4600 (resized).jpegA988E980-96A1-4BC9-BEF2-23FAF96E4600 (resized).jpeg
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#6573 4 years ago
 
LTG

LTG

Pinside member

US Hopkins, MN

12y 191K 56,984 24 7

Quoted from Concretehardt:

I am an admitted member of the Pinside “sewer”

We need a cool embroidered patch to wear at pinball events to show our membership. Like the biker gangs 1% patch.

LTG : )

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#6574 4 years ago
 
MAN

Manic

Pinside member

US Alexandria, VA

10y 60,400 2,381 17

Quoted from razorsedge:

Where we come from "root" is a directly interchangeable word with "fv@k" .... (except in the context of being part of a tree/plant).
Rooted!
Wanna root?
Who gives a root!
Get rooted!
How about you go root your boot!
Would you like to get Deeply Rooted?
F*c# that damn tree root, time to burn the sucker out!
Which makes the name extra funny for us!

Funny indeed... but let's hope that name doesn't become a description of future customers.

I'm kinda numb to PS being described as a "sewer" also. Wasn't that Steve Ritchie's description of the place? Or was that a "cancer"? Somehow I don't think this hurt his sales.

I think every frustrated person in the industry ends up describing this place that way... either publicly or privately.

I prefer the term "free spirited". Or "delightfully opinionated".

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#6575 4 years ago
 
CRP

LateCenturyMods

Pinside member

US Houston, TX

8y 55,150 304

Quoted from silen7ce:

I may be in the minority here but I'm actually really looking forward to seeing how this pans out into a complete game...

I'm with you. Past the first 48 hours of some revelation, there's nothing to see here. The busier this thread gets, the faster I skim it.

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#6576 4 years ago
 
DTS

dts

Pinside+ Frequent

US Bend, OR

8y 119K 1,914 6 21 1

.

Post last edited 4 years ago: “never mind”

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#6577 4 years ago
 
TDK

thedarkknight77

Pinside member

12y 92,050 5,189 7 37

My name is thedarkknight77 and I am a member of the Pinside Sewer, it’s been 1 day since my last sewer post. I once made it 30 days without a sewer post, but then JJP released Dialed In........I fell of the wagon and posted negative smack daily for two months straight. Another time, I made it a week, but then Stern announced they would be screwing us Beatles fans, by bending us over the price gouging barrel. I struggle everyday, but the sewer is all around me. I fell off the wagon just the other day when I heard Robert taking BS on Kaneda’s podcast following a poor showing.........Up until now, I have supported Deeproot, but the sewer got the best of me and won.

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#6578 4 years ago
 
DRM

iceman44

Pinside+ Pro!

US Boerne, TX

13y 162K 26,892 28 49

Quoted from LTG:

We need a cool embroidered patch to wear at pinball events to show our membership. Like the biker gangs 1% patch.
LTG : )

Lol Lloyd! I’ll be wearing some Pinside Sewer gear to TPF

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2
2
#6579 4 years ago
 
GIC

goingincirclez

GIC Pinball

9y 116K 2,835 27

All drains lead to the PinSewer...

(keep your balls out of the sewer)

0
1
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#6580 4 years ago
 
SMB

Concretehardt

Pinside+ Frequent

US Eugene, OR

11y 145K 10,075 2 27

Quoted from LTG:

We need a cool embroidered patch to wear at pinball events to show our membership. Like the biker gangs 1% patch.
LTG : )

Fantastic idea!

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5
5
#6581 4 years ago
 
DMB

PismoArcade

Pinside+ Frequent

US St. George, UT

12y 143K 4,102 3 134

I always chuckle when people crap all over Pinside and talk about it's negativity. Name me a hobby website without drama.

My kid belongs to a Disney pin trading group and the dysfunction there makes Pinside pale in comparison.

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1
1
#6582 4 years ago
 
CJM

cjmjmm2006

Starport

10y 107K 2,185 143

Quoted from wesman:

From seeming like eons ago, sorry for the late reply here.
Haha, I do! I hope they can continually beat me, then point back, and tell anyone that will listen who gave them some pointers, long long ago....
More importantly, I trust you're onbard Chris to pick up some of these for Helicon, Starport, and maybe that other venue you mentioned awhile back.

I will. I have no communication with the company however so I can't project anything.

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#6583 4 years ago
 
RJW

screaminr

In Memoriam

7y 116K 6,151

Quoted from razorsedge:

the pitchforks will be flying thick and fast!! lol

IMG_20191122_153501 (resized).jpgIMG_20191122_153501 (resized).jpg
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#6584 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from razorsedge:

Where we come from "root" is a directly interchangeable word with "fv@k" .... (except in the context of being part of a tree/plant).
Geez, I'm feeling a bit Rooted!
Wanna root?
Who gives a root!
Get rooted!
How about you go root your boot!
I'd be up for a good deep root!
Would you like to get Deeply Rooted?
"I'm Definitely Down for five consecutive days of Deep Rooting!!" (assuming she loves me, and I find her physically and intellectually attractive)
F*c# that damn tree root, time to burn the sucker out!
Which makes the name extra funny for us!

