Why is GB definitely out all the sudden? Have you ever played a GB Premium?

Twd premium , Killer game , best code And dots ever made !

I love Tssp also but Its not in the same gameplay fun level of Twd premium

Dont like GB gameplay

yes, because variety is better. Different eras and different manufacturers feel different. Too much from one manufacturer seems too much like the same old crap with a different look. more variety you have, the more longevity you have. Many on pinside do not realize this.

Really amazed at the love for TWD. Can someone explain what I'm missing? I don't like the show btw but I do think the theme is cool. Enlighten me!

TWD Prem/LE is worth it for sure to most people. Overall, it handily as well as significantly wins the ratings over the Pro. There is a lot to love from its added features. And TWD Prem/LE has one of the most significant added-feature sets from Stern over the pro. The ability to have multiple sound packages is amazing too. From multiple actor versions and alternate music versions (even now a grateful dead), no other pin has so much in enthusiast supported options available. The TWD club has been the best one I've been involved in; a great bunch of supporting members.

It has a unique layout for a newer pin and may be some of the best coding ever. If you are good enough to get over the difficulty this pin is so much fun to play. Its modular coding and play encourages varied approaches that are equally rewarding and keep it fresh. So much depth and variety to see and explore. Add in great theme integration with modes (e.g., CDC, tunnel, BG, Barn, WW, Prison, Riot, Horde, Terminus, Last man standing), visuals, lighting, sounds, and intensity and you have what many are rating and calling a great pin. It's the spiritual successor to MET, and both Lyman and Borg have mentioned how it has been one of their favorites. Watch some game play videos, I think its appeal comes out nicely there. Watch horde mode for example. The best mode in all of pinball imo. And that is just one of many parts.

And still, it isn't for everyone. Different strokes for different folks.

Ok I played pro and wasn't impressed maybe le/prem will be next

It's hard so it doesn't get old, it has a ton of code that other then a few modes are always in reach. It stacks modes better then any other modern game. It has its layout flaws but the code makes up for it. I still like ACDC better but I can see why many consider this Lyman's master piece.

Owned all 3 NIB and TSPP is the only one sill in my collection even after all these years.

Actually I owned TWDpro and sold it to get a premium but when I played the premium realized how bad the flow and shots were and didn't end up buying it.

TSPP all the way. Deep code you will never complete and a fun game with lots of different modes and AMaZInG stacking... try stacking all modes at once... fun fun fun!!

If it was on location, either version of TWD can be brutal. Try a well-setup home pin to see what it can really offer. That means some of the little things people harp on will not be an issue, such as a clunky left ramp or stdm drains from the magnets or pops.

I own both TSPP and GB. Both great games and I don't think you would be disappointed with either one. I haven't had a chance to play TWD a whole lot, but it is also a really fun game with great code. In my opinion Ghostbusters is harder to progress through then TSPP and offers more of a challenge for me personally. GB has made me a better player due to tight shots and quick drains if you don't learn ball control.

Just finished a nice round of TSPP tonight....the game is badass....many shots, nice combo flows, a lot to do, and an upper playfield that makes sense. This one is a classic.....the other 2 will need to catchup ( maybe). Buying one of the 3? TSPP is a proven winner...find a nice one and don't look back....

well, if shadow is your only other game, Stern would be completely different. With shadow, almost everything is completely different, since shadow is it's own animal.

If you like shadow, you are a better player, and used to tight shots. GB will not be frustrating for you like it is for some. You might enjoy it more than some do.

For me TSPP is too cluttered, should have been a widebody, but i understand the people that love it and why.

TWD, has good rules and code. But for me the art package is seriously lacking.

You must be pretty hard to impress.

Just some friendly advice. Anyone who says GB Premium sucks, I wouldn't pay any attention to them because they don't know what they're talking about. TWD is awesome, doesn't matter which model you choose it's a great great game so you cannot go wrong with TWD period. As far as GB Premium goes, it's an amazing game. If I were getting ready to drop that kind of money I would at least see if I could find one to play somewhere if I were you. TWD and GB both are two of the best pins that have ever been made. They are both hard and not noob friendly but if you want a good challenge both of these games will give you one.

I say TSPP. No chance of it depreciating and it is a solid piece. Also lots of fun, I might add.

Stern games always have two groups: pro owners that swear the pro is the only intelligent choice, and premium players that claim the premium is the superior game. The truth is the premium is how the game designer invisioned the game. The pro is the stripped down version sold at a price point that the premium is probably actually worth.

delt31 http://gameroomblog.com/reviews/2015-pinball-machine-of-the-year

That doesn't mean that the Premium version is always better though.

GB hands down for me beats the other two.

All a matter of perception.

But if you look at this logically, think about the implications. You have a company saying: you can buy the artist's intent for $6.8k OR we'll shave $1.8k and you can buy this stripped down game.

In the case of the walking dead, there's no way the differences equate to $1.8k. And pro owners are left without some fun features. And the crazy thing is, Pro owners feel they've made some kind cost saving decision!

What a joke

That used to be my thinking and was a PREM/LE snob for a long time. Then I gave pros a chance, and they are surprisingly more fun. Better? That subjective, but when programmers have to basically program additional features, it can at times get in the way of programming the game to its potential. Not many LEs that are really 'worth' having over the pro; STLE is really the only one I can think of because of its immersive light show an added flow. Most other LE pin features kill speed and flow and add unnecessary additional bash toys or stop n go toys....like TWD.

Eskaybee, I respect you a TON. But I disagree. When you play a game, you want to play designers intent. Just like when you watch a movie, you want to see a movie as the director intended.

Sure, you could watch Interstellar and enjoy the movie if you didn't see them pass through the worm hole... but the director wants you to see that.

