Thanks, Justin! The fact that you can see the clear glass when you peel it away proves that the backglass itself is not silk screened. It's definitely a translite. Very disappointing. It seems like Stern is continuously coming up with new ways to nickle and dime us.

TWD LE backglass.jpg

Aggravating BS Gweem! I mean, as a business guy and looking at the bottom line, I can see these guys crunching the numbers and trying to figure out how to squeeze every last dime out of us.

In the long run, its a terrible strategy in my opinion, take the Amazon approach, the more you give back to your customers the more you receive in the "long run".

TWD LE will be my last Stern pre order before playing a pin from Stern. I hope I never want to buy another one from them.

The thing I don't understand is the backglass wasn't just changed last week. To me this is a genuine bait and switch. There's just no way when they released the details of the Pro and the LE that the backglass/translite decision wasn't already made.

I still think it looks great, will know for sure in a few hours, but if this is "mirrored" could someone please explain exactly what the "mirroring" process is? I always assumed that much like a mirror it meant painted on glass.

So the original mirrored backglasses that we think of, the late 70s early 80s classic stuff, that was actually done by taking a piece of mirrored glass, and then putting a protective layer over all the parts you wanted to be mirrored. Then the whole thing was dipped in acid, and the mirror coating that wasn't protected was etched away. Leaving you with clear glass with mirrored parts. Then you did your silk screens on that, one screen per color. 11 colors wasn't uncommon. Lot of work.

Fast forward to now.

Instead of acid etching a mirror there's a special mirrored ink that's laid down just like a normal spot color. I forget how much it costs, Stu or Kevin from CPR said it's something like $1000 a gallon. Pricey. But much easier than the toxic and time consuming acid process I guess.

Also, instead of doing 11 colors etc, and doing a screen per color, the Stern glasses at least (and the CPR translite -> backglass conversions) are done with CMYK. So 4 color process. 5 when you add the mirrored ink layer. My Metallica photo from last night shows that Stern was fusing on a white layer on top of that, some kind of plasticky material, so that's not an ink layer apparently.

Here's the thing: printing is printing. The mirrored ink is laid down just like any other color (I presume, maybe it has some special printing needs) so in theory there's no reason why you couldn't put it on a translite or translite-like material instead of glass.

I guess that's "cheating" but if it's bonded to the glass so there are no waves or ripples and the mirroring looks good I'm hard pressed to say why it matters. Even when it was straight to glass Stern was still doing CMYK, it's not like they were screening 11 colors.

All I know is now I want to figure out how to make a mirrored translite.

Nope, but I have an obvious interest in translites.

One thing I should note though is that mirrored ink is generally meant to be backprinted onto glass to get the effect. There is a version that works direction onto a surface (like a translite) instead, but it's not quite as reflective.

I'm not sure what happens if you lay the backprinted style onto something that's then bonded up against glass, that might be enough to make it work.

Ultimately, all that matters is if it looks good or not. I just don't think Stern should be using the word "backglass" in their marketing materials to differentiate the LE from the pro. It's misleading.

It's the keeping customers in the dark that bugs me the most. How hard would it be for someone from Stern to issue a statement such as:

"It has come to our attention that there is some confusion over our new metallic backglass process. While the LE does not feature a real silkscreened backglass in the traditional sense, it is indeed different than the standard translite that is used on the pro. Let me elaborate ..."

Me too!

Er, Uh... unless the next title is a music pin like Led Zep or Pink Floyd...

Then, after that I'll never buy another NIB Stern again...

Unless it's a really kick ass theme that interests me.

I'm ok with the translite but I won't pay 9K or higher again for an LE that while very nice seems to be missing a lot of what an LE should be. I just can't get over the fact that they didn't illuminate the BG zombie and have a flasher there as well. I also can't figure out why they excluded colour changing led's on all inserts, even the fish tank was done very cheap, feel like this would have been OK as a Pre around 7K but for me with the shaker its over 9 and just doesn't feel warranted, not yet anyway.

I'm surprised you're suprised that Stern is nickling and dime you.
Selling mods was the last straw for me.
Extra $1200 for shit that should be included in the LE?!

Thanks Aurich, that was a great explanation. I suppose at the end of the day as long as it looks great it doesn't much matter.
Where's my LE!!! I hate when they say by 8am-5pm. That usually means 4:58 and I'm left going stir crazy all day waiting.

Oh, I'm not surprised. I'm just annoyed.

Just got off the phone with the shipping company. Mine will be here on Monday.

Got mine today #317image-158.jpg

Great info. So are you saying CPR backglasses aren't like the originals, rather like these stern twdle backglass/translite concoction?

Since I'm still waiting, the more I see pics of the LE, the more the "rust" armor just looks like brown. Is that just the way some of the pics are or does it look more brown than dark metallic rust red?

