(Topic ID: 203700)

deeproot Pinball thread


By pin2d

1 year ago



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#451 1 year ago
Quoted from spfxted:

The deal is good for people that were never going to sue Poppadoosh anyway.
....also, let's not hang these guys until we see what they can do. If Nordman is there, something must be right....

Well put. First disclosure, I have no skin in this game, but have been following the saga pretty closely.

I do not get all the negativity towards deeproot. I still have no clue why they all got into bed with Jpoop in the first place, but this is seeming like the best chance for those who had skin in the game to actually get something out of it (excluding those who are part of the lawsuit). Even if the machines aren't the best games ever, something is better than nothing, which is where this seemed to be heading.

If all these other seasoned designers (Nordman, Oursler, etc.) are on board, deeproot must be doing something right to encourage them to sign up.

deeproot clearly has a lot to prove, why not give them a chance rather than jump all over them?

#452 1 year ago
Quoted from brucipher:

If all these other seasoned designers (Nordman, Oursler, etc.) are on board, deeproot must be doing something right to encourage them to sign up.

The promise of a steady healthy check?

These guys need to eat too... and contract game design isn't like hollywood movie star money

#453 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

The promise of a steady healthy check?
These guys need to eat too... and contract game design isn't like hollywood movie star money

True, but it appears deeproot has pretty deep pockets to pay all these people, without taking money from the community. That's also a step in the right direction.

I get all the anger, but really, what does anyone have to lose at this point? Why not give deeproot a chance and then get angry if they don't live up to their words. They have promised more than anyone up until this point (outside of Jpoops original promises).

#454 1 year ago
Quoted from brucipher:

True, but it appears deeproot has pretty deep pockets to pay all these people, without taking money from the community. That's also a step in the right direction.
I get all the anger, but really, what does anyone have to lose at this point? Why not give deeproot a chance and then get angry if they don't live up to their words. They have promised more than anyone up until this point (outside of Jpoops original promises).

I agree with this. Let’s see what happens

The blowback hatred is directed at Jpop and most Pinsiders can’t imagine why anybody would be so stupid to take him on

They are counting on a pinball world outside of the current base of players

I only had $4500 in on Raza and Aiw and I’m wondering what records Zidware has if any?

Either way, it’s something and at the very least Pinside loves some great drama

#455 1 year ago
Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:

From what I've been told in the past, Capcom knew *exactly* what they were bargaining for *because* they put Python in a high ranking position.

Bit sad if it was specifically set up to fail, rather than just register losses.

#456 1 year ago
Quoted from brucipher:

True, but it appears deeproot has pretty deep pockets to pay all these people, without taking money from the community. That's also a step in the right direction.
I get all the anger, but really, what does anyone have to lose at this point? Why not give deeproot a chance and then get angry if they don't live up to their words. They have promised more than anyone up until this point (outside of Jpoops original promises).

It's easy to spend other people's money...

I don't think anyone is 'angry' at deeproot for trying. What the anti feelings are about is the televangelist, 'as seen on TV' snail oil speak and dismissive nature towards things people know as credible ways to achieve success.

#457 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

It's easy to spend other people's money...
I don't think anyone is 'angry' at deeproot for trying. What the anti feelings are about is the televangelist, 'as seen on TV' snail oil speak and dismissive nature towards things people know as credible ways to achieve success.

Haha, my concern about shipping cost is exactly related to this 'as seen on TV' sentiment.

#459 1 year ago

They didn't mention handling, did they? I think paying for taxes and shipping seems reasonable.

#460 1 year ago

I may have missed this,but what happens if Deeproot gets tired of JPop redesigning the wheel and decides to part ways with his tinkering?

#461 1 year ago

For anyone else thinking of starting a pinball company I highly recommend hiring a qualified person for public relations. It's hard to be supportive of someone new on the block when they seem to go out of their way to belittle those that have been here for years. First impressions can be lasting impressions...

Here's hoping everything works out in the end.

#462 1 year ago

I really don't like the swagger and way this guy/business promotes itself.

For people concerned about Zidware buyers signing away their legal rights, if they weren't already part of the Zidware lawsuit then clearly it appears they had very little appetite for legal action anyhow. I guess this offer is at least a carrot for something. Whether it eventuates is a whole other thing, but I can't see much downside for them. They sure as hell weren't getting something from John and had declined to take legal action so it appears they had written their money off. At least now they have a flicker of hope.

#463 1 year ago
Quoted from stpcore:

For anyone else thinking of starting a pinball company I highly recommend

I highly recommend not starting a pinball company.