Listen to a Trudeau interview and you'll hear him say that GB Premium is the game as he designed it. And that version isn't that much more in the scheme of things....

You say light show in ST... I point out light show in TWD Prem.

It's a real shame that Stern forces customers spending super high dollars to make those choices.

So you think that all of these designers are designing games with upper playfields? I highly doubt that. They just stick those on the game so they can get an extra 2k out of guys like you, because they usually make the game suck. Some people think just because it cost more that it has to be better. That's not always true in the pinball world. Keep buying those Premiums and LE's though, Gary loves you for it.

You're completely missing the point.

Listen to Roger Sharpe... he said it, not me.

Says who? When I play a game, I want to play something that's fun. Couldn't care less what anyone's intent was. I want to play the game that's most fun. No designer can decide that for me with their intent. Only I can decide what's best for me.

Op. Play all of these games extensively and decide for yourself. That's the best way.

Totally agree. Plus, designers intent doesn't always come to fruition after programmers, graphic artists, sound engineers, bosses, etc... potetionally ruin that intention.

On the case of GB; I really have no comment on which I prefer. I neither love nor hate both versions. I don't have a preference, but know enough that I'd rather own TWD or TSPP than it.

Just imagine TAF in Stern's PRO world... no "power" magnets... no thing flips... a static hand that doesn't move but has a magnet that draws the ball up in the air.

It's a shame that Stern sells these price level models. It really is... And the prices from Stern - across the board - are fit to what they think we'll pay.

I've been thinking about this for quite a while and the whole thing doesnt sit well with me.

So you're saying I can buy an Adams family that's way better than the original for cheaper? Sign me up!!

How about your World Cup soccer with no spinning ball, a Goalie that doesn't move and no physical ball locks?

not all designers make their games with the premium in mind. Some make the pro, then they see what crap they can add to it to give a perceived value.

Some versions of games I prefer the Pro version over the premium. Has nothing to do with costs. LIke MET. I'd never own a premium, and if i did, i'd sell it and buy a pro in it's place.

That doesn't mean a pro should be priced at $5.6 or $5.8 k

premiums and LE's shouldn't be either. But you have to make 400% profit while people are dumb enough to pay it.

I call B.S. on your comment. Name ONE designer that you can PROVE added crap to a game for "perceived" value. This isn't high school bro where everyone believes you have a ten inch schlong just because you tell them that.

Good luck with that because I'll be waiting a long time for your answer.

Lol good stuff! He can't prove that obviously but it's kind of true. Stern has to make the Pro attractive because they can't afford to lose the Pro buyers. Some people will buy pro or nothing because they just can't afford the Premium and LE models so if Stern makes the Pro a stripped down POS the Pro buyer will just pass and not buy anything. About the only game recently that has came out that I think the Premium is a must have is Ghostbusters. The rest of the games I can live with the Pro model and sometimes I even like it better than the premiums.

No you don't. Not if you have a good business model and solid industry to work within.

Don't make excuses for the sterns of the world.

Dnast every company out there charges what the market will allow them to charge. If you were selling hot dogs and people thought they were so good that they would give you 10 dollars for them, wouldn't you charge 10 dollars instead of a dollar?

some designers have said it themselves in seminars. Some work with premium first and see what they can take out. others work the other way and make a game they like in budget and see what they can add later. It's been said here before and many other places. Proof is out there if you just do a little research.

I'm not outright disagreeing with you, but strategic business planning also comes into play.

If your example we're true across the board,why didn't Williams crank prices back in the late 80's early 90's?

Frankly, none of us know the business segment well enough to argue this... but when the Roger Sharpe indicates that companies aren't charging production costs plus resonable profit, then the collecting community should listen.

The collecting community obviously feels like a new Stern is worth the price that is being asked or they wouldn't be buying them, and Stern is selling a lot of pinball machines right now. You should be talking about JJP if anybody instead of Stern on this topic here.

Can't argue either of those... my point is that when folks cite reasons for why prices are so high, you most commonly hear:

(1) It's because manufacturing costs significantly more in 2017

(2) Licenses

And While those inevitably can explain why a product might cost more... don't think for a minute the prices wouldn't plummet if we stopped buying.

That's pretty easy. Just go look at ST. The LE is nothing but a bunch of crap added with only the up kicker really having anything to do with gameplay.

Back to the OP... if you are huge simpsons fan and don't mind a ton of flippers, get it. The theme immersion is awesome and tons of hilarious call outs. My opinion- GB and TWD are both (in factory default settings) too hard for small collections, no matter your skill level. All three are great games and you can't go wrong. I would only get TWD or GB as part of a larger collection... you'll need a handful of others on reserve to go to when those two decide you aren't allowed to do much more than plunge the ball.

Just be prepared for a lot of rules on TSPP.

Nice to hear that you can dial it in and get rid of the linear nature of the game.

Tspp gets my vote especially in small collection . Just has so much last ability and lots to do . The fact you are comparing two premiums vs tspp says it all . This game is far more loaded with toys features and shots than most le's or premiums . Don't miss out on one of the best pins ever made .

It has been brought up before, but a TSPP released today equipped as is would be 9 grand.

GB was designed to be a premium - designer said it himself. FYI.

I own a Prem and it's def worth it after playing a pro but pros for certain games do make sense.

My comment just flew over your head, out the door, and it's never coming back. Your response had absolutely zero to do with my comment.

Sure it did

If I remember correctly in a chat with Steve he stated that he likes to design the pro first and then add to it for the other levels. Granted that was before GOT. ST is a prime example of this. Most of the added stuff have nothing to do with gameplay. That's not a bash on ST either. All 3 models are great. But the stuff added was absolutely for perceived value, otherwise they can't charge more.