#474

My wife is big into halloween, she makes haunted houses, she loved the brown rust. It's brown, with flakes of other colors.

Saw it in person at EXPO and it looked good. Red rusted.

Sonuvab!tch!

I called, since it's now 5pm and at that point they scheduled me to be delivered MONDAY! So my game is going to sit at their hub from 3am today when it arrived until Monday now.

So anyone who's got their tracking number may want to call and just confirm they have you scheduled, so you don't have to wait any longer than you should.

Why do I suspect this weekend is going to drag now.

You think that's annoying. My game has been sitting at the hub since it was picked up from Stern yesterday afternoon. Like yours, mine is not being delivered until Monday. In my case, however, I only live about twenty minutes from the Stern factory. The game is actually now much further away from my house than when it was built.

#491, was scheduled for delivery on Monday...its dropping below freezing all weekend...change of plans, got a truck and picked it at the dock.

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Looking forward to getting some other opinions on this game.

I'm not sure how you resisted supervising it as it went down the line then boxed it up and took it home yourself. lol

Yeah the tracking on their site changed almost immediately after my call. I think they forgot to call me yesterday to schedule for today. Glad I called them myself I guess.

R&L called and #234 mine (mine-mine-mine - seagulls on Nemo) will be here in Phoenix on Monday. Monday Night Football and TWDLE.....

I have died and gone to pinball-football heaven. Especially after the Cardinals are 8-1 after beating the Rams.

Come on Stern, pick up the ball and run harder with it, don't freakin' drop it now and loose ground with the pinballers' supporting you, just because you got a good thing going and the money is rolling in more than ever. Time to give back so your soul is free........

No, I'm not saying that at all. I'm talking purely about their translite to backglass conversions (like Whirlwind and EATPM), and even then they're screened on glass. Just CMYK + mirror ink. Which is how Stern has been doing theirs as far as I know.

No idea what's up with TWD LE, haven't seen it in person, but it's not connected to CPR and how they do things.

Thanks for explaining that. I just bought a Flash Gordon bg and I was going to be highly disappointed if it was like the twdle.

437, but its still in the box. I haven't had a chance all week to open it and decided to put it on a shelf today. Thinking about not opening it for a while. Going to watch the code updates and play the pro in the mean time when I am at the bar.

Since its on the shelf now it won't be till mid December until its opened if I get around to it then. This will be the first NIB that I leave in the box for more than a few days after receiving it. I feel like I am committing a pin sin.

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So basically we need to buy your metal apron, extra lighting mods, a Stern topper and shaker. Probably more as well. I need to get off this ship!!

Mine will be at the depot on Monday. Not sure what number it is.

You are committing "pin sin"........!

Could never leave a pin in the box. It would physically hurt...

I knew that was coming. Truth is it looks good. I have some gripes but that does not matter to me.

Don't care about the translite at all, the plastic apron, lack of GI lighting as it states that green red and white in the TWDLE matrix but only red and white are on the pin, BG Zombie that you can't even see and the plain metallic crossbow. Now I will say as I sit here I'm compelled to go and play this pin, one of the most addicting pinball machines I've had so very happy just trying to come to grips with the lack of LE feeling I'm getting.

#516 in the house. unlike Mustang, I'm pretty sure all 600 have been built by now!
awesome game but lighting and voice callouts are holding it back.

I just got #67 tonight. I don't have a clue about the rules yet, but I'm really digging the layout.

This bothers me as well.

They didnt specify that BG bash toy was spotted.
They didnt specify that the apron was metal.

If a feature didnt make the cut cause it looked like christmas or cost to much whatever ....that's fine
JUST TAKE IT OFF THE LIST !

I received the return call from Gary Stern about 10:00 that night and he said the same thing and also it is a lot more environmently friendly also sharper more vivid and and the cost is about the same,I respect that he called and I am happy with my game

If that BG Zombie had been lit up and the lighting was what it should be then I would be fine with this LE. I guess with the beauty of STLE and the amazing lighting in Metallica LE and Pre my expectations are high, guess I need to let code mature but still disappointing. The sound is awesome and the gameplay/layout is also great. I honestly have to say I'm loving this game and still ok with the LE, don't need an LCD display or special cabinet art but the little details that make the difference from a pro are missing.

Got yesterday. Loving it! Not sure why there been a lot on pinside bashing it. The one issue I have with it is the left ramp is hard and it pops the ball off the playfield too often.

#501

Same here. Almost everyone has been reporting this. And if you hit it perfectly, it's a freakin rocket that looks like it's going right out the back of the machine. WAY steep ramp and powerful flippers = look out!
The plastic in front of that ramp look stupid IMHO. is it really serving a purpose?