#464 1 year ago
Quoted from spfxted:

The deal is good for people that were never going to sue Poppadoosh anyway.
....also, let's not hang these guys until we see what they can do. If Nordman is there, something must be right....

Nordman had a brief encounter with Heighway at one point in time... And check that place out now...

-1
#465 1 year ago

I suspect that many of the RAZA/AIW 'owners' are not telling us what they really think, since saying anything negative about deeproot means they can just deny your claim. I guess you better be careful on what you upvote or downvote. It seems they have carved out a few loopholes to let them pull the rug out from just about anyone. Seems odd that they are so confident in what they can do, and that they will revolutionize pinball, but they fear the comments that might be made on a message board like Pinside by those who have been duped by jpop, I guess the rest of us will have to exercise our right to free speech, to do it for them

I'm certainly interested to see these "multiple titles' all ready to be delivered to homes around the world, come a year from June (although Robert seems pretty darn confident it will be well before that).

I do hope that those screwed by jpop get something of value, but, I have my doubts.

#466 1 year ago
Quoted from Slash:

I really don't like the swagger and way this guy/business promotes itself.
For people concerned about Zidware buyers signing away their legal rights, if they weren't already part of the Zidware lawsuit then clearly it appears they had very little appetite for legal action anyhow. I guess this offer is at least a carrot for something. Whether it eventuates is a whole other thing, but I can't see much downside for them. They sure as hell weren't getting something from John and had declined to take legal action so it appears they had written their money off. At least now they have a flicker of hope.

That's basically where I'm at. If you had zero interest in suing John / Zidware in past or future, I don't see what you're out by agreeing to these terms. About the only thing I can think of, beyond what's been stated, is that you might be helping John (and others) to profit from the intellectual rights generated while John was paying himself a salary from others money. If this these promises end up being unfulfilled, it's possible you've removed your name from the list that would otherwise stand in the way of using these intellectual rights. I don't understand how American Pinball, and now Deep Root, came to the realization it would be worth the baggage, but whatever. We are, where we are.

#467 1 year ago

I'm just happy this super strong pinball economy will be able to support all these new machines they are talking about making, along with all the other manufacturers out there.

#468 1 year ago

5 days of deeproot!!! Don't know about you other kiwi's and aussies but that would bloody kill me. Back in my heyday you're a legend for lasting a few hours.

10
#469 1 year ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Nordman had a brief encounter with Heighway at one point in time... And check that place out now...

People will rationalize anything.

The fact that they’ve assembled this team of wash ups doesn’t mean the company plan is sound, or the people
They are paying have a firm belief in the company. It doesn’t mean ANYTHING, except that they convinced a bunch of old pinball designers to accept their money.

Sometimes the truth can be sobering.

#470 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

People will rationalize anything.
The fact that they’ve assembled this team of wash ups doesn’t mean the company plan is sound, or the people
They are paying have a firm belief in the company. It doesn’t mean ANYTHING, except that they convinced a bunch of old pinball designers to accept their money.
Sometimes the truth can be sobering.

True.

Times have moved on.

Far more interested in say the next game design by Scott Danesi.

And Keith Elwin.

The old designers have had their time in the sun, time for new blood.

#471 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

I'm just happy this super strong pinball economy will be able to support all these new machines they are talking about making, along with all the other manufacturers out there.

Who are you and what have you done with O-din?

10
#472 1 year ago

The TWIP interview noted that deeproot Pinball would have an interview with Tony and me on our February 11th podcast episode, so I figured I should provide a bit of an update. I conducted the interview today, so the release is date-certain now. Topics we discussed include software, hardware, the Zidware Good Will terms, and assembly. I'll post the link here when I have the episode live (we still have to assemble most of it, and I can't do that until the 11th). My thanks to those who provided question suggestions, they were very helpful (and I tried to monitor this thread for ideas as well).

20
#473 1 year ago

The Who's My Generation:

"Hope I die before I get old"

Then I wouldn't have to read this nonsense......

Quoted from Shapeshifter:

The old designers have had their time in the sun, time for new blood.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The fact that they’ve assembled this team of wash ups

Don't get me wrong, giving Eric M. his shot was a great decision by JJP. Nothing against new talent. Scott D. has created something great.

Throwing away lifetimes of experience is unwise.

ddt

#474 1 year ago
Quoted from daudioguy:

Throwing away lifetimes of experience is unwise.

No doubt!

I mean where would we be if bands like Kiss and Aerosmith were no longer contributing to the wonderful world of rock music.

#475 1 year ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Nordman had a brief encounter with Heighway at one point in time... And check that place out now...

Nordman left because Andrew put unrealistic timeframes on his development.