Just to dig up some older pics re. Deeproot, here is an Aussie (who some may know) sporting "unofficial" DR apparel of his own design... but the meaning may have been a little lost on any other than Aussies....

DEEPROOTING (resized).jpgDEEPROOTING (resized).jpg

Takes on an even more wonderous tone when simultaneously viewing the old DR logo!

*don't look too closely at the pictographs!

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#6585 4 years ago
 
WYZ

wesman

Pinside member

US Pittsburgh, PA

5y 92,800 3,526 7 7

Quoted from cjmjmm2006:

I will. I have no communication with the company however so I can't project anything.

At this point, I'm thinking the more removed you, we all are, from Deeproot directly, we have a much, much better chance enjoying their products!

That whole announcement by Robert regarding him and the media, well his future podcast silence till March at the end of the Kaneda interview, hopefully will allow the oral turds he delivered to de-steam, and let us once again focus on their games, and not his girlish angsty tude'.

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#6586 4 years ago
 
DLS

bigd1979

Pinside member

US Hagerstown, MD

10y 137K 14,191 8 78

I don't know much about this company or pin but anytime a new pinball is designed and goes into possible manufacturing than it's a good thing. Not sure why people are being so negative about a new pin...let alone a early prototype with some low grade pictures and video. Seems most that actually played it had fun and said it's a good start. Can't everyone just be excited for more options ? If you like it buy it..if not then wait for another new release. Fun or not what a great time to be in this great hobby with so many new choices.

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2
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#6587 4 years ago
 
RJW

screaminr

In Memoriam

7y 116K 6,151

Quoted from razorsedge:

Just to dig up some older pics re. Deeproot, here is an Aussie (who some may know) sporting "unofficial" DR apparel of his own design... but the meaning may have been a little lost on any other than Aussies....
[quoted image]
Takes on an even more wonderous tone when simultaneously viewing the old DR logo!
*don't look too closely at the pictographs!

Deeproot definitely means something different over here

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1
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#6588 4 years ago
 
WUF

wolfemaaan

Inactive member

5y 69,650 1,495

Quoted from bigd1979:

I don't know much about this company or pin but anytime a new pinball is designed and goes into possible manufacturing than it's a good thing. Not sure why people are being so negative about a new pin...let alone a early prototype with some low grade pictures and video. Seems most that actually played it had fun and said it's a good start. Can't everyone just be excited for more options ? If you like it buy it..if not then wait for another new release. Fun or not what a great time to be in this great hobby with so many new choices.

There are some here that are butthurt because J-Pop t-bagged their noses. Get over it

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2
2
#6589 4 years ago
 
RAZ

razorsedge

FRAG

8y 78,850 3,257

Quoted from wolfemaaan:

There are some here that are butthurt because J-Pop t-bagged their noses. Get over it

Then, after alot of hassles and effort by someone people bag, JpoPs victims were finally, literally, Deep Rooted! (but in a more loving kinda way ) .... they get something back, thanks to RM.

People have the right to be offended... or not be offended.

I'm optimistic. Not offended.

RM ....

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#6590 4 years ago
 
TDK

thedarkknight77

Pinside member

12y 92,050 5,189 7 37

Pinside Sewer needs a T-Shirt! I wonder if the great Zombie Yeti would design something for us???

0
2
2
#6591 4 years ago
 
RON

Rondogg

Pinside member

11y 109K 3,341

Quoted from thedarkknight77:

Pinside Sewer needs a T-Shirt! I wonder if the great Zombie Yeti would design something for us???

It would probably be a "hack job".

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2
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#6592 4 years ago
 
JLG

JodyG

Ramp-O-Matic

6y 143K 4,612 6 21 1

I am headed over to Costco to get my law degree so I don't get in trouble with Robert for giving legal advice without a license.

0
1
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#6593 4 years ago
 
WUF

wolfemaaan

Inactive member

5y 69,650 1,495

Quoted from Rondogg:

It would probably be a "hack job".

I’d buy one

1
1
0
#6594 4 years ago
 
BAD

BC_Gambit

PinMod Industries

Unknown

11y 70,550 3,532

Quoted from bigd1979:

I don't know much about this company or pin but anytime a new pinball is designed and goes into possible manufacturing than it's a good thing. Not sure why people are being so negative about a new pin...let alone a early prototype with some low grade pictures and video. Seems most that actually played it had fun and said it's a good start. Can't everyone just be excited for more options ? If you like it buy it..if not then wait for another new release. Fun or not what a great time to be in this great hobby with so many new choices.

You don't know any of the back story .... and you don't know why people are a bit prickly about this issue.

I wonder if those two things are connected?

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#6595 4 years ago
 
EDG

Richthofen

Pinside member

11y 75,800 2,696

Quoted from Manic:

Well for a "bullshit artist" RM did accomplish something that was NOT bullshit: he actually got CASH back to people that were screwed by JFlop. To ME... that was damn important and bought him considerable goodwill.

The payments to Jpop's victims were simply a transfer from the investors who bought deeproot securities to the Jpop victims. When this thing goes belly up, there will be a new set of victims.