#476 1 year ago
Quoted from daudioguy:

The Who's My Generation:
"Hope I die before I get old"
Then I wouldn't have to read this nonsense......

Don't get me wrong, giving Eric M. his shot was a great decision by JJP. Nothing against new talent. Scott D. has created something great.
Throwing away lifetimes of experience is unwise.
ddt

I can personally vouch for Barry's ability.

#477 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

No doubt!
I mean where would we be if bands like Kiss and Aerosmith were no longer contributing to the wonderful world of rock music.

Have you seen the picture of Steven Tyler shirtless on the beach? Not all contributions are equal.

#478 1 year ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Have you seen the picture of Steven Tyler shirtless on beach?

I had to do a double take on that one. At first I thought it was Liv Tyler.

#479 1 year ago

I say let’s give them a chance. It seems that they took care of Applejuice and Zombieyeti, so that’s a positive development if nothing else happens. Maybe the additional threat will get Stern to sharpen up as well.

As for their pin making success, we’ll see and be able to judge for ourselves soon enough.

-3
#480 1 year ago
Quoted from spoke:

they fear the comments

Nonsense sry. Other than the stoner from California I tell you why: It is not about fear. He does not want to hold hands with someone who throws shit on him/his company publicly.

Quoted from flynnibus:

I don't think anyone is 'angry' at deeproot for trying.

Oh man... So much hate for deeproot because they let Popadiuk back in the game.

To everyone who can not see straight: Get out into the business world to see how (broke) business relationships work so you get a clue what is happening here. I applaude RM for his balls and genius (he is like me) and admire his nerves to read through, analyse and answer to vicious attacks like this (I could not do that)

Quoted from flynnibus:

It's basically a tease for huge value on vaporware

deeproot Tech Zidware Webinar:
Is John Popadiuk working on the games (MG, RAZA, AIW)?
Yes with colaborative help from the deeproot team."

Hail to the pinball wizard! Keep going!

11
#481 1 year ago
Quoted from Makakka:

deeproot Tech Zidware Webinar:
Is John Popadiuk working on the games (MG, RAZA, AIW)?
Yes with colaborative help from the deeproot team."

Hail to the pinball wizard! Keep going!

You wouldn't be so kind if you lost $45,000 to this crook/conman.
Any company that uses this "stain on the pinball industry" has a lot to prove before anyone gets on board....

#482 1 year ago
Quoted from Makakka:

genius (he is like me)

But is he humble like you?

#483 1 year ago

Alright, the podcast episode just released, here is a link:
https://soundcloud.com/user-465086826/episode-55

The interview is just after the introduction segment (jump ahead to 4:30 to get just before it starts), and runs a little over 50 minutes.

#484 1 year ago
Quoted from DennisK:

Alright, the podcast episode just released, here is a link:
https://soundcloud.com/user-465086826/episode-55
The interview is just after the introduction segment (jump ahead to 4:30 to get just before it starts), and runs a little over 50 minutes.

Listening now and you had me when you announced your broadcast is the only explicit one. Well that and after learning Dennis has a buttery smooth voice!

#485 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Listening now and you had me when you announced your broadcast is the only explicit one. Well that and after learning Dennis has a buttery smooth voice!

Sadly, I think you misheard (or if I said it wrong then I guess I have another correction to make!). We are not explicit, Flippin' and Mashing is (Brokentoken, Game Room Junkies, and us at EGP are clean-lyics... at least I think the others are). So if you want the f-bombs then Flippin' is what you want for mixed gaming! But if it helps Tony and I do swear a lot, just off-air.

#486 1 year ago
Quoted from DennisK:

Sadly, I think you misheard (or if I said it wrong then I guess I have another correction to make!). We are not explicit, Flippin' and Mashing is (Brokentoken, Game Room Junkies, and us at EGP are clean-lyics... at least I think the others are). So if you want the f-bombs then Flippin' is what you want for mixed gaming! But if it helps Tony and I do swear a lot, just off-air.

Thanks for your preparation and great questions asked. I learned a bit and it actually peaked my curiosity. Any chance for a mini interview with follow up questions (and some strong language)? Ultimately we will have to wait to see what unfolds, but Robert remains vague about wtf makes their process so revolutionary, fast and cheap.

1) Will 5 days occur in 2018? 2) Is the ruleset for any game divided into selectable preprogrammed components? 3) are the pinball machines modular and/or swappable into a cabinet? 4) will layout be dependent on a screen embedded in playfield? 5) will games consist of a console and virtual reality glasses? 6) is there anyplace to read about their 30+ patent applications filed so far? 7) what kind of company doesn't care if potential customers are turned off by their hiring of JPOP and they don't mind losing sales?

#487 1 year ago
Quoted from DennisK:

Alright, the podcast episode just released, here is a link:
https://soundcloud.com/user-465086826/episode-55
The interview is just after the introduction segment (jump ahead to 4:30 to get just before it starts), and runs a little over 50 minutes.

In this interview deeproot says that every playfield will be hit with a sledgehammer and if it leaves a mark the playfield will be rejected.

#488 1 year ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

In this interview deeproot says that every playfield will be hit with a sledgehammer and if it leaves a mark the playfield will be rejected.

I don't think a playfield will leave a mark on the sledgehammer?

#489 1 year ago

Great interview Dennis! Pretty interesting stuff, especially the part where Robert said that he thought the Multimorphic P3 wasn't innovative and that they would be taking things in a different direction. Looking forward to seeing what that looks like.

#490 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

1) Will 5 days occur in 2018? 2) Is the ruleset for any game divided into selectable preprogrammed components? 3) are the pinball machines modular and/or swappable into a cabinet? 4) will layout be dependent on a screen embedded in playfield? 5) will games consist of a console and virtual reality glasses? 6) is there anyplace to read about their 30+ patent applications filed so far? 7) what kind of company doesn't care if potential customers are turned off by their hiring of JPOP and they don't mind losing sales?

1) Stay tuned. This interview will likely be our last major statements before that time.
2) Even better than that.
3) Hell no.
4) No.
5) No comment.
6) That’s not how the patent process works.
7) That is a very common response (or lack thereof) for most companies.

—dT

#491 1 year ago

This is going to be a disaster.......Poor timing as pinball is about to start it’s downward decent.

#492 1 year ago
Quoted from deeproot:

1) Stay tuned. This interview will likely be our last major statements before that time.
2) Even better than that.
3) Hell no.
4) No.
5) No comment.
6) That’s not how the patent process works.
7) That is a very common response (or lack thereof) for most companies.
—dT

Translation
1) our last option for free coverage is Kaneda, so yeah this will be our last.
2) there are no rules
3) there is no cabinet
4) there is no lcd
5) bugger jpops! Quick take off your virtual reality goggles, they've cracked our cryptic 5 days of deep-ass puzzle.

#493 1 year ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

Are we finally going to get a decent interchangeable pinball system??

Spoiler alert: No

#494 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Thanks for your preparation and great questions asked. I learned a bit and it actually peaked my curiosity. Any chance for a mini interview with follow up questions (and some strong language)?

If they are interested after the 5 Days, sure, we left that option open. Tony and I actually don't do many interviews (we prefer having guest hosts on instead), so I'd want to wait a while regardless.

Quoted from solarvalue:

Great interview Dennis! Pretty interesting stuff, especially the part where Robert said that he thought the Multimorphic P3 wasn't innovative and that they would be taking things in a different direction. Looking forward to seeing what that looks like.

In an interesting coincidence, Multimorphic is actually the only other manufacturer we've ever interviewed, and it focused a lot on the technological differences between the P3 system and a traditional pinball machine. So I'm also very interested in seeing the differences.

#495 1 year ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

In this interview deeproot says that every playfield will be hit with a sledgehammer and if it leaves a mark the playfield will be rejected.

Does there exist a material you can take a sledge hammer to and it will not leave a mark? Maybe my understanding of sledge hammers is flawed?

Maybe i'm just using the hammer wrong???

Maybe the material is water?

Things that make you go Hmmm...

#496 1 year ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

This is going to be a disaster.......Poor timing as pinball is about to start it’s downward decent.

I hope you don't really believe that statement.
Pinball has just started getting mainstream with the public. I'm seeing more and more TV commercials with pinballs thrown in. I hear more younger people start talking about pins now then ever before. New pin sales outside of the pin clan are picking up. But we'll just have to wait and watch what happens in the next 3 years.

13
#497 1 year ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Great interview Dennis! Pretty interesting stuff, especially the part where Robert said that he thought the Multimorphic P3 wasn't innovative and that they would be taking things in a different direction. Looking forward to seeing what that looks like.

He's right when he said I wouldn't find his opinion insulting. I just found his opinion to be wrong. That said, innovations (and talk) mean nothing without execution and customers. Hopefully we continue executing and growing our customer base.

- Gerry
https://www.multimorphic.com

#498 1 year ago

Wow,
not sure but isn't American pinball Houdini and TNA all Pro Roc?

#499 1 year ago
Quoted from robert5earl:

not sure but isn't American pinball Houdini and TNA all Pro Roc?

P-Roc, yes.

#500 1 year ago

need a new emoji!

But for now this one is pf QC check.

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