There's this concept in some economics circles called "The bezzle". It's the fake wealth people believe they have when they're making an investment that will go belly up, but before they realize it. Right now jpop victims who were remunerated feel great. Robert Mueller feels great because he's got millions of investor dollars. And deeproot security owners feel great because they own an asset which, although already spent on salaries to pinball designers and rent, etc, hasn't been marked down on paper to show the money being spent. I know some of his other funds have payouts of 5-7% ... where will that money come from if Deeproot pinball is set up the same way? Deeproot pinball has offered $6 million in equity. What happens when that money runs out? Will Robert dip into the other funds and transfer money between the LLCs he has? Will he sell more securities to pay out any redemptions from the initial investors? Everything is hunky dory until the new money stops coming in. Then the shitshow starts.

I feel bad for Jpop's initial customers but it doesn't mean that the answer is ripping off a new set of investors.

“Galbraith’s greatest contribution to economics is the concept of the bezzle, that increment to wealth that occurs during the magic interval when a confidence trickster knows he has the money he has appropriated but the victim does not yet understand that he has lost it. The gross national bezzle has never been larger than in the past decade.”
https://moneyfyi.wordpress.com/2013/11/15/5358/

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#6596 4 years ago
 
STK

flynnibus

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 134K 13,234

Quoted from BC_Gambit:

You don't know any of the back story .... and you don't know why people are a bit prickly about this issue.
I wonder if those two things are connected?

logical.giflogical.gif

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#6597 4 years ago
 
DMM

DS_Nadine

Pinside member

DE Düsseldorf

8y 72,800 4,105 2

IT'S A PROTOTYPE!!!

EJ-_92WWoAUVafv (resized).jpgEJ-_92WWoAUVafv (resized).jpg
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#6598 4 years ago
 
???

Delta9

Pinside member

10y 87,800 1,523 33

Quoted from DS_Nadine:

IT'S A PROTOTYPE!!! [quoted image]

And the windows wont break lol

0
0
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#6599 4 years ago
 
LEV

CrazyLevi

Crazy Levi's Pinball

US New York, NY

10y 148K 33,545

Quoted from Richthofen:

The payments to Jpop's victims were simply a transfer from the investors who bought deeproot securities to the Jpop victims. When this thing goes belly up, there will be a new set of victims.
There's this concept in some economics circles called "The bezzle". It's the fake wealth people believe they have when they're making an investment that will go belly up, but before they realize it. Right now jpop victims who were remunerated feel great. Robert Mueller feels great because he's got millions of investor dollars. And deeproot security owners feel great because they own an asset which, although already spent on salaries to pinball designers and rent, etc, hasn't been marked down on paper to show the money being spent. I know some of his other funds have payouts of 5-7% ... where will that money come from if Deeproot pinball is set up the same way? Deeproot pinball has offered $6 million in equity. What happens when that money runs out? Will Robert dip into the other funds and transfer money between the LLCs he has? Will he sell more securities to pay out any redemptions from the initial investors? Everything is hunky dory until the new money stops coming in. Then the shitshow starts.
I feel bad for Jpop's initial customers but it doesn't mean that the answer is ripping off a new set of investors.
“Galbraith’s greatest contribution to economics is the concept of the bezzle, that increment to wealth that occurs during the magic interval when a confidence trickster knows he has the money he has appropriated but the victim does not yet understand that he has lost it. The gross national bezzle has never been larger than in the past decade.”
https://moneyfyi.wordpress.com/2013/11/15/5358/

Very interesting perspective.

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#6600 4 years ago
 
RON

Rondogg

Pinside member

11y 109K 3,341

Quoted from Richthofen:

The payments to Jpop's victims were simply a transfer from the investors who bought deeproot securities to the Jpop victims. When this thing goes belly up, there will be a new set of victims.
There's this concept in some economics circles called "The bezzle". It's the fake wealth people believe they have when they're making an investment that will go belly up, but before they realize it. Right now jpop victims who were remunerated feel great. Robert Mueller feels great because he's got millions of investor dollars. And deeproot security owners feel great because they own an asset which, although already spent on salaries to pinball designers and rent, etc, hasn't been marked down on paper to show the money being spent. I know some of his other funds have payouts of 5-7% ... where will that money come from if Deeproot pinball is set up the same way? Deeproot pinball has offered $6 million in equity. What happens when that money runs out? Will Robert dip into the other funds and transfer money between the LLCs he has? Will he sell more securities to pay out any redemptions from the initial investors? Everything is hunky dory until the new money stops coming in. Then the shitshow starts.
I feel bad for Jpop's initial customers but it doesn't mean that the answer is ripping off a new set of investors.
“Galbraith’s greatest contribution to economics is the concept of the bezzle, that increment to wealth that occurs during the magic interval when a confidence trickster knows he has the money he has appropriated but the victim does not yet understand that he has lost it. The gross national bezzle has never been larger than in the past decade.”
https://moneyfyi.wordpress.com/2013/11/15/5358/

Ed,

What is your understanding of why RM would adamantly say that "there are no investors" and it was "his money". Is he stretching the truth?

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